What to Solve Blatant Camping? Here's How:
Hooked Survivors in your terror radius and within 10m of you have reduced death progression shortly after being hooked, while you're not in chase. (Edit) RDP Is deactivated after exiting a chase, RDP will reactivate after spending a total of 10 seconds near a hooked survivor.
Obviously people have complained repeatedly over "face camping" and there are those who defend the idea of "camping" as legitimate. Camping is a problem, when it's blatant. Not only does it create a frustrating situation for the unlucky survivors to be caught, it ruins the thematic flavor of the game itself. Yes, killers who camp are more likely to lose, but this isn't an excuse or justification, it's simply what can happen. However, "Bait & Ambush" is a legitimate strategy and it does add to the thematic flavor of the game. Forget tunneling or blatant camping, Bait & Ambush is using the survivors and their altruism/self-interests against them, forcing plays and creating confusion.
The only way to permanently solve this issue is to split the two forms of camping into a form that's punished and is discouraged and a form that's legitimatized and balanced around. Killers who don't have the powers or the builds to Bait & Ambush shouldn't be hanging around hooked survivors the entire game, nor should they be rewarded with ensured kills/bloodpoints for doing so. Killers who do bring builds to specifically Bait & Ambush ought to be favored as a style of play.
Comments
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What's "reduced death progression"? If it's what I think, this was already tried and abused by survivors in the very first PTB.
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There is no need. Only killers with an insta-down can reliably camp a survivor. (Looking at you Bubba). With good coordination survivors can rescue a camped friend without adding any perks into the mix. If you can use Borrowed Time, it can be done solo. Desperate Measures could also be amazing in breaking a camp.
Tl;dr: Teamwork or perks can reliably solve this problem.
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Yeah the devs already tried adding something to the game to punish camping killers, but survivors abused it all the time.
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The TLDR on these discussions are always going to be:
Its been tried and abused too badly so it had to be removed.
Or.
It would be abused badly and removed.
Camping is not going away just due to the fundamental design of the game's hook system makes any anti camping measures either FAR FAR FAR too abuse-able or not abuse-able but completely useless like Camaraderie.
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Longer time till death on hook and if it wasn't done as I laid out, then of course it would be abused. I forgot to add while not in chase, however, but this isn't something that can just be abused, unless the abuse is in the form of constantly waiting "just out of range" and playing the waiting game with the killer: Hence terror radius, distance and not being in chase are the prerequisites. If you loser your terror radius, the effect doesn't kick in. If you're out of the distance it doesn't kick in. If you start a chase while close, it doesn't kick in.
Incorrect, it's absolutely needed. A less toxic community/play pattern means more overall enjoyable games and that leads to a healthier, more robust community. That's something devs in all games need to promote.
If the excuse to not address it is going to be "Only some killer's can reliably camp/Bring this special perk," then it really just amounts to saying nothing in response. Not every player has X/Y/Z perk and just because some killers can execute a toxic method of playing a game doesn't mean that method should go unaddressed. The game is asymmetrical, with survivors being on the none-low end of information, the expectation for survivors to predict and combat something through their perks to stop one particular (toxic/antithetical) kind of play isn't a legitimate expectation. Killers being on the move and making active plays however is a reasonable expectation, unless they already setup a build to ambush hooked survivors.
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Yeah, of course; camping seems annoying and unfair. But think of it this way:
If you camp someone all the way to death hook, the killer wastes a bunch of time when other survivors do gens, given that the survivor doesn't get saved. If the survivors do wanna save that person, than tank a hit and get the save, or do a 1:1. Bait the killer. Figure it out. It's a strategy with pros and cons.
I don't object to that change, however. Camping can be lame, I suppose, and that could be a good nerf.
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Or, you could always, run perks to counter it, and it shouldn't be an issue because some of these are meta. here's my list from perks to choose from if you that butt hurt about camping
- DS/UB/SG every killer in the world will hate you if you abuse it but if you use it to its intented purpose (anti tunneling), you should be just dandy
- BT it works against every killer but stealth killers and it a free health state for the unhooked
- Kindred lets your teammates know if you are being camped and tell them to rush gens unless you in a swf where you don't need this
- deliverance very good with very smol pp but requires you to get an unhook
I'm pretty sure there are other but you get the point. You have the tools you need. If you have none of these perks rush gens if you find out its a face camper.
Also did you know that when survivors try to unhook a camped survivor, thats technically the bait, the ambush is when you get grabbed. Also you say that camping being punished through bloodpoints and emblems doesn't matter but in the next goddamn paragraph you say "nor should they be rewarded with ensured kills/ bloodpoints. Now, idk about you, but the game ain't over till Jane sings and you say ensured kill like saying camping actually 100% is a guaranteed kill. That's like saying gen rushing is a guaranteed win. Nothing in this world is free or guaranteed without conditions, and i tell you a good team hell even one good player could probably get someone off of that hook easy. Now move along, cowpoke, you should be getting your anti camping build ready.
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I've already thought of it that way, it's in the post.
Unlike many, I want camping to be in the game. However, I want it to be in the form of Bait & Ambush, not blatantly sitting there waiting for a survivor to die. Not only because it's maddening to be the one on the hook (Hooked survivors being camped should really be earning Altruism Points at minimum), but being the survivor not on the hook just makes the game less enjoyable: kind of defeats the purpose of the game holding M1 with no pressure. Additionally, this whole "get a stick and draw out a plan with other survivors" thing doesn't work, innately. Unless everyone is running Kindred and/or Bond (an additional perk alongside those already suggested), there's no method of coordination that isn't SWF.
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Ohhhhhhh
Sorry I'm like tiny brain lmao
ty for clarifying
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Longer time till death on hook and if it wasn't done as I laid out, then of course it would be abused. I forgot to add while not in chase, however, but this isn't something that can just be abused, unless the abuse is in the form of constantly waiting "just out of range" and playing the waiting game with the killer: Hence terror radius, distance and not being in chase are the prerequisites. If you loser your terror radius, the effect doesn't kick in. If you're out of the distance it doesn't kick in. If you start a chase while close, it doesn't kick in.
Yup, it was tried exactly as you laid out and abused by the survivors because they did, in fact, wait just out of range.
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"If the excuse to not address it is going to be "Only some killer's can reliably camp/Bring this special perk," then it really just amounts to saying nothing in response. Not every player has X/Y/Z perk and just because some killers can execute a toxic method of playing a game doesn't mean that method should go unaddressed. The game is asymmetrical, with survivors being on the none-low end of information, the expectation for survivors to predict and combat something through their perks to stop one particular (toxic/antithetical) kind of play isn't a legitimate expectation. Killers being on the move and making active plays however is a reasonable expectation, unless they already setup a build to ambush hooked survivors."
Now, pardner, I must inform you the folly of assuming one's circumstances, as you can always fabricate the notion of your advantage. Translated: You can always just say "well, if you had just brought X/Y/Z, you'd have been able to deal with A/B/C, duh," forgetting that survivors neither know the killer or anything about the player themselves before jumping into a game. You're literally asking people to have the foresight to buy and level the right survivors, then build the perfect build with those perks to counter a specific playstyle with precision.
As an aside, an ambush is by definition a surprise attack from a concealed position. The fact that you're blatantly visible with a massive terror radius means it's not a Bait & Ambush, it's just baiting and setting up shop. Not every single player has the perks or the team to counteract this method play and it has the high potential to ruin one player's game, eating up their time and getting zero out of it.
So the actual mechanism was, in fact, one that required the hooked survivor to be:
- Within the killer’s terror radius and within a minimum distance from the killer
- Not within the terror radius and distance of a killer in an active chase
I'd like to see that patch, because I'm sure the conditions weren't that and were most likely flat distance, without chase or terror radius being prerequisites.
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Didn't I already address if you don't have those perks, could've swore I did
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I will say this. I love the idea of bait and ambush myself. Especially when you're rescuing a friend from a basement Leatherface, it's immersive and feels like the actual films he's based on.((Which originated the whole hook thing if I'm not mistaken)). The game is too restricting on players for my liking.
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What about maps with multiple floors?
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Yeah they could add entity blockers or something, but there would be an uproar from killer stans.
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It was based on distance and was disabled if survivors were in the same radius or if the killer was in a chase. The TR thing was not tried, I misspoke. However, given the findings, the TR would just make it worse, because the problem wasn't killers, it was survivors.
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It have already been tried and abused, so it was cut out.
People need to learn that if you're gonna have a better impact on people's playstyles if you reward them for playing the way you want, instead of punishing them for not.
I mean, even if you made it so that campers got literally no points whatsoever, depipped and got banned for 24 hours for camping.. some still would, because its a mentality. A state of mind.
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This is a very good idea - the chasing condition is important here.
Sadly, the entitled killer mains will tell you that this is "abusable" without any explanations, while it is obviously not - pretty sad..
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It's not because it's a mentality, it's because survivors reward camping. As a killer, why wouldn't you just sit tight and wait for survivors to stop all progression while you continue yours? If your opponent is making a critical error, you don't correct them or make one yourself "for fairness" or because "it's not fun", you take advantage of it.
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That's also true. Most survivors are incapable of letting their fellow survivors die on hooks and just push generators. It does make sense, as there's so many perks that grant second chances and such. Overconfidence.
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This only exacerbates the issue with the gulf between power of solo survivors and SWF. 3 solo survivors have no way to know is a killer is camping if he is just outside of kindred range, or if the individual survivors are not running kindred. SoloQ is already seriously suffering in the current state of the game, and camping doesn't really hurt a competent SWF, which according to most killer stans is what kills the game for them. So why does camping need to be a viable strategy when it's just a "rich get richer, poor get poorer" strategy?
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Use Kindred. Learn (and teach others) the M1 code (spamming M1 on the hook=camper).
Camping is only a viable strategy if survivors let it. Killers should not be punished because survivors make mistakes.
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I do use kindred, but that doesn't change the fact that using a perk slot that wouldn't be required by the survivors who are already at an advantage only further exacerbates the issue. I know the jumping jacks tech, but that doesn't stop other players from ignoring or misinterpreting the signal. You seem to be of the mind that survivors should be allowed to communicate that they are being camped, why not make it a contextual communication option that you gain access to while hooked? Camping is only a viable strategy against survivors who are already at a disadvantage, soloQ survivors should not be punished because they don't have the communication tools that SWF have, especially if they plan on balancing around the latter group.
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And then they down and camp another one or hit them down with noed because your supposed to counter camping with genrush but then noed punishes you for doing that. 2 survivors either way get camped to death. Maybe 3 if the survivors arent fast enough to do all the gens in time. Seems legit.
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How about doing gen as a counter i know this sound terrible but listen when all gen are done you can escape and most of the time 1 or 2 gen are done before the killer get is first down so if you tell me withing 2 minute you cant do 3 or 4 gen then you dont know how to press M1 as a survivor
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Ironic considering...
Already kinda answered your question.
SoloQ is so disadvantaged in this situation because3 different players might waste time to find out the killer is camping. So what's the solution for them? Assume the killer is camping every time and never save? Maybe it would help if all survivors had chase indicators like the obsession does?
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1) Don't loop around the hook
2) Don't produce scratchmarks arround the hook
3) Crawl AWAY if you get downed near a hooked survivor
Also Camaraderie (one of Steves perks) does already what OP want
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If you have the specific patch, I'd like to read it. The only way I can think this would be abusable (the past iteration) would be that the distance was too high and that survivors would loop in and out of chase just outside the range necessary for them to deactivate the mechanism, while keeping the killer within it, so that the hooked survivor was in a permanent state of reduced death progression. That's solved by having a deactivation timer that spans further than the end of a chase/reactivation timer of being within range for an accumulated amount of time and a smaller distance (If too large to begin with).
I know this may come as a shock to you, but I'm not an idiot and do the generators the moment I figure out the killer is blatantly camping. Also, unless I'm SFW (and I only play with either my wife or my buddy), there's no way of conveying this to any of the other survivors, so yes, I will certainly tell you that within 2 minutes I cannot do 3-4 gens by myself. The post isn't a "wah, this sucks" complaint, it's about the toxic nature of blatant camping, from a gameplay, thematic and player experience view: killers who don't actively chase turn games into Press M1 and Walk Simulators (literally your response); Players who are camped gain nothing for their 2 minutes of agony.
This is effectively the entire issue summed in one paragraph. The "Optimized" method of playing DbD is a 4 man survivor team, with everyone carrying specific perks, items and making specific callouts, all within a VoiP. Every counter to the OP and camping issue (aside from one) has been "Just work with your team/It's dangerous to go alone, Take This!" Blatant camping punishes Solo survivors, it does nothing to SWF. SWF, fully optimized, enrages killers and makes the killer demographic have to goto extremes to deal with them (Devour Hope+Mori+One Hit Down Killer). These killers now face the Solo survivors and still camp, but now down you immediately and/or kill you out of nowhere. The rebuttal cannot simply be "Play better and with these perks 24/7."
It is abusable if not implemented correctly, that's why I worded it as I did. The mechanism has to actually punish blatant camping, not simply being within a general range.
While I don't know how BHVR codes it's engine, I can't imagine them having an issue with making a more oval/oblique bubble for distance.
Post edited by MasterofSFL on0 -
They didn't have to loop (although they did). Merely showing up forced the killer into a lose/lose situation (let the survivor be unhooked or let all gens be repaired), which is absurd. They also tried having the first hook stage be infinite (though self-unhooking still progressed it by the normal amount), which failed.
Unfortunately, as this was the very first PTB, back in 2016, I've no idea where to find official patch notes. Best I can do is the wiki.
Post edited by Orion on1 -
Alot of the ideas people post on here have been tried in very old ptbs and even though some of the ideas sound good people always find a way to abuse them and cause it to not be in the game, survivors have no one to blame but themselves for something like this not already being implemented because everything that was tried to prevent camping was abused in the old days
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Well the current camping meta is a lose-lose for the opposite side assuming no voice coms. Either all survivor players check if killer is camping which will probably cede a 3k to the camping killer, or assume the killer is camping which could create a meta of 1 hook deaths, which is absurd. Killer is allowed infinite camping with no recourse from survivors if he chooses not to chase, which many many would argue is a failure.
Edit: C'mon BHVR, just because you shove this to the page where this won't be seen doesn't mean this doesn't matter. Kinda sad how you did that honestly :|
Post edited by StevePerryPsychOut on0 -
Survivors have perks to deal with this scenario and can rush gens, but they choose not to. Even with Kindred clearly showing a camper, survivors will often try to unhook, which is just objectively a bad decision. When they rush gens, however, killers get 1, maybe 2 kills and depip.
Also, the feedback section is where threads go if you want the devs to notice them. If you want the attention of people who can't do anything about this problem, then General is what you want. If you want someone to read this who can actually do something about it, then Feedback is the right place.
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"new mechanic:
- slowed-down the Entity progression on the Hook if the Killer remained within a certain proximity of it.
It was their first attempt to create and implement an anti-camping mechanic. Since the new Mechanic got abused too heavily by Survivors purposefully kiting the Killer around their hooked teammate, the Developers disabled the Mechanic again."
So, like I thought, the survivors were just keeping the Killer within range of the hooked survivors, forcing a reduced death progression. Unless someone can show me the PBE notes at the time, it seems that there was only a distance requirement: In-Chase and Terror Radius were not part of this iteration. Specifically why I placed terror-radius and not in an active chase was for that very reason, if distance is the only requirement then it's a given it's going to be abused. I feel that the missing components in that kind of anti-camping mechanism are what I originally put forth, with some additional modifiers:
Entity's Displeasure: Hooked Survivors while within your terror radius and 10m of you have reduced death progression shortly after being hooked, while you're not in chase. Entity's Displeasure Is deactivated upon entering a chase, Entity's Displeasure will reactivate after spending a total of 10 seconds near a hooked survivor after exiting a chase. Entity's Displeasure is not in effect when two or more survivors are on hook or during End-Game Collapse.
This solves for the looping/kiting/stalling of survivors, which now cannot endlessly kite the killer around and force a permanent reduction in the death timer It keeps killers from standing directly near a single hooked survivor, but rewards getting at least two hooks then camping. It also allows for forcible plays end-game, catching a survivor and forcing the remaining survivors to make a choice. It keeps open the ability for stealth power/perk killers to utilize Bait & Switch strategies without punishment.
Having just went through both the PBE and Patch Notes for the game, I only found one iteration of anti-camping popping up in the first PBE like Orion stated. That version simply made it so the killer had to be within a certain distance and nothing else. My version places several conditions, all of which combined are what constitutes blatant camping. The only abuse this could cause would be survivors actively get someone thrown on a hook and then ignore them until End-game collapse. However, that all depends on whether or not a killer is going to actively camp to begin with and the whole point is to punish the activity.
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And they were also just showing up to force the killer into a lose/lose situation, like I said. I should know, I was there.
Regardless, no tweaks can solve the main issue this suggestion had, which is that survivors could (and did) easily abuse it.
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Okay, I'm really not trying to be a jerk here, but did you even read the other responses? You keep making the same generalized arguments without responding to criticisms of your arguments directly. Whereas I have been very careful to address your arguments directly. What perks do survivors have to deal with a Leatherface revving a chainsaw next to a survivor (outside of Kindred to straight up ignore the poor survivor being camped)? Should the game be balanced around the assumption that all players will either be SWF or using 1 specific perk? If not then what if 3 soloQ players don't have it? People often throw around 4 minutes as the time it takes for gens to get done in a quick game. Assuming all 3 players take an additional 30-40 seconds on average to check if killer is camping + time to open exit gate that leaves time for the killer to get 2-3 kills, for no more effort than downing 3 people once and standing still and watching them die. Against a SWF, the unstoppable boogeyman of killer mains, that still leaves a consistent 1-2k for absolute minimal effort. A soloQ survivor would have have to put in an exponential amount more effort to ensure similar results, and could not guarantee it in the same manner a camping killer could.
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The lose-lose situation was caused by the permanent reduction in the death progression due to distance being the only qualifier for the killer. It's that binary "Is the killer within range: Yes or No" that makes it profitable for a survivor to show up and force the killer to chase, as now the killer must choose to give up a hook and chase, leave and hope to find the other 2 survivors or chase and risk gens being completed.
Without that binary and instead using a true/false, you instead get in that exact scenario:
"Is the Hooked Survivor:
- Within the terror radius: True
- Within 10m of the killer: True
And
Is the Killer:
- Currently in Chase: True"
With that change, the survivors can't abuse the mechanism by just showing up, there is no lose-lose for the killer. The moment a survivor shows up and taunts a chase, Entity's Displeasure disappears. It would be no different than things are today when a survivor taunts a killer to give chase, the timer would still be the same, the survivor would still be delaying the killer on purpose. It's only when the killer camps and no survivors show up does Entity's Displeasure activate. So where does the abuse exist in this framework?
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That's very general, and is therefore barely an argument, can you state how survivors would abuse his proposed fix specifically?
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The only thing which will "effectively" deter camping is to make it worth the Killer's while not to do it. Punishments for staying near the hook have never worked, nor will they ever work. I suggest creating a benefit to Killer BP or emblem advancement which rewards them for moving away from the Hook (when not in a chase), not unlike the "Bold" Survivors get for remaining in the Killer's Terror Radius. In this case, going further from the Hook and remaining away would earn. Likewise, a version of Barbecue & Chili (weaker) could be made base package so the Killers have something to move TOWARD whether an Aura shows the Survivor's briefly or lights up a Generator(s) currently being worked. Killers will be more likely to leave that "bird in the hand" if they have a direction to go. Do you see my point?
Camping is a valid tactic, and is sometimes the right move. More often than not, it only hurts the Killer's overall performance. Until we make it crystal clear through rewards that moving off has merit, pointless camping will remain. That is why it is more common among new Killers who don't really understand when/why they should camp versus when/why they shouldn't. I think all of you are presenting this in the wrong, self-involved light. This isn't about your fun as Survivors. It is about commonsense in application, i.e. what is rewarding and what is efficient for the person you want to NOT camp you.
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Why would a real solo survivor care for the camped scgmuck anyways?
Real survivors only do care for the normal game flow until the hatch might come into play.
Funny how swf's suicidal altruism is leaking into solo mindset.
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Yes, I did. What you don't get is that I'm not making any arguments, I am telling you what actually happened when these ideas were tried. Not an idealized scenario, not even a hypothetical scenario, but the very real scenario that happened.
Survivors showed up without triggering the chase conditions. That's where the abuse lies. They don't have to trigger the chase conditions if they don't want to since one of the conditions is literally that they're sprinting within the killer's line of sight and within a certain distance from the killer. Your solution does not and cannot account for that.
See above, this is not an argument, it is me telling you what happened. I'm not going to reply here again unless I get bored, but anyone who's been here a while can tell you that this is the same idea that everyone always suggests and has been objectively proven to be a bad idea.
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One thing was tried once when the game was in a very different state, so there's no point in iterating or trying anything else? Sorry, I don't follow your logic here, especially considering you refuse to address any reason outside this one. I'm willing to listen to your justification for this point of view, but just digging your heels into the ground and stubbornly saying "no" doesn't really do anything for me here.
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So perks to bandaid fix a problem and do gens because the killer is still technically baiting right?
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They are multiple flaws to what you said. Let's start the the obvious "rush gens."
The death timer from hook is 2 minutes. You can only achieve 2 gens in the 1 minutes because a solo gen is 80 seconds. That's more than 1 minute for 1 gen. Let's assume all 3 survivors are spreading out gens.
Only 1 gen is getting popped during that 2 minutes. The killer is almost guarenteed a 2k if they arent bad in chases. A depip means nothing as rank doesnt matter and most camping killers do not care.
Ahh yes my favorite argument "survivors have perks to deal with this scenario." That Is bandaid fix to a problem. You shouldnt have to run perks to deal with something such as camping.
One more thing if camping subjects the survivor to holding m1 there is no real reason to play. Holding m1 is boring and chase is the only interaction. If you are somehow fine with this clear design flaw that's quite weird.
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I'll say it again: camping is only harmful to the Survivor unfortunate enough to have become the victim; effectively removing them from the game and denying them bloodpoints.
A good group of Survivors, will work on generators while the killer camps - knocking out several before either attempting to save before state change; or choosing to leave the hooked Survivor to buy more time and knock out most if not all the remaining generators depending on point in match. The huge problem is Survivors will kill themselves on the hook immediately instead of struggling it out and buying their team that time - which often results in camping feeling like it is toxic to the entire time when it is really the 'I quit' Survivor mentality when they get placed in an unfun situation.
Camping can be combated by team-rushing the hook and even solo-rushing or trading your place on the hook to buy even more time for the rest of the team, unless it is a one-hit down killer like Bubba that makes you have to think and weigh your chances more carefully because he can multi-insta-down. Also, killers that camp are also the killers that either: do not care about emblems or pips or ranks; or are trying to derank themselves.
The problem is the game has a plague about it in the form of a Survivor vs. Survivor Team vs. Killer mentality -- where Survivors care more about their own individual escaping than making sure members of their team are able to Survive -- and that isn't the Survivors fault. That is on the Devs for designing the reward system to not reward you based on team gameplay: such as post-match awarding something like 25% of the individual bloodpoints scored by teammates during that match, which would encourage players to help their team make as many plays as possible instead of worrying about themselves first and foremost.
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You are assuming that they are starting those Generators right when the Hook starts. Chances are they were already working them when the unfortunate got downed and then hooked. Most Survivors will milk that time to finish their current Generator before even thinking of getting up to go for the rescue. The only important thing is to get there before Stage-2 starts (if the first hook). Beyond that, an early unhook around a camping Killer is wasted opportunity.
Post edited by Moundshroud on1 -
That's what the devs are best at. (No offense intended devs, this was a joke)
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Yeah you srent wrong though. DS bandaid fixes tunneling, corrupt bandaid fixes gen speed.
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To deter behavior, you need to provide both carrots and sticks. I have only come across one true punishment for staying around the hook and that was the first PBE, of which was just a binary Yes/No of whether the killer was or was not in range. Simply giving bloodpoints for doing what a killer should already be doing under most circumstances isn't the bullseye here. Giving killers more innate power probably will exacerbate the issue, allowing them to have a weaker BBQ&C will just tell experienced killers whether or not camping is the move. Whatever carrots you want to give the killer, the fact is the stick has to be tied to standing with the hooked survivor, otherwise it's free bloodpoints/auras up until you want to camp.
If you read the post, you'd know I am not contesting "camping as a tactic," it's blatant camping as your sole method of playing. It doesn't matter if the killer's performance is or is not hampered more often than not, that's only a point in the direction of making the act not worth it in the first place. The fact is that it is about the fun of survivors, as the next poster points out.
Which is why I have also stated that survivors being camped need to gain Altruism and Objective points. That lessens the frustration of the act and at least gives the incentive and satisfaction that surviving as long on the hook as possible means getting something out the game and the rest of the survivors leaving (I.E. not DCing immediately).
However, this whole concept of "Good X do Y, therefore" is neither a counterpoint or a rebuttal when talking about an inherently toxic, counter-intuitive action. It doesn't matter if "Good Survivors do Gens," bad killers let survivors do gens. I don't know about you, but when I play survivor, I play for the action and pressure, not to hold M1 for 3 minutes while I play walking simulator. So a camping killer does in fact harm more than just the hooked survivor, it's also lessening the overall game for the rest of the survivors, whether or not three escape and one dies. As with the first reply in this post, when you want to promote one action and deter another, you need both carrots and sticks. If the game was geared to more team-based plays and rewards, the altruism aspect of the game would be intensified, making hook saves more valuable and therefore, camping more lucrative.
Survivors already show up to hooked survivors and wait out the killer to leave or taunt them to chase. You've lost the plot here, the issue is blatant standing next to a survivor and camping the entire game, 10m is roughly a 3sec walk for almost any killer (which is also roughly the minimum safest distance for an unhook) and the complaint/criticism here is that survivors will show up and somehow ring the killer around the hook in just the right manner to never engage a chase. This is forgetting that the PBE you said was a problem occurred in September of 2016 when the only available killers were Trapper, Wraith and Billy, some of the easiest to kite killers in the game. "Sprint Burst" was the only exhaust perk in the game and it's highest tier only left it off cooldown for 20 seconds and it recharged even while running.
What was being abused wasn't just the hook-distance mechanism, but also the lack of mobile killers while the most mobile survivor perk had an absurdly low cooldown that could be used effectively ad-infinitum. So everything that created the framework for that abuse (Lack of mobile trappers, high mobility on low cooldown, universally used mobility perk) has been removed or solved within the game. Between the Terror-radius now being a qualifier (with many killers now being able to remove it), a ~3 buffer zone for most killers, a chase breaking the effect and survivors being unable to infinitely kite, the problem you're pointing out can't exist in this form.
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But it isn't about that. The Killer is a Player too and his/her agency is just as important as the Survivors. They are not Bots, and we don't get to decide what is fun for us is more important. Thus, the only thing that will work is making it lucrative to move away.
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I've said this before, so I'll repeat as many times as I have to: asymmetrical games require as asymmetrical solutions. Survivors and Killers each have different considerations to take into account. Killers want to be able to chase/hook/kill survivors without being endlessly harassed/looped/interfered with. Survivors want to be able to successfully escape chases/hooks and avoid dying, without being overtly oppressed.
Just because a killer likes killing and winning the game with a 4k does not excuse the existence of secret moris, which breaks the format and expectations of the game. Conversely, just because survivors like surviving and winning the game, does not mean 4 man flashlight DS+Unbreakable+Borrowed Time should be condoned. At some point the game has to function within a certain parameter for each side, so it's completely irrelevant whether or not a killer finds a particular thing "fun." If something you're trying to justify comes at the cost of game and community health, then the bar for that things has to be higher than "Well, these people like it, therefore."
This is specifically why I stated in the OP and in multiple posts within this thread that the distinction between Blatant Camping and "Bait & Ambush" needs to be made, where Blatant Camping is standing in plain view, with your terror radius, watching and daring the survivors come rescue the hooked man (typically the first one downed). "Bait & Ambush" is concealing yourself and your terror radius nearby the hooked man, using your powers/perks to setup ambushes. It's the plain difference between a Ghostface hiding behind a tree or a Trapper running Insidious and placing traps all around a specific hook vs a Leatherface dragging a survivor to a hill, hooking them, then standing on the hill till the survivor dies and/or others attempt to unhook.
If you want to try and argue anything resembling the latter is justified because "The killer is his own agent, he decides what is fun," then there is absolutely no rationale within the Dead by Daylight community to complain about 4 man SWF squads making the game a living train wreck for killers. These survivors are their own agents and they decide what is fun. That's obviously absurd though, so why even put that forth?
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