60 seconds DS is an abuse
60 seconds of decisive strike is ridiculous, I hang a survivor, I go for another and I chase him, I hang him, his wounded friend comes and I throw him, I am going to pick him up and he still has ds. I find another survivor, I chase him, I hang him, so I hit another survivor twice and take it to the hook (I think it was a considerable time if you compare at how fast a generator is repaired) after that I go to a engine and I see that someone is repairing, I beat him up and he has ds ... I am extremely fast throwing to the ground survivors or the ds is ridiculously long?, at no time did I tunnel, I was in pursuit with other survivors and even hang them but the ds is still active? 60 is unfair, I understand that it lasts about 30 seconds to avoid in tunnel, but 60 seconds is a total abuse 🙄
It is more profitable as a killer to camp the survivors? making 12 hangs in less than 4 minutes is very hard in red/purple ranks. The survivor can be hung twice and continue in game and if you add that besides they have an extra 1 minute of invulnerability and the 5 generators can be repaired in less than 4 minutes is a clear injustice here 🤨
And if the devs do not plan to change the ds time then one option would be immunity to ds for 60 seconds, if someone used ds against you then nobody else could use ds against you for 60 seconds.
Comments
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Yes, I ate 3 DS yesterday because I was very efficient in the chases.
Why should I be punished for doing my role well?
Oops, right, survivors are the ones who buy clothes. 🤦♀️
I recommend that you accept it, they will not change it. 🤷♀️
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Your words say it all : "Why should I be punished for doing my role well?"
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If you're so good at doing your job, DS shouldn't be a hindrance to you.
So why the complain?
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I have literally downed and hooked two people, found Jake healing behind a tree after that and got DSed.
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I'd like to see that.
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I think that it is not only 60 seconds, the problem is that the DS is really an abuse, you can completely repair a gen by having ds and take advantage of it, and if you have adrenaline then you are not only untouchable for 1 minute also you heal after repairing the engine, the idea of this is very bad, if you start to repair an engine having ds or it heals completely then you should not have that privilege and the ds would have to be disabled
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It is evident that you did not read anything of what I wrote
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Play plague with infectious you can do it too
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I think I will use your phrase as the title of this thread 🤣
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It's not that easy. Sometimes a DS you took for no reason is the difference between winning or loosing.
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Nice, those games are fun. You count the unbreakables and DS. At least you brought Lightborn. It's always fun not to worry against flashlight squad and give BOING on their head while they try to blind you 😅
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I agree with that
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You act like you don't believe him lol
95% of DS-es eaten are because of this (or something similar) or survivors being cocky because they know they have 60 seconds of invincibility.
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I'm going to have nightmares tonight, thanks.
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Because I don't believe him.
I don't believe anyone who says that this is common in their games.
It doesn't happen to me as a killer, it's not an issue to many killers on this forums.
I honestly feel when something frustrating happens ONCE, they make it out to seem like it's an on-going daily issue.
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NOED is op. I run around the map doing 4 totems but it still activates and wipes out multiple survivors. Maybe NOED should get weaker the more totems are done?
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so pretty much you were already winning the game and cry because you go DS and cannot win even harder because you couldnt count to 60 and just slug the jane
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You don't even have to believe the man. Dozens of streamers have this happen to them over and over again you're just too lazy/deluded to see it.
Puppers has said DS is busted, Tru3 has said DS is busted, Fungoose has said DS is busted, you want everyone to believe it's just a "vocal minority" that thinks DS can be abused way too easily.
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Either your a god tier nurse or the SWF is terrible.
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Yeah, dozens.
Dozens of streamers are also bad at the game, doesn't prove anything.
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DS should deactivate when either someone else gets hooked or when the user jumps into a locker
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Ahh good to know! We finally found the DBD oracle, the only true god of this game!!
No point arguing anymore, you're the only person who knows how to play perfectly, I apologise. All these 5000 hour players who do this for a living are mere peasants compared to you, their unworthy opinions hold no value.
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most of them are killer sided, and their solution "make it deactivate when another survivor is hooked" would easily be abused by campers or instadown killers.
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I- I applaud that victory.
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Imo, alot of the perks in dbd need to be reworked, not just DS
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For DS I think it should rapidly drain the timer or have it shut off early if you touch a gen, heal someone (being healed and self-healing is fine though.), touch a totem, (EDIT: On second thought, what if someone's doing the totem because they want to activate inner strength and heal? Maybe only lit totems since you're trying to destroy a killer's perk slot?) start unhooking, start saboing a hook, etc. MAYBE using a flashlight but that's pushing it.
There you go, DS is still anti-tunnel (Killer returns to the hook, etc.) but once a survivor decides he feels safe enough that he can continue progression of the match by working on a generator, he's forfeits protection of DS.
You can still run from the killer. Other survivors can still heal you, you can search chests and Jigsaw Boxes, cleanse at a Plague Fountain, snap-out-of-it, grab a Freddy Clock, etc. (things done in self-preservation that don't progress the gamestate) and you'll still have the same protection of DS as always.
Just if you get unhooked, immediately run over to generator and start repairing it, or try to unhook a survivor, you can't argue you're being tunneled at that point if the killer finds you. I hate a pet peeve for when survivors are on gens, you go over, and they just hide in a locker so you can't slug them, or someone "Hook-Yeets" with DS up, you grab-interrupt them mid-unhook, but get DS'd anyway.
DS would still offer good protection from genuine tunneling, just it can't be "abused" (I can't really call it abusing a perk, but it's the best way I can describe it) as 60 second god mode window to do the objectives or make borderline suicidal plays. (Rushing up to the killer as he hooks someone to unhook in his face before the hooked survivor's scream can even finish, since if he DOES grab you, you'll get to DS him.)
I have heard someone mention this system should also deactivate DS if you're healed back to healthy, and I disagree because I think if you get unhooked by someone with We'll Make It, they heal you, and a BIlly chainsaws back to the hook and chooses to go after you rather than the David that unhooked you, even though you're at full health, it's still tunneling. However this WOULD mean you can't use DS after being unhooked with Adrenaline, but I think this is more of an issue with DS in the endgame and not adrenaline.
I do think DS at the exit gates is pretty annoying but the "meta" at endgame is for a killer to camp (I can't blame him since there's no generators to defend at that point and leaving the hook usually results in a rescue) and try to grab unhookers.
That's my 2 cents on DS. I do think it needs some changes. Keep it at 60 seconds, just those 60 seconds are to be healed, make distance from the killer, etc and once you decide you feel safe enough you can start progressing the match by working on gens or unhooking, you're no longer afforded the protection of DS.
"Locker-DS-Tech" would still exist, but that's if you're genuinely tunneling. Survivors can't work on a gen, then hop into a locker as you get close anymore.
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I play both sides equally a lot. As survivor I refuse to use DS because it's such a bs perk. To me it's the same as NOED. "Well I lost but I think I deserve to win anyways". If DS wasn't a thing Noed wouldn't be needed.
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Lmao
If killers didnt try to tunnel one person out of the game within the first 2 minutes then DS wouldnt be needed.
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All of these deactivation conditions and prerequisites don't address the underlying issue. This is a Survivor experience, but every complaint and balance suggestion is about improving the experience for The Killer. Tunneling is already effective, powerful and easy to accomplish. Yet all of these posts are ultimately about making it even easier to tunnel.
And I've seen myriad videos from a lot of whiny crybaby streamers that show a very skewed perspective. When they tunnel and slug someone and laugh about leaving that person on the floor for 60 seconds bc they know they have DS, those videos aren't posted in their highlights.
As a killer, I have never accidentally run into the same person within 60 seconds of being rescued. And this is probably because I don't tunnel, I don't camp, and I never go back to the area of where someone was recently rescued. I'm not saying that the people that do run into people within 60 seconds are doing that I'm just pointing out that in my experience I never have this problem.
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That is the most nightmarish sweat squad I've ever seen. Midwhich with 4 OoO's and DS??? Dear lord BHVR nerf this #########' perk already...
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Well said.
I hated old DS. Absolutely hated it, it felt so unfair.
When new DS came in I had some apprehension but I think in the past year and a half I’ve probably been hit with it....under 10 times maybe.
These people who are struggling with new DS game after game after game, they need to reflect on how they’re playing because it sure as hell sounds like they’re tunneling.
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These are 3 examples (I can't find 2 more but I remember one where Deathslinger got DS'd from a hook-grab, and AngryPug I think getting Locker-DS'd literally 3 times in a row back-to-back-one-after-another) of where deactivation upon certain conditions would make sense. It's impossible to "be tunneled" if you're unhooking someone and I grab you.
These things don't happen every match (I'm not a red-rank killer) but it's definitely annoying when it does. Especially if the survivor players are trying to take as much advantage as possible out of it.
Would the changes make it easier to tunnel? In a way, yes. (IF the survivor is progressing the gamestate after unhook by doing generators or divebombing a hook. But is that really arguably tunneling?) Do I want the changes because I want to tunnel everyone to death? No. I want the changes because getting DS'd from a hook-grab is infuriating because there's no real counter-play. Everyone says "Go after the unhooker" but we have situations where the unhooker will DS you, do the unhook, his unhooked friend body-blocks him with BT through the exit gate, you down him at the last second, then HE DS's you, (Although that one can be considered tunneling) etc. and there's just no real winning in that situation.
I've already touched on DS in the endgame (for the unhooked survivor) in my original post. Dunno what to do about that. I know killers can try to burn DS by tunneling intentionally but I hate the idea of having to tunnel on purpose on the off-chance they might have DS so it won't proc in endgame.
In your opinion what is the underlying issue and how do we fix it? I think DS just needs some changes so it can't be used offensively (Doing gens, rushing a hook, etc.) but only defensively (I.E. killer returns to the hook and actually tunnels you.). I can't think of any better solution that wouldn't make DS completely useless or too powerful. Tying DS to the Terror Radius like Borrowed Time for example (If there's no TR when unhooked, DS never activates) would make DS useless vs people who return to the hook or use insidious. If the DS countdown only went down when outside the killer's terror radius survivors could follow the killer around and keep DS up literally forever.
Having certain actions preemptively end the DS timer just sounds like the best solution since it would still punish actual tunneling while preventing people from just progressing the gamestate while under the DS shield.
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The three examples aren't compelling. The reason I'm not moved is the official position is that DS is not an anti-tunnel perk. It can help with being tunneled once to some extent but is ultimately and very simply a perk that allows you to stun The Killer if you are grabbed within 60 seconds of being unhooked. The description of the perk is clear and concise, the fact that it can help with being tunneled doesn't signify that it can only work against it. There are many tunnel cases where it provides no use. If your tunnel exceeds 60s or The Killer decides to slug you for 60s the perk does nothing. Then there's the infamous second tunnel, which is usually relentless because now The Killer knows you no longer have DS. The issue again with the suggested changes is that it is purely to benefit The Killer. DS is not an anti-tunnel perk but people want to justify major changes by declaring it is and narrowing the opportunities to use it while also still allowing a killer to engage in a very effective, easy to do and powerful tactic. Imo tunneling probably has to be addressed in points and emblems, it should be allowed but highly discouraged behavior with an in-game determent. DS or any future perk slated to address it would be extremely difficult and likely not too effective.
I don't think everyone wants to tunnel freely, but I do think this is part of it. Same with UB and BT nerfs, the cornerstone is really about camping and slugging without consequence. I do think camping, tunneling, slugging should be allowed but should come at a cost. The current cost is too trivial to discourage it.
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I RARELY come across killers that play like that and I play a LOT. To balance a game based on a small amount of players that do something isn't the move chief. I'm not saying DS should be gone just needs to be changed up so it's not so hardcore on killers. Any decent team of survivors running DS can waste a lot of killers time especially using locker techs.
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30 seconds and if you're in a chase it pauses.
60 seconds but touching a gen/healing/getting into a locker, thus implying you are safe and not being tunneled, deactivates it
DS seems worse than it actually is because it activates when a survivor gets off the hook, and due to how long it takes to drop a health state, it's not hard to hook someone else and find the DS user and hook them, especially when they abuse it.
All DS currently does is punish a killer for being very good in chases or rewards bad survivors for being bad in them, as you'll see good killers who stream get DS'd constantly because of this. Similar to how BT does its job despite the fact it's often used to safe in the killers immediate area if they're not a real threatening killer, DS does its job well against people who go out of their way to tunnel AND punishes those who do not.
To add to all of this DS also gives every single survivor added power, ever match, even if just 1 person has it, because the killer has to assume, regardless of how fair they're playing, that the survivor has it and that, as a bad survivor would be unaware of, can dead stop all of your pressure. Toss in some Unbreakable and you've got something that should not exist.
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Ds Is supposed to be an Anti-tunnel perk but thats not what it is. Survs use it as a weapon against the killers and it needs to have its timer lowered or activation changed
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Everytime i read "invulnerabilty" it makes me laugh soo hard. If you get hit by DS cause of overperforming, why still bitching about DS if it obviously isnt any issue at all.
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The second video, the problem is those survivors who seek to abuse everything they can.
Devs should balance (thinking) about the most abusable point of all perks.
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The second video, the problem is those survivors who seek to abuse everything they can.
Devs should balance (thinking) about the most abusable point of all perks.
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Whataboutism.
This thread focuses on DS not NOED. Make a new thread to complain about it.
Also how i would fix DS:
Cut the timer to only 30 seconds. But pause it while in a chase.
Also, if you get healed, start work on a generator, enter a locker or another survivor is hooked in that time, It automatically deactivates.
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It is just a 5 second stun, and annoying..and a third life state
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First of, i am a survivor main, but i play both sides. And i never run DS, because i don´t get those tunneling killers often enough to use the perk slot for it. But i also don´t go looking for the killer once i get unhooked.
I really don´t think DS is the issue. I had lots of games as killer and survivor, where even 3 people running DS didn´t make a difference. Because i play solo survivor most of the time.
For an swf, it is just another powerful tool to go after the killer, and i think thats the issue here. Solo´s don´t do that often, because they never know if their fellow survivors will come and pick you up in time after the killer downed you again. Solo is not realiable enough for this kind of play (aside from specific unhook-at-the-open-gate-situations).
So the real issue is once again swf, not the perk itself. Because i bet all those coordinated attacks you experience were from swf. I play in red ranks as survivor, and i get potatos so often, i can´t belive this is a common experience in solo survivors.
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thats the thing... the killer NEEDS to get rid of 1 person as fast as possible. unless you really think the killer can perform 12 chases per game that wouldnt even calificate to a decent joke.
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DS needs to deactivate if you perform action which progresses your game as a survivor such as; go repair a generator to save other survivor. If you can repair gens you aren't being tunneled, just carried with 60 second crutch. Otherwise DS would be fine
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Name 1 killer perk that deactivates when you do your objective.
You people will complain about anything, and what about End Game?
If someone has DS available End Game will you still complain?
Of course you would, because you're changing scenarios by the day.
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if you are playing well enough to get a hook and re-down the same survivor within a minute the killer is playing much bettre than those 2 survivors and deserves the hook. DS needs to be condition based not time based
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If there's an obsession in play in the match, keep track of who you've hooked. If they've gotten off the hook recently, just slug them out.
Is it bullshit when you go after a survivor and they hop in a locker to use DS? Sure, but they're going to die in the next 10-20 seconds anyway.
It's not hard to leave slugs on the ground to wait out DS. Plus it also applies more pressure to the survivors because that's one less teammate on gens/totems and it forces the other 2 or 3 survivors to go pick up their slugged teammate.
Play around DS, don't take the bait of DS using survivors. It's obvious when they have DS.
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Why the deflection of conversation. This is a killers rage about taking ds from a possible tunnel or not possible tunnel. Stay on topic lol
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Honsetly Ds by itself is alright. But combo with unbreakable it can be tedious to deal with. Most times i just take the stun and move on.
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Firstly, Meg main ain't no FlamingKitty. They're the true god of dbd.
Secondly, those 5k hour players you mention all streaming are doing it for that- streaming. They want their audience engaged and they want to be entertaining for as many people as possible. This doesn't equate to playing as well as possible.
Were I to see videos of them off-stream/video and playing normally and they're still that good then I'd concede but I'm pretty sure they'd be better off-camera than on.
The only thing that needs changing is the interaction between DS and Unbreakable, especially when you add Soul Guard into the mix. Ds is fine provided you can be slugged by the killer if they didn't want to tunnel you. Ds/Unbreakable makes you literally immune.
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