Should the hook timer freeze within a certain range?

I wouldn't mind it at all if in exchange gens slowed down when you aren't camping and putting pressure on survivors

Most killers care far more about not being a 1 kill game then camping. It is just really clear that you are overly invested in being able to unhook right away and thus are the exact kind of person that killers wait 15 seconds 'soft camping' to trick into having a hook standoff.

Again, I said this in multiple threads to you, but sincerely, just count to 30. You got a full minute to rescue. 30 seconds is enough time to pop 2 gens and put the fear of god into killers. See how many actually are willing to wait out the 3 minutes it takes to kill a survivor. If your not in beige ranks, its probably going to be like... one in one hundred games maybe?

Like if a killer is just willing to throw the game vs a team that has 2 people willing to stay on gens (Because hard camping loses even if you can lure one survivor off gens doing it, 2 survivors can fix around 5 gens assuming they can do skillchecks in 3 minutes), that killer is hard de-pipping most games. If your at 20, then I would just say climb to 15 or 10 which should be trivial even if your a 4 man SWF and a camper is forcing 1 survivor to de-pip every game (You lose 1 pip, gain 3 every game, rotate the person first caught and you all gain .5 pips a game) and get to a rank where the killer isn't such a thirsty skank that they are willing to lose nearly ever game for a singular kill.

It was already tested long ago and abused by the survivors so it was scrapped.

I think camping/tunneling happens way less than people act like. Many times the survivors are just making bad plays and getting punished. Not saying it doesn't happen, but even on survivor I see way, way more games where the survivors accuse the killer of camping or tunneling, than there are games that they actually tunneled or camped.

All that said, the reason many killers camp/tunnel is because of the games poor balance. It incentivizes them to do so. The way you fix this is not by punishing them for camping/tunneling, you fix it by making it more efficient to leave the hook and down someone else than it is to focus the same guy.

IE you are trying to cure the symptoms of the disease(camping/tunneling) rather than curing the disease itself (game imbalance).

The killers camping and tunneling is them backed into a corner from poor balance and feeling like they have no options left. Just gutting them for that with nothing else doesn't make them stop camping or tunneling, it makes them quit the game.

Absolutely. If the idea being the game is high stakes hide and seek, then the game should always being motivating the seeker to continue seek. That’s the objective.

This comment is lazy and you should form a worthwhile response

No. There are times where it is important to force people into the second hook stage. You'll see that alot in tournaments.

Also, camping is the only thing you can do in the endgame to get at least one more kill.

General gameplay as a whole is not based on tournaments, there are other players in the community and that is the focus, not a small percentage

I play at all times of the day and I experience it often enough for it to be common. And having a strong opinion and not having a problem voicing it is not trolling, it’s being engaged in the community. Responding negatively to someone choosing to be involved in that community is trolling and discouraging their participation. People are allowed to voice there opinions and disagree with others

The mechanic they ended up making was a combo of BT and BBQ. The dissatisfaction with the fix wasn't because they wanted to remove camping (again, they literally said in the clip they don't want to make camping worse, they want to reward not camping, and they said they will never 'destroy' camping), it was because their solution had too many negative costs.

Pausing the hook timer is not an option. Not because it makes the game 'harder' for the killer, but it breaks a core interaction. Pausing the timer when the killer is 'camping' (AKA: defending the hook, which may or may not be correct), breaks the game because it removes all pressure the hook creates from the survivors.

I am sorry, but getting hooked is MEANT to suck. Its meant to make the game worse for the survivors. That is to encourage you to not get hooked in the first place. Same with how getting shot in CS:GO sucks, or getting cornered in a fighting game sucks. Games NEED gamestates that dramatically disfavor certain sides to work.

So get good at doing good rescues, get good at not getting caught first, or get wrecked. Don't be the guy complaining that AWPs are OP because you can't rush down long wildly firing an SMG at max distance and get instantly killed because you won't buy a 50 dollar flashbang in counterstrike. Camping is here to stay, because its too important to the game's health.

If you don't want to lose control over the game and risk being eliminated without you being able to do anything to stop it, play better earlier in the match and apply gen pressure so the killer never has the time to even CONSIDER camping. Don't be the definition of a scrub, someone who when things don't go their way in the game don't adjust their own playstyle or try to get better, but instead complain the game itself is unfair despite everyone understanding the rules beforehand: http://www.sirlin.net/ptw-book/introducingthe-scrub

If your complaining that it is unfair you can lose, you lost the game before you started. Games don't exist to let you win or have fun all the time, they are a more cohesive experience, and if you can't enjoy how the game makes you lose, you should re-adjust yourself, rather than demanding the game changes.

They talk about in later dev posts how they aren't interested in persuing this and implore survivors to, in not so many words, 'Get good.'

For real, camping isn't actually a problem in the game if you know what your doing, and the devs are super sick of people complaining about. They flat out said any reports about camping will be discarded.

There is no valid reason to punish killers for defending hook if the survivors refuse to punish them. You have the tools to stop camping. Use them. Survivors have been complaining about this since 2016. Its not going to change, the 'anti camping' feature of the game is the killer believing at least 2 survivors are on gens so if they camp for the 3 minutes required to get a kill they lose (As 2 survivors can do 6 gens in 3 minutes if they are good at skill checks).

Convince the killer you WILL punish them, and they should move. If they don't they will depip down to 20 pretty quick and most people will statistically pip past a hard camper meaning they will find themselves alone vs other people who can't play. If you are at 20, you have problems outside of getting camped.

Also, to the point of “if you don’t want to be camped then get good” what does that say to players who have just started playing or are still learning? Yes practice makes perfect, but there is an importance in providing a reasonable learning curve and at a certain point that point of view turns away players who were interested in playing, but are immediately discouraged when their first week of playing is 70% getting face camped. That’s a pretty bad first time experience on a game you were hoping to play, any new player would feel like they’re being punished for being new to the game and having little opportunity learn. And we see that reflected in how many console players have left the game as well as players who tried it for a month and just moved on to a different game. I get that there is a learning curve, but it doesn’t need to be so severe and no game should ever ignore the focus of providing new players a welcoming experience. That’s a very “gated community” outlook.

So here’s a perfect example of a rank 1 blight who made no effort to leave the hook even with 3 survivors on gens so the idea that the threat of gen progress while they’re camping does not apply. This is no isolated incident, but rather common in higher ranks players, they will risk gens popping if it means they can remove even 1 survivor from the match.

For real, if someone is at rank 1 and your ACTUALLY threatening gens and constantly pop them, the blight won't be at rank 1 for long. So said blight CAN'T be doing that every match. Its actually impossible.

Furthermore, its important to remember that while, yes, some killers may camp 100% of the time and thus auto-lose the game rather than 'correctly' going off the hook... so what? This problem self corrects, and the cure is worse than the disease here. Especially because good survivors tend to NOT assume they will get all 3 hook stages unless they set it up ahead of time for the entire SWF team to have BT.

Camping isn't actually an issue in the grand scheme of game balance. If a killer is just sitting in front of a hook or walking back and forth around it constantly, they're going to lose the game very fast against even remotely competent survivors. The only reason it might work out for them is if the killer is using Insidious or something like that, and a survivor runs up to try and rescue you and gets grabbed or downed, and that's a very rare scenario. Against less skilled survivors it can work more frequently because they run up and try to unhook you directly in front of the killer, but that's more an issue with survivor skill. Some people have suggested l1 kindred be made survivor base kit to help counteract this, but if that happens IMO gen kicking should be buffed to compensate (see some recent threads about it)

Camping is mostly an issue in the sense that it absolutely sucks ass for the person getting camped, because it means you're almost certainly going to de-pip, you wasted any item you brought, and you basically didn't get to play that match. There's unfortunately really not any way to fix this without degrading the health of the game itself. Directly punishing killer for staying near hook is going to lead to SWFs abusing the hell out of it and bullying killers out of playing even more.

1) Yes you can hide in lockers and whatnot; most Survivors don't bother doing that. And if you don't see anyone, they certainly ALL wouldn't hide in lockers outside 40M away. If you don't see anyone you might as well hunt around the hook region.

2) it's YOUR job to demonstrate how you could make it unexploitable. YOU'RE the one saying this is needed.

3) No, it's not. It's a behavior, not an error coded into the game. It's a real scumbag move. I hate it and it makes the game worse for all parties.

4) yes, you're right. The corollary to your statement is that a good killer may stay NEAR a hook without camping to do some of the other stuff I said (reload, set traps, break pallets, kick gens), and, by the extremely bad idea you support, would not get any hook progression.

You got camped by someone who felt uncertain in their skills. I'm sorry you had that terrible experience. It sucks. This solution makes the game unplayable for killers. Every killer has several things that survivors do that are jerk things to do that aren't exploits and gets them riled. Flashlight flicking, teabagging, gesturing at the killer, locker spamming? These are all jerk moves. I'm not going to suggest something like giving anyone who crouches 10 times in 5 seconds exhaustion for 30 seconds for basically doing squat thrusts in front of me.

Your idea is not a solution.

Edited to take the edge off a bit. I'm getting a little heated by you spamming this forum topic trying to suggest this "solution" as a thing that wouldn't completely break the game. It would. Stop.

Not a very bad idea but to be sure it only work against real face campers, it should have 2 conditions :

1) Not applying if a survivor is less than 32 meters of the hook cause sometimes you saw or know there is someone who followed you and hide for the unhook or by any other mean (Flashlight fail, BBQ, contagious fright etc...) and you have to search around the hook for it tho youre not actually in chase.

2) Not applying when all gens are done, it would be a dumb move for killers to leave your last kill when you have almost no chance to down another surv and doors is 99 (which all survivors do before rescuing).

As for DS in basekit, its okay but they should make it so if you hook someone between (and of course the DS surv is not down to avoid slug exploit) it would not apply, you shouldnt be punished cause you were good/the ds surv being bad or greedy and end a chase quickly, cause actually good surv exploit it, making them virtually invincible for 1 min and allowing them to bb, do gens/totems in front of you or take the chase for another surv.