Why is camping so effective?
I made it to red ranks finally and I'm seeing a lot more campers. Its either a really good killer that strategically knows where to apply gen pressure, gets quick downs and knows how to end loops fast or its players that just get one person, proxy, then when they're dead get another kill. You get a guaranteed 2k almost using this and then a possible 3k when the last two are opening the exit doors. I might just be bad so don't take me too seriously because I haven't played as long as a lot of you had but camping seems to be the winning strat in red ranks.
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It's definitely a strategy that works. Especially if survivors are too altruistic, had games go from one person down to nearly everyone down because the killer decides to camp and instead of doing gens and getting the heck out of there they want to bomb the hook. Definitely effective
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Because stupidly, it can actually be quite efficient. Each state is only 60 seconds. If it would have taken you longer than 60 seconds to find, chase, down and hook someone else, it’s a better use of your time to just camp the first guy into second state.
Then there’s the fact that most survivor teams are not 4 man SWFs, so you’ll almost always have a survivor coming to the hook for the save not knowing that you’re camping, which allows you to keep them off a gen as well without actually doing anything. Then a third guy may think “why is nobody saving?” and run to the hook, meaning that you managed to get the survivors down to one guy on a gen by doing absolutely nothing at all.
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Because many survivors don't take killers into account in their decision-making process. They want to do something, so they go do it. The killer's presence is irrelevant.
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Those juicy unhook bloodpoints are good bait.
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Almost every game in almost every tournament in Thailand, the killer just camping the 1st survivor to death and it's disgusting.
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It works best against those who are tunnel-visioned into getting that hook. Survivors will often waste a lot of time, observing when is best to save. This loses time which could have been allocated for generators.
However, if a team realises they're facing a camper and rock on with their objectives, it's normally a de-pip for the killer.
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Because camping is effective. It may not be fun but it is very much competitively viable.
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While this is true in general, it doesn't have to be because of tunnel vision on the rescue. It works because solo q lacks information, or because of overly altruistic SWFs. It takes advantage of the fact that if the first chase isn't overly long, then the survivors literally have to pump out all gens without wasting any time to assess the situation and the killer can almost mathematically get a guaranteed 2k by having a staring contest with their first hook and everything else is a bonus.
I'm not even factoring in meta killers, insta downs, early slowdowns like corrupt, or end game clutches like noed+bitter murmur. Because there's not enough time to do both gens and bones in this case. Add those to the mix, don't overcommit to your first chase and you can 3k/4k consistently against rank 1s except against dedicated depip squads.
It's simply a flaw in design.
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Full-on camping? Because people would rather try and get the unhook and hand the killer their moderately petty (and near-bloodpointless) victory than slog through a zero-interaction genslam.
Getting wins as a facecamper is nothing but a personal victory. We all know how easy it is to deny.
Now, if we're talking about patrolling hooks, well, that's more nuanced. A lot of the time a hook will just be in a naturally high-traffic area (often intentionally) and there's only one strat to win against good survivors: Snowball. A little forced farming is dirty, sure, but it's also a good place to get the ball rolling.
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Camping is just a lose-lose situation for survivors. Either you gotta gen rush, get out and lose the camped survivors or you try being altruistic and feed the killer.
i don’t even see it as a win when I escape vs a camper, it was just lost time in that case..
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Yeah, I can see that. A co-ordinated team might be able to pull something out of the bag. Would longer durations on the hook be more effective, or would that completely kill it for some killers?
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Because every survivor has been in the position that a survivor being camped has been, there is nothing more boring in Dead By Daylight than a killer who isn't very good, standing infront of you the entire game and preventing you from playing, so survivors go out of their way to try and get people off the hooks so they don't die with less than 4K BP.
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Its a cheap "tactic", personally i think "How have you enjoyed that match when you downed the first survivor then camped them?". I always feel bad for the person on the hook as they haven't really had chance to do anything to get bloodpoints. Also when you are in solo play it can be difficult to work around a camper. I know there's the "just do gens" argument but if you can't communicate then how do you know?.
Normally if I'm quite away from the hooked survivor i try and get the gen I'm working on done and hope my other two team mates who are closer with rescue. However if i see that they are nearing second phase i will head over and then if i see the killers is straight camping i won't save unless someone else is there and we can take hits for that person so they are not tunnelled. But again those matches are always so boring and the killer usually gets rewarded because the survivors cannot communicate.
But there is also the issue of team mates dying early on hook if they are being camped. In some cases that person on the hook wont give you time to do gens to punish the killer for camping. So its not always as simple as "do gens".
I think a good solution to this would be to increase the time of hook states, atleast then you can work through gens and it will really punish the killer for playing so poorly. I know that some people will disagree with my statement but it is prevalent in this game and more so with the blood event on right now.
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The thing is, in high ranks, a lot of survivors know how to loop. While some killers ignore looping (and therefore are always called out for a nerf), good loopers simply can waste too much time for the killer to stand any chance of winning. In that case, securing the kill you got can be the better alternative. In addition, a lot of survivors that are being camped suicide or dc on hook, so it doesnt take 2x 60 seconds to die, but more like 30.
So basicly, it is the better alternative, depending on your opponents and the killer you play, and the chances survivors help you with that strategie is very high.
Also, if survivors get out of their way to rescue ppl from a camper, they are actually stupid. Sacrificing the hooked one (who should struggle to the end) while the rest genrushes would basicly lead to a loss and a boring game for the killer. If all survivor did that, camping would be a lot less attracitve than it is right now.
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Because it requires absolutely no skill and can be done by everyone, even without a single brain cell. Same goes for tunneling/slugging/t-bagging and so on.
And since this is a team based game, it's only natural, that your teammates will try to save you...even it's only for the bloodpoints. This is the reason why I still think, camping and other "unfair" tactics need to be punished WAY harder. -50.000 BP for every minute camping (when not in a chase) is the bare minimum here, maybe all those toxic braindead killers will learn to play decent.
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It really depends on the survivors.I had matches in which,when i camped,they immediately came to rescue the hooked one,not knowing i was there.Other times they just left the poor unfortunate soul for dead.
U will see many Leatherfaces camping cuz he's the best at this btw.
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Cause its so easy to reach red rank, but difficult to develop the mindset of a red rank survivor. Some still play like babies or just bad overall and make very poor decision making, killer camp? pfft I am gonna dive bomb hook and make a juicy play.... and then they are down on the ground and we only have 2 survivors who can pressure the gens
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This is why I always take the full time when I am hooked. I run kindred so I will eat up the full two minutes and hope the rest of you get some generators done.
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It’s not just Thailand, it’s Asia in general, Asian killers are probably the biggest campers world.
As a survivor you have to play first hook as death hook because it generally is.
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I break the behavior down into three different types:
- Squatting. *This is what most people call face camping, where the Killer remains so close there is no way to do a safe rescue.
- Lurking: *This is where the Killer is hiding extremely close by out of sight of the Hooked and would-be rescuers.
- Camping: *This is where the Killer is making very short range patrols or circling the immediate area, sort of leaving and sort of not.
*I don't quantify proxy camping because that is part of the powers of specific people and doesn't require discussion. The problem is people lump all three of these things together when they are VERY different and are dealt with in different ways. Some are lucrative to the Killer when properly done, while others are terrible. I really wish we would not use a blanket term, but be specific. As it is hard to offer advice or comment on the topic when we aren't clear which of these, Squatter, Lurker, or Camper we are talking about.
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why killer camp ? I ask same question to survivor : "why gen rush ?"
same right ?
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Well it's a tactic that's used in any game. For example call of duty or siege. Camping is actually a legit and encouraged tactic, there are even game modes where it is literally get to point A and hold it.
So when I first started playing and I heard it was effectively a no no to camp. I was a bit confused but also I understood as you have 4 people to worry about and with how quick gens can get done these days it's sometimes not effective to camp.
However I am a firm believer that camping and tunnelling is a strategic method to win the game or at least get x amount of kills. Sometimes games are tough and people be stupid so camping and tunnelling might just happen without you actively trying to do it. Which happens about 90% of the time it happens to me while the other 10% is me trying to yeet survivors off gens only to watch my beloved run away. Why you run from my love Bill? ;_;
The amount of survivors on crossplay who just run into me as if I'll just faze out for a while so they can pass through is amazing. Though console has its plebs too, for instance when a whole team tries to rush hook but 2 of them run away and I get a free down because they chickened out or even when their running about the area you have hooked someone and they expect you to just leave when I can see your god damn scratch marks you fool.
There are 3 types of camping and tunnelling for me.
Purposeful. Accidental. And forced.
Purposeful is when you actively go in to camp and tunnel. Like you load in and just go "I'm going to camp the first person I hook because x y z..."
This is bad. Stop doing it. It's toxic and makes other killer's look bad. Same for survivors who go in to actively bully, stop doing it it gives the game a bad name and makes survivors look bad.
Accidental is when you hook someone and you walk away only for them to get unhooked so you walk back. Some would consider you not being halfway across the map as camping in that moment, I don't as you intended to move away. But then you get there and the person you hooked is an idiot and gives you a free down. This is tunnelling but it's not your fault they ran into you. If they give you the opportunity take it, their mistakes are your saving grace.
Accidental camping would be if you don't know the map very well or if you like me sometimes get stuck on stuff and have to figure out the maze of barrels or tires etc before you can gtfo. This is more for newbies as you can't really accidentally camp when you learn maps etc. My excuse is I'm busy looking for ma boi Bill or that fine drink of water Felix. Or I'm just not paying attention it happens.
Forced is when survivors force you to do it. Not like their holding you hostage kinda thing but their just god damn stupid.
If a group of survivors hover about you and you are forced into camping or tunnelling depending on what happens then this is something you can't really do anything about. For example Jake Bill and Meg are on Gen 1. You down Kate and take her to hook. Meg and Jake come to swarm you at hook while bill sneaks over for a easy unhook while your distracted. You can chase the others off while defending your kill, you know if there's 2 then there's a 3rd somewhere around you waiting for you to take the bait. You persist and they have to change tactics. So they rush hook, you get a few hits off and manage an exchange. They swarm so you have to just hit what you can while you try to hang your new kill.
This is boring. This is bullying. This is a SWF. You have been forced to camp. Eventually they'll force you to tunnel as they'll run out of bodies to block eventually. You down em all you hook em all and the end game messages are all "reeeeeeee you camped and tunnelled reeee".
For me it's forced if I have no choice but to sit and wait because I can literally see you hiding behind that bush Dwight. Or I can see the wall covered in scratch marks and I know your literally there waiting for me to move, like do survivors not know how to stop running? Why are you running? It's giving you away.
Other times are when I've gone to walk away only to hear the rustle of the swarm coming towards me. And it's like... 0.0 oh no. One of us about to have a bad time.
Sometimes it just be stupid being stupid. Like I've had trapper games where an unfortunate soul got hooked at shack and I had 3 traps on me or in the area I could just go get and set at shack. Then I walk away and in the distance I hear "ahhhh" "ughgh" "aghhhhh" as all 3 go off and I'm like... •.• ok...then guess this is a quick game after all. Then be looking at the fact I still have 5 gens up like ¿-?
Anyway it's a tactic but it should be used only when needed or you have no other choice. I've had a lot of altruistic people lately who just want me to sit in one area and that's it.
As long as you don't do it to ruin others game outright I don't see a problem with it.
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I would suggest rather than increase the time on hooks, that a small buff to gen speed be applied to the other survivors. This has the benefit of punishing the killer alone. Putting me on a hook for 5 minutes might guarantee the win for the survivors, but it would also guarantee that I would alt-tab out until the next match started. 5 minutes would be extreme sure, but I use that to make the point that longer slower matches with survivors spending that time dangling isn't more fun.
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A lot of replies say it is efficient - it is actually not, unless you are facing some god tier players on an unfortunate map (which happens extremely rarely in pub games).
Camping leads to a lot of extra kills because it bores the hell out of survivors, and they make suboptimal decisions that usually result in them dying. Boredom is a stronger opponent than any killer, people gladly sacrifice themselves just to get to play the game for a bit.
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I always run kindred, so I can see when a killer is camping/proxy, or show when I am. I will always try rescue them regardless because, the end of the day, that survivor isn't getting an opportunity to play the game they paid for. How is it fun for either person, survivor and killer, to sit staring at each other for 2 minutes after waiting for god knows how long to play. I'd rather try rescue that survivor and let them actually get some sort of interaction from the game than let them waste their time queuing for a lobby to be facecamped back to it, even if I die for it.
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That’s only if you’re playing against a potato group
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Because survivors just can't help but try to deny killer everything even if it costs them the game.
There' a fine lane between altruism and stupidity and survivors just love to cross it.
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Sometimes is like all the other people said: "Altruism". And sometimes is because you are playing with your friends or you are just a kind person and you don't want them to be frustrated and let them die in their first hook. Camping takes all the fun for survivors and also generator rushing and survivors toxicity takes all the fun to killers 😔
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That's not it at all. Going for a risky save is just substantially more fun than holding M1 for a few minutes until the killer camps your teammate to death, and that's extra true when the guy on the hook is in a party with you. People just want to have fun.
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Then they really shouldn't be making countless posts about camping being bad and bitching in chat that killer didn't want to chase after them like an idiot.
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On the one hand yes, but on the other hand that doesn't mean it isn't a problem. If everyone just rushed gens would that reduce the amount of campers? Yes. Is that fun, though? No. Is it reasonable for people to be frustrated about camping even if they choose not to rush gens? Yes.
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The reason I think so many killers camp is because it works on so many survivors. Especially randoms. A person gets hooked and most don't even know "waving your arms" is a signal that the killer is close. Randoms have no idea how close the killer is, if someone else is going for the save, if someone is going for the save and they get chased by the killer or if no one is even going for the save. This is why I run Kindred when I solo.
The other side is the killers. They get kills doing this method that they think "this must be how I should play. I'm at red ranks so I must be doing something right". They simply do not know rank means nothing and against experienced survivors or a swf, camping will almost never work.
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Red ranks are the "upgraded" version of rank 20. But I do get a lot of respectful killers and survivors recently
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Believe my experience, the moment survivors feel they are about to lose, they start rushing gens like they are playing tournament, unless they are as clueless as babies.
Not rushing gens is fun as long as survivors feel safe, but once they feel threatened, like when they see Nurse with legacy (even though I play her now only for dailies, bc she sucks ass much more than she ever did) or Spirit or Blight making quick downs, they start sweating to have gens done. Then, they either feel safe again and 99 gates and keep ######### around to mess with killer or they still feel unsafe and try to leave as fast as they can.
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Oh my gosh I just heard the screams of killer mains 😂😂.
I think if hook times were longer it would actually solve problems when in solo que. There's always that moment of "are they being rescued or not". I don't think it would be game breaking to add and think it would combat camping quite well.
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One of the problems is that there's really no way to combat camping. If the killer decides to camp, well then that person is pretty much dead. Sure you can work on generators, but one person being guaranteed removed is kind of... broken.
Its like an unintentional flaw in game design. Obviously killers are intended to go around applying gen pressue but you know... some killers really don't care if 2 survivors escape, and camping can easily get you 3 kills depending on the killer you chose and the survivors. There's no actual "Counterplay" to camping. Yes the other survivors can focus on gens while the killer camps, but that's still one death, and then most likely atleast a 2nd death when the killer camps again.
I would say its a similar issue to slugging, where the killer just downs as many survivors if not all survivors instead of hooking them. There's just not anything the survivors can do in most cases to fight back against it.
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They should just make hook progression stop when a killer is around the hook and no survivor is in the area.
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The hooked survivor might get to stage 2, killer might down a survivor trying to rescue, survivors leaves gens. I think what they call "proxy" camping is more effective than facecamping because FC will get more survivors to just do gens, which they should. The proxy camping will get survivors to think they can sneek to hook unseen, and they rarely can.
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Its effective because no one wants to hear their teammate complain for the next hour about that one camper and non of the team tried to save
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More often than not, the other survivors will attempt to rescue the player being camped, leading to not a single gen popping. Now the killer has every survivor together for an easy snowball.
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If a hook is being camped why would a survivor bother trying to save that person when they can just win the game.
Like how misguided are you to try to force the save?
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By experience as a middle-rank when I get matched with high rank survivors?
It's effective because people seem to lose all common sense.
Like... i usually run kindred. which means the team sees where others are when someone gets hooked. Do you know how often i witnessed an obvious swf jump up on me to all run to the hook to unhook while the hooking animation wasn't even through, and then they wonder why they get hit by the killer?
I had this on killer side all too often as well. Lambs to the slaughter is an utterly appropriate phrase here.
People seem so bloody eager to get the match done as quickly as possible that they lose all sense of anything.
Best part then is when you DON'T camp, but run lightborn cause there were 2-3 flashlights in the lobby and you get accused of cheating
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Simple.
Because as long as the survivor getting camped gets nothing out of it, they'll just suicide on hook. They have no reason to stay and keep the killer busy when their reward for doing so is depipping and not getting BP.
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The reason I always run kindred
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I'm not trying to whine and i'm sorry if you felt that way. When I do gens when this happens usually you can get 2 and a half gens done for the teams I'm in usually. Then they can get someone else and then usually the gens get done but then someone else can die on the exit gates.
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Camping is only as successful as survivors make it and they make it very successful
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Full camping is basically pussy move unless it's endgame, you're stopping and forcing survivor to not play game as they were there to do in first place and than killers wonder why survivors dc over that why would I spend my precious time on pussy starring at my soul at hook? I dc immediately and go for another game to actually play if I learned one thing in this game is to not lose time on idiots and to not get mad at it anymore but just dc and move on and block person to make sure I don't get in match with them again that's it
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I play survivor SQ mostly and from my exp and killers camp bc of the other survivors, they unhook too fast or under inappropriate conditions. Best counterplay for camping is gen rushing and escaping, leaving the killer to depip with one kill. SQ uncoordinated and altruistic efforts often lead to lots of unnecessary hook-bombing/changing.
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It’s actually not that effective in red ranks. Maybe during the double blood points event because everyone wants unhooks. However, in red ranks your average survivor is much more skilled and won’t rush the hook. We realize that’s just free time for us to finish the inner gens. If the killer keeps camping, will finish all the gens 99 the gate, then come grab our man with borrowed time and take protection hits for him.
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camping works if survivors are way too altrusitic and the killer knows they are around, also if u are chasing around a hooked survivor then you are just dumb. camping can work aswell when a survivor is on second hook and about to die the killer may waste 15 to 20 seconds and secure that kill to relief some pressure. sometriems is the right move, but in a wrong scenario wont do nothing for you, for example all the other 3 are doing gens.
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