Survivors: why is this update to you the "ruin of the game"

sorry i wasn t talking about last nerfs.. i mean compare all the nerfs since the game was released. but your devotion shows that u wasn t around @ the broken times

Wow, showing off some bait threads. Pretty good job so far.

After many people got boosted to red ranks with nurse and her range/+blink addons, the devs made most of her addons meme addons, gave her about three to four good addons, nerfed her base power with giving her a CD on the blinks and fixed none of her bugs.

She's addon reliant and extremely difficult to play rn.

I don't play the killers you listed as having received nerfs to really feel the weight of the changes they received, but I can say that almost every single new killer gets adjusted in some way after release. This is not uncommon, and not a hit to the Killer community, it's meant to provide balance, like every other change in the game. Nurse really needed some changes and from the survivor perspective, she has remained the same in terms of facing her...a bad nurse is easy to escape, but a good nurse is absolutely lethal. I got steam rolled in a random team by a great nurse just the other day. It depends on who is playing her.

Spirit and Oni are also still incredibly powerful. Most matches I have with those two killers in-particular, in random matches, result in a 3-4k, which is not DBDs definition of balance. Although, I'm sure they are competitively matched in other group comps besides random solos. Like Nurse, I also can't agree that DS is weak, especially not a weaker version of Huntress from the survivor perspective. I can dodge a hatchet with ease. I cannot dodge a DS quick scope. If you are aiming down sights, prepare to get juked - but if you can quick scope survivors, there is almost no recourse. Again, a skilled player behind a Deathslinger is a very powerful Killer...one that has an instant shot and doesn't have to divert from a chase to reload, while boasting a tiny omnidirectional terror radius.

I never cared about ruin. Hitting a skill check is not that hard and when you miss it, it allowed for more gen time which was more gen points. So I never even bothered looking for Ruin because it's not difficult to play through. You could have kept your ruin, IMO. But new ruin is still very useful - I've had several matches now with killers running ruin where the totem was significantly well hidden...ruin in end game is super hard to overcome. In addition to the fact that Killers have POP, Thana, Overcharge, etc. to also help slow down gen progression.

If you would like to know why changes seem to sting survivors particularly hard, it is because the game has been continually tuned to help Killers have a more competitive edge against SWF teams, to the detriment of solo survivors. Every change that is meant to slow down or lessen the gap between a good SWF team and a Killer means those slow downs apply individually to solo survivors who don't have the same benefits of a coordinated team as SWF do. So what's a balance change to SWF feels like a nerf to solos. Here are some of the changes solo survivors have felt in the last year:

Windows closed

Less palettes

Less window/palette combinations

Increase in the number of unsafe palettes (+Killer hit priority, this is deadly)

New maps have been quite a bit smaller

More hooks

Hooks closer together

Totems remapped and better hid

EGC (is killer sided)

Hatch changes (are killer sided)

Hooks regen significantly faster

Inability to 99 hooks

Nerf to Insta-Syringe

Nerf to Styptic Agent

Nerf to toolboxes (you can argue they are faster, but the significant reduction in repair amount makes them next to useless when your entire toolbox can be nullified with 1 POP kick)

Nerf to self-care heal time

Nerf to DS selective use

Nerf to leader

Changes to door RNG that place doors closer together, despite EGC

...this is just a few, and doesn't include any of the changes to Killers that were additional and positive, like movement speed increases and the reduction of 'negative side effects' in perks.

Every time a core perk is changed to balance its use in a SWF team...or a loop is closed to stop elongated chases...solo survivors lose their competitive edge. They don't have the same benefits as SWF teams, yet they are expected to play as a team at that level because the game is being balanced to make the SWF/Killer dynamic more even.

Making maps smaller, increasing dead space, reducing palettes further, slowing gen speeds, and taking out every major loop on every legacy map is going to be very interesting for the solo survivor community. I am in the camp that thinks it will probably ruin the solo survivor experience because the solo survivor experience is already difficult, sweaty, and only marginally fun.

I don't begrudge Killers their balance. I understand that SWF is very frustrating - I experience it when I play Killer. I think the game should be balanced and everyone should be able to have fun, competitive game play. But to ignore the solo survivor community - the largest segment of the DBD player base - I think is a misstep. At least an unfortunate step for players like me. I hope they find a way to balance out the two segments within the survivor community too.

This was a very nuanced and empathetic response. I appreciate this. Really. I do hope that your experience is improved as well. It'd take a while and realistically, Behavior would have to take a sledge hammer to this entire game in order to be enjoyable for both parties but it'd be nice if it got there.

Here's the thing, I'm not really arguing with you that changes were needed to improve the QoL of Killers. Especially after coming here and legitimately understanding there are issues for both sides. It was asked why survivors are so upset about the latest patch and this is the answer. It's not that these changes over the last 18 months weren't needed for Killers...it's that they are needed because of a dynamic in the survivor community that not everyone benefits from - in fact the majority doesn't benefit from.

The window/palette changes as well as the hook changes mentioned were not in reference to this PTB and were not a result of new maps, as they occurred before new maps came out. The first window, palette, and hook changes happened months ago. I don't remember the specific patch, but it wasn't recent. But they did happen - I specifically remember thinking it was bullshit. 😂

I agree with you that EGC was a good addition in terms of not having toxic people make a game unnecessarily long. It is, however, Killer sided for some reason. If it was solely to get survivors off the map, you wouldn't have doors purposely being put closer together to make it that much harder for the last remaining survivor to get one open. It is to the point that depending on the killer, I dont even try. I go do totems or open chests until the entity kills me because a high mobility killer with adjacent doors is a death sentence. Its no fun to know the game is so stacked against you in end game that you will not survive no matter what you do, even if you played the best and it resulted in you being the last remaining survivor. Even if you know you're going to pip. Thats not the objective of the game. All you really want as a solo survivor is a fair shot, and they stole that.

The same goes for the Hatch changes. I personally loved hatch stand offs. To me, it was a totally different element of the game. It was a test of wills. Who will swing or jump first. I understand a lot of people didn't like it...but I found it to be fun because it truly was a 50/50 chance. You are either going to get snatched out, or you'll make it. Now, you cant even enter the hatch if the killer is in too close of a proximity to it...so if you're a few steps ahead of the killer and go to jump in, you can get denied, but they can close it even if you're standing on it. Not to mention it can be closed and start EGC, which we already covered. And the likelihood of the killer finding it before you is high, given that they can and have freely traversed the map at top speed and you cannot.

I dont think I've ever seen a survivor ask for the changes that occurred to hooks. No one wanted those changes, and getting hook sabos is much more difficult. It actually doesn't take less time to sabo hooks if you consider the fact that someone hell bent on sabo would 99 the hooks, thus a hook drop would take a millisecond. Now, you have to correctly guess which hook the killer is going to (which is a feat in itself with the aforementioned hook changes) and prepare so that you can have it down in time to not put yourself in danger or you have to take a hit to accomplish it. This was not a benefit. I have yet to see a single person in a random match successfully execute a hook drop that saved someone. And since toolboxes are such garbage now, most people dont even have the resource to accomplish this.

On that note - a toolbox's primary function was to repair generators, and toolbox addons had already been significantly nerfed long before toolboxes were (IE: BNP), so no survivors are happy that their core function was gutted and we got a "buff" we didn't ask for and almost no one uses.

The change to the styptic agent is not a buff. You could take a hit before with how it worked - you could also heal yourself when needed. Now you have to correctly predict an 8-second window of when you're going to get hit and you have to effectively get away and mend or you'll go into a dying state anyway. It was absolutely a nerf.

I get that Killers didn't like the ruin change and were basically told to "adapt". That is what solo survivors have been told every single patch for the last year and a half. It's gotten very old. And the game hasn't gotten anything but more difficult and more toxic as these changes have occurred.

I am not saying the game should be balanced to solo survivors. I am simply expressing why the largest segment of the survivor player base is upset, as the posts asks. The game is too far into the changes its made to nerf SWF at this stage. The only option is to continue toward leveling the playing field between swf and killers, and do something that brings solo survivors back into the fold on a similar level as swf teams, IMO. Which is why I dont think the balance changes lies with nerfing killers vs. finding a way to provide balance within the survivor community itself.

Lots of killers are escapable once they find you, at least in my experience as an iron will wielding Claudette. 😂 He, on the other hand, like all ranged killers, are harder to escape because distance is not in your favor - as it is with a ghostface or a myers (aside from ghostface's broken ass stalk ability LOL).

I'm just advising from a red rank survivor perspective, a DS main is not hot garbage. Although, you are right, huntress gets some ridiculous hit box hits. You went around that corner a full second ago? Too bad, your invisible ass is still hanging out there somewhere. LOL I would argue that at least with a huntress at extreme close range (in her face) it is harder for her to hit you if she has a hatchet cocked. You wouldn't run at a DS...he can just spear you, M1 style. LOL

DOZENS of people have said that, if not more