60 seconds is too long time for Pop Goes the weasel but not for DS?

Pop literally removes 20 seconds off a generator, being able to chase a fully healthy survivor and still be able to use it is too strong. Lets say the average chase time is 50 seconds, you'd still have 10 seconds left to remove 20 seconds of progress, meaning your actual chase time is 30 seconds. This doesnt affect the killers pipping, it doesnt affect the blood points much, all it does is reduce a generator massively(and yes, 25% reduction with essentially no cooldown is insane)

For DS, its much, MUCH different. Being quickly hooked after an unhook can be the difference between life and death, being less long in the match means essentially a depip. It's why Mori's are a much bigger issue than keys are too. Because the killer doesnt get removed prematurely from a match. Keys are annoying, sure, but they should not affect your progress.

I agree that Unbreakable and DS are a bit of an issue right now, but thats not because of DS or Unbreakable on their own, its the situation that both of them create.

And as for the last patches hurting killers. REALLY? you got a totem that resets other totems, essentially guaranteeing at least 2 totems to be cleansed before the effect wears off while also getting free wall hacks without the survivor EVER knowing it. Pyramid Head has guaranteed hits without any skill. Deathslinger pretty much the same. Unless you run a vault speed build, its essentially impossible to not be downed instantly against a decent Bubba. Face it, since november all the patches have been killer sided. Felix had decent perks, but they pale in comparison to what The Blight has to offer. The average killrate for pretty much every killer is above 2.5, that means the average game, the killer is more likely to win. Now it's time again to balance the game, and thus survivors are getting buffed to get the average killrate back to 2.5. And yes, 2.5 is a fair balance.

DS cant be nerfed due to how the pip-system works.

You know what? Give survivors the ability to stun the killer for 5 seconds whenever they please, then we can start talking. Pop can be applied whenever the killer wants to apply it. DS can only be applied when picked up. There is a guarantee for the killer to use Pop, multiple times in a row on the same generator, survivors dont have that choice. Killer mains forget how much free will they have in the game, while survivors rely extremely on the killer. Killer afk? survivors get depipped even though they did great. Killer terrible at mindgames and having tunnel vision? Survivors get punished with a depip. Getting mori'd after being camped and tunneled from a hook in a deadzone? Too bad, here's only 7k bp and a depip, should've git gud instead. The game is heavily balanced towards killers in terms of bloodpoints, pips and in-game choices. The only way survivors can start bullying the killer is if they have teamplay that is better than the skill of the killer. And even then, the killer is still extremely likely to get at least 1 kill. For survivors to have a 4 man escape, the killer must really make massive mistakes during the entire game. For all survivors to die, there only need to be 1 early death by 1 tiny mistake. People claim survivors get perks that allow mistakes to be fixed, but thats not true(well, kinda I guess), you can make 0 mistakes as a survivor and still be downed within 30 seconds. You can make 15 mistakes as a killer and still get an early down because a survivor made 2 mistakes.

All this, is reasons why Pop and DS are not even close to similar. DS is more comparable to Haunted Grounds than it is to Pop.

DS isnt really too lenient, its literally a 5 second stun vs being removed early from the game. If you refuse to eat a DS and call the survivor "immune", then you're the one making the mistake. You have the choice of waiting 60 seconds to pick up a survivor, or picking him up instantly and eat a DS early on, ensuring that survivor will never be able to DS you later in the game. And you choose to give that survivor 2 whole minutes of "immunity" because you think a 5 second stun is too much of a punishment.

While pop removes 20 seconds of survivors progress, for every single time it gets procced. Thats a total of 20 seconds of being stunned by DS, vs a total of 160 seconds of gen regression in an instant. Yet you choose to give survivors a total of 240 seconds of "immunity". Now, who is really the one at fault for that?

Well, that still doesnt matter due to how the perks work.

Pop goes the weasel can be activated at any time by the killer. And when activated, will remove up to 20 seconds of survivor progress. If optimally used, thats 12 uses and thus up to 240 seconds of progress being removed.

DS cannot be activated at anytime, in fact, you need the killer to pick you up to activate it. And when activated, will stun the killer for 5 seconds flat. When optimally used and the killer pretty much tunneling, thats 4 uses of 20 seconds being added to a chase. The 60 second timer actually doesnt really matter, because you decide to wait it out rather than taking a quick one use stun. You literally are the one who turns 5 seconds of stun into 60 seconds of "immunity". Its not immunity, and in fact, its better to eat a DS earlier in the match rather than dodging it all match and have them all have it during the EGC with a gate nearby.

So again, that is 1 perk that can be activated on demand for 60 seconds, up to 240 seconds removal on progress, versus a perk that can be activated only if the killer picks you up within 60 seconds, up to 20 seconds of stuntime. They simply are not comparable. Personally, I would have kept Pop at 60 seconds and instead nerf the % it removes from gens to 20% or even 15% while also buffing base gen regression.

DS is like Haunted ground, dangerous for the killer. SWF team abuse of this perk, the randoms dont have !

No, im right, because I was talking about the 60 second period where it can be activated. 'To quote you here "So again, that is 1 perk that can be activated on demand for 60 seconds" it's not activated on demand it activates when you hook someone you then have 60 secs to use it." Break down that sentence: 1 perk can be activated on demand for 60 seconds. So for 60 seconds, while the perk is active, you can choose when to use it. Where is that sentence wrong? By that logic, DS never works if you never get hooked, unbreakable never works if you get picked up or never downed. The only downside of Pop is that you have to hook someone, thats literally it. And in the average game, you're pretty much ensured to do so. Pop has the ability to gain more time than it costs. You can pop 1 generator 2 times before survivors have the time to reduce the time you removed the first time, you cant stun the killer twice in a similar fashion unless the killer is trying to get rid of all the DS's asap.

"and its up to them and there team how they use it" No, its not. They literally HAVE TO BE PICKED UP BY THE KILLER for the perk to activate. I dont run DS because 99% of the time I use it, it simply never gets used, even if I "accidentally" get downed. Survivors have little to no influence on the usage of DS, the usage of DS lies by how the killer react to it. Its really not as strong as people claim it to be, the strength literally lies in how much the killer fears it.

"and you play optimally vs it(DS) which is not always eating it at the start of the match" What? how is that optimal? You want DS to be gone as early as possible untill its too late to get rid of it. DS is extremely strong late game, but early game is has practically no effect. Not eating DS early game is literally throwing your own game.

"any gen slow down perks killers use end up getting nerfed" yeah, because it has to be possible for survivors to finish the game against all killers. Gen regression perks get nerfed because its practically impossible to face it when killers who are already good at gen patrols without any gen regression perk. PGTW was too strong for what it did. You could literally have 5 gens at the end of the match thanks to PGTW, which, unless you face literal potatoes, is too strong. Survivors "win" by having 3 escapees, if 1 perk prevents the method of escaping to be an impossible goal, then that perk is too strong. PGTW needed a nerf to put more pressure on forcing the choice between going for another hookstage or reducing an important generator, currently, at least 4 killers could do both, and those killers do not need a nerf.

And again, DS is single use, when survivors get killed early on, they lose a pip even if they play practically perfectly. Killers can do terribly the entire match and still earn a pip because they run pop. Its literally not a double standard because of that alone. I mean, unless you want to give survivors to remove the killer from the game within 2 minutes time.