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Absolutely done after the "hotfix"
- Removed the ability for The Executioner to see the aura of the Cage of Atonement and survivors inside them
- Added a system that will despawn the Cage of Atonement if The Executioner near it for too long. The Cage of Atonement (and the survivor inside it) will respawn in a new location.
Yes, this. I will preface by stating that I didn't follow the tactic complained about on these forums which entailed rushing to the cage from across the map to tunnel a caged survivor. Don't really care if you believe me or not, that's not the point as long as you acknowledge that that wasn't the MO of every Pyramid Head.
Second, if you check my post history regarding PH you'll notice that I've engaged in arguments regarding "PH shouldn't be able to see his cages". The gist of my argument was that the cages were already a very situational ability; if you weren't zooming to the opposite side of the map to tunnel a caged survivor then it was a minor time saver at best and only practical if you see another survivor to engage on within your immediate vicinity at the time of the downing of a (soon to be) caged survivor. That is because 1) you first have to go through the effort of applying the debuff of Torment and 2) caging a survivor in most circumstances very likely sends the caged survivor much, much closer to a survivor who isn't being chased for an uncaging.
Third, the developers have already acknowledged that guarding hooks (OBJECTIVES) is a core part of playing as killer. Pyramid Head is a killer which is commonly acknowledged as having little map pressure. This is because he doesn't have any real map mobility tools like, say, Hillbilly. Nurse. Hag. Even Demogorgon. At this point, it's not a simple matter of PH's cages putting the possibly hooked survivor on the opposite side of the map from him with no innate mobility options; he also doesn't see the cage. This means that in the majority of situations experienced survivors will recognize this as a 100% "free-save". In other words, you're taking away map-pressure from a killer that already lacks map-pressure.
Fourth, the last change; "Added a system that will despawn the Cage of Atonement if The Executioner near it for too long. The Cage of Atonement (and the survivor inside it) will respawn in a new location." I've seen literally no one suggest this change so it at least is not a very popular suggestion. I've obviously not had much time to process this direct nerf, however, on the surface it looks like it will at the very least make Cages even MORE situational than they already are, even for the non hard-tunneling PHs.
Finally, if you'd again take a look at my post history regarding PH you'll notice a very, very simple solution to tunneling PHs (because, as with most things in life, the simplest solution is usually the correct one); allow all hook-related perks to work on cages. The entire game was balanced with hook perks in mind from the start; Killers want their BBQ stacks, Pop-goes-the-weasel procs, and possibly quirky Make Your Choice/Devour Hope builds while Survivors cling to their comfy security blanket of DS, BT and possibly We'll Make It, etc.
I get that BHVR may have wanted to shake up the meta, try something new, force-feed people into taking different perks? Solid attempt, but this isn't an appropriate manner to do it. My prediction is that far fewer people will use cages, the exact same staple perks will be taken on every killer and survivor, and PH will instead usually just save their "Torment" for the mini-mori.
But don't make the mistake of thinking that I'm quitting strictly for Pyramid Head (a single killer in a large roster); I first started this game because I heard that Michael Myers was becoming a playable killer in a modern video game. Since then, BHVR has knocked it out of the park as far as choices in which licensed content they incorporate. However, this is a an extremely blatant case of "survivor favoritism". I use that term very lightly; I doubt there are very many members of BHVR that wake up every day and think "how can we make 1/4th our playerbase miserable" for the hell of it. Instead, it probably comes from a place of inexperience. That's understandable, sure, but after nearly 4 years of supporting the game it's still unacceptable and quite frankly, unfun.
TLDR; A simple and appropriate solution to tunneling off of cages would have been to allow all hook-perks to work on cages, which would probably have satisfied both survivors and killers. Instead BHVR further engaged in an on-going trend of catering only to survivor complaints regarded the new Killer.
Comments
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Cages having unique mechanics is cool, but they needed this nerf to prevent that from being abused. Doesn't matter if you didn't personally abuse it. Many did and it was a necessary change.
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I've shared my more detailed thoughts in a bunch of other threads, but I will say, for all the community's complaining about how "many" PH players played, I never encountered that once as a survivor, but I played against plenty of PHs in the days after the chapter dropped.
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While I didnt play against a facecamping PH blocking the cage, I did play against a ton of PHs who beelined directly towards the cage right after it spawmed, usually getting there relatively fast ready to tunnel the caged guy.
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When the cage despawns does that still count as a hook or does the whole thing restart?
Clearly more than enough PH killers were playing in such a way to warrant these changes. If anything you should be critical on the people that were playing as him like this.
I've had many PH killers block the cage so that my teammates could not get me and vice versa.
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Because why cage someone if your intent is to camp them? Just ######### hook them. Oh wait, you want to negate DS and BT.
Not to mention it can help PH if he gets there just before a survivor and makes them now unable to save and be caught by him.
They werent nerfs. Unless you rely on camping and tunneling on a killer who promotes not doing so.
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The point is to save yourself a trip to a hook, it literally saves you time. I don't know why they made the change but this definitely fixes the whole blocking cages issue. Unfortunately for me, I've had it happen too many times.
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The changes was needed to keep the games against PH healthy.
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Instead BHVR further engaged in an on-going trend of catering only to survivor complaints regarded the new Killer.
I don't understand why you had to put it in an us-vs-them perspective.
Many survivors asked for hook perks to work on cages since day 1. Instead BHVR just kept them so that cages bypass all hooking mechanics. Your conclusion: zomg BHVR only listens to survivors.
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Your suggestion would absolutely kill him and there would be no reason to play him over the top4 (freddy, spirit, nurse, billy). I play PH when I don't want to deal with DS/BT, the only reason to play PH if hookperks worked on him would be because of the novelty of playing PH.
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I put it the way that I did because I felt it to be the truth of the matter and there is no need to mince words at this point. And please don't put words in my mouth, it's not very classy. There is a great deal of difference between "favoratism" and "x only listens to y".
There's been a lot of great fixes for killers in general throughout this game's lifetime. What I said in no way amounts to "BHVR only listens to survivors". But a bias is clearly there in terms of priority of addressing issues and it has absolutely destroyed a game that I loved, at least for me.
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Ok let's talk about gamehealth:
Totems in open spots or next to gens.
Survivors in SWF having a huge unfair advantage with no compensation for the killer, not even BP as suggested a billion times which would not even impact gameplay but reward killers for enduring oftentimes relentless bullying either through ingame actions or postgame abuse with 4 ppl dogpiling you.
Keeping the looping bug in the game even tho killers have hated it since it's inception.
Genspeeds being way to high with with no reliable way to counteract on most killers.
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I didn't put words into your mouth. I went so far as to quoting you saying that BHVR only (sic) caters to survivor complaints. Backtracking and moving the goal post don't do you any favor.
The fact that they changed PH like they did, instead of they way you suggested, can actually be seen as the lesser nerf, because the other way around would have forced the killer to deal with DS, BT and all the menu of other perks and complaints thereof.
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Thats exactly nothing to do woth game health.
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It's got tons to do with gamehealth, you're basically sayin tunnelling is frustrating and crappy gamedesign, which i by the way absolutely agree with, so I also mentioned some really bad gamedesign.
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Pretty, pretty please quote me where I said "zomg BHVR only listens to survivors"? I would be ever so grateful. Or are nuances lost upon you?
And yes, PH would have to deal with DS, BT, etc... You know, just like how nearly every other Killer does? It would be no change in gameplay style of NOT TUNNELING / CAMPING. Granted he no longer has to worry about being in range for BT with the hotfix, but for all the wrong reasons. But with my change he'd also have the unique dynamic being one of the best users of Make Your Choice / Devour Hope outside of Nurse / Hag / Demo and possibly a quirky BBQ & Chili user (Aura based on 40 meters from PH or 40 meters from the cage? Either way it's a direct tell that someone is in position to save or a buffed up Infectious Fright).
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You can put down the thesaurus, it doesn't strengthen your argument when the meaning of what you said could not be mistaken. There's nothing nuanced about "instead BHVR further engaged in an on-going trend of catering only to survivor complaints".
A change to the killer was made. You wished for another one, potentially a worse one, but because you didn't get you wish, then the conclusion is "BHVR further engaged in an on-going trend of catering only to survivor complaints".
You can either go on and post complaints that won't be catered to, because oh oh you're not a survivor. Or, accept the change as one of the possible choices and realize that you can't always get what you want.
Either way, good luck.
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I just want to leave this for BHVR to read. PHs torment is already extremely ineffective because 99% of people know to just crouch through the rites of judgement, making the cages already hard to use, then i have to debate if i even want the cage because 9/10 times theyre right next to another survivor. And if insidious bubba is allowed to camp basement hooks why the hell would you make it so its 100% impossible to camp for pyramid head. If a killer wants to waste the 2 or 3 gens it takes for me to die in the cage that should be their choice its no different then a bubba camping my hook, whats next you going to remove the ability to see hooked survivors? you going to teleport hooked survivors to a new hook when i get facecamped by a bubba? You should make the rites always inflict torment if youre going to make the cages this useless
also the seal of metatron add-on is 100% useless with how difficult it is to actually apply torment to people change that the rites or put the cages back to normal. Your complete and utter pandering to survivors while ignoring the killer side of the game is frustrating and why i will be going on hiatus from the game. Think about this BHVR you may have more survivor players but what happens when the few killer mains you do have just quit playing because of how much you disregard they exist? you end up with 30 minute survivor wait times with them eventually saying screw it and playing a different game because noone wants to play as the killer
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How about this don’t camp or tunnel cages and this doesn’t effect you sound simple enough for your pea brain?
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Nice dodges. From "zomg BHVR only listens to survivors" to "I didn't put words into your mouth. I went so far as to quoting you saying..." to deflection when I asked for the direct quote. All around, well done.
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Hi I am new to the forums so I don't exactly know how to quote a specific sentence, apologies.
If you look in the last line of your TLDR, you said "Instead BHVR further engaged in an on-going trend of catering only to survivor complaints regarded the new Killer."
If I'm not mistaken though, you're only referencing the new killer.
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signed, a tunneler.
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