Red rank survivor perks - my statistics
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Because @NoShinyPony has not given me a reason to think she would post stats that paint a picture that backs a hidden agenda. That "other" source of stats has been accused of presenting their information in a way that suits them, forming a conclusion first and then building stats that will reinforce that conclusion.
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Getting to Red Ranks as Suvivor is so easy like never before.
My build is Kindred - We'll make it - Inner Strenght - Quick & Quit
Don't run Meta Perks, you don't need them. At least it's nice to have just 1 DS in the game, as the Killer must asume all have it.
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I have a question. If on average two people per match run DS, is it a worthy gamble to tunnel the first person down that isn't the obsession?
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I think you did statistics wrong. You should count all survivors in match that has at least 1 red rank. It likes the way devs did when they counted hex ruin on killer. If your match only has 1 red rank survivor, there is only 25% chance that DS could be equipped.
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People keep talking about metas and survivors all using 4 or 5 outrageous perks, specifically adrenaline . I stopped using adenaline over a year ago and hardly anyone uses it anymore. It's awesome when it works but in most matches, I'm either dead before end game or already fully healthy because I don't play injured, and i just get a little sprint burst.
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Even when I play killer which is about 40% of my time roughly, I hardly ever get hit with DS.
- because I don't tunnel and intentionally ignore the unhooked person to chase the hooked one (unless the gate is already open)
- the likelihood that I end up back on the same person off hook within 60 seconds happens so rarely that it seems inconsequential to me based on my playstyle. I'd rather leave a game with 1 or 2 kills where everyone had fun than camp someone for a single kill. Hell, I'd rather they all escape after being hooked twice than camp. But that's just me and everyone has their own playstyle
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I'm disappointed head on didn't make the cut :(
It's by far the best perk in the game!
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The difference is that Ruin was the only perk that functioned as a bandaid fix for ridiculously fast gen speeds, while DS was reworked to be one of the most powerful perks in the game.
I legitimately do not understand how you guys came to the conclusion that nerfing Ruin with no compensation to the rest of the game was the right thing to do. Everyone was telling you why Ruin appeared so often, but instead you went with, "It must be OP! Better delete it."
Regardless, it should be alarming to see only a handful of perks being used in most matches. It says something about how garbage many perks are, and how incredibly strong a few are. They all should be much more equal in terms of power level.
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I don't see why the devs don't just release current perk use statistics across all ranks - it's not a complicated process and would allow the community to provide input on multiple things such as balance and buffing unused perks.
I can't understand the unwillingness to do so when the end result can only benefit the community as a whole.
It's mind boggling.
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Oh My God
I hope this is a joke.
I hope that @Peanits knows how math works...
80% Killers in red ranks used Ruin.
So Ruin was being used in 80% of all red rank matches.
~46% Surviviors in red ranks use DS
So DS is being used in around 46%... OH WAIT, THERE ARE 4 SURVIVIORS IN EACH GAME
So whats the probabiloty that DS will appear in a red rank game?
(1-(0.54)^4)×100%=
(1-0.8503056)×100%=
0.91496944×100%=
91.496944%
If you dont believe my math skills then here is a calculator:
PROBABLILITY OF DECISIVE STRIKE APPEARING IN A RED RANK GAME IS ~91.5%
This sounds like more than 80% lmao, even if its statistics and not reality...
Devs, I hope you were not talking seriously...
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I think DS is one of the few cancers of this game. i mean killers already have precious little time to work, so if everyone in the enemy team brings DS its an aditional 4 extra chases you have to engage in.
Which is pretty mental.
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I think the OP already took this into account.
It has a 46% chance of being used by at least one Survivor.
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No he did not:
"[I] wrote down the perks of 100 red rank survivors I got matched with."
Also, 2 DSes per game makes perfect sense.
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Because they didn't know how to pressure gens and instead decided to bandaid it. The only times gen speeds become problematic is on terrible maps.
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Survivors also have better overall perk quality to be fair
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46% of Survivors running DS in 100 games means that there should be roughly two per game.
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Yes
Also, according to my calculations, DS does not appear in 8% games.
Seems fair to me
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Hello, thanks for your work !
To clear out any ambiguity, could you explicit what calculations you used to obtain these % numbers ?
May be you could share the raw numbers ?
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O think these are the raw numbers, sample size was 100, so 1% is 1 person.
Would be cool if he uploaded all data though
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Like @Archimedes5000 wrote, 1% = 1 person.
If you are interested in the numbers for a specific perk, feel free to ask me. But I don't think it makes sense to post a full list with all the perks (like Autodidact for example) which have been picked by one single player.
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Normally I would agree that something that is overused needs to be nerfed. But in this case it was fixing a basic problem with the way the game is, and that is the matches going by too quickly for many killers to do anything. It was a bandaid perk that was ripped off while the wound was still festering, and now its bleeding pus everywhere. It was nerfed before an actual fix was put into place, and we now have this situation of five minute matches while survivors wait in 15-20 minute lobbies. Why wasn't the problem that Ruin was mitigating not fixed before its nerf?
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If you tunnel each of those survivors. Sure.
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You rekt them
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Except DDS triggers even when yyoyou ddodondontdont ttutuntunntunnetunnel
Edit: ######### happened here, looks like forum had a stroke.
Post edited by Archimedes5000 on1 -
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Your logic makes absolutly no sense. Ruin was used 80% and it affected 4 people every single trial.
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I may have an extremely stupid question to the OP, but when you say 46% DS usage rate, it means 46 survivors out of those 100 had DS in their build, right?
Or am I extremely dumb?
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Well yes?
You cant equip more than one DS, so this is the only thing it could mean
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Hmmm how many surviviors and killers are there in a game again? I think it was 4 vs 4, or something like that...
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Correct, since 100 survivors = 100%, 46 of them had DS in their builds.
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Yes, like, 2 or 3 instead of 0.
4 man swf squad are roughly less than 5% of games.....
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Depends on whether the killer dodges lobbies. A killer who is more likely to dodge will maybe play against 2% 4-men-SWF, while a killer who doesn't dodge might face a 4-men group 15-20% of the time. So if a killer player who doesn't dodge believes "I definitely face full SWFs more often than 1/20 matches", they are probably right.
Also these stats are one year old. Who knows what changed since then? The most used perks surely did. I would love to see current numbers but since the devs said we won't get any perk statistics anymore, we probably won't get SWF statistics either. 🤷 Pretty hard to discuss anything when there is a lack of hard numbers.
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ofc the devs will ignore the fact that 1 DS in a game forces you to have to treat every survivor like they have DS because there's NO indication to see who actually has it
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Schrodinger's DS.
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how does tunneling change the fact you have to capture them X amount of time to get them killed unless you camp them?
it doesnt. Tunneling doesnt matter
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What percent of the community is Spine Chill Gang?
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I listed this in the op - the perk made it into the Top 10.
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Oh.
Paying attention isn't my strong suit.
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I wonder if we gonna get hit with the "The statistic's we're greatly skewed" next.
This is why they want to alway's hide statistic's they take, and the ranks. Then the community can't call them on responses like this, while they directly defend only caring about the Survivors fun in the game.
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I mean from what players who manually track data, the values they say they see seem accurate. For example, I started recording, what survivors, perks, items and addons I saw as killer. I've only got about 30 games worth of data so far. Which is not enough for an accurate calculation of usage in games. Yes, Perks like DS and Borrowed time are in the most used perks, neither of those break 50% usage. EDIT: Unbreakable isn't even the top 10 most common perks
However people seem to forget that if every perk was perfectly balanced, you only have up to 4 killer perks per game, but you can have up to 16 survivor perks perk game. So yes to the people that say, I see DS every game, ya, you probably do, I am currently tracking about 40% usage, which means I should expect 1-2 survivors per game to run it.
BHVR specifically talks about usage stats overall, meaning how many survivors run the perk in all of the games over all, not how often a perk shows up per game. Which does not really favor killers, they have fewer perks than all survivors combined per game.
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All I have to say about BHVR taking statistics. Hopefully they learned from the Ruin nerf, that you shouldn't make such big game changing updates on just a flat statstic alone. Figure out "Why is this perk being used most often in high ranks" rather than "80% in high ranks is using this perk, therefore it's broken, and needs to be nerfed. Why? Because the bad survivors said so".
Then again they do only show to have that "Will the survivor have fun" only mindset when making changes anyways, so I probably shouldn't put hope there.
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Xbox still is without ded servers nor ever optimized so things like consistently hitting the DS check may drive down usage
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It's also not quite true that usage of DS affects only two people. Any obsession perk forces a killer to play around DS, when ruin was visible right away (in 80% of red rank games). Its somewhat like noed, except noed works ONLY at endgame. Killer should know if survivor has a DS as soon as he gets hooked to be comparable, I guess?
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I mean that ruin nerf only effected 80% of the killers at red ranks. For example, I am a red rank killer main who plays a wide range of killers including Huntress, Spirit, Piggy, Ghost Face and Oni. I've never even made ruin a teachable to use on any killer and I still managed to get to red ranks.
Was it harder? Probably. But being a part of the 1/5 part of killers who didn't use ruin at red ranks, I actually wanted ruin changed. I won't admit that every one of my games have been perfect, I've easily had games where the right group of SWF work got gens done super quick and I just lost, but those were always such outliers it never really mattered to me. For example, out of all my killer games this past weekend, I got on average 3 kills, with more 4k's than 0-1k games.
I honestly believe the reason there are so many killers on here complaining about how complicated it is to "win" the game is simply because they care more about their own enjoyment to get the statsification out of tie. The game is a competitive 1v4 game in which the dev's have said they want an average of 2 kills and 2 escapes per match. Which to me says, people need to worry less about getting a 4k and just try to have more fun in the game.
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It’s also a bigger population with more viable perks so of course the % will be lower
its just logical
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The most common survivor perks complained about (DS, Borrowed Time and Unbreakable) have easy ways to counter them probably 80% of the time.
- DS: Literally slug or chase someone else.
- BT: Chase the rescuer
- Unbreakable: Don't slug for more than 30 seconds.
Where as Ruin went one of 3 ways and it really depended and where the totem spawned.
- Was cleansed in the first minute of the game, be completely useless
- Was cleansed within the first 3 minutes of the game, which is I think what the devs wanted out of it
- Lasted so long the survivors stood no chance against it.
Also everyone keeps bringing up the usage factor of Ruin and skipping completely over the other reason the Dev's said they wanted to change ruin. It was simply to strong of a perk combo when combined with Pop. To be fair, until killers made Ruin+Pop a standard, I never really minded ruin before. Basically a percentage of killers found a way to easily secure a 4k every game ruining the experience for the other 4 players in the match.
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The ruin nerf was needed. It was greatly skewing statistics. What I mean is they made a big change, without knowing why people were running it in the first place, and without any remedies when they did it. However when they make ANY changes to survivors they tip toe around it, and often end up doing the complete opposite - buffing them instead. Which you see with the Chains of Hate update. Small changes without complicated thinking/concepts is how you should be making changes in games. Look at some of the top mmo games out there like World of Warcraft, Final Fantasy XIV, League of Legends, Smite, Dota, Overwatch, etc. They all went through these mistakes already, and we've all seen it when we've played these games too.
Anyway's by making this mistake consistently update, after update. They have reached a point where playing Killer - at any rank. Is horrendous. Playing survivor solo is nearly just as bad. They won't balance the game - at all around SWF. So it's not only the most powerful entity in the game, but the most broken, and only way players are finding to have fun. (Before you hit me with that SWF statistic, that was solo VS 4man swf, not 2man swf, or 3man swf. By observation alone, and most streamers you see on twitch you can tell most survivors play with at least one other person when not just ranking up).
The issue with the Dev's version of win - is that it's not the same as the games version of "win". Many times, and I mean MANY times. Most times. When a killer only get's 2 kills a round the end game screen is screaming "Entity Displeased" and you either black pip or de-pip. That doesn't feel like a win at all, at the same time playing when 2 players escape and the other two have already died, and left chat. You can be sure those two players are not making you feel like a winner in end game chat, and the end of the game. It doesn't feel like a win at all - even the game tells you it's not a win. The survivors you faced don't treat it like you did well. Then the dev's follow up trying to say "You did win". I'm sorry but if my nexus blows up in League of Legends and the game crosses my screen with a big ol' "Defeated" it doesn't feel like a win, does it?
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Or you can, like myself and many others, learn to hit skillchecks
it’s second nature at this point and even combo’d with pop games were still fine, assuming your team weren’t potatos.
now it’s M1 while sleeping
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It is amazing that people never bring up that ruin taught all of the good survivors how to hit great skillchecks because you had to.
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You realize your argument is, design the game around a mechanic that is supposed to reward players with a higher skill than the actual mechanic. I've always hated the argument, "git gud, hit greats". Hitting great skill checks isn't the way that mechanic was designed, it was meant to reward those players for getting better not to be the way the game was meant to be played.
assuming your team weren’t potatoes.
Solo survivors have zero control over this, crap when I do play SWF at least one of my four friends will potato all night long.
As to your last statement, its counter productive to your point. Your point being, I was already hitting great skill checks so it didn't really matter, followed by now its just M1 while sleeping. Ruin actually made you hold M1 longer with no reward for hitting great skill checks. Without ruin you get to hold M1 less, even more so if you are always hitting the great skill checks.
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