New map design vs now useless perks.
It's been a long time coming. But now noticing that most best loops will only about get two uses unless killer permits more. It makes you wonder. What perks are now p and pointless and need changing:
Bamboozle. Definitely pointless, even more so now.
Zenshin tactics. Was only for those with no map awareness.
Cruel Limits. Again, unless you're chasing them at the exact time they pop gen, useless as they dont need to jump windows.
Lithe I thought was good, especially for getting good distance on killer after a loop. Very strong for the best of loops. Now seeing as how most windows will just have a door right beside it, what is the point for vaulting most windows now.
Windows of Oppurtunity. Survivor Zenshin Tactics basically.
I'm sure there are more. My question is, these are perks that just aren't used, where this game should be encouraging to use any set, not just the current meta. Hopefully these perks are taken note on and will be re-worked to be better in the upcoming patch. Hopefully when Candyman comes out, there arent going to be as many problems. But hey, its BHVR here, 1 step forward, 2 steps back.
Comments
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Honestly the perks that you’ve listed do exactly what they do (except Cruel Limits that’s a bad perk). Windows and Zen Tactics help new players and Lithe still gives you a sprint burst after a fast vault.
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You're acting like this patch made those perks not viable.
Besides Bamboozle, none of those perks we're viable.
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Regarding Zenshin tactics, Cruel Limits and Windows of Opportunity:
Those were not used often. I can see Windows as a semi-decent Perk, but Cruel Limits and Zenshin Tactics were nearly useless. Windows could need a Buff anyway, the range is too low.
Lithe-->Depends how the Loops are. It will still be used, I guess, from what we have seen on the Screenshots, only the problematic Windows will have a Door. I highly doubt that Jungle Gyms will get a doorway next to the Window. Changing Loop Tiles or the distance between Tiles will not Windows disappear.
Bamboozle-->This Perk basically had its justification for God Windows, but lets be real, people were using Bamboozle on mindgameable structures, because then they would not need to learn how to mindgame. They will still use Bamboozle, because why bother to learn how to run Tiles as Killer, when you can simply dedicate a Perk Slot to have it easier.
So yeah, the first three I mentioned could get some love anyway, but I dont think that Lithe or Bamboozle need changes.
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Bamboozle can still be useful literally everywhere else.
Zanshin Tactics and Cruel Limits are already bad perks.
Lithe can be used everywhere else and it will give you a reason to vault the new windows: to get the speed boost.
Windows of opportunity can still be useful literally everywhere else plus it shows pallets.
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Killers will continue running Bamboozle. The time you save on a good maze tile or LT wall is still very profitable. Especially now that they don't spawn as close together you can get rid of stronger loops pretty early. Also people are lazy..
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Anyone see the "doors" in the pictures near god loops as breakable walls that have been broken and not just...doors? Cuz that was my take. There's a similar god loop on the new map that just has breakable wall next to a window. Since the pictures were in a post that mentioned using new tools at there disposal, and the newest map related tool is breakable walls, I think that's most likely what is being shown.
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I hope windows and zanshin will just get buffed to be passive aura reading without a cooldown. Trading a perkslot to get more map awareness to learn looping seems pretty balanced to me.
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I like running Windows once in a while because it tells me which pallets are used and which ones aren't without me needing to actually check so it saves me time and effort lmao. A buff is always appreciated though, it's not like it's an insanely overpowered perk.
The only windows getting a door beside them are the busted ones so Lithe really won't be affected that much, unless you genuinely just used Lithe to run the busted windows. I can see it being used a lot more strategically on certain maps when tiles and jungle gyms aren't just mindlessly placed next to each other and help you close the gap to the next jungle gym. I'm certainly going to give it a try in the PTB and who knows I might even run it all the time from now on seeing how Dead Hard sometimes gets me killed anyways. We'll see though.
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I never even seen 4/5ths of the perks you mentioned.
I don't even know ######### they are to be honest.
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What about bbq and chilli on smaller maps?
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The point I was making was that although the were hardly used before, now they are just forgotten. I want all perks in this game to be viable for use. Just highlighting that there are a number of perks they will have to rework to cater for the new designs
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Make Your Choice, Devour Hope, BBQ, Object of Obsession, Sole Survivor, any distance related perks will need to be considered no matter how often they're used. Sure some of these seem fine as it is buts just to analyse just how these are going to play for both sides in the long run.
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Without a doubt, Lithe would still be good. It's just the typical, here is what the new set of frequently used perks are. Instead of making it that all perks are viable for a particular play style, half the roster just isnt used. Whens the last time someone ran Sole Survivor, Buckle Up, Streetwise or whatever. Sure with new rework, the odd Streetwise but should people have to use a perk to make something reliable? Now what 'God loops' are now is probably two uses if lucky and that's fine, forces variation and effort but other spots will just have really sketchy placements. We will have to see in the PTB just how viable these new designs are and if they are unbalanced for either side. Honestly, I feel like it's going to turn from a survivor biased game to killer biased which isnt going to be good either. 🤔
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Do you know how many ######### perks there are for killer that do nothing? I think there's about 10 good ones, and the rest are Buffalo Doo.
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Bamboozle will be worse, but still viable. (also worth noting that depending on the godlike window loop, Bamboozle might hardly work and the Survivor could outlast the blockage)
Zanshin/Windows aren't being affected that much because their entire premises are fundamentally flawed. The two Perks are bad no matter how many windows there are on a map.
Lithe is actually BETTER with a door next to these windows. A big problem Survivors have with Lithe is that it often triggers when you don't want it to, as vaulting a window often gives you a lot of distance over a Killer anyway, and gaining even more has very little purpose. With doors next to the windows Lithe pays off more consistently. The Survivor is in an overall worse situation with these loop nerfs but Lithe helps them out more.
Cruel Limits wasn't even remotely viable before anyway and is one of the worst Perks in the game, I don't think anyone's going to mourn it becoming slightly worse because of map changes. Though, it IS worth noting that more and more openings in maps means Cruel Limits having an infinite or much, much longer duration is more of a possibility, which is actually a rework to potentially get excited over.
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If it DOES turn from Survivor Sided to Killer Sided then that's excellent news.
Not because being Killer sided is somehow inherently better. But because it implies that perfect balance would lie between this patch and the PTB, which is a relatively small margin.
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I don't think these doors are actually doors. I think they're breakable walls that have been broken.
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actully lithe is now stronger beceause some window are unsafe so having a speed boost make the old infinite safe for at least one loop
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Agreed. There’s no cool down on any other aura reading perks as far as I’m aware, and it’s not like seeing pallet/window auras is some overpowered ability. Even if they removed the cooldowns and buffed the range of both perks, I doubt they’d see much more use except by new players and in niche builds.
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If they would buff Range and remove the Cooldown, those two Perks might be useful learning tools. I see Windows as somewhat decent, because it might help Solo Survivors to see where Pallets and Windows are or which ressources have been used.
But without the things mentioned, new players will have an efficient learning tool and it would also help experienced players to learn new Maps (at least that is what I would use Windows for).
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