any survivor who use DS can be moried by the killer

With no other changes that doesn't really change a lot, because people could just exclusively use DS after their second hook/struggle phase. At that point the only thing they lose out on by being a mori target is any potential flashlight/pallet/head on/sabo saves that might've happened if the killer had to take them to a hook.

This would also result in more people just happening to have it at endgame where it's the most powerful, even the people that go out of their way to use it on the killer as soon as possible will keep it until endgame as a result of this.

That's fair, and I honestly agree there. I just know some people would be way more angry about losing more kills at endgame to DS than now than they'd be happy about getting more hooks and points earlier in the game.

Guess it comes down to a player's goals. Pips/points vs raw kills.

DS on its own makes sense. The problem is that survivors know they can abuse is so they intentionally run at the killer after being unhooked. I'd prefer if the game could measure if you spent more time running away from the killer after the unhook or more time running towards the killer while in their terror radius after the unhook. If it's the former, then DS should work as intended. If it's the latter, then after you get off the killer's shoulder, he automatically swings behind his back and smacks you straight into the ground.

So, you want a free mori one because I use the anti-tunnelling perk as intended?

A lot of survivors these days have taken to using it since more killers have been tunnelling after the Ruin rework. If they all stopped, then the number of DS users will fade naturally.

Down and hook someone in the EGC, especially anywhere within half the map of an exit. If there is BT they'll get away for free anyway, but even if not, you have to respect DS. If not, they get away for free anyway too.

If you jump in a locker, the killer can't even slug you. they are FORCED to grab you and eat the DS. Unless they sit in front of the locker for a minute and then boop you when you eventually get out (or it wears out, which they have to time mentally anyway). either way, they gave up anything they could have elsewise gotten JUST to secure the kill.

Its bad design. Overall its not bad, but its HIGHLY exploitable in situations that have a very high frequency of occurring, which makes it bad unless there is some type of failsafe that prevents exploitation. They removed the BT bonus on the unhooker because people exploited the hell out of it, and this is an example of people giving evidence why a similar change would be beneficial to the health of the game.

BT and DS are exploitable, huh?? How about tunnelling and slugging?

Don't punish people because a few cheat the system.

Most of the time I get tunnelled, it's nowhere near a locker, or I'm left on the ground as they run after the other guy.

If you also try the risky unhook with BT, I'm sorry, but I owe you nothing.

I would also propose that slugging the 3rd person for a guaranteed 4k is on the same level as DS/BT in EGC and is therefore fair game while killers continue to abuse this particular mechanic.

its not though, unless they make it so the hatch doesnt spawn (or at least isn't visible to survivors) until they are the last survivor alive. The hatch is a busted mechanic that has been a balancing point of contention for ages, for that exact reason: it will always favor one side or the other. Killers slugging for the 4k is them not knowingly putting themselves at a disadvantage, since the hatch isn't a surefire victory. When i am survivor and it comes down to the hatch, i just wait at an exit gate for the killer to find the hatch, then i start opening the gate the second it pops. 9/10, i get away for it (depending on proximity.) Its a surprisingly safe bet, when i legitimately "lost" based on finding the hatch as a "win condition" on top of all the other win conditions I would have lost to get to that point. Its just bad design.

Also if you just got unhooked, there is a VERY strong chance there is a locker nearby. You might not see it, but most hooks have at least 1 hook within walking distance, barring some in places like the middle of a cornfield. Seriously, keep an eye out, they are EVERYWHERE.

while I agree that it needs a nerf, this is not the way it should be. instead of punishing cocky DS users, we should try and prevent them. make it so that if

1. they start working on generators, totems, hooks, unhooks, or chests the perk deactivates as to prevent the 60 seconds of essentially immunity
2. the killer hooks somebody else while you are not on the ground the perk deactivates so that it actually becomes an anti tunnel perk.

however, we should also add that the perk timer will not go down while you are down so that slugging is no longer necessary

this will help make DS a fair perk without gutting it like ruin

This game is full of So many whiny people 😂 killer players have plenty of fun, just learn and adapt. But yeah I’m gonna stand by the fact that DS needs a longer stun duration. It doesn’t cover the 7 seconds of track marks so killers are just gonna come after you again. It only has a one time use. And the skill check is super small. It’s not really a fair enough perk for its purpose.

Maybe you played fair and it was not fair to DS you, but in general killers like to tunnel to death survivors, so DS is ok. Endure.

Boil Over doesn't actually increase wiggle speed or else it would be a meta perk. It makes the killer sway to the side a certain percentage more than usual which is what's essentially useless.

I think that it's a fair trade-off as both DS/BT prevent the other side from doing their ojective. And yes, in this case the hatch is the survivor's objective.

Hatch isn't an objective, its a participation trophy that gives an extra 5k bloodpoints.

I do play killer more. As soon as I got to level 40 I saw 3 back to back ebony Mori’s and who knows how many more when I keep leveling. It’s kinda ridiculous they call those “ultra rare” when it should be more like “common”

I main plague. But I have no problem getting 3-4K a game. I also have Astro A50s and a 50 inch 4K TV with a 4K Xbox. So... you’re not really hiding and not injured unless you have IW.

look all I’m saying is, I don’t think Ebony Mori’s should be in the game as they don’t allow people to keep playing. I think with how easy it is to get someone hooked once why should you be able to kill them after that? The game is handing you different ways To either sneak up on survivors or find them using aura perks. I just don’t think it’s fair. There’s nothing that gives survivors the ability to make up for that death is there? Can they insta repair a gen to make up for that? No they can’t. I’m telling you it’s not as stressful as you think, some killers are really built for gen control. Those first 3 gens will fly but once they get down to the last 1-2 gens on me it can be rather difficult for survivors to get it undetected. Killers get off unfair hits all the time from lag, vaulting, lunging. I think they give killers too much. I’ve played both sides. But there are so many games where I see teammates getting laid out and idk what you guys really should be complaining about playing killer... only complaints I see are ones that are just so situational that nerfing them would only make it useless. Yet killers wanna have all their stuff go untouched? Okay.

if you're playing on X1, its understandable. TBH the game is pretty wildly different in playerbase on console vs pc, let alone between regions. For everything you mention about stuff like "unfair hits", false positives happen a lot as well, which ive specifically been able to take advantage of as survivor where the killer thought he hit me and also seen while window hitting someone and having them mysteriously run from the window unscathed. thats dedicated servers, and it punishes anyone who isnt acting like 5 seconds ahead of what they see sadly because 200ms is a-ok.

Also literally nobody LIKES ebony moris, they're yet another bandaid fix to how absurdly fast gens can potentially go. I hate using them and i hate being killed by them. But i also hate games being over in less than 5 minutes.

and the "objective" of the killer is to kill. Are we ok with the killer slugging everyone and letting them bleed out so nobody can theoretically get the hatch?

You 100% a rank 20 killer

I find DS pretty useless. I only seem to get tunneled if I don't have the perk. Same thing with unbreakable, I only get slugged without it.