Honest Players Get Zero Respect
So I'm one of these guys who always tries to play the game the right way. I prefer builds that are not antagonistic. As a survivor I try to be a team player (unless a rift challenge encourages me to be selfish which is inevitable). As a killer I avoid tunnelling (although sometimes being a chaser type of killer it happens naturally) and never facecamp or slug.
This game is obviously not targeted towards people like me.
More and more lately I'm coming up against players not interested in using skill. As a survivor I get a slugger or facecamper at least 50-60% of the time. As a killer I constantly get over-aggressive survivors or worse I get DCs and teabaggers if I'm playing well.
The culture of this game SUCKS. The toxicity is born of poor character design, devs saturating the game with underdeveloped killers who I swear go through zero beta testing and bugs galore. It is then promoted by people who get frustrated by the design of the game. Survivor vs Killer arguments on this forum are mute - the real issue here is the lack of developmental oversight.
Don't get me wrong - Dead By Daylight can be hugely satisfying and I massively enjoy the fun rounds. However for a game that generates massive profits I find the lack of investment shocking. Why am I paying to get constantly dunked on?
Pull your heads in devs. The players may add to the crap but it starts and ends with you guys.
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I refuse to blame the terrible behavior of people on game developers. Own up to your own bull#$!%, people.
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The devs practically encourage toxic behavior by being silent on the issue, because those are the people who buy the game. An online bully simulator is more appealing than an actual multiplayer horror game. It's why a lot of people buy CoD, because they want to use the game to ruin someone's day.
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Yes winning, getting kill streaks, and making flashy plays isn’t the reason I buy CoD.
It’s to “ruin someone’s day” and be an “online bully” when the other player is literally buying it for the exact same reason I do and goes into each game knowing they can either win or lose.
You act like people are being forced into playing video games or something.
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I'm sorry, but the entire concept of blaming the devs is like saying if the guy whose laptop I stole didn't want it stolen he shouldn't have left it on the table like that.
It's terrible rationale and I am not buying it.
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You need some time off DBD in general if you started to think people buy a casual fps game to bully people.
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They're not forced to play, but I want to play and have fun. Instead, I get some Joe Schmoe every other day coming out of his way to be toxic.
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I disagree. As a killer you have that choice to not slug all players at once. Slogging ALL players at once or not moving away to give choice to pick people is Indeed Toxic. As a survivor there are TWO perks that are available to be able to pick yourself up both of which are often not teachable. Or are not able to be equipped.
Slugging is not a necessity. It's just sloppy.
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I had to laugh when I read your post. I know that statement needs some context. Your post sounded to me just like those obnoxious creeper guys who spend all their time complaining about how they are a "Nice Guy" and deserve to get the girl. They are angry and upset that the girls just don't see how "nice" they are and make the only sensible choice.
Of course the truth is that guys who get angry about girls not choosing them aren't that nice in the first place. The "Nice Guy" is just their act. Nice isn't real if it is really just an act with an ulterior motive. Nice that can do a 180 when one doesn't get what one wants was never genuine. Calling yourself an "Honest Player" just brought that involuntary snorty laugh from me.
All that being said, I'm going to clue you in on a stark, simple reality. There is just the game, and what is within the rules and what is not. "Nice" is a subjective, worthless term that is not in the rules. All you need to do to be a good sport is:
- Don't cheat, either by hacks or lag spikes.
- Don't disconnect; if you start a game, finish it.
- Be humble in victory and gracious in defeat.
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If the game is affecting your ability to have fun, either take a break or play a different game.
Is part of the community toxic? Yes. Should it affect you so much on a personal level? No. If it does, as mentioned, either take a break or play a different game. Maybe stick to single player games where no one can be "toxic".
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So why would people respect you if you don't respect them and how they choose to play a game? There are definitely toxic people who'll just swear and say awful things but those are different from saying if people don't play like you do they're just toxic no skill people.
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The rules are wrong. The devs can fix them. They don't. In doing so they passively encourage toxic behaviour. Same as when lawmakers ignore flaws in law they passively encourage harmful activity like tax evasion. In fact they participate I said activity.
Now there's a cynical statement - imagine if the reason the devs encourage irresponsible gameplay is because they love to be toxic players themselves...
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Also I follow your three rules. Just saying.
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Are they now? Well here is an even simpler suggestion. If you aren't happy with the game and not having fun, vote with your wallet and move on. I can assure you that what you are doing right here in the Forum is redundant and pointless.
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What a novel suggestion. I'm guessing you suggest it on every forum on this site. If you read the comments from the devs, they want feedback. Some feedback is gonna be bad. However the devs have also stated they want to hear about ways to improve the game. Whether or not they actually mean that is up for debate. With that said. As for ok letting my wallet do the talking, it already has by purchasing every character in the game on top of the initial purchase price.
I have a suggestion. Why care about my opinion? Ignore me and walk away. If it's good enough for you to tell me to do it I'm guessing you're not against the notion. Of course you could be like Donald Trump and say you don't have to do as you tell people they should do... which would not surprise me either.
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If you aren't gonna return my laptop, can you at least clear my search history?
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Your first mistake is assuming that there’s a “right way” to play the game.
Play however you want, but don’t expect anyone else to follow your made up rules. Nobody made you the authority on the right way to play, so expecting the rest of the player base and the devs to agree with you and change the rules to suit you is quite egotistical.
Camping, tunnelling, slugging, gen rushing, using strong perk combos, playing selfishly - they’re all allowed so your only choices are to adapt around them, or stop playing.
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I digress. I don't think slugging in and of itself is toxic, I think the ability to slug all four survivors at once with no way for them to be able to pick themselves up is sometimes (stress the sometimes. Because sometimes its unavoidable) garbage. Especially if you're a newer player going against rank red. That being said, you're right slugging doesn't make the game toxic. It sucks, but it's not toxic.
But I have found (and don't take it the wrong way. By all means I don't mean you) that players themselves can be extremely toxic.
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Following made up rules of yours doesn't mean everyone else should, too.
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I have a third choice - play my way regardless. With that said, the fact you can list all that stuff shows you know exactly the techniques that piss people off. You've underlined my point - this game encourages "toxicity". I try to play the way I do because I've read these forums. Hell I've read the responses to my comments. The killer perk vs survivor perk "what is toxic" debate clearly shows a community divided by the mechanics of the game. Is this made worse by deliberately toxic players making the rest of us look bad? Absolutely. Are the devs then free of responsibility? Not a chance.
Now the devs recently made changes to moris that have intensified the argument. Thing is that change has killer mains asking "how will they adjust survivors as a response?". There are some very loud voices calling for keys to be nerfed. This highlights my point - everybody knows there are multiple flaws to be resolved but the devs just do small fixes while they spend most of their time churning out new characters to make more money.
This game can get great fun. We need the devs to make many more fixes to make the game consistently fun. Stop creating new characters or upgrading maps just because the PS5 exists and focus on improving the game as it exists now. You can always bring in more money making bullshit when you're done.
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They're not my rules. I'm doing what killer mains and survivor mains suggest we should do. The fact that doing so probably doesn't work suggests that the game is ######### up no matter how we play. That makes it a developmental problem.
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It is suggested by the same skill group that asks for noed nerf, take it with a grain of salt.
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Don't be "an honest player" ?
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I don't care about your opinion; it is a bunch of passive aggressive nonsense. Your problems in the game are just that, i.e. YOUR problems. Nobody is going to solve them for you. We all play the same game and run into the same issues. For better or worse, most of us keep on trucking and don't try to scapegoat others for our personal failures or lack of fun. Games (all games) give back only what you put into them. Not only is it entitled to demand the DEV fix your problems, it is foolish. The problems originate inside you, not from the game. This game is PvP and full of countless variables. It is one big social contract on wheels, and your inability to function within said contract happily says far more about you than it does their product.
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Oh my god it's a video game with a big enough player base to get a few naughty players. That's bound to happen anyways no matter what game it is. CoD was notorious for that back in the day, thank god this game doesn't have voice chat otherwise I feel like there'd be more complain threads here.
Then again, maybe a voice chat would be therapeutic for this community.
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The devs nerfed moris because they were objectively too strong. You can’t say the same about certain styles of play, because it’s completely dependent on context.
If a survivor goes down and gets hooked smack dab in the middle of the last 3 gens, and the killer patrols those gens, they’re essentially “camping” but actually they’re playing exactly the way they should. Forcing “camping” to be bannable or punished by in-game mechanics would end up penalising the killer player for playing the smart way in this scenario. Could they leave the 3 gen and the hook and go wander the edges of the map? Sure. And if you want to play with “honour” and do that then feel free. But expecting people to make an objectively bad decision for the sake of fairness is totally unreasonable, and forcing them to play badly on purpose because you don’t like campers would not be good game design.
This is just one example. Camping, tunnelling, and so on are already risky because they can easily lose you the game. It’s not on the devs to force people to play in certain ways, because players already have tools within the game to make camping/tunnelling/etc. unviable.
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They also encourage it by setting double standards. If I was to do something unsportsmanlike and somebody reported it the devs might reprimand me. If a twitch streamer who is constantly doing shady stuff but brings in a lot of viewers, they will look the other way because that person is bringing in more money for them. By letting that streamer get away with that play style all their viewers are thinking "This must be allowed because he's doing it and they haven't banned him yet"
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Made me think...Can we block players from future matching? I know you can block survivors in the campfire, but does that block from matching with them again, or just friend requests? Is there a way to block killers in the end game scoreboard? If not, then I think that would solve matching up with "toxic" players repeatedly. Not necessarily a permanent ban... Have it adjustable to give the selected players a chance to mature, then have them flagged (visible to the folk that ban that player) as probationary post-ban; if they aren't "toxic" anymore, then play on.
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Do u ever just think that maybe... Just maybe..... Ur just a entitled person?
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I'm entitled to my opinion.
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At no point did I call for a ban of any kind. I'm calling for devs to find creative solutions to game flaws. I'm not saying it's an easy fix either. I'm merely stating a few truths relating to the lack of oversight by devs. I think the constant attacks on players for simply doing what the game encourages them to do is bogus and instead believe the game mechanics are the greater failing.
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Sounds like you do care about my opinion. If I quit you'd never get an answer not would you be able to carry on with your comments.
With that said, I'll restate that the devs have said they want feedback and this forum exists to discuss topics about DBD. Sounds to me like you're not interested in allowing people to give their opinions. More than likely you're here so that people like you will see your contributions and agree with you while you bully anyone who doesn't share your opinion. I'm rather enjoying your comments though - they're hilarious. Like Trump's adolescent speeches/tantrums.
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Ur opinion is not even factual. Facecamping is extremely rare.
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This is completely untrue - the game rules apply to everyone, regardless of who you are.
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If you want facts, here's one - I got face-camped today.
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It’s because the devs prefer to be hands off and had an idea for how the game would work, trusting that players would take it upon themselves to create a fun experience. Keep in mind a large majority of players are youths, when was the last time you found maturity in them. Case in point, the following comments from everyone I just “offended”.
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This game has been around how many years now? I'm sorry if this offends you but if you are right that's shameful rationale. There is an old gaming psychology that states that when games are developed, devs just pay attention because gamers are far more likely to take the easy way than the proper way. Move spamming (hadoken anyone), cheats codes, sacrificing teammates, whatever - any dev naive to rely on players to behave should be fired. Is that cynical? Of course. Doesn't make it wrong.
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*Devs MUST pay attention, not just lol
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I think
Post edited by honestyoverbias on0 -
I think you are putting too much faith in game developers, as well as people in general. They themselves are of a generation plagued by a degrading work ethic and pride in accomplishment. It’s a phenomenon prevalent in more than the game industry and growing rapidly, each new generation is becoming lazier and more complacent in their work. People (not all, but many) don’t like to work hard, if they can take the easy route they will and that’s what happens when you lack drive and dedication to your craft. Game developers are not an exception, they’re just normal people trying to get a paycheck and it’s easy to say “good enough”. And I’m not offended, I’m saying this is the reality of things. Sure, I could be wrong, but if you look around, I don’t think I am. Sad, but true.
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Everyone gets facecamped every once in a while. But it doesn't happen very often.
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Sounds like you're exactly the type of person they're talking about. Sportsmanship be damned as long you're entertained by your own nonsense.
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Fact - I got face-camped today too.
I could state more facts but the point is made - it happens relatively often.
Now watch while the trolls justify face-camping.
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The lack of dedication by the devs is exactly my point. If they're lazy (I hope not) then they shouldn't sell their services for money. You know what I do with lazy workers? I fire them. Haven't had to in a while - people are desperate for work right now - but I make it clear I expect my employees to work for their money.
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It happens to me multiple times in a night. Usually the same couple players.
But that's not what I'm here about. I just want to remind OP and everyone who disagrees with OP that no, you can't expect everyone to play by your rules, and no, you won't get along with everyone in the game, and no, you're not entitled to wins. However, the social contract of the game, as unenforceable and unstable as it is, does at least suggest that the game be played, like, for fun and entertainment, and that playing "as intended," per se, will net you more points and rank increases. It's not that someone has to play in a self-sacrificing manner and let the other side walk all over them, it's that, in some ways, killers and survivors have to work "together" to make the most of each match. If you don't believe that, consider what happens when you do have a match against a face camper. Whoever is camped is basically sacrificed for the rest of the team, and whoever escapes the match (if they're lucky enough to escape) leaves with such a pitiful score that they might even de-pip, and they'll have maybe enough BP to get two items off a bloodweb. Survivors need to be hit and hooked and chased off gens to rack up points, and killers need survivors to be unhooked and escape and work on gens for them to rack up points of their own. If one side chooses to say "[BAD WORD] points, I just want to ruin their game," it violates the weird contract set up, but there's nothing you or anyone can do about it.
Except the devs. And it seems like perhaps, they aren't very concerned with that contract or the people involved, because it doesn't appear they do much to discourage that. And this isn't just the face campers, it's also the people who come into endgame chat just to tell you to ######### and list off all the racial slurs they know.
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TLDR - devs must take responsibility and make changes then trolls can leave like bitches or stay for a good game.
You make done very good points. For the first time somebody has directly acknowledged the purpose of this post. I commend you.
Yes it is implied by the nature of the game's concept how you should play and in that (like most games) it can be better to be lucky than good. The problem we run into with the way the game continues to be developed is that while the concept is sound the application lacks merit. There are parts of this game that encourage toxicity that are solely due to devs choices when constructing the game.
As an example, the mori system should NEVER have been an advantage as it was. With the audience this game interests, the use of a mori should be for the "cool" factor - something you apply as a fun addition for horror fans. By that measure, I would argue that with the new nerf that all moris should be of the pink variety but should have the gold cost making them more accessible but no more than a Flex as opposed to a tool. It then becomes the choice of killers to use them or not merely to be entertained. As a horror fan myself I like the moris only because they are fun to execute and watch not because they reduce the level of difficulty.
Making the game as appealing as possible to horror fans should be what makes this game fun. The devs lost that vision with some of the choices they've made with gameplay development. I'm encouraged that they're maybe turning a corner and walking these mistakes back but the DBD community resists these changes which makes it tough to do. Yeah the community is what it is and anyone who deludes themselves into believing bullying of fellow players is acceptable deserves to have their opinions ignored. However the community is what it is because the game the devs created from what was a great concept has encouraged such a corrupt community. Is it CoD? Hell no. It's still toxic. In the end however it is the devs alone who can remove features and/or impose new rules. Remove mori advantage, disable crouching in the endgame, stop the use of flashlights, make killers slower around hooks - all suggestions I've seen or heard and all things that can only by done by devs.
I'll end with this. Earlier I was encouraged to quit because the game was unfair. I say the devs should fix the game and then if the trolls don't like it they can always leave. Of course they could stay and enjoy a better quality of game too.
Thanks for reading.
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When you play nice people usually tell you to "get gud" (which I find incredibly annoying). Occasionally people will thank me and tell me I'm a super cool killer, and I legit take screenshots and look at them whenever I get crap from people because it makes me feel better
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I can only laugh at these "nice killers" in the game. The game favor killers so much that they have to pretend to use a "code of conduct" like no tunneling/camping to try and be ethical.
If you play the game seriously it is impossible to survivors get away, and that's apparently an intended mechanic, so every time i play killer i will ######### act like one and be as efficient as possible.
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I rarely get facecamped. Facecamping is where the killer does nothing. He just stands there up ur face and looks at u, and do nothing.
Ppl who regularly plays dbd knows that for a fact, that facecamping is rare.
Facecamping is different from camping. It is a specific form of camping.
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