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What in your opinion makes a good horror villain
So I've been working on the Pinebrook series for quiet a while now and I am in the horror adding phases on creating the villains, filling it with as much unsettling, terrifying, and hopefully Iconic horror villains as possible without overdoing it. However I stopped to wonder, will this suffice, and will it be enough? I have faith that it will, however I wondered out of random curiosity what you as the community would like to see within a horror character, like what will make it scary, iconic, and essentially good? Plus I feel like asking this can give me advice and help make the series as good as possible for you guys.
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A good villain is one you can almost sympathize with. Think Joker from the newest movie. He gets hurt, mentally and physically, until you sympathize with him and forget he just killed his mom.
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Thanks, but I was talking about like Pennywise, or Jason, or Pyramid Head even, but thank you though I will remember that
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In that case, go for hulking behemoths. Slasher villains arent usually scary looking, so try making a big dude in a mask.
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Done, The Fireman stand at most 6.11 feet tall, where's a mask, and doesn't speak. So yeah
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For characters like Jason or Pyramid, its presence and intimidation. They don't have to do much, but the fact they're basically unstoppable tanks, makes them intimidating to go against. For character like Freddy or Pennywise, however, it's more they're charm and charisma about what they're doing that makes them memorable. They take such joy in what they're doing and are so charismatic and fun about it, you get tricked into liking them even though they are evil monsters.
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Intimidating with a larger than life charisma. A horror villain should be one that even the viewer should think "How can they beat that."
A feeling of helplessness goes a long way and the better you can transmit that feeling to the viewer the more iconic the horror villain is.
It's part of why dbd is popular, can you imagine how lame the game would be if the survivors were capable of Tekken style wombo combos on the killer?
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Okay thank you, thank you. I already have monsters like that, so it is relieving hear this, thank you
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I think a few factors come into play and it depends on the kind of villain you want.
Believability: Are their motivations and actions believable?
Intimidation: Are they scary? Can the audience take them seriously?
Backstory: Does their backstory flesh them out enough?
Humanity: Do they have a personality? Are they sympathetic to a degree?
I think the most iconic villains fit this role. Darth Vader would be a good example of a villain who excels in all these categories. Keep in mind, that these aren't set in stone. If you think it's better for your story if your villain has no humanity, they don't give it to them. It depends on the villain you're looking for.
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Again thank you that was the plan for one of the many villains, he just walks around and brutally kills people without giving a damn, and the fact he can know of your pressence jsut by you feeling fear, or sad, basically emotions that make you call for help
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Horror makes you question your own morality in an extreme situation.
It plucks at your deepest fears and phobias.
A villain? So they're on the chaotic evil scale? A good villain in horror preys on those fears. A psycho with no remorse. Someone who does horrible things but justifies it by their own twisted morals. Someone who could easily fit into your own lifestyle but is wrong. Doesn't quite fit. And progressively less so as time goes on.
Or simply a beast. Man vs Nature has always been a good horror trope.
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For the Fireman he is just in short an emotion brought to life, he is a manifestation of the rage, and the hatered that burns inside all of us. Although He just slunks around with his axe and just stares at people and brutally murder them. I can't tell you more but would you say that is enough, because he fits alot of those categories they are just subtle
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I actually based off one of the villains with the fact if you call for help or show signs that you are in distress he'll know where you are and hunt you down and eventually kill you. I based it off of my strange fear of embarrassment for asking for help/questions at school when I was younger.
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I think it's fine, as long as he is able to drive the plot forward with his actions. If a character is lacking in one category, feel free to exaggerate in another. For example, Fire Lord Ozai has very little humanity whatsoever. But this is used to amp up his intimidation by giving the audience the idea that he is completely cold and ruthless.
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Damn. I remember vomiting all over the hallway in Kindergarten because they told me to walk to the bathroom. Well I walked. But there was nothing left in my by the time I got to the bathroom.
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Oof that sounds rough but yeah I got over it, but I felt like I looked stupid for asking a question that may be as simple as saying whats 1+1 for example. Although maybe not that exaggerate but that's how it felt.
He is just that, he has no heart, let alone love, although he very , very rarely shows empathy. He pushes the plot immensely and is in for the long run until the very end, he may not have as big of a role as he will for the first part of the series, but I have plans for him.
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They need to be a threat. When they appear something NEEDS to happen. Have them constantly impede progress, make the reader dread seeing them. As someone working on a book himself, this is probably the best advice I can give you.
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Oh I'd like to read it sometime. Yeah I've been doing just that he always comes in and tries to kill the characters in those moments, or just show his power, in a sense that makes you feel like there's nothing you can't do
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I think a look and name that stand out as well as a primary weapon/method of killing are three of the biggest things when it comes to the villains identity. For examply, almost everyone can match the hand knives with Freddy, knife with Ghostface or Myers, machete with Jason, and chainsaw with leatherface. Build a backstory to your character whether it's tragic, terrifying, happy, whatever. People want that; just look at dbd and how they incorporated stories about all of their characters - they didn't need to, but they knew some people would love it if they did.
Think about the vibe you want your character give off. Are they supposed to be like Voorhees or Myers where they don't talk and just walk the whole time? Or do you want them fast and sprinting after their victims? You probably don't want a guy who looks similar to Myers sprinting after people, that would just look funny. Then look up Three Finger from the Wrong Turn series if you're not already familiar - because of his appearance he'd look really funny if he wasn't fast-paced and high energy. Not that the Wrong Turn series isn't already funny regardless... 😂
Lastly, LOCATION! I think this one is really overlooked, but you can't mention Camp Crystal Lake without thinking of Jason, or Haddonfield without Myers, Springwood without Krueger.... Even a lot of killers in dbd have a map that's supposed to be their own. Think about it, would be afraid of Jason as is - but put them in Camp Blood and now he's actually a threat. It's like you get a whole second tier to work with, and you can really work with how scary that villain will be simply based on where other characters are at.
So all in all, I think you should really try to match your villain's appearance to a name, a backstory, and a location at the bare minimum. I also think Behind the Mask: The Rise of Leslie Vernon could be a valuable movie for you to watch. You'll probably figure out more about classic slasher movies as a whole than you will about the villains themselves, but overall the movie is a great experience. Good luck!
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Personally, I think you have three main archetypes within most horror genres:
- Slasher
May have supernatural elements, but still seem mostly human in what they can and can't do (ie, they can't fly or run at supersonic speeds). Usually extremely relentless and virtually un-killable. Their big thing is suspense through atmospheric buildup. We (the audience) often know they are lurking around before or as our protagonists realize it. The tension comes from the uncertainty of if/when/where/who the killer is going to strike. These stories also have large casts of protagonists, since you need lots of supporting characters to kill off to give your slasher street cred.
Examples: Micheal Myers (Halloween) / Jason and Mama Voorhees (F13) / Leatherface (Texas Chainsaw Massacre)
- Monster (including Lovecraftian/Eldritch Horror creatures).
Strange beings with confusing and/or dark origins. Usually ridiculously overpowered until the protagonists figure out how to escape from them (or sometimes defeat them). Often come in really disturbing shapes and sizes and have unsettling movements. May have humanoid characteristics.
Examples: Pyramid Head (Silent Hill) / The Pale Man (Pan's Labyrinth) / The Gatherers (Amnesia)
- Mastermind
Highly intelligent, probably with a sadistic side or possibly suffering from sociopathy/psychopathy. May prefer to work behind the scenes, actively threaten protagonists to "toy" with them, or even pretend to be one of the good guys for a while. May or may not be very physically dangerous in addition to their intellect.
Examples: Albert Wesker (Resident Evil) / Hannibal Lecter (Silence of the Lambs) / Jigsaw (Saw)
Some characters bridge the gaps between these archetypes too.
For example, both Freddy Krueger and Ghost Face toe the line between Slasher and Mastermind. They like to mess with their victims and show pretty high intelligence compared to the more impulsive/instinctive tendencies of normal slasher villains, but are also very persistent once they've determined who they're hunting.
Meanwhile Pennywise from It is a mixture of all three archetypes. He is effectively unstoppable when racking up his kill-count and tends to appear suddenly without warning. He taunts/misleads his prey to manipulate them and their emotions. Plus he's actually some sort of godly spider-clown-shapeshifter monster who feeds on fear and children every 27 years.
More than anything though, your villain needs a distinct appearance that makes them easily identifiable.
Myers has his overalls, mask, and knife.
Freddy has his fedora, sweater, and glove.
Ghost Face has his costume and camera.
Leatherface has his faces and chainsaw.
Chucky is a doll with scars and a knife.
Pyramid Head has... well, you know, a really big... knife. I hear it's great.
You can also subvert this trope by using a relevant stand-in. For example, Jigsaw is really just a plain and sick old man. His puppet Billy is really the iconic face associated with the "Jigsaw Killer". Meanwhile he has "games" and henchman to do most of his dirtier work.
If it helps, I also dug up this article from 2016 which discusses some of the things that make horror villains more fun:
https://bloody-disgusting.com/movie/3413245/makes-horror-villain-interesting/
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Thats great! it seems like your on the right track. You could have them do any other number of things. Close off an area they were going to visit, force them to take a different route, maybe even kill off a side character (But that depends on what you want to do). The stuff you've been describing in your other comments seem pretty cool, I hope I get to read it someday.
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probably persistence. in a way the killer is death, you can run and hide but it will get you eventually.
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Thanks that is what I plan to do for the many mosnters and killers to come within Pinebrook.
That is a lot useful information, My first monster to appear in the series is a mix between slasher and monster, and some other characters just like what your describing, oh and yes he does have a distinct look, thank you also do you mind if I copy this down for notes because this is really good, but everyone here also posted some good stuff and I'll copy those down as well, thanks for the tips
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Done I tend to apply that feel commonly with my horror villians
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Are you saying Jason isnt sympathetic? he was (almost) drowned as a child, and is killing to avenge and fulfill his mother's wishes, who herself ultimately died trying to avenge her presumed drowned son.
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No I meant was what would make them intimidating, like Pyramid head, like I know how to make people sympathize with villians
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Well my personal favourite Horror villian is John Kramer because he's intimidating,sympathetic,uses consistent logic. I find these all play off each other to enhance each other, his consistency in making the traps test and possibly kill while always having a way to survive I find makes him more intimidating due to how much he's calculated it so that you know there's no way out except the way he planned.
oh, well with Pyramid being a manifestation of James's fear and Pennywise knowing and using the loser's fears against them, it seems the intimidation comes from the fact that they'll be able to tailor a experience that'll prey on your own individual fears.
With something more like the Hillocker's from Wrong Turn its the fact that they treat other people just like animals to hunt, somewhat out of necessity due to lack of wildlife in the area, in a way similar to Dead by Daylight's own Huntress.
So I'd say the 2 ways to best create intimidation in the viewer,reader,etc is to either have it prey on deep fears of the characters, and/or make your audience contemplate if they would do the same if faced with those conditions.
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Ah okay thanks
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Many different things can make up a good horror
I like "Xenomorph" type of horror villain. Some unknown ######### thing that is killing humans in some closed area. Demogorgon is good fit.
I also like horror villains that looks just like normal human, but their true nature is something demonic and monstrous which they reveal only when they know there would be no witnesses left.
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So like a deceiver kinda, already have a charcter like that, but I like the idea of the villian secretly deceiving you
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Watched the video, Gezus, that was creepy with Lector, and very helpful as well. Also now I have to go watch Silence of the lambs now
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I mean the villain who appears to be completely innocent and normal at first glance, but once he is tet-a-tet with his victim he reveals his true nature. +1 point for him having split personality. Legion and Ghostface fulfill that trope in one way or another.
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Yeah they do but it is great advice thank you
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It depends on what you want out of the villain, as a hobby writer myself I've written a couple of villains, ranging from completely insane to sympathetic to giant monsters
since you're writing a horror story I'd go down the soulless evil human route or the eldritch monster route
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I've gone down the route to villains who are psychotic as Lector, but are as charming as Pennywise or Slappy. and villians who are as intimidating as Pyramid Head or Jason, and invoke the same fear they produce
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Good horror movie villains will hold your attention the whole time they're on the screen. I go to Hannibal Lector in both Silence Of The Lambs and The Hannibal tv series. Both portrayals of the character were excellent and you could never take your eyes off the screen when either of them were there.
Same with Kevin Spacey in Seven. The second you saw him you couldn't take your eyes off him. Jigsaw in Saw is another who just owned the screen every single time he was on it.
For more general reasons as to what makes a good horror villain (or villain in general) is someone who you can sympathise with, understand their logic or relate to. They can also be someone who seems really nice and calm but can just flip at any given time. Lastly someone who you know would get you if you were in that situation. One horror villain I remember is Joe from The Following. He was incredibly charming and you could see why people feel for him and would've done whatever he said. He's evil but he can fool you so easily into siding with him.
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Yeah thats what people have been saying
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The best villains are villains you can still somewhat identify with, sympathize with, or operate in a moral grey area. Jason was abused and left to die, so now he wants revenge. Freddy was burned alive unjustly, so he is getting revenge on the town that attacked him. Etc.
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sounds interesting
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😁
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Again thank you to everyone who answered some of my questions, I already jotted down some of the adjustments to the monsters yet to come, thank you and I will see you all in the fog
" Best smile... Best laugh, for you are living a happy... little... life... you... Ungrateful... Little..."-Unknown
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It depends entirely on your target audience. Horror villains don't have to be the scary characters in the story - menacing, sure, but they don't need to be what makes your audience check their closet at night. I dont write horror novels, per se, but all my short stories tend to be. And very few of them have a clear bad guy. Mostly they deal with either supernatural phenomena, genuinely terrible situations and choices, or cruelty from groups of otherwise normal people. Supposedly, that's what makes them scary.
But, if you want your villain to be the icon... Make them relatable. Human emotions, human reactions, but a completely alien perspective and goal. Having them commit unexpected cruelties and/or be driven by unknowable motives is a good way to get people to question things and create their own terrifying scenarios through fear of the unknowable.
Or you could just go full lovecraftian. That also works, and the gatekeepers of taste seem to prefer it over gore and body horror.
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The Pinebrook series combines a bit of both with just a hint Lovecraftian and the intimidation sort of feel. Also a little Teaser is in the post
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I also realised I didn't clarify this point: The protagonist can be the terrifying character that keep the audience up at night.
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Ooh that is interesting Idea( Evil thoughts going into the head). But the protagonist or at least main protagonist is at times is stubborn, and protective, but at times hes really empathetic, and kind, one thing he does have in common is that he is willing to bust his ass to help out others, although he won't be happy afterwords. Anyway I do have some characters like that in mind. Again a teaser is in this post if you haven't looked at that or have any questions let me know and I'll be give as much s I can
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These are all extremely fine points to expand on a character. I love how the Scream trilogy did literally none of these though.
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If the villain stays with you after the book/movie is over. If it changes the way that you think about life. Like JAWS made people scared to swim. The Exorcist has everyone believing their child was possessed.
Also less is more. If you just show everything, there's no room for people to have their imagination run wild. You have to build the suspense.
I also prefer psychological horror. Gore is low brow. It doesn't even have to be horror to come off as a horror villain. Like Nurse Ratched in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.
The setting/environment have as much to do with it as the actual villain. I love the feeling of trapped by isolation. John Carpenter's The Thing. The Shining. Alien.
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I agree with the post overall, but Freddy doesn't exactly fit into that category. His death was pretty just considering he killed children. I always saw his scare factor as that of "Hey lets give literally the worst person ever the ability to control your dreams and kill you".
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Well, in the original i believe he was wrongfully accused and then in later movies they said he did it
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Idk I watched the OG last week and unless I'm deaf he definitely killed those kids.
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YEah he definitely did kill those kids
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