http://dbd.game/killswitch
How would you nerf/rework The Spirit? Here's my idea.
In my opinion, Spirit has 3 main problems that make her so incredibly unfun to go against.
- No indication of when she is phasing creates unfair "mindgame" with little to no risk for the Spirit and forces survivor to make a guess on what to do.
- Feels hopeless to versus when injured, as you cannot hide from her nor see her.
- No information given to the survivor limits how much of the survivor's skill can be used, often leading to random guesses.
My suggestion to rework the Spirit to fix these issues is as follows:
-Spirit can no longer hear grunts of pain while phasing. She can still hear footsteps and breathing, however. Many can agree that Spirit feels a lot more fair when Iron Will is present, or while healthy, because the survivor has the chance to mindgame the Spirit by faking their movements or being unpredictable. This will make the Spirit much harder to play, as the Spirit will have to be making predictions and guesses much like the survivor, instead of the one-sided situation we have currently which requires not a great deal of skill from the Spirit in contrast to what the survivor has to do.
-Spirit's husk will begin rapidly passive phasing over and over again while she is phasing, to give survivors an indication of when she is phasing. She can hide her husk out of line of sight, importantly, to avoid giving this away, in exchange for losing line of sight with the survivor and making her approach in phase walk more difficult. This makes the stand still "mindgame" much harder; it is technically still possible, if you start phasing and stay still for its duration, but obviously has a strict time frame. Since grunts of pain are not audible, she will not be able to tell if the survivor is still waiting at the loop; meaning the survivor actually has more chance to outplay the Spirit here.
These changes will make the Spirit considerably more difficult to play, but not butcher her, at least in theory. Every use of her power will have to be measured and calculated, like Blight; predictions on both sides. Her stealth aspect remains unchanged, importantly. However, these are pretty significant nerfs; as compensation, here are some buffs you could do:
-All stats of Haunting increased by small amounts. Duration, speed, recovery, etc. This partially makes up for the now reduced strength of the power.
-Holding the active ability button causes Spirit to begin passive phasing on command, as well as move at 4.6m/s. This consumes Yamaoka's Haunting charge at a lesser rate than Phase Walk, and can only be activated at full charge. Allows Spirit a less risky alternative to potentially losing her target with Phase Walking, but at the expense of depleting her power.
What do you guys think? This can be improved on, definitely, but this would fix a majority of her problems in my opinion. The part at the end with on command passive phasing was just a quick thought, but I think it would fit thematically and be a good substitute for some of the power she lost. Give me your thoughts!
Comments
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"make her so incredibly unfun to go against."
Fun or unfun doesn't dictate a killer to be reworked. This is a epic fail post.
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Then why was Legion changed? Fun should be a primary concern in reworking, not just whether the killer is too weak or too strong.
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Dont think this is hard enough nerf. She's still invisible so no way to tell what's happening or what to do. Idk
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"Can I actually do anything here" is a pretty good metric on whether or not a killer should be changed.
Like Altarf mentioned, it's why old Legion was reworked, because it didn't really matter what you did, you were still gonna go down in 30 seconds once Legion had their eyes on you. You could still WIN, it was just gonna be an absolute slog for everyone involved, because you were on a time limit with basically nothing to change that every time chase was initiated. One of the most fun parts of the game, the chase, was little more interactive than holding M1 on a gen.
Now, a lot of people would call that "unfun"-- because it was, and it saw people just leaving Legion matches and people dropping the game entirely because it really sucked. Hence, the rework.
Spirit is like that, but to a lesser, yet still significant extent. You can still win, and there's things you can DO, it's just that you're gonna have to play in a real lame way to win and accept that nothing short of a very lucky guess is going to extend a chase past the 20 second mark, because if the Spirit is good enough none of it matters.
Because she's moving at 176% speed, you're not, you've got no info and if she's got a good pair of headphones her disadvantage is moot.
Hence, rework talk.
Post edited by Grandpa_Crack_Pipe on2 -
- Buff her base kit
- Nerf her add ons (by a lot)
- Giver her a phasing indicator
That's literally all you need to do. Not hearing grunts while phasing would make her incredibly unfun to play especially when people who know what they're doing and on maps with no grass.
Plus the secondary ability of moving at 115% while passive phasing just sounds kinda unnecessary and obnoxious to verse and use.
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I'd disagree, to be honest. Her add-ons besides Mother-Daughter ring aren't particularly problematic, I don't see why you specified a massive nerf. Buffing her basekit is ridiculous if the only thing you're doing is giving a phasing indicator. She's considered the second strongest killer for a reason. Hillbilly's overheat and Nurse's cooldown also, on paper, make them "incredibly unfun to play" as compared to their original versions. I'd argue Spirit needs a higher skill floor for how powerful her power is in a chase, and this is the simplest way to do that while giving both sides equal chance to outplay the other. But, that's just my opinion.
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Buff her Basekit? She does not need Add Ons to begin with, lol. A Killer who does not need Add Ons should not get their Basekit buffed.
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I think all of your ideas are great. Otzdarva recently just posted a YouTube video on how disgusting her iridescent and ultra-rare add-on combination (I can't recall the names of the add-ons). But the match only lasted a couple minutes max. Then, throw in Ruin/Undying/Tinkerer, and, well... good luck getting anything done as a survivor.
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Remove her from the game with deathslinger.
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Honestly that bug a little while back that made it that you heard her while phasing would have been a pretty fair change
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My preferred would be
Give survivors a obvious cue to phasing such as the breathing like when it was bugged but maybe a little more obvious at the beginning of phasing as well
Nerf addons so they aren't as impactful/game breaking
Change base phasing speed to 7.5m/s
Change base max cooldown to 13 seconds
Have duration and cooldown addons scale properly so they play well together
Change values of brown/yellow/green to be 5/7.5/10% more so they are not nerfed/slightly nerfed/moderately nerfed (combs become 10/15/20% faster
and change the purple addon to be longer cooldown instead of less speed and mother daughter ring to be 20% speed for the first half 30% for the second half of phase aka you need to use your power more for a full effect
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Than the game will just become broken. Too many arguments are made becuz certain aspects are considered 'unfun'.
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Actually that's pretty false, they've basically stated before that fun IS a factor in how they decide to balance the game.
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Anyways, I personally enjoyed the bug where Spirit could be heard while phasing. It sucked for her sneaking up on people on gens, with BBQ, etc., but I feel like it could easily be changed that if she started her phrasing within a certain radius close to you, THAT'S when you heard her while she was invisible, otherwise she could remain silent while phase walking to you from further away, if that makes sense?
That way, she could keep her long ranged sneak attacks, but her power would not be as non interactive as it currently is for survivor.
I think Spirit should still be able to hear while phasing, but I really, really hope that devs consider adding back her own audio cues while phase walking.
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Survivor need a cue for when she's phasing next to you so she can't mindlessly mind you on semi-safe/safe pallet.
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I'm fine with this if you nerf loops in exchange. You talk abaut mind games, but majority of loops don't have mind game potential as you can see killer 24/7. So you could change loops higher etc so you don't have view of the killer all the time.
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"No information given to the survivor limits how much of the survivor's skill can be used, often leading to random guesses."
You can hear her footsteps and you can even use a flashlight to check her position when phasing. Also it's easy to come back in the direction you were running when she is phasing just to 360° when she comes out.
"No indication of when she is phasing creates unfair "mindgame" with little to no risk for the Spirit and forces survivor to make a guess on what to do."
Funny how you point out unfair mindgame, isnt that what Killers have to deal with in almost every loop? You know, things like cars, those Mcmillan little loops, rocks, new Autoheaven makes It really unfair for tall killers, the list goes on and on... Maybe Spirit players are tired of that sh*t and want to be on the other side of the coin.
"Feels hopeless to versus when injured, as you cannot hide from her nor see her."
Maybe you should start bringing other perks like Quick and Quiet or Iron Will, you should also try to get inside lockers, or even use your grunts to your advantage, throw down pallets earlier, go for windows or even fake them, I dont know use your imagination, it's the Spirit the one who is blind and chasing you, she is the one who has to guess, maybe the problem is you guya re so limited to regular windows and pallets plays that It makes you predictible.
And just to let you know
Legion wasnt reworked because he wasnt fun to play against, he was reworked because he was ######### broken, and unlike Spirit, he didnt have any counters even if a survivor was like top tier IQ. In fact he is still boring to play against, mending all the time and being forced to heal all the time doesnt really seem fun to me.
The "fun" factor is not taken into account when balancing a killers.
The "fun" factor is taken into account when designing the base idea of the killers power, not the level of it's strenght.
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All they have to do is make It like old Freddy and the wrath Where you can see the spirits..like outline thing when she moves..You know, like when they are invis you can kind of make out a body shape If you look at them.
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This game will never be balanced. U know how they say never?
Well... I'm saying never.
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Legion broke chase mechanics and put survivors in unwinnable situations like with moonwalking or double blade add-ons for inf mending or the other purple add-on that let the mending time go down when you hit them with frenzy. It isn't comparable with spirit
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