General Discussions
General Discussions
Are the breakable walls horrible? (Whats your opinion?)
Personally i dislike the killer having to spend more times especially when its mandatory like the ones in midwich. And it seems like the general consesus around them is they aren't very liked. Otz,Tru3,Monto,Tofu,Scott and a few others have weighed in on them in the past and the first 3 seem to hate them on the new macmillian map. So i just wanted to see everyones general opinion on them. If the killer has to break them they should be in spots where the killer gets a good advantage for breaking them (while not being pretty much mandatory) the survivors dont break them. Anyways thats my consesus whats yours?
Comments
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No, I hate them. There are literally infinites on new badham, but since the breakable wall is there, it stops becoming an infinite, so the devs think it's ok. Not to mention, there are way too many on the map, and some of them are unnecessary.
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I don't know, but it gives me something to do for bloodpoints in the I just got stomped and am waiting out the EGC scenario.
I you're maxed out on chase you might as well go break stuff rather than chase people out the door.
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I said it on another post, they're a nice idea but bad in practice. Think they would be better if they were doors that survivors and killers could open/close with killers having additional ability to break them to remove from game.
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they don't address the core issues of map design, they are the BHVR standard of Bandaid fixes
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Yeah I hate them as well, especially when you have to break them (like the main buildings in Dead Dawg, Groaning Storehouse, and Coal Tower) otherwise you’ll have a god loop available to Survivors.
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I dont like them in general. However, they improved until this Midchapter.
Saloon Breakables are bad. Midwich was better, because you can break them "on the go" (and dont basically have to B-Line to some of them like on Saloon), the Walls on Badham were good IMO. Killer had a choice on most Walls if they want to break them or not.
I dont like the MacMillan-Breakables, the Main Buildings were all fine after the Map Rework and there were no other Spots for Breakables (and I hope I will never see Breakables in Structures after the Saloon-Map).
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The only one I really break is the shack wall on Dead Dawg Saloon. I just ignore them the rest of the time. I haven't bothered figuring out which walls are good to break or not.
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On paper they can lead to some dynamic gameplay such as opening different routes for killers. However they've been mostly used to create pseudo infinites at main buildings. Springwood's house of pain and nearly all the new Macmillan buildings are suffering from this right now greatly.
If they're going to keep implemeting the walls as predropped ultra safe pallets, then they need to give them faster break speed or something like that.
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I don't think they are being utilized in an effective or interesting way in their current state. Feels like an excuse to allow certain strong windows to remain available just because killer can (sometimes) shorten the relevant loop by breaking the wall.
It just feels like these walls were intended to be a new mechanic on par with the introduction of Obsessions and Totems/Hexes (hence why they keep gradually getting added to everything). Instead they wound up being nothing more than non-vaultable pre-dropped pallets.
One suggestion I've seen was that these should not be initially present and instead be something that survivors could periodically build in a trial to strengthen loops and/or hamper the killer.
Alternatively, I think they could be adjusted to ONLY create new routes for the killer (the Entity would block survivors from passing through the opened doorway). Breaking them would give killer additional pathways through tiles/structures without providing much benefit to survivors.
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On paper I like the idea, perhaps the survivors could be given like a hammer in order to break them so the survivor sided walls get use outside of inexperienced players. In execution though they suck, real bad.
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The way they're being used is essentially like pre dropped pallets in loops that were already fine. My thoughts are very much in line with Scott junds, where behavior uses the walls as an excuse to make infinites and say "no it's okay because it's a breakable wall."
Breakable walls should benefit the killer. Not the survivor.
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I like the concept, but the implementation is mediocre so far.
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They only hinder killers.
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I'm not sure how I feel about them.
Hate them because it's one more thing I have to waste time breaking. By the time the animation is done they are already at the next jungle gym.
Like them because some areas are better off not breaking the walls. Like the school on bedham or the dead end room on the 2nd floor of dead dawg saloon.
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Map designers suck at there jobs, they need to go in the corner and put the dunce hat on.
Breakable walls right now are just dropped pallets survivors can't use and make the killer waste there time breaking them all so the infinites can stop.
I thought they actually knew what they were doing and was just using the Cowboy map as a test run but it seems they took the worst parts of that map and putting it in all other maps with the breakable walls.
The maps people do not understand or play the game from what i'm seeing with these McMillon updates.
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As killer, I don't like them, because it's just another task I have to do when I'm already pressed for time. I much prefer the map re-works where they just added extra holes in the wall to take away strong loops.
As survivor, I find that it creates annoying situations where I run into a bunch of dead ends, and I basically just get killed because I didn't know where the doors were. I kind of don't think there should be dead ends besides basement, and breakable walls create lots of them.
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So far they are added in the favor of the survivors instead of the killer. What I mean by this is the devs will make a loop a literal infinite unless the killer breaks said wall, which is foolish and short sighted. The breakable wall should make a mildly safe loop unsafe once broken, because the killer has to invest time into breaking this wall where as the survivor does nothing. The concept is cool but they are currently added in the favor of the WRONG side.
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They could just add a mechanic where a window with 3 fast vault will break it and become a door.
Then they can increase number of pallets abit to cover that.
Suddenly everything is solved.
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I think they could be a lot better if they broke in half the time pallets take. As it is if you come up against one in a chase that you need to break, you basically just handed the survivor a free pallet for no effort.
We all know the time dynamic of the game doesn't give killers a bunch of free time to run around and play with breaking walls, so they shouldn't be a huge time sink.
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They should break wayyyyy faster than pallets imo
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The badham ones in the school are good. The school is a death trap if you don't break them. Breaking them means you can get around easier but so can the survivors. The ones on the corners of midwitch works the same. I like the idea that you can weigh up the cost of breaking them. Where I don't know one on dead dog saloon that shouldn't be broke
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The problem with breakable walls is they got the concept in the opposite way. There are some maps/places where having the wall actually benefits the killer. There are other places where having the wall benefits the survivor.
I'd argue that having the wall there should always benefit the survivor. However, instead of having it be that breakable walls just exist and killer has to break them to remove infinites, there should be no breakable walls at the start. Survivors should have to spend a little time building the breakable walls up, that the killer then has to break. This would make it so survivors would be able to put up walls as an alternative defense to say pallets and windows, but the killer can break them. After a wall is broken though, it can't be put back up.
Another thing i'd like to see is "degradable windows" make certain windows and "god loops" have windows that degrade everytime you fast vault them, and after like 3 fast vaults they break and turn into a doorway.
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I absolutely hate them
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There are 2 types of walls the usefull one and the uselles. Part of springwood make the main building a 2 exit instead of 4, on midwich is complicated.
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I generally don't like them. They only one I like is the one in the shack in Dead Dawg Saloon because it's optional and spices things up when broken, but all the others feel like either you have to break them to not being looped into oblivion or you could ignore them completely and not even notice. In the new Badham Preschool it seems there are way too many of the first kind.
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Another killer placebo.
You have to spend so much time wandering around breaking walls so you aren't stuck in a literal infinite if someone runs to the main building in Dead Dawg.
Midwich requires like 6 wall breaks for decent mobility because of the poor map design.. it's either walk 100m to one of 2 staircases, or break 4 walls. Then there's another 2 walls minimum you have to break to counter vaults and get access to a gen.
If the tiles were designed better to begin with, they wouldn't be necessary.. and atm, they are just illusions of balance, when actually it's just another time sink for killers.
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there just annoying either have breakable walls there to keep survivors in one are or have survivors make the walls to create stronger loops but dont add infinites with breakable walls to justify them, its just irritating
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Its just a predropped pallet most of the time, personally I enjoy them just because they are making more ways to break them
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Most of the ones I seen in the reworked maps benefit the killer more by leaving them untouched. It cuts off normal routes.
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