Can survivors contribute to the conversation or understand?
So I've been lurking these threads after these pyramid head nerfs and I keep seeing every survivor respond in the exact same way like a hivemind. I can get behind the nerf where the cage spawns elsewhere, I cannot get behind the nerf where PH cant see the aura of the cage. Can survivors begin to understand that one low rank pyramid head tunneling people does not mean that pyramid head is a killer that deserves to have their tools neutered because a possible application of their ability is tunneling/camping. An example of this is legion, Legion is not a tunneling killer because his design encourages going after groups and clumps of survivors, not individuals. I wish survivors could understand how much of a disadvantage it is to essentially not be able to see a hook, so caging people is actively giving up pressure now. If nothing else, I wish for pyramid head mains to gain compensation and buffs, Ill make a post later on a pyramid head rework/buff.
Back on the topic of survivors not contributing to conversations, survivors make no efforts to actually understand how hard these nerfs are, to survivors, these nerfs will make pyramid head hook more often. To killers, an interesting killer has been essentially lost a huge part of their pressure, and now has to play the game in a much more orthodox manner. This nerf will not end tunneling, this nerf will just make pyramid head tunnelers just throw you on hooks and then tunnel you.
Now heres WHY these nerfs are rough on pyramid head. This is not just a crippling to the option of tunneling through the nerf of the cage despawning. Removing the ability to tunnel is always rough for killers. The taking away of the cage aura is the worst part. Survivors can still see the cage aura, while the killer cant, essentially making it so the survivors have more information from the killers power than the killer. A survivor can effectively uncage someone and start stealthing and before pyramid head could at least have a good idea that now 2 survivors are coming from that cage, but now by uncaging then stealthing, 2 survivors have essentially become unknowns. This also makrd it hard for PH to properly capitalize on the potential advantage of stripping survivors of certain perks due to the Pyramid head being forced to ignore cages. Pyramid heads playstyle has become less freeform due to this, instead of choosing if to cage or not to cage, then if you should then go to the cage or patrol gens, PH will likely only cage as a last resort when surrounded by flashlights or to dodge an obvious DS. This makes his playstyle much less interesting and makes him play like an orthodox killer more often than not, which if you really think of it, Orthodox is not what you should expect from either silent hill or dead by daylight.
This all just infuriates me to no end. I remember joking about the 4th anniverary killer being pyramid head but threw the concept away because it was too far of a reach. I wanted pyramid head far more than any other killer in this game and I was excited when I saw how cool his power seemed. I find it incredibly annoying for survivors to just try to deflect the ridiculousness of the nerfs with saying things like “Just dont tunnel or play scummy” or things of that nature. Pyramid head did not need these nerfs, at all.
Comments
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Sorry for the long post, I needed to rant on this.
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Well... as a person who ofte uses agitation to save some time i will say... this perk is now good on PH...
And what's even worse:
His zoning is now worthless, survivors will never respect it now... which means he lost most of his kit because it will also impact his ranged attack negatively.
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I completely agree, but to be fair its the same the other way around.
Nerf anything, people complain without reflecting.
buff that, people go mad about it without thinking about it.
Its not survivors that are not understanding...
The Problem is:
People are dumb.
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Yeah, people are pretty dumb, whichever side gets hit is usually the one that'll complain. Though the complaints arent always unjustified. This is a case where I think its justified.
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"Removing the ability to tunnel is always rough for killers"
LMFAO
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Removing an option is still removing an option.
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If PH seriously goes to the cage, camps there until it despawns, then run to respawned cage to camp it again and has an opportunity to do all of that without running into a survivor. Its highly improbable and also would indicate that the caged survivors team is just not doing gens or going for the uncage. Thats phenomenal effort to camp when camping is a low effort option. If the survivors did gens during that scenario, im pretty sure they could reasonably get 2 gens, maybe 3 if they are really good.
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If a bunch of survivors are running, as they might to either go to a gen or go unhook, there will probably be many scratchmarks that wont lead you to your cage. Its not like cages appear in a certain direction away from you either, nor are cages constant and set in stone so im pretty sure to the average killer, theyll just hook someone and just know “the survivor is somewhere away from me now”. A cage can be any direction away from you.
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As a Pig main and used to seeing the aura if my boxes, it isn't THAT great if a feature.
Also, if you feel like you're being forced to tunnel for a kill, then maybe that match isn't yours and you have to take an L, or that killer isn't for you.
People have been complaining about PH's tunnelling ability since day 1 on the PTB and how perks like Decisive Strike don't activate from the Cages. This change will certainly help lower the amount of tunnellers, which frankly is needed. It ruins the game for everyone and boosts the stats of killers to the point where they don't get the help they need because the stats say they're fine.
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There is nothing to understand if you try to defend tunneling and camping. Why do Killers always want to play like a scumbag?
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I've mostly only been sending people to the cage/final judgement on their final hook, so this nerf won't make much difference to my play style.
Seriously, I keep seeing your posts and they are always extremely survivor biased, to point I believe you're trying to troll.
I highly suggest you try playing killer at red ranks.
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I agree. Even before his nerf I noticed higher skilled survivors didn't care at all about running over the rites of judgement trails. What incentive is there to care about them now? It negates half of his zoning ability. I guess we can still try to send people to cages for the novelty, but that's not going to hold up for long.
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Maybe learn to play killer properly, if you think its fine to tunnel or camp. I got to rank 1 as Trapper only without resorting to such pathetic methods. Its pretty easy.
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Not all killers play scummy. So you can stop saying that and stop acting superior all the time.
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The issue people have with you is not your having an opinion it's how you choose to express it. Being egotistical and condescending is not a good way of getting people to listen to you. It only serves to make you look like a dick.
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Welcome to Dead by Daylight, where amazing characters like Pyramid Head and Leatherface lose to an angry Japanese girl and a self concious floating woman.
Go figure.
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As a killer and survivor main myself I feel it’s time both sides need to understand each other more.There’s always going to be a group of wild people on both sides who don’t like to admit that they are apart of the problem.Not everyone of course though there are still genuine people for example @Respectfulnancymain @Orion and many others😀.
Post edited by NinjaDette1 on5 -
I personally play extremely fair when I play killer, I don't camp or tunnel. Although I personally have the mindset that the killer can play however they like.
However, I always see your posting extremely survivor biased posts, which makes me not believe that you play killer at rank 1.
I think you need to watch this video by Scott Jund:
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That's what i want to say about this nerf when the patch note drops. However, people keep bombing my thread without even thinking about my point by saying, git gud, oh don't tunnel, oh you're bad killer etc etc...
Man, i just want to have a civil discussion.
Personally i think this nerf is bad, and i said it already when people suggesting it. Unable to see the aura of cage means caging is worthless in EGC, and it makes the uncaging event basically risk-free. Also, it already sends the survivor to farthest location, so they have plenty of time healing to full health before you can reach.
People keep saying how his cage ignores DS and BT, but so does Pop and BBQ from killers. As for now, caging is worse than hooking survivors normally, and it's KILLER'S POWER to begin with.
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Ive no sympathy on this one after seeing how the majority of killers played him. It was coming.
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I dont think he is the strongest tunneler killer at all. Hes a pretty average tunneling killer, he just had the added benefit of effectively negating survivor perks. Nurse can definitely tunnel super hard, bubba is one hell of a camper, I feel like demo can tunnel and camp super well. People who tunneled are still gunna tunnel, PH or no PH
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I heavily agree with this, thats why I feel like if PH is getting nerfed like this, then torment in on itself should become more threatening, cause there are so many people who will gladly eat the torment.
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I'm gonna start this by saying that I play more survivor and that I didn't play that much Ph, but I'm think I have a pretty good grasp on his power.
Anyway I think main problem isn't the nerf its his cages, because most of the time I don't find that the cages are useful, like at all. The cages don't give much of any pressure as the survivors usually save instantly, and also require a them to be tormented which is easier said than done. It also doesn't help that some of the strongest perks relies on hooking a survivor. All that just for a hook stage without carrying a survivor to a hook, and allow you to avoid survivor hook perks.
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It's annoying that people on the forums think that survivor mains opinions are invalid. The only people that get listened to on here are killer mains or people who play both. There are unfair and frustrating things for both killer and survivor. Let's stop pretending that killers are the only ones who can get frustrating and unfair matches.
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My suggestion for fixing the nerf is for uncaging to cause a loud noise notification at the cage spot, so the killer at least knows where the survivors are coming from.
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Id rather give PH more tangible buffs, but that works
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I do play killer in red ranks and I NEVER camp unless its camping a farming survivor farming their teammate. Otherwise I never camp even end game. Im not trash
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I am in no way trying to invalidate perfectly valid survivor opinions, but when a survivor opinion boils down to “stop complaining about ds” and “he do be tunnel doe”, its hard for me to take them seriously.
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"The taking away of the cage aura is the worst part. Survivors can still see the cage aura, while the killer cant, essentially making it so the survivors have more information from the killers power than the killer" - That part right there omg.
No other killer gets the ability to track Survivors while they're on the hook taken away from them while Survivors get that crucial info which has been deprived from Killer.
It's like PH has a permanent Third Seal blindness hex on him which he can never remove because he CANT DO BONES lawl.
I don't see any reason to use cage any more so I wont be using it.
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I Am a red rank killer and could post my gt as proof. I have plenty of clips and screenshots. I've never resorted to being scum and tunneling and camping just to get kills.
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Its absurd to me that PH got blindness on his own power
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You are like the hive mind of Killers crying about the supposed nerf.
It’s only a nerf if you chase the cage and camp/tunnel. Otherwise it doesn’t affect you. Also it still offers the benefit of not triggering many hook related perks for survivors (namely DS) and it saves you from flashlight saves, body blockers etc.
Honestly if you only played him just to camp the cage then I’m glad you been put off of playing him.
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Yet another survivor who doesnt contribute and will call me a tunneler. Im still gunna main pyramidhead, usually your not avoiding the hook related perks now other than DS due to the lack of pressure provided from cages.
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Lack of pressure? You can still patrol gens. In fact usually it wastes the survivors time going to the cage to rescue in most cases so there is pressure.
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Its significantly less pressure than just putting someone on a normal hook
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I main survivor and I think this change was a bad decision. Every single time a killer has a power or addon that makes survivors have a hard time, it gets nerfed to #########. And survivors get more perks that add more second chances to their already huge arsenal of perks to abuse killers.
Honestly, any time a killer gets some feeling of power, people cry about it and it gets changed.
With this change, you may as well remove every killers ability to see hooked survivors.
I can't stand how easy the game is for survivors now. It takes the fun out of it for me.
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The title implies that you don't think survivors in general can't contribute. I agree that some survivors have a strong sense of entitlement.
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Not even worth arguing with someone who assumes survivors “can’t contribute or understand”. This killer vs survivor stance needs to stop. After all, we are all here to have a fun game.
Have you played survivor against PH? Most of the time they make a beeline for the cage, if you wasn’t lucky enough for survivors to get to you in time then he just proxy camps you. Someone goes for the save and he uses his ranged attack to instantly down you again. Is that fun? At least the devs made a change to make the gameplay healthier
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If they beeline towards me good. I have played survivor, against hag who imo is far stronger at camping hook than PH. Hag even eats up less time approaching hook than PH. Yet if im getting tunneled, if my teammates are half competent they know that they can essentially force the killer off hook by doing enough gens. I just play surv less because theres nothing I enjoy about the role other than the sheer power I hold when I use dead hard and devolve into a clicky clicky. But i still understand the role, since I know killer I know that tunneling will literally cost me gens, but since I know survivor, I know tunneling does exist, especially in low ranks.
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I have seen far less survivors be accepting of what killers have to go through, and ive seen far too many entitled survivors just call every killer a tunneler and camper. Even when I give hatch and be altruistic ive never been complimented or given a thanks.
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Maybe you should rewatch and understand what he said. I dont think you got that.
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If someone doesn't play killer they really don't have a place to complain about killer issues, vice versa.
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