http://dbd.game/killswitch
Anti-camp/tunnel/slug builds. No DS/BT/Unbreakable
People often complain about DS. People also often complain about things like tunneling camping ect. Here are some builds that can help with that as Survivor you might not have considered.
Anti-Tunnel Builds:
1: Poised, Lithe, Adrenaline, Quick and Quiet
Something you will notice in this build as well as many of the other builds here is that the objective of the build isn't the same as with second chance stacking.
You aren't stopping tunneling by tanking a million hits, you are stopping tunneling by stalling until you can outright lose the Killer for good.
Poised is the key here since it let's you remove scratchmarks for longer than any other perk does. Lithes speed boost and Adrenalines speed boost both let you take full advantage of this, as does Q&Q
2. Bond, Hope, Dead Hard, Spine Chill/Adrenaline
This time the strategy isn't to lose the Killer, but to simply hold the chase throughout the entire end game until the gates are opened.
Hope makes looping in the end game easy so if you can last that long then you can escape before the Killer can ever down you.
Dead Hard is the best perk for traditional looping due to its manual activation. Hence using that perk.
Anti-Camping Builds
1 (for if you are camped). Kindred, Leader, Sprint Burst, Iron Will
The idea here is simple: Use Kindreds aura vision to help the Unhooker find the perfect time where the Killer is looking away. Leader speeds up unhook times letting them pull you off super quickly, and then you sprint burst away and hide with iron will.
Leader also helps you get healed quickly making the Killer less likely to try and tunnel you immediately for being injured.
If you tend to get camped in the late game you can swap out iron will or sprint burst for Adrenaline instead.
2 (someone else is being camped). Babysitter, Spine Chill, Mettle of Man, Dead Hard
Babysitter is pretty obvious. Remove their scratchmarks and they can get away after the unhook.
Spine chill much like Kindred above helps with getting the exact timing, also helps ensure you unhook them a bit faster. It's not much but every bit helps.
This process is likely to give you a MoM stack after you body block for the unhooked. But more importantly, having it available can let you safely unhook even if it's a Leatherface or something. And Dead Hard serves a similar purpose of letting you get out of there afterwards.
Also you can use dead hard to bait a swing and then unhook while he recovers.
Anti-Slug builds
1 (You're being slugged). Soul Guard, Leader, Sprint Burst, Tenacity
Soul Guard and Tenacity are obvious. Leader helps the other Survivors pick you up faster and then you sprint burst the heck out of there.
2 (someone else is being slugged). For the People, Buckle up, Dead Hard, Resilience
For the people let's you instantly pick someone up from the dying state, buckle up makes sure the slugged person (and you) don't run right back into the Killer. Dead Hard so you can avoid going down immediately if the Killer shows up after you use for the people and Resilience because synergy.
Takeaway build (that trades strength for versatility):
Adrenaline, Soul Guard, Dead Hard, Leader
Camped? Leader for fast unhook and Dead Hard for a clean getaway. Adrenaline let's you tank an extra hit in the end game.
Tunneled? Leader speeds up gate opening. Dead Hard is a good general chase perk and Adrenaline resets the chase if you can last long enough, thus letting you Survive the endgame until the gates are openned.
Slugged? Soul Guard helps if they just camp your body and obviously has the hex interaction. Adrenaline can instantly let you pick yourself up and leader speeds up someone else picking you up.
If slugged at the right time you could have:
Adrenaline -> Soul Guard -> Dead Hard, all while leader helps the gate open super fast in the meantime.
Comments
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The moral of the story is that Leader is an underrated perk, since it's the only perk that lets other Survivors do actions faster on you, rather than the other way around.
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I appreciate the effort you put into trying to think about these scenarios, but a lot of these scenarios don't play out this way - and no one is going to use lesser perks to combat these play styles when there are more viable perks available.
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Eh yeah I know. The idea is to point out alternative methods instead of just DS, BT, Unbreakable every game.
At least try dropping DS, if you must keep unbreakable sure whatever but by explicitly limiting myself from using those perks I instead have to come up with other ways to solve the problems.
I pointed this out with the anti-tunnel builds. The point of them isn't to be a crutch, but to give your chases a win condition.
Even Decisive Strike doesn't stop tunneling, it deters it but it doesn't stop it. The builds I propose STOP tunneling. As in they could attempt to tunnel you and try chasing you all game, but still fail anyways. Particularly with the first build.
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I agree, DS doesn't really stop tunneling. A Killer will still pursue a DSer in a lot of cases and down them eventually anyway. The benefit is the waste of time, or its very strong end-game use. I don't think your builds stop tunneling either though - if they did, people would use them instead. For example, using babysitter to allow the off-hooked to have an easier time escaping. Killers with a tendency for camping/tunneling usually come back as a an off-hook is taking place, so they don't really need to see the scratch marks...they can see the survivor. The same with adrenaline...it does you no good for 90% of a match. It's only useful in end game, its most powerful use is completely situational, and you don't have control over when you use it. All the perks you listed are good perks - no doubt. I run Kindred. I run iron will. But DS and BT are a core part of my build because they are just more useful and effective than some of these other perks for these specific situations. But, if you find these builds work better for you and your play style - that's great. I have tried other builds, because I don't like feeling like I have to use the same perks over/over again just because camping/tunneling is so common. But alas, the second I dont have perks like BT...I get into a scenario where the only solution would have been BT. And I immediately revert back.
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Personally I just love trying to come up with as many builds as possible and trying to make every perk work for at least something.
For example whenever a new chapter is released I always make a list of perk build ideas that involve the new perks, and I try and use each perk at least twice. Even if it's only for gimmik builds.
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Soul Guard will become Meta.
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Im gonna give some of these a try tonight. :)
I used to run self care religiously, but eventually grew out of that. Maybe it could happen with DS/BT. 😂
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DS, BT, Unbreakable encourage tunneling and camping more than they dissuade it. If nobody ran those builds and instead ran a chase like they were trying to get away instead of to waste as much killer time as possible (which these perks enable big time), you'd see a lot less tunneling and camping.
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I don't doubt it.
Agreed. Tunnelers can't do ######### if you successfully escape the chase. Being invisible instead of invincible has it's advantages.
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I don't believe this is true.
Killers camp and tunnel because its one of the easiest ways to efficiently kill people. Not because survivors run specific perks. And if you can win a chase, tunneling isn't an option - true. I've had chases post-hook that lasted until my DS ran out. But that's not a very realistic scenario. How many people coming off a hook with the killer right there have an opportunity to even enter a chase? Not many.
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My personal favorite when solo queuing is Deliverance, DS, Sprint Burst, and Kindred/BT.
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Anti-Slug Build:
Tenacity
Flip-Flop
Boil Over
Breakout (Unbreakable would be better, but we have to remove that one per the rules)
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It's more the playstyle that these perks enable that makes camping and tunneling the easiest ways to kill people. With the current state of the game, everything the killer does is reactive to the survivors. If it were easier to escape the killer but harder to maintain a chase, tunneling and camping wouldn't be anything but griefing a bad player and a sure path to losing MMR. Right now the survivors have all the tools to maintain a chase pretty much as long as they don't make an obvious mistake, which is far more valuable (in terms of wasting killer time) than getting away - so they don't even consider other perks or modes of gameplay. Just loop. Tunneling and camping is just a reaction to that.
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Ignore her, this is a good thread
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This paragraph is why Scratchmarks are ultimately the source of this games problems, and thus why I value perks like Poised so much from a game design standpoint.
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Tunneling sure, but camping is extremely inefficient. 60 seconds per phase is longer than a typical chase would have taken.
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Scratchmarks are a big problem too, but ultimately it comes down to how one-dimensional the killer's game is. Hooking people to death is their only positive feedback loop - there's no other way for them to influence the outcome. Survivors have many different things they can do in their approach to success, including being able to interfere dramatically with the killer's only available feedback loop - meaning they can try to win the game while they prevent the killer from being able to try. These are the perks that enable it, so it's not surprising to see an obsessive focus from killers.
I do feel like if you just swapped the "terror radius" from the killer to the survivor (and made it much smaller) and made scratchmarks fade much sooner (if not eliminate them entirely) you'd have a healthier chase dynamic that didn't invariably devolve into running circles around piles of trash. It'd put a priority on getting distance from the killer rather than just finding ways to dodge him indefinitely. Granted, of course, that you didn't have 3 or 4 ways to avoid the killer when he did catch you.
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I'm trying to say that the one-dimentionallity of the Killers gameplay is a direct result of balancing around scratchmarks. Making it a symptom rather than the cause.
Your solution of built in whispers replacing scratchmarks as a mechanic in general sounds interesting tho.
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Except survivors don't have to make a mistake for a chase to end. Killers are faster. Killers get blood lust. Strong loops have been changed. There's now much larger swatches of dead space on maps. Long before the latest patch, window and palette combinations were change to be less strong. There are more unsafe palettes now. If you are in a chase...in a good area...and a decent player...sure, you can prolong a pretty good chase that allows your team optimal time to do what they need to do. Even that isn't great for the person being chased, since if that's all you're able to do for the match, you will cap your points and end up not actually doing well. Camping and tunneling happens from the first hook on...regardless of how long that chase lasted. That is not reactionary to what is happening in that match. That's just a play style choice because it's easier than legitimately entering into an actual chase with another survivor. Again, if you are the person coming off a hook from a killer who is camping/tunneling...you usually don't even have the opportunity to enter into another chase unless you're lucky enough to get hooked near some pretty useful resources. But no, camping and tunneling is not a response to survivor perks, nor is it a reaction to play style. It's pretty typically a choice made by the Killer before the match even starts, because it's their go-to method of playing the game.
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@NuclearBurrito Yes, but even without scratchmarks the killer only has one objective and only one way to do it - chase, down, and hook survivors. Perhaps all the second chance perks are a balancing response to scratchmarks, but they just exacerbate the problem rather than do anything to fix it. It does need to be easier for survivors to actually escape (re: scratchmarks) but ultimately the problem is that if the killer doesn't chase, he can't do anything that helps him win. Second chance perks make the dumb looping mechanic the default go-to because nothing will ever be as valuable to the cause than wasting the killer's time with an intentionally prolonged chase. It's also not surprising that killers will bear down and tunnel or camp, in that scenario, because the only thing that helps the killer is having less survivors on the board, and the only surefire way of removing survivors who potentially have these perks is by literally making them an obsession.
You can see the developers trying to address this by introducing "stealth" killers and jump scare one-shot mechanics - trying to encourage hunting and surprise tactics - but between how easy it is to identify an incoming killer and these second chance perks, the gameplay is essentially the same. Announce yourself to the survivors and choose one to watch for a while. Tunneling and camping are just "extreme" versions of what the killer already does, just with a line drawn by the survivors as far as how much is too much.
Scratchmarks are certainly part of the problem but the underlying issue is an imbalance in paths to objective fulfillment.
@LALYTHIA Right, and why is it easier to tunnel or camp? Don't get bogged down in the micro details of "oh if you're good it's not reactionary cause on this map some of these loops aren't super strong and not all pallets are get-out-of-jail free cards" etc. It's easier to tunnel and camp because of two factors that dovetail with the one-dimensional aspect of killer gameplay. One - there's zero benefit for a killer to not secure a kill after a chase, despite plenty of benefit for the survivor, and two - there are so many "surprise" methods for getting away at the last second that tunneling/camping becomes an incentive. You can't "surprise I got away" from the spectator screen. Since the killer can't do anything but "say hi, chase, hook, repeat" to try to win - especially combined with those two factors - it shouldn't be a surprise that a lot of killers min/max it.
The difficulty is in tunneling or camping hard enough to beat gen completion times. It still won't beat a dedicated genrush, but it will make it easier by default in a rando match even if it's annoying for the other team. In pretty much the exact same way looping and second chance perks make things easier by default for survivors but won't guarantee anything versus a killer who is better than you - even though they're super annoying for the other team.
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"@LALYTHIA Right, and why is it easier to tunnel or camp? Don't get bogged down in the micro details of "oh if you're good it's not reactionary cause on this map some of these loops aren't super strong and not all pallets are get-out-of-jail free cards" etc. It's easier to tunnel and camp because of two factors that dovetail with the one-dimensional aspect of killer gameplay. One - there's zero benefit for a killer to not secure a kill after a chase, despite plenty of benefit for the survivor, and two - there are so many "surprise" methods for getting away at the last second that tunneling/camping becomes an incentive. You can't "surprise I got away" from the spectator screen. Since the killer can't do anything but "say hi, chase, hook, repeat" to try to win - especially combined with those two factors - it shouldn't be a surprise that a lot of killers min/max it.
The difficulty is in tunneling or camping hard enough to beat gen completion times. It still won't beat a dedicated genrush, but it will make it easier by default in a rando match even if it's annoying for the other team. In pretty much the exact same way looping and second chance perks make things easier by default for survivors but won't guarantee anything versus a killer who is better than you - even though they're super annoying for the other team."
We just wholly disagree. :) Which is fine.
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As long as second chance perks are allowed to synergize with one another then nothing will ever change. The post was a nice thought though.
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Your build might, even if others won't.
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I don't run crutch perks to escape, they are only needed if you are bad at looping. Tbh my favorite build is the vault build, second chance perks are boring and overpowered when stacked together.
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Nah, you have to run DS, BT, Unbreakable, and Dead Hard every game to be a real survivor player
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This sounds dumb, but the solution to seeing less BT/DS/Unbreakable would be for killers to change there playstyles as these perks are meta for that reason.
I personally don't ever really care about them as killer, because I rarely ever go after the person off hook, So DS and BT are basically wasted perks against me. I also rarely slug for more than 30 seconds so Unbreakable doesn't really do anything.
Usually the most I see is BT and that is generally a survivor forcing me to hit them because they have it, which at point I will chase them and I might see DS. The only other time I see DS is if I happen to down someone quickly and then move back around to the unhooked person with active DS before the timer is off... Which I guess is why they push for DS to be an anti-momentum perk is so strong, as that isn't counter tunneling. But these are maybe once every 10 matches.
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