I am about 80 percent certain the new sabo will start out way too strong

immortalls96
immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652
edited February 2020 in General Discussions

2.5 seconds, that's all you need to do in order to break a hook..that is easily done during the pickup animation so theres no resistance , I can already see builds that could end up making this new sabo into an issue, now I'm wanting to stay optimistic this time as so far this seems like a pretty sweet patch..however with a swf group say 1 guy is doing gens and two are saving for the chaser, this new sabo could just become a much less countable flashlight save and that especially in the current meta could end up a big problem..I do hope they will be watching very closely this time around..because sabo is already at its core very unhealthy amd risky to have around the meta..so it must be handled with care or itll blow up in the devs faces

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Comments

  • raulblideran
    raulblideran Member Posts: 225

    That's not a bad idea of a perk to be honest for killer, but it might need a cooldown cause in interaction with other perks might be too op.

    Hope's gone:

    "The entity is having a bit of fun messing up the generators"

    When hitting a generator the entity locks it for 30/45/60 seconds.

    The perk has a cooldown of 40/50/60 seconds.

    When a survivor completes a generator additional 5 seconds are added to the cooldown.

  • Jacoby2041
    Jacoby2041 Member Posts: 843

    Sabo won't affect you if you camp slugs 😎

  • Kai6864
    Kai6864 Member Posts: 377

    You guys may have to be a bit patient with this topic- wait till it comes out to make judgements like this. With the charge decrease to toolboxes I don’t think many people will be using them to do sabo anymore means you’d likely have to use Saboteur which now has a cool down. Very often, there are many hooks around the killer who can easily get to another one in time. The problem really comes when you meet 4 man SWF, even 3 man might do it. This change makes it so only a max of 3 hooks can be broken with saboteur meaning you’d need 3 people to do it right versus the one person who has 99d all the hooks previously. Sacrifice everyone working on gens to get a quick sabo save- sounds fine and great till it meets ruin or thrilling tremors. Either way people are going to complain, it’s what the dbd community does best- so why not shed some positive light on the situation? As killer, knowing 3 people are off gens isn’t a bad thing.

  • Aven_Fallen
    Aven_Fallen Member Posts: 16,199

    "however with a swf group say 1 guy is doing gens and two are saving for the chaser, this new sabo could just become a much less countable flashlight save and that especially in the current meta could end up a big problem"

    Do you even read what you write? This would mean that only one person is doing Gens. Ever played Solo Survivor with your teammates taking a stroll across the Map? Thats how it feels when only one person is doing Gens, it will take way too long to do all the Gens alone, until then, all the Ressources are gone.

    I know that people like to make things up, but lets not get too hilarious. If two people are following the Killer with Flashlights while he is chasing one person, this is one of the best scenarios. Same will be the case with two people following for Sabotages...

    I dont think it will be too problematic. In fact, I guess nobody will sabotage anymore, in my opinion. But hey, its like always - something for Survivor is being changed and people see a problem. Cant wait for the Threads about the new Survivor Perks, where at least two will again be problematic (and then not be used at all, because Survivor Perks which get released are always bad).

    The 2,5 seconds might sound too fast, however, if someone sabotages during the Pickup Animation, the Killer has so many Hooks he can choose. Hooks are so close to each other that there should be at least two other Hooks. 99ing the Hooks is way stronger (if coordinated), because you can sabotage in the Killers face, which will not be possible with 2,5 seconds.

    MAYBE Sabotage will be more useful, because you dont need to waste so much time for preparation, which will not pay off, but I doubt it. If it turns out too strong, they will change it anyway, because Sabotage is a difficult topic, it should not be too viable, because it would negate one of the Core Mechanics of the game.

    So maybe people should wait for the actual outcome instead of assuming and calling it a bad change... My guess would be that nobody will sabotage after the Change.

  • Helevetin_nopee
    Helevetin_nopee Member Posts: 408

    2.5 seconds? Really? Well thats never making it to the final release. However one of the Pigs perks got a buff, dont remember the name of it, it will show survivors auras near hooks if you are carrying a survivor

  • GHOSTfaceP3
    GHOSTfaceP3 Member Posts: 1,364

    the sabo change will be very strong with sabo teams resilience, Saboteur, Unbreakable,ds with Alexis toolbox with sabo addons will be strong so I can see it being easy to bully in swf

  • Adeloo
    Adeloo Member Posts: 1,448

    2,5 seconds ? where did you get this number ? Coz there weren't any numbers in the Dev update

  • Seanzu
    Seanzu Member Posts: 7,526

    I am 100% certain we should try it out first.

    1. Sabo is 2.5ish Seconds
    2. Sabo is disabled for 30 seconds after use
    3. Saboed hooks are only gone for 30 seconds
    4. It's a perk slot not running "meta"
    5. There's a heck tonne of hooks, once you know they're saboing, look at your two closest hooks
  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    It will be broken perk. 2,5 seconds is far too generous. You must be full survivor main if you think otherwise. I'm also 90% survivor player and i can see problems with this perk lmao

  • Seanzu
    Seanzu Member Posts: 7,526

    Or, I've seen how reactionary everyone is to changes and like 95% of the changes the devs have done have been so far from as awful as the forums will say they will be that I'm more inclined to trust the devs over someones reactionary statement.

  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    Yes, becouse people were wrong abaut absolutely broken mechanics like flashlight/ pallet saves without ZERO timing needed. Or perks like MoM, which gave survivor insta heal without any conditions. Who would have known those things would break the game?

  • Seanzu
    Seanzu Member Posts: 7,526

    Wow, the flashlight changes were what, 2 years ago and only lasted 3 days, and mom only lasted 2 weeks.


    SO MANY CHANGES THAT WERE SO AWFUL, it's almost like they fall into the 5% of changes that were actually bad that I was talking about.

  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    Yeah and it doesn't take einstein to see how new sabo will break the game, just like MoM was absolutely braindead perk everyone knew it would become a new meta once reading what it would do.. just like DS remained almost the same for several years.

    Can you show me your killer and survivor rank? i would gladly show mine to prove i play survivor much more. But it's quite obvious

  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    This could be old screenshots taken ages ago. I reached rank 1 survivor back in 2017. Then i stopped playing survivor for 1 year. and now i've been mostly survivor main for 1 year again.

    Posting old pics doesn't prove anything, just that you ONCE reached certain rank. I want your CURRENT killer rank

    Equip trapper with diamond stone and stitched bag addons. If you take screenshot of that i will believe you. You can name then character and addons you want me to take screenshot of

  • Raccoon
    Raccoon Member Posts: 7,711

    No one cares about rank.

    I can only imagine that you brush using a REACH toothbrush.

  • Seanzu
    Seanzu Member Posts: 7,526

    You can clearly see Yui's perks being used in the killer screenshot, lmao.

  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    You are right. Rank doesn't mean anything, but it does indicate which side you favor clearly.

  • Raccoon
    Raccoon Member Posts: 7,711

    This conversation, in its current state, indicates that you had no rebuttal or viable argument, so you tried to throw shade on the dude/ette by bringing rank up.

    I don't agree with @SenzuDuck's assessment, but I wouldn't engage them in such a petty way :-/

  • Callmehandsome
    Callmehandsome Member Posts: 529

    How is this "shade"? I'm not going to waste time talking abaut balance with somebody who is obviously biased. Showing your current rank is best indicator that if you either play both sides as you claim. :))

  • Seanzu
    Seanzu Member Posts: 7,526

    again, you can clearly see Yui's perks in the killer screenshot, I've got nothing to prove to you.

  • Sonzaishinai
    Sonzaishinai Member Posts: 7,976

    If they are dumb enough to sabo during the pickup animation you can simply walk to another hook and still make it 95% of the time

  • Todgeweiht
    Todgeweiht Member Posts: 3,666

    Sabo meta back?


  • Pok
    Pok Member Posts: 100

    Wait and see before crying.

    I like the change so far, it makes it again a realisitc possibility to use sab build. I mean if you want to use half of your reworked toolbox to get rid of one hook, you can, you just have a choice to make here. And for the "toxic swf sab team" argument, it was already here, it's just that people needed to 99 every hook before, and they could instant sab, at least now you can see it coming.

    My only concern is about the saboteur perk, I hope the cooldown is long enough to prevent abuse, but still interesting to give the perk value.

  • EvilJoshy
    EvilJoshy Member Posts: 5,295

    The thing is, there have been some things they announced that we said would break the game and they did it anyway. Then the game broke and they had to fix it. (Old MoM) I don't trust these devs to know what's best for their own game.

  • Todgeweiht
    Todgeweiht Member Posts: 3,666

    MoM was just a cheap way for the devs to milk cash, not really a balance issue

  • EvilJoshy
    EvilJoshy Member Posts: 5,295
    edited February 2020

    The "QoL" patch for flashlight and stun times

    Old MoM was a serious balance issue. I agree it was a cash grab for them but before they nerfed it you couldn't go into a match without running into MoM+DS+BT+Adren.

  • Pok
    Pok Member Posts: 100

    I guess that's why they are using a PTB, to see if this is what they aim for, and tweak it according to feedback. It's very rare that a new feature, in any multiplayer game is at the start perfectly balanced/

    I don't trust the community to know better. At every single change, you have a larger number of players complaining that it's not balanced, either because they don't like it, because it threatens their playstyle, or because it is really unbalanced. If you listened only to the community, we would never get anywhere because anyway people will never stop arguig about what's right or wrong, and you can't be sure if they are not biaised about why they are complaing in the first place. And also, people happy with change don't come on the forums to complain...

    That's why I think we should wait to see how it really turns out before calling for the end of the world..

  • ALostPuppy
    ALostPuppy Member Posts: 3,398

    It might be annoying for the killer, but if everyone's trying to be sabo gods, nobody's doing gens so honestly who cares? And there are a lot more ways to "bully" killers as a SWF team. I'd MUCH prefer playing against sabo players than Marth's depip squad for example.

  • fleshbox
    fleshbox Member Posts: 494

    As killer i am not looking forward to these increased sabo speeds. I am a bit worried to be honest. We will see how this pans out but i defo see lots of sabo squads the first week or so testing out their builds.

    I think hangmans is going to be used a lot during the first week as a defense.

  • FrenziedRoach
    FrenziedRoach Member Posts: 2,600

    I find myself in agreement with SenzuDuck

    World has gone all upside down XD

  • Malik1178
    Malik1178 Member Posts: 34

    Im 99% sure that breakable walls will be way too op at the start

  • Zoldyar
    Zoldyar Member Posts: 438

    So why can’t the killer just check his surrounding and prevent any near by survivors from sabotaging?

    A killer can lose the survivor during pick up animation if a surivior point a flash light at the killer’s eyes. So does that make flash lights too strong?

    By survivors sabotaging that means that aren’t doing gens. So you as a killer would have more time to chase after other survivors because you aren’t losing anything. If you down one survivor and see someone trying to sabotage, go after that other person. Then the other team mate would have to stop what he is doing to go for the down person.

  • TBfishy
    TBfishy Member Posts: 28
    edited February 2020

    I was using saboteur for about 10 games for the ptb yesterday. It is SO MUCH fun

    While it is a very powerful mechanic, its not anywhere near overpowered for me, heres why:

    1. Out of every game i played (with and without it), i was the ONLY person in all my games going for sabos.

    2. Just about every sabo i got i had to get downed, so i really just traded everytime. It also resulted in me getting tunneled many many times.

    3. When you're hiding around waiting for the killer, youre not exactly doing anything for your team.

    4. If the killer was smart, theyd see me before even going to the hook and just put them on another.

    Overall, if you really look at it from a standpoint of just introducing something to add more fun, its great. And honestly competetively, i think its extremely fair and not many people are gonna be going for it, because what people forget it is that most purple ranks are immersed useless players who slithered their way into high ranks by hiding.

    Im sure it will be nerfed anyway with how many killers are complaining on these forums without actually having it happen to them or just happen the minority of times

    Also i think its a fair trade, killers get breakable walls plus the few other survivor nerfs this update and survivors get sabo buff

  • fcc2014
    fcc2014 Member Posts: 4,388

    Hooks spawn really close. I don't think it will be that OP. If it gets a person off a gen to try for a save isn't it worth it.

  • immortalls96
    immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    Time..killer is a relay race rn and if sabo makes you lose a hook slug or not your losing invaluable time, and the difference is flashlight saves require good timing..sano does not require any skill whatsoever..and some maps like the game and swamps have horrendous hook distribution at times

  • immortalls96
    immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    Theres a few key differences


    1..killers get 1 map with breakable walls and currently they only help with shack , the others are in odd spots and can only be broken from 1 side apparently unless it was bugged


    2..Would you find it fun if a killer could just walk to a gen and snap it out of existence when it was nearly done..? No..sabo isnt a healthy mechanic as it's the killers main progression , otherwise I wouldnt be wary of it but it just plain sucks to deal with, especially with how insane the sabo toolbox is now

  • Dreamnomad
    Dreamnomad Member Posts: 3,920

    I'm 80% certain that you are 80% wrong.

  • Frankie
    Frankie Member Posts: 807

    Hell with that. Knockout, Thana, Sloppy. They can all bleed out.

  • Mister_Holdout
    Mister_Holdout Member Posts: 3,144

    Anything that can be abused by SWF, will be.

  • Primalux135
    Primalux135 Member Posts: 1,045

    Killers will slug even more, I would. Why having agitation while i can have infectious fright and nulify another surv

  • immortalls96
    immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    People dont think that far usually..but the numbers make the outcome predictable

  • immortalls96
    immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    That's my point, why create something that makes them specifically more lethal?

  • TBfishy
    TBfishy Member Posts: 28
    edited February 2020

    For one, They plan to implement breakable walls to all maps if it works out on that map in ptb


    And Im not sure if you know, but the sabo'd hooks are only gone for thirty seconds (ten seconds with hangmans trick). And you also failed to bring up my other points. Theres perks for killers that are about the equivalent of saboing hooks like pop and corrupt intervention, saboing does not even slightly compare to deleting a gen from a game. And like i said, all you have to do is change direction for another hook. or just drop them and go for the saboteur.

  • immortalls96
    immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    Drop them and gain no progression precisely my point..its not so bad on occasion but if this is meta..mm..


    And also they have said those will take a long time to implement even if they go for it also I'm well aware..that doesnt matter for the purpose of denying a hook, you dont get 30 seconds of carry time