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People who actually play blight and think j-flicks should be removed, why?
This post is just asking people who actually play blight why they think j-flicks should be removed instead of endorsed as a feature
Feel free to leave your opinion about the other side of why it should be actually endorsed as a feature as well
Arguments that have obvious counter arguments with proof behind them
It has no counerplay, yes it has really easy counterplay and can be dodged really easily if predicted
Its an exploit because it was unintended, thats not a reason to not endorse it as a feature as bugs becoming features has been seen before
You need a dpi switch, No you don't people flick on every single dpi under the sun
Comments
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Some people play both sides.
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...I don't understand this reasoning / line of thought, could you explain it better other than people play both sides
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Why should we endorse an unfair feature that takes away a big part of a character’s counterplay, that needs a specific setup to accomplish meaning it isn’t available to most players?
I’m a killer main but defending j-flick as a balanced feature is a new level of bias - Blight is already good enough
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You can counterplay it, just make not a 180, but a 360 juke.
If anything, it making playing as and against blight even more skillful.
Without that flick, blight's lunge become hilariously easy to dodge.
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If the counterplay to his counterplay had no counterplay I would think it is an unfair feature, however as j-flicks have counterplay im going to disagree with the fact that it takes away a big part of his counterplay, as it only converts a big part of his hard counterplay into 50/50s where both sides have the oppertunity to outplay each other
Blight is fun because he isn't simple, J-flicking will remove most of the movement on his rush attacks and dull him down, its like the oni update that made him only have a 30° demon strike, it just dumbs down a fun mechanic
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I remember playing on the ptb with blights attack being laughably bad at maneuvering, I would never want to go back to anything close to that
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I would consider myself a Blight main and didn't even relies this was a thing until a week or so ago when someone was complaining about it. I don't care what happens with it because it is something I don't use so if it is "fixed" removed what ever you want to call it I don't care because it wont effect me.
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I would love to talk about that but unfortunately Blight is like the worst thing ever on console and i almost never face Blight (never experienced a j flicking blight).
So i'm not too sure about the counterplay part.
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example of j-flicking having counterplay at 2h27m33s since you can't embed the video with a timestamp for some reason
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Any time stamps?
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I assume I qualify when Blight fluctuates between 2nd and 3rd on my list of favorite killers? And my stance is the same as in your similar thread from yesterday, so I'll just link that instead of reposting it before going further: https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/comment/2065404/#Comment_2065404
I'll add that if it was to be adopted as a mechanic it would both have to be made a feature accessible to everyone (so make it a basic thing, so console players can do it too) and it would most likely be considered a buff to Blight. And if they simply did that and changed nothing else they'd still have to do something as people could use the exact same flaw with the game to turn even more than j-flick allows. As it'd just be j-flick turn with another layer of j-flick on top with no further changes.
As long as DBD is a game using things like turn speed and even field of view as things involved in game balance it's perfectly understandable and reasonable that things allowing players to bypass intentional restrictions on such things end up getting fixed. There's a reason Blight and Oni don't have free unrestrained control while going for a hit with their power, and it's for similar reasons higher field of view is offered as a perk benefit and stuff that messes with it like wacky aspect ratios ("stretched res") is controversial.Something like 4:3 stretched in something like CS:GO is mostly uncontroversial even though many feel it makes targets "thicker" and easier to hit, as it's available to everyone and vertical FOV is kinda irrelevant in that game compared to horizontal FOV unlike DBD.
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I honestly think its a bit BS, as a Blight main, he is an absolute pain in the utteral ass to learn and play, almost as difficult as nurse. So I think its absolute bias, for people wanting him nerfed when he requires skill and dedication, yet they don't complain when nurse beats them because she requires skill and dedication. Basically the player be rewarded for taking time and effort to learn how to play a very hard killer with a very powerful and fun killer
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refresh the post
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That didn't really look like counterplay but rather like him being lucky there
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Its not complicated. Its not intended therefore it shouldn't be in the game.
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Since when is removing an exploit a nerf?
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Oh nevermind I actually looked it up, I'm stupid, honestly that's really not that bad, and I don't see why it should be removed, it does seem complicated to learn and doesn't seem like it will happen that often
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Thats just the only example I have on hand there are others of more conscious counterplay that was the only one I just knew offhand
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Can a console player do this I flick? If not it shouldn’t exist
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The logic behind wanting the j flick gone makes literally no sense to me.
- Has counterplay, makes playing blight and playing against him more skillful.
- Buffs blight to the top 5, without it this makes him a mid tier killer.
- If the j flick was removed more people would play spirit, nurse, twins and pyramid which are infinitely more unfun than blight.
What's the issue if it does nothing but benefit the game.
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I don't know what the point of removing an accidental mechanic from a high skill killer that made their skill ceiling higher instead of just accepting it. If they decide its a feature the skill ceiling suddenly jumps higher, if they decide its not more people just play nurse and spirit
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Not a Blight main but this is known to be unintended and the players that use it know it's unintended.
It's the same for the Nurse looking up during fatigue. A bug that was fixed years ago but has resurfaced.
These need to be fixed or you face BHVR nerfing your main because too many exploited a bug.
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Not intended, yet it adds another layer to his gameplay on both sides that have plenty of counterplay.
I do not think it's fair to comment on something like this when you have no idea how it actually functions in practice. Unintentional does not equal bad or unhealthy because it's unintentional. You look at how it plays out, how both sides can use it and play around it, and determine if it's a balanced aspect of his power or not. If it is, and it genuinely adds GOOD gameplay to him, then it could actually be incorporated into his kit as an intentional feature as it is, or just left alone (with console given more freedom with Blight's controls).
The problem is, NOBODY flicks as Blight and so nobody knows the counterplay. The more people that do, more counterplay can be developed, there's more understanding of it, and everybody wins, because all in all, if you actually know how the flicks work - playing as and against him - you know it doesn't break him.
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That's not counterplay, he just missed. The survivor didn't predict or account for the flick, the Blight just messed up.
People need to stop equating mistakes to counterplay.
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That was the only example I had on hand there are plenty more examples with more active counterplay to j-flicks, and while its not spirit levels of no counterplay its closer to huntress hatchet levels of counterplay where you can bait it out or juke them, dead hard through them, go around objects in weird ways but its way more interesting than he will be without it.
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Exploits and unintentional design becoming mechanics due to them being fun is actually a pretty common in game design
Rocket jumping in quake
Combos in fighting games
Ghandi becoming nuke happy in Civilization
Just because a mechanic can start out as unintended or an exploit doesn't mean it can't be accepted or added in a more complete state.
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I'm fine with it staying in the game, I don't have much against it but it's an unintended feature and thus it should be removed, that's about it.
The major issue here? Console players don't have access to it, making it unfair for them. Devs are not gonna bother adding it in because of how difficult it'd be. Also I believe someone said the devs won't make the j-flick an official feature either.
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Only issue is that it cannot be done by console players like myself
Plus these two killers are already strong enough anyway
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J flicking Blight here. It's not intended, but its a cool skill cap thing. I'm indifferent.
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Because it's an exploit? It's not a super serious one that I'm going to bother complaining about every day, it's not like a 360 turn with Oni or anything (although you can still 180 with Oni's lunge the exact same way as Blight can), but it's still an exploit, all other exploits get patched out, why shouldn't this one.
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- What counterplay? Assuming that every Blight player is gonna exploit his lunge is counterplay? So it's another 50/50 but this time the 50/50 is "is the Blight cheating or not"? Awesome.
- No it doesn't, he's still a high-tier killer without this stupid lunge, and if you think he isn't you and everyone else who thinks like this are relying on this exploit too much.
- These killers are already played enough that the removal of an exploit isn't going to change the amount of Pyramid Heads and Spirits, and Blight is already not played often.
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Turning corners is meant to be part of the counterplay to Blight. J-Flicks remove that.
Blight was given a turn restriction for a reason. J-Flicks are just the result of bypassing that built in restriction. I do not consider that fair.
Can you counter it? Sure. If it became a feature, I'm sure people could adjust. I don't see that happening, the devs don't like it, so I think it should go.
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Exploits can become and be accepted as game mechanics, its happened in the past where exploits and unintended mechanics become game mechanics.
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If you aren't worried about the playerbase of a killer then why bother with arguing against them getting a mechanic that makes their gameplay more fun and interactive
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Yea but as counterplay running in a circle has been in the game since the beginning with killers like trapper, its boring and having a hard to use mechanic that increases the skill ceiling that can both circumvent it while also having its own counterplay is much more fun design than another killer you just go around in a circle with.
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Because Nurse, Deathslinger, Pyramid Head and Spirit exist. I don't want yet another ridiculous killer who has no real counterplay. That's just the most unhealthy thing I can possibly think of. If someone wants to play a killer with no counters, go play one of those and stop pretending a guess is counterplay. Or keep pretending, what do I care, just leave Blight alone and let the Devs fix this stupid exploit.
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Blight has more counterplay then all of them j-flick or not, if you think differently you obviously don't play blight or killer enough in general while complaining on a thread for people who play blight to suggest why j-flicking should be removed or why it should be endorsed.
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Yes, we actually can. Unintended features are implemented as features all the time. Game design is not as plain, boring, and black and white as you're making it out to be. Some of the best ######### added to games have been unintentional because they fun and added something new to the gameplay.
We're human beings, not robots. We don't have to see something as "This is exploit. We must fix. Beep boop beep bop." If something that isn't intended but is working just fine with the intentional game mechanics and people are enjoying it, then it shouldn't just be removed; It should be embraced or left alone so more people can understand it and use it.
The worst part about this situation, the ACTUAL unfair part about all of it, is that people are crying out for it to be removed because it's busted and breaks Blight, yet they have never gone against it, have never used it, and have never developed or seen any actual counterplay to it which very well exists (watch 1v1/1v4 scrims against top tier Blight players. It's VERY, VERY counterable).
All this is is a bunch of parroting. Truly a shame.
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Some fun examples of things to support your argument of features being implemented
combos in fighting games
rocket jumping in quake, which is also seen in games like tf2 and other movement shooters
nuke happy ghandi in civilization
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Exactly. All of these things became very memorable features of those games.
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??? Why would I be worried about a killer being played more or less? That doesn't even matter, it's an exploit and it should be removed. Whether it will be removed or not is up to BHVR but you're exploiting game mechanics to gain an advantage and that's the end of it. Blight could be played by literally only 3 people on Earth and I'd still want this gone because it's not intended and gives a significant advantage. I play Blight too but I don't use this exploit, I'm against it because it's cheating, end of.
And, interactive implies that there is reasonable counterplay on the other side as well, and there isn't unless, like I said, you're assuming every Blight you come across has a DPI switch at the ready and will always turn 180 degrees in 1 frame around a corner to try and hit you, which is not reasonable at all.
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Eh.. counterplay should not be a 100% guarantee or nobody would ever die.
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Actually, it should. Because he can still play those tiles as an m1 killer, a perfectly viable and completely interactive piece of gameplay. If anyone thinks Blight is weak because he can't use his power in shorter junk tiles, then they're getting outplayed. As they should be.
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I'm so tired of 3 new threads about this being started every day that repeat the same arguments.
"Why should my exploit be removed? Removing my killer's counterplay is fun design and makes him more skillful. If you disagree, you're just an entitled survivor main."
"You can't remove my exploit because another unrelated exploit exists."
"Flicks only account for landing a couple hits per match so they aren't even a big deal. Also if you fix this not a big deal thing, I'm quitting playing him forever."
Get. Over. It.
Blight will still be a strong killer without a broken lunge mechanic.
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Asking for Blight mains specifically is a poor idea.
It's like if I were to ask survivor mains who don't touch killer what do they think about some strong mechanic that wasn't intended, most of them would be in favour of it staying, but if we opened it up to everyone more people would be against it.
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Is it worth keeping this if they decide to add it in, and tinker around under Blight's hood? Billy and Nurse really enjoyed their time in the shop.
With at least five platforms not able to do this, you know darn well they'll do something. Even if it is not for a few patches the one thing they are unlikely to do here is nothing.
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better question, why do you care so much about leaving it in?
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All is these things were accessible and useable to all players of these games though.
Why are you so intent on ignoring the fact that J-Flicks should be removed because they can only be done when playing on PC? It is literally impossible for console players to do this, this is more than enough reason for this "feature" to be removed.
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Peole want 100% counterplay to deathslinger in an open field. Do you think that is a good design to aim for?
I am all for blight being changed, but if you make the cp so basic that yoi can pull it off at any time and anywhere like in the middle of the corn field, that is bad design.
The lunge needs to be 90 to 110 degrees.
I have tried console blight and that turn is to small.
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I like j-flicks.
Wish I could ######### do them on console...or turn, at all
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