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I think this video of Otz shows everything wrong with generator speed in DBD
Comments
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A game that ends with 2 gens done, a 4k, and a 2 pip despite survivors doing the first gen in 17 seconds and getting a 59 second ds off on one of the more survivor sided maps in the game.
I'm sorry man but if you're trying for the narrative of "killers are weak" this fails at proving your point. There are so many games where gens are done in seconds why would you choose the game with a 4k and a 2 pip at the end of it?
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Did you see the video? Those survivor can not loop for the life of them. So without a skill they managed to get a gen done in 17 seconds.
Now imagine, just imagine, survivors who actually can get chased attempt this?
Notice: This video is about gen speeds.
P.S: Otz plays the game literally like 10 hours a day 5-6 days a week too.
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On one hand. "Killers are so strong that they can come back from EVEN THAT!"
On the other hand. "Those Survivors are so bad they STILL lost after that!"
It's a little bit of both, but there is more of #2 in my opinion in that game. With a touch of #3 for that game in particular "It's Otz, dude is good".
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I actually think it shows a good thing about DBD. Don't give up. You can still 4k and double pip if you play well. Sweaty SWF groups are annoying as hell but they aren't infallible.
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This again?
They did the first Gen super-fast because they dedicated their loadout to this. Afterwards, they lost heavily. If anything this proves that the early Gen does not matter (which is true) or that Killers are very oppressive.
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It shows those survivors can't play for the life of them, second chance perks toolboxes and still failed.
Other than that, it shows how the game is survivor-sided because just imagine those survivors actually had little common sense and were average.
Also, Otz plays 10 hours a day 5-6 days a week, so...
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Yeah but this happening in a game is probably 1 out of a few hundred. It doesn't represent typical DBD.
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Or:
It shows those survivors can't play for the life of them, second chance perks toolboxes and still failed.
Other than that, it shows how the game is survivor-sided because just imagine those survivors actually had little common sense and were average.
Also, Otz plays 10 hours a day 5-6 days a week, so...
Which means (tl;dr):
Game survivor based and rewards survivors for not even having common sense, while average killer-player would get destroyed so hard easily.
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it just shows how much this game gives survivors that they can be that bad and still be in the high ranks. It also illuminates the reason why the devs favor survivors. Although this creates a cycle where survivors get progressively worse at the game. Survivors are just bad at the game and there's no reason for them to even get better because the game is so easy for them in the first place.
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It show that skilled killers can snowball pretty quick. The team was aware of their objective, but as a group of solo players they didnt stand a chance vs good killer.
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This is at least a 3 man SWF (I checked the profiles). But yeah, must be Solos, they lost. Because as we know, SWF is unbeatable. :^)
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The argument would be true, if the same Otz wouldnt destroy everything that moves and breaths on his way. :^)
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Nah, I just dont get how you think that those are Solos. I mean, the narrative must be kept alive that SWFs are unbeatable, but even without checking their profiles it is quite obvious.
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This times a million. Imagine a killer with their equivalent skill-level, what would happen?! What can be a "crutch" for him? NOED wit it's million counters and only active in end game?
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Oh I don't doubt those survivors were god awful. As in, holy ######### how can you lose after that?
I'm just saying there are many, many, many more videos which would illustrate your point better. Trapper expects gens to fly and gets incredibly powerful in the late-game when everything is set up, same with Hag. It's expected yens fly by vs him then at the final 3 he snowballs and wins in seconds.
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Again, splitting up with 3 survivors being on 3 different gens, while someone is being chased by the killer is what a truly optimal team should do. Multiple survivors on the same gen is really inefficient, especially after all the nerfs made to discourage grouping up.
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Its otz this guy is probably the best trapper you can find in this game
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Except that only 0.1% are god-like players like Otz.
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Why do you make up threads that already exist?
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And how many of these teams do you normally face too?
The fact being that if you didn't play Trapper you'd also stand a much better chance at winning since Trapper relies on late-game pressure, whilst killers like Freddy, Spirit, Billy, and Nurse could've made more than enough pressure earlier (or in the case of Billy, could've actually interrupted that gen).
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This. I can't count the times where the first gens are repaired very early and I still get a 3-4K by applying the right pressure on the remaining gens.
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If anything this proves that the first gens don't matter. Stop caring about the first 3 gens and you'll see your games will go a loy better
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This happens everytime. Everytime we get a genrush video, the killer always wins.
Almost as if there was something to what Almo said about first few gens going quickly and last few gens taking longer.
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Also for context it took 4 survivors co-operating to bring 4 good toolboxes and 3 bnp to do that, most of those items would have been used up quickly, with the BNPs gone immediately.
The killer could have easily brought an ebony which would have lasted all game.
People act like killers dont have their own add ons/offerings to counter such builds with
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Look man, this is why toolboxes were nerfed. Sure they can get the early gen or two, but without fast toolboxes and brand new part, this isn't exactly doable throughout the entire match. Without a toolbox, it takes 2 survivors at least 40 seconds to finish one generator, and 4 about 30 seconds. Imo, mid game is the meat of the game, not early game.
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Gen Progresion is a problem and after devs do something about it I want to watch the reaction of those who say is not.
I'm sure games are faster than ever in 4 years in DbD, that doesn't mean that every game ends in a gen rush. Currently playing on red ranks as killer and survivor and there are 2 options: or the killer hard snowballs or 5 gens are done in 4 minutes.
In the second case, that pressure is too much for a lot of Killers so they are forced tu run noed, tunneling and even camping. They are forced too to play Nurse or Spirit.
Not the healthiest meta, but not the worst.
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Something to note: They only ever stacked on gens. They never spread out. This just shows how stacking on gens is not that great of a strategy. Had they had spread their pressure out better they might've actually done more than 2 gens.
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How many of "these" teams? Maybe none, because they suck and I go against mostly way better teams that gen rush even harder than that.
This video just proves that theoretically a gen can be done in 17 seconds, though it's not optimal nor is it efficient for them to all work on a gen and do so.
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And it also proves that it's possible to return from a 17 second gen and 59 second DS stun on Rotten Fields.
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And your point is? Who said it is not possible?
But it also proves survivors have upper-hand with zero skill, and killer has to work his way around their million rewards for having literally no skill.
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My point being that there are videos that show amazing killers like Otz struggling against teams that do gens increidbly quickly. This was a ######### example because it ended in a 4k and a double pip.
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Fair enough.
But like I said please keep in mind this video just wants to show you how ridiculous gen times can be. Such thing should never happen.
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In a solo game I believe this is perfectly fine but with SWF depending on if the survivors are actually skilled or know how to play it may be a problem, but in the video they barely got 2 gens done as he was able to kill them within a short amount of time (video is about 11 minutes). Most of them were around rank 4 or higher except 1 survivor. In these ranks it should be expected as it would if you were a high rank in a different game. I believe it is fair if it's against a killer of the same rank because they obviously know what they're doing and what to expect. The chances of this happening are low unless with a SWF like I said. Even then low rank survivors do not have the coordination to do this with randoms unless they are high rank which, as I keep putting out there, it should be expected as it is high rank not newbie survivors or killers.
This is like saying a pro in a fps shooter shouldn't be able to hear callouts from a teammate so he can prefire the enemy charging in his direction. Most regular players do not have the coordination level to do what the pro would do themselves, unless they're high ranking, so believing that communication is a problem would be the wrong direction to take. What should be the problem at hand is if the matchmaking is fair.
I believe this is completely fine if the matchmaking is fair and not random like it usually is. The real problem is matchmaking not gen rushing. High rank survivors or even SWFs should not be against a low rank killer but it happens anyways.
Also just because one youtuber who plays his life out of DBD doesn't mean he's a god, there are plenty of players at his level of skill who can do what he's done. Yes, he's really good, but many other players are as well and this is not a big problem I would see when there are many others that need to be fixed with more meaning to them.
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This just shows why killers shouldn't give up. I've had plenty of games where the killer gives up when only 1/2 gens are done even though they could've made a comeback.
Yes Otz is a good killer but if you want to get better at the game you should follow his lead. Do you think he ever gave up and sat in a corner because "gen rushing"? No.
Don't get me wrong Otz is a good killer but he's not miles better than anyone else. You can do what he did quite easily if you actually play the game out and be smart. The survivors weren't the best either but even good survivors can be beat if you play correctly.
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This video shows me those survivors suck without their 2nd chance perks and BNPs.
They couldn't loop for #########. One of them even stood at a pallet instead of continuing to loop. Not only that, they also failed a mind game standing at that pallet.
They DS'ed twice when they should have saved it.
They tried to bait swings with BT. Which was blatantly obvious they had BT. That just fed Otz stacks and told him what they were running.
They made terrible saves.
They stepped in traps. They didn't even disarm 1.
I don't think they even tried looking for ruin. What if he had noed or was running Devour Hope?
They even stream sniped him and they still got their ass's kicked.
IMO this video doesn't show that gen speeds are BS, which personally I think they are. Or that killers are powerful because Otz is up there on the food chain. This video does show me that survivor can be crappy players and still escape by stacking 2nd chance perks and rushing gens. Granted they didn't get away but what if this was a killer with significantly less playtime than Otz? They probably would have been crushed by this team.
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The thing is, you can't just compare a "normal" killer player with Otz's TRAPPER. He's like, if not the best, one of the best Trappers in the entire game. And yes, the survivors in that game were potatoes, they're clinging so much in their crutch perks and gen rush that when they face a god killer that's what happens.
Most of the players, as you said, would get rekt by that team, not because they're bad, but because they're not Otz. Gen speeds are busted as a #########, and we all know it, and most of the teams will have someone runnin Prove Thyself, and sometimes another one running leader so they can swarm up and heal an injured teammate in a blink to, guess what, gen rush another generator.
And what sums up the entire thing is, you don't really need to be a good player to win as a survivor. If you know to hold down M1 and press spacebar, that's it. You don't need to be a god looper if someone in your little SWF team is, you can just sit on gens and let other players do the dirty work with the killer.
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This again??? Also Otz won that game so I fail to see the point of this thread. If every gen could be done at that speed then it’d be a problem but 🤷🏻♂️
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Otz is a VERY good Killer player. One of the best. 17 seconds is fast, but it really doesn't matter to him.
It matters for the average Killer player though.
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Copy/paste from the other topic:
Here's why this isn't unbalanced:
The survivors sacrificed efficiency to get ONE gen done really fast. They used their BNP's to get a gen done in roughly 17 seconds. And yeah, that sounds crazy fast. And it is. But it's also one generator out of five. The first gen is the easiest to complete. If they save their BNP's until later in the game, they risk being killed before it gets down to 1 generator. After that one gen is done, they aren't able to complete other gens at the same rate, or similar rates. They've used up their BNP.
Yes, Otz is crazy good at the game. I wouldn't want to take anything away from him. But if you're a red rank PC killer you could probably get a 3K-4K in the same scenario as long as you don't give up and act like you're defeated because one gen popped really fast. Not as fast as Otz, but you'd still probably get there.
That's not to say there don't need to be some tweaks to gen speeds. But this video doesn't illustrate the problem with them. It's not a problem when one gen pops REALLY FAST. It's when FOUR gens pop really fast because the killer can't exert pressure on enough survivors at the same time due to a bad start. But -- rather than making gen times longer, devs are looking into a "Trial Warmup" which could help killers get off to a better start, and therefore make gen times more bearable and allow killers to have more natural early game pressure, which is precisely what's needed.
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Again, STOP comparing OTZ to an average palyer, if every killer in the game plays it like Otz, barely no survivor would have a single chance. It's like balancing LoL around Faker, or Counter Strike around Coldzera.
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I hope the devs are working on that idea of some kind of start up phase for the game. M1 killers could really use it. I seriously think nerfing ruin was a mistake on their part. At least they could have nerfed ruin and tool boxes in the same patch. The patches after nerfing ruin just felt like they were trying to mitigate the dmg they did.
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Oh I like this one, it's where we pretend every survivor brings in BNPs and balance around that.
I think we should balance around the idea that every killer brings in a mori :)
Some killer mains say mories are fine because they're ultra rare, every killer mains says keys are too strong.
One whole gen for 3 ultra rares, lmao.
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2 gens finished and 4k as trapper? If anything it shows that gens are too slow.
I'd suggest trying to think for yourself instead of drinking up popular streamers' gospel, but sheep will be sheep I guess
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There’s still no issue with it...3 BNP’s should complete a gen rather quickly.
Seeing as they are one time use it’s not like other gens can be completed in 17s.
Also how often do you see 3-4 BNP’s stacked???
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I think it varies game to game, one game gens can be popping one after the other but in other games you can be 5 gen and everyone dies is less than 10 minutes it's all RNG really. Do the survivors all spawn together? Is the map a good killer or survivor map? Is it a swf or solo queuers? Are they good or bad? Did they bring items? What perks are they running? All the questions and how they're answered decides how your game is going to go in the end.
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Yes but why did he get a 4k? Because the survivors threw the game. If they wanted to win bad enough and were skilled enough to, that 17-second gen would have been game over. Just because he got a 4k does not mean you always will get a 4k off of an instant gen loss. That quick gen wasn't even the best use of the toolboxes, because it may have served them better if they spread out that extra progress over multiple later gens. But the fact that this gen speed is even possible shows that it's a problem.
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And there are videos that show this.
Yall are missing my point of posting the game that ends in a 4k 2 pip instead of the other good examples isn't helping your cause.
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Only thing this shows is that we need a working matchmaking system.
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SWF teams are not unbeatable. Otz if he had been preparing for them would have _owned_ them. He has shown very good videos against SWF teams and always explains killer very detailed so the mere fact you're complaining about Gen time in ONE match tells me how long you've watched him. Cuz it happens in games. Even in survivor sided maps. It's not about 4k in tournie. So why you sweating the 4k now?
I even tried his Freddy anti SWF build as a rank at that time, 16 killer. Owned everyone of them green survivors. Trust me, as a killer main? It's _not_ survivor sided right now. Not at all. Devs are trying to balance both and they are at the moment working on killers.
If you can't handle the games now with the sided ######### you get away with AS a killer. Then I don't know what to tell you. Plus hey? Bet if you look. Otz earns more BP then them before the 5k bump. People forget this game isn't JUST about gen rushing or 4king. And that's why it's so damn hard to enjoy the game with y'all.
No wonder you all so thirsty for your cakes. How else you get those BPs as fast as the players who UNDERSTAND the actual challenge of the game as killer.
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Sometimes survivors spawn together and get a gen done. Okay...and? Notification goes off and you were just alerted to every survivor's position.
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