http://dbd.game/killswitch
Flashlight saves should not be a thing
They just don't work.
From a survivor side, the timing and the angle for flashlight changes every other dang patch and when combined with lag makes getting them consistently almost impossible
From a killer side, you can't really do anything about it. Yeah, you can look at a wall but sometimes it just happens anyway because screw you. Yes, light born exists, but that is giving up an entire perk slot for something that might not even happen
Overall, they are way too inconsistent and tend to fail more than they work.
Balance
Then you have the question of balance, and flashlight saves are a great example of a mechanic that survivors have that negate Killer's work for way too little cost. While it doesn't often work when it does the killer is in for a bad time. Being able to essentially negate a chase is very annoying to killers and can straight up win a game because of denying a pop for a little longer.
Solution
Instead of having the flashlight instantly save the person on the back, have it very quickly raise the wiggle meter. Still keeps the ability to flashlight save, and in some cases do even do better, but makes it something that a killer can play around with. Instead of being a "did it work or did it not work" it becomes a more interesting mechanic with some depth to it.
Edit: I want to make this clear, but if you blind a killer for the same amount of time it would normally take to save someone, the killer would have less than 2 seconds to put them on a hook. I don't want to get rid of Flashlight saves, I just want them to be less binary.
Comments
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Yes, let's just delete everything that requires skill in this game.
We can have M1 only killers, no pallets or windows and a hold W game.
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Naw fam, that's whack. Flashlight saves are valid, gives the killer something to worry about
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Nah.
It's risk/reward with incredibly tight timing for a survivor but extremely satisfying when done right, and I think you're downplaying just what you can do about it as a killer.
You can look at a wall, of course, and considering a lot of downs happen at loops or buildings that's not too hard to pull off. And even otherwise, you have to realize that a survivor going for a flashlight save, positioning themselves for it, trying to avoid getting detected.. is doing a whole lot of nothing otherwise. I love when people bring flashlights, because they waste a lot of time prepping for saves that's easily foiled by either looking at walls or just checking the area and chasing them off. They're usually gonna try and stealth around to catch you unaware, so one good smack and watching them run off means they've got no hope of saving now.
Or better yet, slugging the first guy and going to down the would-be saver. That's someone down, someone being chased and someone else who has to go get the slugged dude, creating a lot of good pressure.
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i rather eat flashlights then ds
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On top of gens, survivors, ds, bt, exhaustion perks, head on stuns, hook sabotages, and Keys? If you want to give Killer something to worry about, there are much better ways. My main problem with Flashlight saves is that they are inconsistently strong. 80% don't work, but the other 20% of the time it does.
I am assuming that you just read the admittedly rather click-baiting title and assumed from there. If anything, my solution adds more skill by making the flashlight saves less about just pressing the right button at the right time but rather carefully planning when to stun to maximize the amount of wiggle gained.
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Flashlight Saves are one of the fun things on the Survivor side and one of the more skillful things to do.
Removing those (or weakening those) would basically make Flashlights useless since Blinds on Pallets are not really good anyway. Let alone that against a somewhat decent Killer, a maximum of 1 Flashlight Save is possible. If someone gets blinded twice or more times while carrying a Survivor, thats up to them.
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There's counters, like slugging and lightborn and Franklin's. If survivors have to use iron will to get counterplay to spirit, I don't see the issue :/
Also, it takes a hell of a lot of skill from the survivors, and is one of the few things that makes survivor gameplay enjoyable still. Take that away and it's just more M1 simulator, yikes.
Also, yeah you lose a chase as a killer but that's also 1 survivor following you around not on gens. I know how much of an impact this makes because I'm usually that survivor following the killer around for stacks and saves. When I don't have a flashlight gens fly because 3 people on separate gens is so difficult for a killer. When I do have a flashlight and I'm not on gens they slow to a crawl because smart killers know they just need to never chase me and I'll still not touch a generator.
It's actually beneficial for survivors to have the ability to flashlight and pallet save because of the amount of time they waste for a chance at something.
If you're that worried just bait or face a wall or bring one of the many perks.
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I actually agree with you there, but sometimes that game decides that the wall you are looking at is not actually a wall and you get blinded. And as a Killer Main, I have won multiple games just because the poor sap went for a flashlight save and got downed for his troubles.
The reason why I think they need changes outside of the reason I already mentioned in the post is that they are too binary. There is no real depth to it, and survivor gameplay desperately needs more depth than press a button at the right time.
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Flashlights aren't even that hard to avoid if you know what you are doing. But sure let's get rid of something to make Flashlights even worse than they already are since they aren't Map-tier yet.
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I don't think they're particularly hard to play around, one tactic I like to use is to approach the downed survivor, making it obvious you are about to pick up, simply doing this action will bring the survivor out, since they actually need to be positioned before you enter the animation to pull it off.
At this point you can just chase them, or just do a 180 turn and pick up, in most environments it will be quite difficult/impossible for the survivor to reposition in time before you're no longer locked in the animation, since a quick spin for you requires them to walk a large semi-circle around you at quite a far distance (and if they get too close, enjoy your free hit).
Also you can tell from the lobby if you'll be playing with flashlight users, so it should rarely even come as a surprise.
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Why do you keep downplaying the skill required to get a flashlight save?
It's really hard to pull off a flashlight save against killers that are smart.
Would be more or less the same like saying that we should remove mindgames for killers because all it is is running backwards at the right time.
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Yeah dude, next let's just delete every single every from the survivor side! Better yet, let's also take out all the vaults and pallets so survivors can only hold M1! Those dang pesky survivors, how dare they be able to chances!
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Flashlight saves are fine and easily avoidable and when avoided play into the killer's favour.
If you have someone trying to flashlight save, you have one less person on a gen. Simply face a wall or if there's no wall fake the pickup in the opposite way of a suspected flashlight saver. Once baited, hit that survivor and repeat or pick up once you know they are distant enough. If there's a swarm of survivors trying to flashsave, slug and down someone else if they are cocky enough and stay near you.
It is not difficult to avoid flashlight saves. Make it a habit of facing walls or picking up in the opposite direction of a could-be survivor even when you don't think a survivor is near.
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Here's the problem: flashlights are mega high risk = high reward items. Of ALL the items a survivor can bring, a flashlight is honestly a pretty bad idea if they don't know how to use it. Will it come in handy against Wraith and or Hag? Yes but those are very niche and not always applicable.
A survivor bringing a flashlight is a survivor that could have brought a medkit, a toolbox, a map or a key. Literally every other item is more consistent than a flashlight and so, if someone brings a flashlight they're playing a risky game imo.
Now, while I don't dislike your idea (I think it's rather interesting) it doesn't feel like it would be very fair to the survivor who pulls it off because what if you're already close to a hook, and you hook the person you're carrying through the blind? Idk that seems sad. A flashlight save is one of the only possibly solid ways to save someone on their final hook and if you removed the flashlight stun / save it could make that even harder. And what of any and all current achievements / challenges involving flashlight saves (If there are any, forgive me I'm still somewhat new to the game)?
Also I would like to say there are other ways of countering flashlights than just Lightborn. Infectious Fright is my favorite as, when you down the survivor, any other survivors lingering around the area (Your terror radius) will scream and that's usually a big flag that they were hiding to flashlight save. Leave the survivor slugged and go scare off the other survivor(s) who screamed and bam.
I feel your pain because it feels awful to be flashlight stunned but without it, flashlights are almost 100% useless and as a proponent of both sides, I can't support the idea to remove the stun.
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I love how all the comments here are the same, it gave me quite the chuckle
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