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Frustration makes dbd good
around 9m 55s, MCote talks about how dbd sort of thrives on frustration.
How do you feel about that?
Comments
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Frustration doesn't make me want to play DBD. It makes me want to "play something else" :P
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Sounds like brainwashing.
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Guess the frustration that you can't physically get to the generator being worked on because you're not a mobility killer is aight.
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perhaps CIV5...
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Frustration is the reason I STOP playing DbD. Seriously, I would absolutely put in a lot more time (and cosmetics money) if it wasn't so painful.
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That train of thought drives me crazy. The game isn't good because it's frustrating, it's good in spite of being frustrating
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I think what he was trying to convey is that the feeling of frustration is a core part of a horror experience. Read any horror book or watch any horror film. The diminishing, overwhelming odds always induces frustration and n a main character at some point.
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I don't think hes talking about frustration the same way you do.
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If you like frustration, then you are not frustrated.
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Frustration makes no game good. That comment from Mcote shows how out of touch the dev's are with their own game.
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I don't want to be frustrated. I want to be having fun while playing the video game. Like what? 😕
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Video games have always been meant to challenge you. If you don't want that tension and anxiety just watch a movie.
That's how games like Super Meat Boy and rogue-likes thrive. (This game is kinda rogue-lite in a way too, by loose definition.) McCote knows what he's talking about.
Would you have liked the original Super Mario Bros if you didn't die constantly learning it? Nintendo hard was a common term, but people sure love Nintendo don't they?
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I mean, think about dark souls. Its so frustrating because it doesn't always make things exactly fair, you throw the controller, walk away for days, but you pick it up again. Why? Because the frustration of failure makes the victories so much sweeter. Of course bad bugs are frustrating in a different way entirely. What im talking about is the frustration of learning a new killer (as or against) but getting better and learning how to cover for where they lack. Survivors feel frustrating because you feel powerless, but you learn where you excel and play to your strengths. High mobility killers are frustrating because they're hard to control. You get better through practice. High effectiveness killers get frustrated because of a lack of gen pressure, but you learn what perks and tactics best cover where you fall short.
If darksouls wasn't hard it wouldn't be satisfying. Same for DBD.
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LMAO ######### dark souls!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! but yeah
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Ghouls 'n Ghosts...
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I mean, every pvp type game has frustration to some extent.
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I recall "bump n jump" pissing me off a lot LOL
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I love the part right after that, where he talks about dedicated servers and how long people are willing to wait to get a perfect match. (10:47)
*looks at the threads where rank 20 gets matched with rank 1.
Yeah... that didn´t age well...
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He would be right if there weren't so many things you could blame for losing in this game.
If the reason you lost was almost always your fault and not bad game design, terrible balancing, bugs, etc. then you might get pissed but still have a good time.
It's why I like playing against NOED and not DS.
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Motivational Frustration is good but that happens when you feel like its your own fault.
Aka souls Born's difficulty minus the endless Ambushes in BloodBorn/DS3(DS2 has one of lowest amount of ambushes # wise in the series).
In DbD its increasingly not anyone's fault to losing.
A clown VS a sweat squad/Wannabe sweat squad can't really be blamed for losing as the game is far too rigged against them to be the player's fault and thus it rarely becomes Motivational Frustration.
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I feel like McCote is always under a microscope.
- He is not a designer. The game is not frustrating because of McCote, he is not the person making gameplay changes. When he said that frustration is a driving motivator in the game is from personal experience as a player. And honestly I don't get why he's getting flack on that opinion.
- The work that he does is responsible for bring iconic killers into the game. If you enjoy playing as Michael, Amanda, Nancy, Steve, Ash, or DemoDog then you have McCote to thank for that.
Alright, off my soapbox I get.
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I stay for a challenge, I move on if the game makes me feel like all players are frustrated and it sadly has been this way for a couple chapters.
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After a frustrating match and you win,a rush of euphoria feels you're, but if you don't win that euphoria becomes venom.
I do feel though he is right ,if killer's didn't have that constant threat the games would be boring.
Like I said if you don't when you're just left with that anger and if you're like me you want to get the one's who made you mad ,so the anger I feel leaves with the survivor's and don't take that anger in other matches.
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Ill be honest, sometimes I carry it to other matches. Like, if I get totally destroyed by a god looping David, if there's a David in the next match I'm like "you shall pay for the sins of your brethren!" Lol
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Yeah I saw that interview, and it was rather revealing on just how out of touch BHVR is with their community. Frustration isn't a driving factor for any game. At the end of a long day I just want to unwind with a good game. I either want to delve into an excellent story, or play a good game alongside my friends. Unfortunately DBD doesn't offer any of that.
The DBD community has been asking for the same features year in and year out. How long have we been asking for a training mode? The FREE TO PLAY mobile game received one within three months of release, and here the main game has been out for almost 5 years and we still don't have anything like that. The only thing that BHVR seems to be consistent at is releasing bug-filled chapters that they feel perfectly comfortable charging us money for.
Simply put, we're whales to them and nothing more.
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Yeah I do to in away I go in the match blood lusting,I just don't make some directly pay for what someone else did,but I change my gameplay style to adapt to the next team
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It does make sense but he kinda worded it poorly. What he really meant was tension. DbD is tense. which is why it's good.
Too much tension does lead to frustration though which is the bad part of it. Most people should just learn to take a break when they get too much tension from the game but most of them just instantly requeue.
This game isn't nearly as frustrating if you just don't let it build up.
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It does make sense but he kinda worded it poorly. What he really meant was tension. DbD is tense. which is why it's good.
Too much tension does lead to frustration though which is the bad part of it. Most people should just learn to take a break when they get too much tension from the game but most of them just instantly requeue.
This game isn't nearly as frustrating if you just don't let it build up.
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If you like frustration then you are not normal. That is a fact.
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Saying that dead by daylight's level of frustration is no different than a game like dark souls, makes me wonder if you have played dark souls.
What keeps gamers coming back to a game like dark souls is that despite how frustrating some encounters may be, the core mechanics are there to overcome any obstacle and any challenge, it just takes practice. Now yes there is a level of practice to be had with DBD, but DBD is so bug-ridden, so heavily dependent on a good ping, so heavily reliant on the right perks and proper matchmaking, on top of hoping that players don't play in a toxic way (camping, tunnelling, etc), that comparing the frustration levels in both games couldn't be more night and day.
Post edited by SweetTerror on2 -
Frustration in the context in being in cometition with someone is good an aimless frustration brought on by game mechanics you can't interact with in a meaningful way is not.
It also helps to have some aides or advice on improving. Dbd is lucky to have the dedicated content creators it has. Ut good to see they recognise thsi with the fog whisperers prpgramme.
Without there help the game would have died or at the very least not gotten as far as it did. Side note artist for this game have been doing an incredible job as of late feel likes it worth acknowledging.
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Have you stopped playing DBD?
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I don't think any of us have stopped playing DBD, but I think the more accurate question is, "Are you still having fun?".
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Haven't played since covid started. That tells you how long a break I've been on and I've had plenty of time to play games. DBD isn't one of them. Even when the Twins released I didn't even turn on the game.
Post edited by EvilJoshy on1 -
Well I've beaten DS2, DS3, and bloodborne multiple times, so yes, i have played them and there's bugs in them too that break the game.
I did make clear that bugs are a separate issue. My point was the frustration at learning curves and, yes, even toxic players are a part of the "good frustration". You learn the scope of what the opposition is capable of and change your strategies and builds to counteract them. Plus, in PVP games, the feeling of loss frustration is greater because there's an actual person that you can blame, instead of AI. I stand by my comment because the difficulty frustration and learning curves are similar. You have to be at the top of your game to do well, which makes success more satisfying
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"There is no one who loves pain itself, who seeks after it and wants to have it, simply because it is pain..."
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I think what he is trying to say is, you are frustrated in your attempt to stop your opponent. It is an effort trying to win. If there is no frustration, there is no game.
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Nothing worth doing has ever been easy. The reason people value anything is because it's not easy to come by, whether it's an item, an accomplishment, or an experience, the rarer it is the more valued it is. We like to acquire and hold onto rare things because they tend to reveal the most about life, so we covet them. Sometimes we don't get to take an item from our endeavor, or really acquire anything but an experience; in DBD I can't think of what you would want to take from it other than your experiences. It's true that the bad times can be really bad, but that just means that the good times can be really good. DbD is pretty much the only video game I play these days - lately, less so because of various bugs, but still!
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The most fun thing in the game is the least frustrating - kill your friends
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Yes, hopelessness, but that tends to almost always go hand in hand with frustration.
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Sometimes it seems that some aspects of the game were specifically designed to be frustrating. Playing survivors is meant to be frustrating cause your character gets beaten up most the game, while playing killer is meant to be frustrating because of some game mechanics (kobe, hatch) or survivors perks that can nullify your efforts to win. And post game chat on top of that, which is mainly used for insults and complaints as if something else can be expected in a game with so many elements of frustration.
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Remember when Cote got destroyed against 4 Korean players and he got very frustrated because he only hit 1 survivor in the total in 1 match.
Good to see that his frustration helped him in that match.
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This couldn't be further from what I think. The idea of going against 4 survivors, all using infuriating perks and items, makes me want to play the game less. The main thing that makes me feel this way is keys. I know these will be getting a nerf of some sort but the idea that I played perfectly and lost because the key not only can give vision of the killer but also open the hatch for multiple people is beyond infuriating. Whenever I see someone with a key, I have a sort of feeling that I somewhat need to tunnel them before the hatch spawns. I already hate tunnelling but I almost feel like it's needed to counter keys. Another thing that drives me insane is the Brand-New Part add-on. 30% repair progress over 10 seconds feels so overkill. I wish I could say these 2 things feel balanced but they really aren't. The key has a counter, that being tunnelling, but that isn't remotely fun at all. Having to chase someone exclusively because of poor balancing makes the game feel sloppy.
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