Please do something about survivors holding the game hostage.
Just got out of a game that 2 of the survivors decided to troll from the very beginning, never do gens and hide. So the other 2 survivors gave up and the last 2 hid. It took me a good 15 minutes to find them, because of course one of the hiders burned an offering so we could go to temple of purgation, the largest map in the game.
I had tinkerer, and they never touched a single gen for 15 minutes. Eventually i got lucky and found one of them.
Can we please make it so if survivors do this kind of thing they get crows? Its ridiculous.
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Yeah, if little generator progression has been made and no chase initiated in a certain amount of time, it could be another condition to proc crows.
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Sure, give them crows for not participating. I can get with that.
On the flip side, lets give Killers a stacking movement speed reduction when spending periods of time at the hook. Because as annoying as survivors not participating in Gen is, Killers cherry-picking kills by camping a hook is equally annoying and not fun gameplay for anyone.
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Please no "whataboutism" create your own thread if you want to talk about that.
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As long as you can trust BHVR to implement it without allowing Survivors being able to abuse it.
Op's suggestion, on its face, is controllable by the afflicted party to avoid the punishment.
Your suggestion, on its face, allows the opponent to force the punishment onto the afflicted party.
Which is often the problem with any anti camping mechanism. A punishment for actively avoiding your objective makes sense, a punishment for actively degrading the game atmosphere also makes sense. A punishment leveled at you because all the rest of your objectives decided to go hang around the punishment area just to make you eat it, doesn't make as much sense.
I'd be 100% behind some sort of anti camping mechanism, as long as it is somehow avoidable if the game state dictates that it's the right thing to do at the time. Sadly, I don't think BHVR would be capable of making a workable system that punishes camping conditionally.
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Usually when this happens I just stand still and wait for them to make a move, they will do something eventually, in the meanwhile you could do anything else, that's what I do when this happens
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Hiding and not giving you a free kill is playing the game, just saying. I can see why it is annoying and I wouldn't do that myself, but if as survivor you know you will be dead the second you touch a gen then hiding and waiting for hatch is a valid playstyle.
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For now all you can do is record video evidence and make a support ticket.
An in-game solution for this should really be added though, but this situation might be too rare for it to be a priority.
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Which is why this game needs a fix. Currently no reason for survivors to do anything game related if they don't want to.
They can spend the entire round trolling the killer, avoiding objectives.
Either the game needs a timer (it it dead by daylight after all, so daylight implies dawn is coming).
Or if no gens are worked on for x amount of time a countdown starts which can only be interrupted by gen completion.
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Fr that's dumb. Not participating in the gameplay and just waiting and prolonging the game is annoying af with 2 survivors one person can at least make an attempt to loop the killer while the other one tries to do gens. It makes 0 sense for both ppl to be hiding and extending the game for no reason like if you don't succeed that sucks but at least the game is over and you can move on to the next one instead of staying in one get hiding and not getting anything out of it except boredom for both teams
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Also, just a nitpick, temple isn't the largest map in the game. That honour goes to Mother's Dwelling; I believe temple ranks 3rd? Although I'd have to double check on the wiki.
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There is NO PROBLEM of survivors holding game hostage. In fact it is the opposite. Too many try hard killers will leave a guy on the ground to get the 4k. To the point that he will bleed out from being first downed and then dying just so that the killer can waste time finding last survivor and get the useless 4k (because we all know killers LOSE if they 3k and 1 escape for god knows what reason).
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Letting a survivor bleed out is not holding the game hostage.
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Slugging isn't holding the game hostage though. It's literally just buying a lil bit of time to prevent hatch from opening and maybe getting the 4th kill. Where as hiding indefinitely til the hatch opens is keeping the game going way longer than slugging would. Killers don't get point for bleed out. It doesn't count. And killer can definitely lose with a 3-1 kill/escape ratio. Depip happens all the time for it. Sacrifices are major point on emblems.
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There is a difference between slugging and letting a full health person bleed out just to get 4th kill. AND NO a killer does not lose in 3-1 escape ratio. What logic are u using? PIPPING? I can pip by letting all 4 survivors escape!!! is that a win for killer? Killer can get 4k and a survivor can PIP+ so did killer lose?
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There is no difference. You are bleeding the 3rd to try and stop the 4th from just jumping through the hatch. That is playing the games objectives. The killer can lose in a 3-1 escape ratio easily with the current pip system, he could even depip. I don't understand your logic.
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And then through your logic Phaeris, HIDING from killer (crying about holding hostage) is not against survivors objective (and that is to survive). And again IDK what world can u consider a 3K 1E a loss for a killer, well unless u r a try hard main killer only that thinks 4k is the only way to win.
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You cannot let all 4 survivors escape and pip once you rank up enough, it's mathematically impossible.
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And u can mathematically DEPIP and get 4K/DC so what is your point?
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My point is that your claims of being able to pip while letting all survivors escape do not apply at red ranks.
Hiding without any intention of doing the objective is indeed holding the game hostage.
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I think I may have been a survivor in that game, were you a billy and were the 2 hiding survivors a prestige 3 Claudette and a prestige 3 Meg?
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Just hiding whilst doing no objectives isn't doing objectives. It's trolling. The killer trying to get 4 kills is doing objectives, not trolling.
Surviving infinitely isn't the objective of this game. Which is why don't get any rewards for this avoiding all killer contact and doing no gens/unhooking/etc. Your statement is ludicrous. You seem to think this game is a real life situation and not a game with points being awarded for completing certain tasks.
A loss for a killer is a de-pip, simple as that.
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Well yeah I am using that logic. That's literally the logic the game uses so yeah. Depending on situation definitely. A 3-1 and then depip obviously means you didn't rack enough points even if you killed 3 survivors so yeah I look at that as an L. And survivors can pip in almost any situation so comparing a survivor pip to a killer pip is irrelevant.
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"A loss for a killer is a de-pip, simple as that." That in itself proves your logic is failed. I have stated before getting 3k/4k (in certain circumstances) can result in a depip. And what if he neutral pips? Is that a tie? A PIP a win? U can get 4k and neutral pip. Can get 2-3k and get a pip+ (although for pip++ u would probably need 4k or 3k with 8+ hooks).
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I wasn't leaving anyone on the ground. It was 2 survivors hiding because they were both waiting for the other to die for the hatch.
Either way though. Even if killers do that, there is a time limit, eventually the survivor bleeds out. Same with EGC, which literally exists to prevent hatch standoffs and survivors who don't want to leave. This is the same kind of thing.
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No, i was Blight.
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ah guess theres been a few doing it on Temple of Purgation recently then, I just remember after dying I tabbed out wrote an email, made a cup of coffee, tabbed back in and the 2 of them were still hiding
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Reinami there r tons of perks to help find survivors. Maybe stop using undying/ruin and try using whispers. I generally dont have issues finding survivors even if they hiding (except can be a bit more annoying and harder vs blendettes).
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Compound 21 on Blight also might help u find survivors.
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Trust me when i say this... learning to find hiding survivors will make u a better killer. Being able to scan and spot someone fast, spot blood, spot marks can help improve your game; and the best way to improve that is by experiencing it and learning from it. Try to take this negative aspect of the game and turn it into a learning experience positive.
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As i just said if you're not racking up the point you need for emblems and then depip then yes it's an L. That is literally the system the game has. What don't you get about that? Not once have I gotten 4k and depipped unless a mori was used before death hook on multiple survivors. I 100% agree that a depip is a loss because it eventually drops your rank where as exact opposite happens if you do pip. That sounds like win/loss to me. Obviously a neutral pip would exactly as it sounds neutral not necessarily a tie because a tie would insinuate that all survivors also neutral pipped which isn't the case.
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I'm sitting at 1.5k hours in this game, i know how to find survivors and i know other perks exists. The point is that survivors are able to hold the game hostage by intentionally not doing their objective. I shouldn't have to run a perk to prevent people from holding the game hostage and actively not doing their objective.
Also, i was running information perks, 2 of them in fact. I had BBQ, and tinkerer. BBQ requires a hook, and tinkerer requires survivors do do their objective. Which they were not. They were effectively AFK, which means they should either get crows, or some kind of time limit needs to exist, but they were moving around just enough so they wouldn't get crows, which i would argue is an exploit.
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one of the many persistent issues in this game that the community already figured out how to fix a 4 years ago.
simply have a timer, lets say 6 minutes, of no gen progress means you get a crow that alerts the killer to your location. done and done.
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The pip system works on 4 categories. Only 1 of the category DEVIOUSNESS relies on killing survivors. Others are about chases, gens and using abilities. So yes if u let all 4 escape u most likely will depip. But it is mathematically possible to neutral pip if u max chases and abilities (gens/kills will bring u down). So again is 4E a tie? And killer pipping only considered a killer W? Again u can get 4k and depip (rare but possible) or even neutral pip. 4k neutral pip a tie when u obviously killed everyone, AND MOST LIKELY dominated them to get a 4k with no pip+. Again flawed logic... how can I dominate a team, 4k them, they did no gens but all died on first hook.
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Again back to main topic of this thread, is survivor hiding against the rules? Look at the thread https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/204625/why-isn-t-it-against-the-rules-to-leave-one-person-to-bleed-out/p1
and that is what I am talking about. I have had games where killers down all 4 and just let us bleed out to death (not a lot but like at least a dozen times) and as killer i've had people hold "hostage/hide" in my games maybe 2-3 times.
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I dont think anythings a tie, as with the pip system all 5 people could depip or al 5 could pip given specific situations at certain ranks
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You generally see hiding at the lower ranks so when u move up higher it doesnt become an issue, that is why I see far more toxic killers (bleeding out) than I do toxic survivors (hiding).
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I agree with u OllieHellhunter, but like 3 people on this thread say PIP is a measure of W/L
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Actually there was 2 games where killer was holding me hostage for 1h. I got stuck on hill (stupid game bug) and couldnt move. He killed all of my other teamates and just stood next to me without hitting me for 1h. I went to watch some netflix and came back around 1h later and he decided enough is enough (i wasn't Dcing) and he just hit me and dropped me on hatch.
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I mean its the only real metric in the game that effects ranking, and with most ranking systems win gives increase loss gives decrease. So I do think its intended as such, however I think the pip system is very flawed for doing so.
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Again, I have had more personal experience where killers are far more toxic than survivors. Majority of survivors just wanna have fun and a good game, dont wanna be tunneled die in first few mins, get only 2-7k BP and sit out. Ive seen countless times exit gates open and people sacrifice themselves to try to save their teamates which turns a 1k game to a 4k game (although i have seen some courteous killers let people get hatch or farm BP when DC's).
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I've had the opposite experience, Ive had far more survivors insult me and the only time someones told me to kill myself in this game was a survivor that was my teammate because I ran no mither.
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Honestly OllieHellhunter rank means nothing. The ELO rating system in this game is kinda borked. Rank 1 should be given to like the top 1-5% players and so on like in other competitive games.
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I agree but given it's the only in game metric I can understand why people use it.
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Temple is far below 3rd now. It used to be but since its rework its under 10,000km2
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You're only looking at it as if it's only your game, and everyone wants to play like you, if they hide and you have a problem then either find them or leave. There are different play styles even if they are shabby. I agree that it's not the best and it defeats the whole point of the game, but you either have to lump it or leave it.
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This is not a play style, this is holding the game hostage and it is against the rules.
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If it's against the rules then just report and move on
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Whispers is a great counter to this kind of behavior. So maybe they could give the killer Whispers for 30 seconds whenever all survivors not on the hook, or in the dying state, fail to accumulate 15 seconds of interaction with an objective, for every 5 minutes that passes.
So, say two survivors are left and they are cycling around the map trying to fix gens while the killer patrols. In 5 minutes they would easily accumulate 15 seconds of interactions, which would also create opportunities for the killer to stumble on them. Whereas, if survivors are just hiding, they won't accumulate interaction time without at least giving the killer some information. If they don't interact at all, the entity helps them.
The only case I can think of that could be abused is if two survivors allowed one survivor to stay in the dying state for 5 minutes while the other two hid. But, if the rule excludes people in the dying state and on the hook, it would work. Even if it did include people in the dying state, they would bleed out within 5 minutes.
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Well then.
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I had a similar situation to this when I played Plague for the first time. I only had BBQ and killed 2 survivors fair and square...they whittled me down to a close proximity 3 gen.
Spent about 15 mins patroling/puking on gens until I finally broke patrol and found one, the other shortly after.
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