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I think Hope should act like BT

NMCKE
NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
in General Discussions

I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

Comments

  • FrenziedRoach
    FrenziedRoach Member Posts: 2,600

    Hope is actually very good, it's just so many other perks are much better.

    Most killer's only run 15% faster than a survivor. With Hope, you cut their speed advantage in half (unless they are running NOED). If they are a slow killer like Hag, Huntress, and soon Spirit (assuming they keep her speed), you almost run as fast as they do.

    Default Survivor speed - 100%
    Hope Survivor runspeed - 107%
    Slow Killer runspeed (Hag and Huntress) - 110%
    Normal Killer runspeed - 115%

  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Nickenzie said:

    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

    Maybe increase it to 9 percent and to all teammates within 32 meters of the exit gates? It needs something to make it a little more useful 
  • Sally55
    Sally55 Member Posts: 368

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

    I think this is a neat idea tbh. As long as it Didn't stack with BT Saves.

  • TigerKirby215
    TigerKirby215 Member Posts: 604

    Feels very gimmicky. I'd just increase Hope's speed boost really. That tiny bit of extra speed really isn't helpful.
    Another option could maybe be to make Hope grant a Vigil effect, or increased action speed for Self Care and the likes.

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @lyric said:
    Maybe increase it to 9 percent and to all teammates within 32 meters of the exit gates? It needs something to make it a little more useful 

    It's already plenty useful. The problem is that Survivors either stick to their stale meta or are unaware of how massive a 7% speed increase really is.

  • lyric
    lyric Member Posts: 611
    Orion said:

    @lyric said:
    Maybe increase it to 9 percent and to all teammates within 32 meters of the exit gates? It needs something to make it a little more useful 

    It's already plenty useful. The problem is that Survivors either stick to their stale meta or are unaware of how massive a 7% speed increase really is.

    I’ve used it before but honestly if you’re gonna run an endgame perk like that I would prefer adrenaline over hope any day of the week 
  • Peanits
    Peanits Dev Posts: 7,555
    edited September 2018
    Hope is actually pretty dope. It nearly doubles the time it'll take for the killer to catch up. It'll more than double that time for any killer slower than 4.6m/s.

    The effect itself is pretty big, it's just situational. I think replacing it with endurance would just be frustrating more than anything because that one hit would often be more than enough to get to a gate anyway.
    Post edited by Peanits on
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @lyric said:
    I’ve used it before but honestly if you’re gonna run an endgame perk like that I would prefer adrenaline over hope any day of the week 

    That's up to you. However, Hope is a very powerful perk.

  • Bravo0413
    Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,647
    Sally55 said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

    I think this is a neat idea tbh. As long as it Didn't stack with BT Saves.

    It pretty much would give them old BT back since it's an end game perk... this would be broken just like old BT was 
  • Dragonredking
    Dragonredking Member Posts: 874

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless.

    I don't usualy do that because I don't like putting word in people mouth or people putting word in mine but...
    No matter how many time I read this, it still seem that you imply that hope is useless because it doesn't make you outrun the killer.

  • MegaWaffle
    MegaWaffle Member Posts: 4,172

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

    You don't want to increase Hope too much in speed because some killers only have 110% meaning if Hope gave you too much it would take a unprecedented amount of time to ever hit a survivor even once. I would like to see Hope increase the altruistic actions of those around you on top of the current speed boost. Maybe even if it increased the hook timer of the first person hooked after the exit gates are powered. Make it about filling others with hope but try not to overdo it as to make it too broken with SWF groups.

  • FrenziedRoach
    FrenziedRoach Member Posts: 2,600

    I always considered Hope to be the Counterpart to NOED. NOED increases the killer's speed by 8% if memory is correct.

    IMO, you can't increase the HOPE speed past 8%, otherwise you might make more killers feel inclined to run NOED to counteract it.

  • Sarief
    Sarief Member Posts: 543
    Dragonredking said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless.

    I don't usualy do that because I don't like putting word in people mouth or people putting word in mine but...
    No matter how many time I read this, it still seem that you imply that hope is useless because it doesn't make you outrun the killer.

    It simply means survives are so used to their broken perks like DS and SC that they think it's normal and everything else is underperforming. 
    They can't even imagine that SC is absurdly broken and it needs huge Nerf.

    You will see many more threads like that
  • Dragonredking
    Dragonredking Member Posts: 874

    @Sarief said:
    It simply means survives are so used to their broken perks like DS and SC that they think it's normal and everything else is underperforming. 
    They can't even imagine that SC is absurdly broken and it needs huge Nerf.

    You will see many more threads like that

    Thank you sherlock, I've been part of the community since day one, I already saw my fair share.
    I just feel like giving op the benefict of the doubt because I just came back for a long ass break from the forum and internet in generale and don't remenber seeing one of his/her post during the time I was active in the official forum.

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Sarief said:
    Dragonredking said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless.

    I don't usualy do that because I don't like putting word in people mouth or people putting word in mine but...
    No matter how many time I read this, it still seem that you imply that hope is useless because it doesn't make you outrun the killer.

    It simply means survives are so used to their broken perks like DS and SC that they think it's normal and everything else is underperforming. 
    They can't even imagine that SC is absurdly broken and it needs huge Nerf.

    You will see many more threads like that
    Umm rude? It's just a suggestion and I respect that you disagree with it but please don't assume I'm a survivor who wants a easy win. Geez sometimes I think that killer mains are 25% of the reason why survivors have a bad name to them.
    Dragonredking said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless.

    I don't usualy do that because I don't like putting word in people mouth or people putting word in mine but...
    No matter how many time I read this, it still seem that you imply that hope is useless because it doesn't make you outrun the killer.

    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    10% would make the Hag and Huntress worthless.

  • Sally55
    Sally55 Member Posts: 368

    @Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    10% would make the Hag and Huntress worthless.

    My thoughts exactly tbh

  • Dragonredking
    Dragonredking Member Posts: 874

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    If you make it a 10% increase you would literaly out run The Huntress, The spirit, The Hag and T1 myers.
    Hell even with current hope you can out run T1 myers since he has a 105% movement speed

  • thesuicidefox
    thesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,223

    Hope is a soft counter to NOED. You get a greater speed boost so you can loop as well as before. It also means Hag and Huntress won't be able to catch you, and Nurse will also have a tough time. The problem is it's end game survivor perk and you are better off using perks that help you get to end game over actual end game perks.

  • Iceman
    Iceman Member Posts: 1,457
    Dragonredking said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    If you make it a 10% increase you would literaly out run The Huntress, The spirit, The Hag and T1 myers.
    Hell even with current hope you can out run T1 myers since he has a 105% movement speed

    Hope only activates at the end of the game and by that point Michael Myers is T2 unless he is using that add on that stays at T1 
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @Iceman said:
    Hope only activates at the end of the game and by that point Michael Myers is T2 unless he is using that add on that stays at T1 

    At tier II you still cut his speed advantage by almost 50% with Hope.

  • Iceman
    Iceman Member Posts: 1,457
    Orion said:

    @Iceman said:
    Hope only activates at the end of the game and by that point Michael Myers is T2 unless he is using that add on that stays at T1 

    At tier II you still cut his speed advantage by almost 50% with Hope.

    Oh okay, I used it several time last month. And it really help me get ahead of Killers for a while until they was able to catch up with me again. 
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @Iceman said:
    Oh okay, I used it several time last month. And it really help me get ahead of Killers for a while until they was able to catch up with me again. 

    That's what it does - allows you to buy time, maybe win a chase if you're smart enough, or even get to the gates before the Killer.

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    edited September 2018

    @Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    10% would make the Hag and Huntress worthless.

    Not really, you can cut cornors! It's not too difficult to catch up, you just have to use your brain a little and think where the survivor is going to go vs where you going to go. However I don't think a minute would be too much tho since the survivor sacrificed 1 perk slot for a strong end game! :)

  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @Nickenzie said:

    @Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    10% would make the Hag and Huntress worthless.

    Not really, you can cut cornors! It's not too difficult to catch up, you just have to use your brain a little think where the survivor is going to go vs where you going to go. However I don't think a minute would be too much tho since the survivor sacrificed 1 perk slot for a strong end game! :)

    Cut which corners? The ones the Survivors can see over and immediately turn around?

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:

    @Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    No, I just want Hope to have something else besides a speed increase because it feels underwhelming to use. I'm just throwing some ideas around and it was just a thought in my head. However maybe a 10% speed increase for a minute instead of a 7% speed for two minutes? You can buff NOED to 10% if that you wanna balance it out! :)

    10% would make the Hag and Huntress worthless.

    Not really, you can cut cornors! It's not too difficult to catch up, you just have to use your brain a little think where the survivor is going to go vs where you going to go. However I don't think a minute would be too much tho since the survivor sacrificed 1 perk slot for a strong end game! :)

    Cut which corners? The ones the Survivors can see over and immediately turn around?

    I mean if 10% is too overwhelming then I can handle 8% for a minute, it's just that I don't feel anything when I use Hope. I remember when I was a rank 20 survivor and was able to keep a Freddy chasing me for a while.
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675
    edited September 2018

    @Nickenzie said:
    I mean if 10% is too overwhelming then I can handle 8% for a minute, it's just that I don't feel anything when I use Hope. I remember when I was a rank 20 survivor and was able to keep a Freddy chasing me for a while.

    7% is fine (according to the devs; I'd put it down to 5%, but that's just me). 8% is too much. You may not feel it, but I can tell you exactly what the difference is if you were running in a straight line vs. a Killer with 110% speed and another with 115% speed.

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    I mean if 10% is too overwhelming then I can handle 8% for a minute, it's just that I don't feel anything when I use Hope. I remember when I was a rank 20 survivor and was able to keep a Freddy chasing me for a while.

    7% is fine (according to the devs; I'd put it down to 5%, but that's just me). 8% is too much. You may not feel it, but I can tell you exactly what the difference is if you were running in a straight line vs. a Killer with 110% speed and another with 115% speed.

    Oh yeah, you have the Java Script! :)

    However it's all cool, I'm just throwing out some ideas! If it really does a lot more than I guess it doesn't need to be changed but I never can tell the difference, both as a killer and survivor.
  • Orion
    Orion Member Posts: 21,675

    @Nickenzie said:
    Oh yeah, you have the Java Script! :)

    However it's all cool, I'm just throwing out some ideas! If it really does a lot more than I guess it doesn't need to be changed but I never can tell the difference, both as a killer and survivor.

    Indeed, I have the Java Script.

    It's a subtle difference to the human brain, but it is there. Human perception of time is unreliable, especially when you're in a high-adrenaline situation.

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    Orion said:

    @Nickenzie said:
    Oh yeah, you have the Java Script! :)

    However it's all cool, I'm just throwing out some ideas! If it really does a lot more than I guess it doesn't need to be changed but I never can tell the difference, both as a killer and survivor.

    Indeed, I have the Java Script.

    It's a subtle difference to the human brain, but it is there. Human perception of time is unreliable, especially when you're in a high-adrenaline situation.

    Well, it's settled! 7% haste for two minutes is strong! :)

    Thank you for being civilized and have justification with your reasoning! I wished more people was like you to be honest!
  • Rattman
    Rattman Member Posts: 1,088

    Hope is weak? Try to use it with adrenaline, lol.

  • NMCKE
    NMCKE Member Posts: 8,243
    edited September 2018
    Rattman said:

    Hope is weak? Try to use it with adrenaline, lol.

    I didn't say hope is weak... I said hope feels underwhelming like you don't really feel its effects! However @Orion was able to explain it to me how much of a impact it has so I think Hope is fine! :)
  • Dabrownman1812
    Dabrownman1812 Member Posts: 1,857
    lyric said:
    Nickenzie said:

    I'm just throwing out some ideas since the current 7% haste doesn't feel like a lot since the killer will still catch up to you regardless. However I been thinking, would it be cool if Hope gave a 1 minute to 2 minute indurance status effect? I mean it actual helps against certain end game perks and the perk will hold true to its name! If you want, you can even get rid of the 7% haste status effect if this is too much or we can chance the number values. Opinions? Please leave civil feedback below! :)

    Maybe increase it to 9 percent and to all teammates within 32 meters of the exit gates? It needs something to make it a little more useful 
    Crazy idea, think of stacks always with survivor perks. If 2 run it they are 114 speed 3 is 121, it kills end game kills or catch up plays a killer can have, too to share.