When Are Keys and Memento Moris Getting Changed/Removed
Seriously, they ruin the game.
It's not fun to do next to nothing special and basically guarantee a win.
This is especially true for Moris, as after only a single hook you can completely remove someone from the game, and it's especially unfun when the person has to wait 10+ minutes to play a game only to get booted from it in less than 5.
Keys, on the other hand, can basically guarantee an instant escape as long as the survivors do enough generators (which doesn't take long at all) and then find it.
So, when are keys and Moris getting changed or removed? Neither is fun for either side. Moris completely turn the tide of a game, whilst keys secure and easy escape.
Comments
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I think this is merely an opinion I think keys are fine, as a killer if you don’t want to chance that run franklins and one hit and their key is gone. I find that killers 4K or close hatch more times than a survivor can escape with a key.
Moris benefit killers so I highly doubt devs will remove them.
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If you were going to ask for a change, what would you have in mind?
I've always been of the opinion that Ebonies (Cypress and Ivory are fine how they are) should have to have everyone hooked at least once, have the survivor been hooked twice, or both, before you can do it.
As for keys the only real solution to that is to buff a killers ability to find the door, i honestly couldn't think of a justifiable change to how keys function now.
Personally i think Moris are fine if you use them responsibly and keys ive never had too much of an issue with, so I'm just throwin' my hat in the ring.
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Franklins is a joke. They will just pick it up again.
Keys are stronger then moris in acrually benefiting your points.
You mori a person? Brutal killer incomming.
Key? Easy pip.
Keys need no effort. You can hide until your mates die and wait until the killer closes hatch and then run to it. No counterplay possible.
For moris you need to get hooks at least.
Both are massively overpowered and should get a rework.
Moris should have the condition to hook EVERYONE first.
Keys should have a 10 second cast time + only work for 1 person.
DS should be nerfed into stop working when hopping on a gen but give the opportunity too counter a mori(if its active while being moried)
Both sides would be happy
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Why wouldn't they remove Moris just because they benefit killer?
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Wow, the amount of disinformation here is staggering.
1) Franklin does not "remove" keys in any capacity, it simply makes the survivor drop said key, which can then be picked up by any other survivor during the match.
2) Keys don't have to be brought into the match, as they can be found in chests, so the idea of "just bring Franklin's" doesn't hold weight. And even if I have Franklin's, there's no guarantee I will come across the survivor who FOUND the key in a chest before they find the hatch. If you think that level of RNG is fair for any side you're clearly bias.
"I find that killers 4k or close hatch more times than a survivor can escape with a key"
Really cause I find the exact opposite, I will often end up with a defendable three gen before I suddenly watch three survivor icons go from normal to escaped with no chance for me to do anything about it. Was I supposed to psychically know they had decided to hunt for a key instead of finishing the last gen? How do I acquire this psychic knowledge exactly?
"Moris benefit killers so I highly doubt devs will remove them"
Ok, bias confirmed, if you actually think the devs favor killers over the survivors who throw out oodles of cash for cosmetics, not to mention the thousands of wannabe twitch morons who main survivor you're actually delusional.
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ebony needs to go
its stupidly powerful and game changing
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Cypress Mori should be a basic ability. It does literally nothing to be an offering.
Ivory Mori should be very rare and should activate after hooking at least 2 survivors.
Ebony Mori should activate after hooking all four survivors at least once +1 additonal hook and only be able to kill 2 survivors.
Broken Keys should have the most charges. Something like 30 charges.
Dull Keys should take 30 seconds to open the hatch and reveal the auras of any person w/ the key to the killer within 30 meters.
Skeleton Keys should take 15 seconds to open the hatch and reveal the aura of the person using it within 15 meters.
Moris should be able to be canceled with a pallet stun.
Keys shouldn't be able to open a hatch closed by the killer.
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Well I don’t know what you play on but the information isn’t staggering or incorrect. I didn’t say that it would make the key disappear but the chances of finding where they key was dropped is slim; coming from a main console survivor. Furthermore there are more people playing solo than in swf to nerf how many people can escape with a key.
and unless you run plunders the chances of finding a key is about slightly higher than your chance to escape off the hook
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Ahem, your exact quote.
"as a killer if you don’t want to chance that run franklins and one hit and their key is gone."
It's not hard to find a dropped item as the game prompts you to pick it up when you walk over it, you don't even need to be right on top of it so yes, you were objectively wrong.
Second, this isn't a conversation about SWF or solo, the point was keys skew the game for survivors just as bad if not more so than a Mori will skew the game for killers.
Third, I don't give two halves of a flying (BAD WORD) whether it's a 4% chance or a 1% chance, the point still stands survivors can find a key in a chest, something that does not happen with a Mori under any circumstance.
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-100% agree. At the very least it could be a flashy way to end a match if you don't care about emblems.
-Another whole heart agree.
-This one i sort of agree with in theory, but it messes up a few things. For instance, the only way to get Blood on your Face would be to run tombstone Shape. It's just one of those things where not having it would be stupid. I think the conditions where you can mori just need refining.
-I think broken keys are good where they are. If anything, it should have 15 charges max, if anyone else thinks 10 isn't enough. Or just bring prayer beads.
-I started writing an explanation of how unfair this one could be, but the more i thought about it the more i think it could be interesting. 3 survivors 4 gens done, one of them would have to commit. 2 survivors 3 gens done, one of them has to commit. 1 survivor and the gates closed, its a viable alternate to the exit gates.
-The problem i DO have with the dull/skeleton key ideas you had were the auras. At that point bringing a key in from lobby would be suicide, even with a skeleton key, and unless you know where the hatch will spawn just setting it down wherever at best wastes upwards of a minute when you do find the door. It also ruins all key addons for anything that isn't broken, as whats the point of seeing everyone/the obsession/the killer if they can see you pretty well, at no loss or input from the killer. And if you happen to find one in a chest, no one in their right mind would take it unless they had the incredible improvisation of finding the trapdoor, assessing that it's the only viable option, going to look for a chest, finding a key, and using it, all assuming they can sneak around the killer. And even then they'd have a 15-30 second time to open it where the killer ALREADY knows where the door is. even at a 3 survivor 4 gen situation that wouldn't be a good use of time, unless maybe you were on a bad map with a terrible 3-gen situation.
-This one i can see the thought behind but disagree. Not for gameplay stuff, i think it would make sense if a killer doesn't re-position a survivor before they mori it might be punished, but, for example, the Spirit stabs right through the chest, Ghost Face makes swiss cheese out of them, the Shape slices them up good...the survivor wouldn't survive, even IF the killer suddenly lost grip/got off. It wouldn't make sense and it's honestly such an inconsequential thing that it wouldn't hurt anyone to keep it the way it is.
-This one i agree with, however i think it should be a 30 second-1 minute cooldown rather than indefinitely.
Hope this doesn't come across as rude, i just think moris and keys are both an integral part of the game/tool for each party, but also need some pretty beefy changes to make fun for everyone.
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Not rude at all! Your points were articulated well and I totally understand why you think that. Of course these probably shouldn't be taken word for word and put in the game. These were more of brainstorm ideas that would work well as a general idea for change.
Ebony Mori change seems pretty good. It doesn't completely screw survivor teams as long as they can win chases enough to prevent the Mori, though different conditions altogether might be the better alternative.
I feel as though broken keys don't really have much to offer. They look like regular keys (make a different model for broken keys plz) so the killer will probably focus on you, which might have you die really fast, and they're literally completely useless without add-ons. Increasing the amount of charges or giving base aura reading might be fine alternatives since they offer nothing on their own unlike their very rare and ultra rare counterparts.
Maybe an alternative would be to replace the aura while opening with a directions noise?
True, it would be largely inconsequential, though I do think it would be fair to give both survivors and killers a way to counter each others's trump cards in some kind of way. New Mori animations are also something the devs have considered... so maybe a window of time in which the survivor isn't dead in which they can be saved?
With the proposed changes and how it would take a bit of time to open the hatch, having a cool down to use the key after hatch has been closed seems good.
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The problems with keys are the RNG factor of finding one in the game and being able to do nothing about it. Additionally having a free escape for the whole team at the end is bad, however, keys require survivors to work together to do at least part of their objective (depending on how many are alive)
The problems with mori is that you can use it to hook someone, then tunnel them out of the match completely very quickly, since DS doesn't even counter it.
Moris and keys can easily be fixed:
Keys:
- Make it so keys can't be found in a trial
- Keys only allow 1 survivor to go through the hatch
- Keys are now consumed once a survivor with it dies on hook.
Moris:
- Make yellow mori base kit
- Ebony and Green mori stay the same but require you to get 6 hooks (no longer requires you to use it on a survivor that is already hooked)
These changes solve both problems in preventing RNG keys, and allowing killers to prepare for them, as well as them having a way to remove one from the match completely. It also prevents the issue of the entire team getting a free escape when a killer works at getting a successful 3 gen. It stops moris from being oppressive in the early game, and makes them a mid to late game option, while still requiring the killer to get a good amount of hooks (remember 6 is half their objective) and makes it more in line with keys for survivors, requiring them to do a significant portion of their objective to be used..
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