Deathslinger not fun to play against?
As a survivor main, i can say that i really dont like playing against a deathslinger, and heres why:
I personally think a really big part of this game is getting chased by the killer, getting things done like a 360, 180, windowtech, etc.
But if youre playing against a deathslinger, you just cant do that stuff becouse he just grabs his gun and shoots you, and there isnt much to do about that.
I think deathslinger just doesnt really fit in dbd, dont get me wrong, i really like the idea of ranged weapons in dbd, but just not like this.
Honestly, i have no idea what they could do about this to make him more fun to go against.
Comments
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Okay, first off, none of the "techs" you mentioned are of any use against even a Wraith or Trapper. They exist to bully noobs, something you can easily achieve against a Slinger.
That being said, he is a ridiculously low-counterplay killer and there's nothing really to be done about that. The game needs the variety that 110 killers bring, but nerfing his power would force him to be a 115 killer.
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I think they could just make him go "hurgh" and take like an extra .25 seconds to be able to fire his weapon when using ADS. Like a faster version of the Huntress. He still should be able to aim more quickly since he has a smaller range and doesn't have guaranteed damage on landed hits, but right now his aiming is functionally instant and there's no real telegraph of intent.
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I try to use those techs on not noobs, and if it works (wich most of the time fails), its just funny, and thats what i like about the game!
I totally agree with the rest tho
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That would be a great idea, but when im playing against a huntress half of the time i dont even hear the "hurgh" sound, idk if thats a bug or just a game mechanic
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I feel like they could nerf his oppressiveness in-chase at the cost of letting him shoot onto walls and grapple himself closer to them at a fast speed (and could then tap m1 to break the chain, and need to reload) and make him 115% too. Increase his general map pressure but make the 1v1 more fair and fun, a bit closer to Huntress. I'd enjoy facing him a whole lot more if I didn't just get quickscoped every bloody time; I remember in a KYF once against one of my friends and he'd spend time aiming and lining up his shots perfectly, there was even a sound queue to show he was aiming at you! It was amazing fun and I wish that was the optimal way to play as Slinger because taking time to make the perfect shot is great fun to do and to face.
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a great rework idea is to make his gun more accurate the longer you aim, for example when he starts aiming he begins with 25% accuracy and it takes like 3/4 seconds untill he gets 75-100% accuracy
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"Boring, oppressive, unfun" is the new "oplznerf".
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im not begging for a nerf, im just saying what i think about deathslinger and how i think they could change it to make it more fun to play against/as.
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Lmao. You just want another killer to bully. You cant loop a Deathslinger the same way you can any other killer.
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I personally just don't like how quick ADS is and how he can instantly M1 after cancelling it. I think thats everyone's issue with him.
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A survivor doing a 360 causing them to disappear or aim dressing to yank the killer's camera in the wrong direction... that's not fun. Not for the person playing killer, anyway. It's extremely frustrating that playing on certain maps makes 360s more powerful due to killing the fps.
So, you talk about something not being fun for you and wanting to change it while also listing stuff that's not fun for the opposite side that you want to make more viable...
The role of killer needs to be fun to play as, not just against.
That doesn't sound fun. You're requiring the killer to be crippled both ways, either with forced poor aim (which sucks in every game I've played that punishes players with RNG misses despite actually making a skilled shot) or by giving the survivor an extra 3 to 4 seconds in a chase. That while aiming the gun the controls feel crappy and he's slower only make it worse. Aiming the gun for an extended amount of time is not something players want to do.
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they think killer just there may sure survivor have fun.
I hate that too.
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I don't like him because he's anti-stealth and anti-escape-chase playstyle. It's a whole lot of denying other people's playstyles rather than anything like challenging people's playstyles (and the latter of the aforementioned playstyles is already heavily punished by almost every killer).
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I love deathslinger, he possibly has the best chase theme in the game and the chain mechanic is really fun, at least in my opinion. His chases could be a bit more interactive, but overall he is pretty solid.
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Well that sucks for you, I like facing deathslingers. I'd take him every match rather then facing trappers or hags, I hate vsing those two.
Fun is pretty subjective, isn't it. Just because one group of players doesn't like it doesn't mean that there aren't other people who enjoy to vs such killer.
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I'd happily nerf his power and make him 115% movement speed. Half of the frustration with him is how annoying he is with Monitor so a 32m TR would be glorious.
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Well, yeah, they are there so that survivors have fun. Killers should be designed so as to be fun for both sides.
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Absolutely not. Deathslinger has very little counterplay in a 1v1 so he's a pain in the ass to face. However, he's bad at pressuring multiple survivors at once because he needs to reel survivors in and reload his gun in order to have his power. He's not a strong killer, but he's still extremely strong in the 1v1. 1v1 counterplay is most of what dictates whether a killer is boring/oppressive/unfun, not strength. Huntress is very strong, for example, but there's also a lot of available counterplay to her. As a result she's fun to play as and fun to play against, at least in my opinion.
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So long as Deathslinger can quickscope he will not be fun to play against. If survivors dodge when they see the gun raise, he walks up to them and M1s. If they don't, he shoots them in the back. The only counter is to break line of sight, but you can't really do that when his TR is 16m with Monitor and it's one of the annoying new ones that take a second to spin up and it's hard to gauge distance from. By the time he shows up and you know what direction he's coming from, it's almost always too late to break LOS. You need to hope you're repairing a gen right next to a strong pallet that you can pre-drop.
The fix doesn't need to be raising accuracy over time, but I think that's a decent idea. You could also raise projectile speed over time, like Huntress, or just massively increase the weapon raise / ADS time.
It's just silly for a ranged killer to be able to use their power to zone and gain distance. Huntress moves at 77% speed while charging her hatchet, for example, and Demogorgon moves at 92% speed while readying his Shred. In both cases, survivors are given warning of the impending attack and are able to attempt to dodge the attack and/or break LOS without losing much/any ground to the killer. Deathslinger does technically slow down to 83% while aiming down sight, but ADS only takes .15 seconds. He can therefore basically spam ADS as much as he wants to zone survivors. Pyramid Head has exactly the same issue with his attack right now. It'd be less egregious on like 30ms ping because you might have a chance at dodging his attack instead of just anticipating it, but on my typical 125-150ms ping it may as well be a guessing game.
The only killer I hate playing against more is Legion, because free deep wounds is boring and frustrating as hell. Doesn't really matter how weak they are overall; I want to have some counterplay to avoid that first hit.
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So your idea is to:
- Give the survivor a 4-second heads up that the killer is using their one-shot-reload power, giving them ample opportunity to time a dodge
- After that 4 seconds make it so the killer has to 'maybe' score a hit, with a ~3-second reload, but if he doesnt time his 4-seconds properly he'll more than likely waste his shot even if the survivor is not dodging.
Deathslinger doesn't need a rework. Just as with Pyramid Head, survivors just need to rethink how they approach loops to bait the killer's power, and more accurately predict dodge in the open.
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Deathslinger is not op, but he is indeed boring to play against. Short, unintense and very unfun chase (which should be the complete opposite).
Nobody wants him to be nerfed, he actually might be in a good state about winrate, but people want some changes of his power, which gives counterplay. Give him mobility, nerf his chase potential, that would actually make him way more fun.
Boring is indeed the right word for deathslinger. You can also call him uninspired or just annoying but he is not op.
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I'd like to hear how survivors should counter Pyramid Head, because I legitimately don't think there's a way that doesn't rely on the killer making mistakes. The best thing I can think of is dropping pallets way early and running in the other direction. He needs massively reduced movement speed when using Rites of Judgement imo. His ability to zone makes him ridiculous in 1v1s right now.
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The issue with Deathslinger isn't strength. It's counterplay.
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Hes so easy to counter lmao
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exactly
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if you play against a good deathslinger, it isnt (or im just bad af)
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If pyramid head uses his punishment of the dammed, just before the attack lands, you see a red outlined stripe on the ground.
If youre quick enough ( i just press a or d when holding w), you an jump away before it lands.
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I dont think its a perfect idea or anything, just a little tweak to make him more counterable, what he needs is less 1v1 focussed chases and more grouped power (at least in my opinion)
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In theory that's how it's supposed to work, but in practice ping is a big factor and makes this impossible. I typically have 100-150ms ping and his attack is impossible for me to dodge even when I know it's coming. If the killer and I were both wired into the game server I'm sure he'd feel a lot less broken, but alas.
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But isnt fun subjective? Many people (including myself) probably find deathslinger very fun to play against
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I agree, im definitly having way more fun against a huntress, and the reason is that against a huntress i feel like i can maybe at least have a chance to counter her, instead of getting shot the first 3 seconds after i start a chase.
Btw i dont know why people who like/main deathslinger are so toxic about this.
I dont hate those people, i dont hate deathslinger, i just think he needs some tweaks to make him better against multiple people and maybe a little less impossible to counter :)
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Please tell me how, because it seems to me that you need to be on the perfect tile when he shows up, or running Spine Chill, for that to be true. He has a 24m TR, which many people shrink to 16m with Monitor. His chain is 18m. If you're out in the open, he can shoot you before you even hear a TR. If not, by the time you realize which direction he's coming from (especially given his new TR, which spins up a bit slowly and makes it hard to gauge distance), he's going to be very close to you. "Just break LOS" is the answer I typically get for him, but that's not really possible when he starts chases so close to you. Other killers can start chases from very close by, but they all have downsides. Wraith trades easy first hits for hard second hits, as he has nothing to help him in the chase. Pig is slow while in Stealth. Myers needs to stalk before he can even raise his speed to 115% and has no tools to help in the chase until he hits Tier 3. Ghost Face has the best stealth in the game, but like the others I mentioned he has no tools to help him in the chase until his power recharges.
Deathslinger plays a lot like a Huntress without a lullaby that doesn't need to charge her hatchets to get full-speed throws and that can easily pump fake them to make survivors dodge. The only real downside for him is that missing requires him to reload, but good Deathslingers will rarely miss. If you see him early, sure hold W and make him waste some time running you down. That's often not how it goes, though, and he has more say in where the engagement starts than you do.
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At least legion is counterable, i actually really like the idea by slowing down survivors by forcing them to mend, but i think mending just goes too quick and is too easy.
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It very is subjective, and thats why this forum exists :)
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I'll drink to that
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I run spine chill on all my builds, becouse i find it very fun to play with and its just really nice against killers like pig, ghostface, myers, and many more killers.
Even with spine chill i barely ever counter deathslinger.
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lol
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Isnt that the whole reason why this forum even exists?
I made this discussion becouse my experience with playing against deathslinger isnt always good.
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he is boring for the same way Pyramid head is. just the act of redding there power is more effective than actually using it, the moment deathslinger brings up his gun or the moment PyHead sticks his sword in the ground the survivor has two options start preemptively dodging or keep running both of which work in the killers favor. you try dodging they won't use their power and will just close in on you for a free m1 or you keep running and they will just use their power. in the open this doesn't always work but the moment a window or pallet is involved it's a free hit.
but when you compare these two with huntress you can see why it works. with huntress she makes a warning sound way before she can even throw a hatchet and slows down giving time to the survivor to react and if she cancels her hatchet she stays slow and cant instantly attack
whilst deathslinger can immediately use his ability and cansel is without repercussions.
pyramid head does have a delay before he can attack but he is only moving 5% slower so its negligible
a simple fix for deathslinger would be to add harsher punishment for canceling his power promoting him to commit to actually using it or only being able to fake it once or twice before losing to much distance and making the sound that plays when he is aiming at you actually audible (yes there is a sound cue that plays when is gun is aiming at you not that you can hear it over the chase music)
as for PyHead just make him move slower when he pulls the G. knife out of the ground for a couple seconds so survivors can actually have a chance to make a play.
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My issue with Legion is that there is almost nothing you can do to avoid being deep wounded if Legion sees you with Frenzy up. Good Legions are seldom going to whiff, and attempting to pallet stun them is counterproductive because you almost never get the stun and you also really need those pallets for looping when Legion isn't in Frenzy. You can maybe hide, but again, a good Legion is going to trigger Frenzy close enough to you that you have nowhere to go. Spending the whole game mending is just boring to me.
The typical loop for Legion is usually to Frenzy, hit as many people as possible, and then to chase the last person in the Frenzy chain. That person is then going to be forced to do the whole chase with Deep Wounds VFX on their screen, which can make the environment very hard to see, especially in dark areas like the downstairs of The Game.
As a team there's plenty of room to win - just split up as much as possible and rush gens. They drive me crazy in the 1v1, though.
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Yeah, once he catches you you're going to have a bad time. Spine Chill just gives you a head start, but that's important against him - like, if you know he's coming when he's 36m away instead of 16m (with Monitor), you at least have a chance to run away or put yourself in a safer position by the time he arrives.
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My #1 strategy against PH if they're trying to bait them to use their laser going into the loop. It's not 100% because of servers and a patient pyramid head might be able to get past it but I've gotten out of a lot of nasty surprises with that technique. Also, I'm considering testing and incorporating abusing lockers into the mix. Throwing pallets early pretty much gaurentees you're taking a laser to the face unless it's really early, in which case you shouldnt do it anyways.
Dont be fooled, the only way to counter PH is to force him to make mistakes, but in fairness that's how you counter any killer.
I dont agree with your position he needs less 1v1 focus. The ability to pressure multiple survivors at once is very strong, and if there's a ranged component with that I would think he'd be very, very uncounterable. Consider as well that Deathslinger can easily get the first hit through loops, but the second hit 'usually' takes a bit more effort and has a higher margin of error.
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You are right about that, there isnt really anything you can do about legion stabbing you in his frenzy.
But i still like the idea of wasting time of survivors with the mending mechanic.
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Oh yeah ok fair enough.
I thought you meant spinechill for in a loop lol
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if he shoots me, then hits me, he doesnt get a longer hit animation, he can just catch up within 5 seconds and shoot again
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So long as I have more of a chance to not eat that first Frenzy hit, I'm happy. I'd be fine with buffing Legion in other ways to make up for increasing the counterplay to Frenzy, like for example shortening their cooldown when coming out of Frenzy and increasing the time it takes to mend, but still.
I think I'm not fundamentally opposed to slowing survivors down with mending. I think Deep Wounds only really bothers me because of how unavoidable it is when Legion's in Frenzy. Like, Deep Wounds through BT or something doesn't bother me at all - you basically cheated death, now here, pay a time tax. Seems legit. Frenzy now feels like "we temporarily gave the killer training wheels to help them hit you, and as a reward for their hard work you now have to spend extra time mending". I want it to feel more like "I got mindgamed / made a mistake / got outplayed by that Legion, so now I have to spend extra time mending".
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Oh no no, that might save your life 1 time out of 100 by giving you a faster vault, but otherwise not really lol.
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Yeah, slinger got high chase potential and ######### map pressure. He's a good killer, but definitly not top tier. Now look at legion. Amazing 4v1, horrific 1v1. Don't transform slinger into a worse legion please.
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I dont get this slinger no counterplay bs. Walls, walls and prediction crouchs. A smart survivour knows real excellent play is keeping distance from the killer at all times. This aittude of i need the killer to send me notifications for every action taken is ridiclous.
Every time i face a slinger i force him to make tough shots always maintaining as much distance as possible. Why the hell do you think he has a range limit. If your mind is stuck in the world of 115 ms killer on my ass and there lunge is the limit that's just entitled.
I want diversity in my high rank games not just spirit and nurse. Whats being proposed is the same formulaic killer strategy. 115 ms killer with a delay on his power.
Treat slinger like huntress with wind up add ons and youll be fine. Maintain distance and force optimum shots. Stop standing in the designated safest point in the loop and move further ahead depending where you think he'll come from.
You know who also has a giant notification with a extended range attack. Pig and how well did that work out. Pigs low tier garbage because people coped that if you just maintain distance or act on the notification the killers screwed. You want current deathslinger who has reeling in limitations reloads on every shot and two hits targets. Without any gen delay or additions to the kit.
Until you start suggesting actual compensation for nerfing at best top mid tier killer i cant take anything said here seriously.
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Why would you want to "nerf" a low tier killer like deathslinger with 0 map pressure?
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