BHVR doesn't understand physics (Trickster)
Warning this is just a Pet Peeve of mine concerning the Tricksters Power Mechanics.
Newton's 3rd Law states: For every action, there is an equal and Opposite Reaction.
I guess they took that literally when designing how Trickster throws knives as they've given him Recoil for every knife thrown, but therein lies a heavy Flaw:
When a Gun goes off, the force of the explosion and the ejecting projectile causes a genuine Equal and Opposite reaction to the person holding the gun that is commonly known as Recoil. However, when throwing an object, there is no counter reaction to the force put into it that is equal or opposite, instead the act of throwing puts all the force in the direction your arm moves: forward and towards the direction of the target you are aiming at. If throwing it hard enough, you get an excess of that momentum moving forward and down towards the target, and absolutely don't get any momentum upwards and to the side, as that's what happens when you Catch an object.
Basically what I'm saying is that, Unless Tricksters arms are guns, he shouldn't have any Recoil at all, and instead should have a more forward and down momentum towards the center for each of his throws. They can even add a bit of a Side sway wherein His left hand throws move his aim slightly diagonally to the right by the end of the throw and his Right hand throws move his aim slightly to the left, but they should always move forward and down the middle.
Seriously, I know this is just a game with fictional characters and all, but come on BHVR! Did no one on your team try throwing knives themselves or even throw a ball around the office for research before you made this character? Hell, Did any of you even consult videos on YouTube about it?
Just a pet peeve rant... sorry for wasting your time everyone.
Comments
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his recoil doesn't seem bad on PC
but then again I'm using a high DPI mouse
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Are you saying his arms AREN'T guns?
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This isn't even about how bad his recoil is, just that the recoil exists. They could've easily had the momentum of the throws going in the opposite direction for the same amount, and that would've been more accurate physics wise.
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Truth be told, they might as well be... if we're talking bb guns.
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isn't the entity's realm some alternate dimension?
You can fall from a great height and not get hurt
physics can be wrong it's all about perspective reality.
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And yet, Plagues Barf, Clowns Bottles, Huntresses hatchets, and even Tricksters' Knives traveling in the air have somewhat realistic arcs to them. As I've previously stated, I know this is a game in a fictional universe with Fictional characters and all, but if they are gonna to keep the physics of the gameplay remotely consistent then they should at least TRY to get this much right. Either that or change his animations from an overhand throw to an underhand one, then at least the recoil would make more sense because instead of throwing his arms in a forward and down motion, he's swinging them forwards and up.
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The mechanic exists as a failed attempt to balance the sheer number of projectiles he throws, not to be accurate to real-world physics.
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Replace the recoil with a stagger as if he's stumbling forward cause he's more show-off than precision you mean?
Yeah, what the other's said, this seems a haphazard attempt at balancing, like, eesh, is there anything done right with this killer?
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I can only assume it's a balancing mechanic. It's like the Dev's version of a submachine gun and they possibly wanted it to feel similar.
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the argumentation is kinda flawed. if the law says everything, then it means everything. you could also say the "as that's what happens when you Catch an object" part about a gun shot. action and counter reaction when shooting, action and counter reaction on landing. when you accelerate the knife, you get the "feedback" or counter reaction back into your hand. try throwing a knive over 10+ meters but instead of holding the handle you hold the edge with the tip against your finger, and then tell me again about "no reaction".
basically it is just kinda stupid to call it recoil. just think about it as worse aim when trying to throw faster. you can take your time to aim or you can just spray and pray. when throwing 3 knives per second I'm pretty sure 99% of all people will have a worse aim compared to one throw per 3 seconds.
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I get the reason for it
But it's too much for console i can control the vertical not the horizontal especially duty to survivors trying to dodge makeing me over shoot or under shoot where I wanted to go
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Lol plug in a controller good luck 26 blades for an injure
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No the Reaction is simple, the weight of the object adds to the force you apply to the throw in the direction you are throwing it, which continues after the object has left your hand until met with an equal amount of resistance. This does not translate to the object applying an opposing force to the throw, just that whatever kinetic force you put into it continues in the direction you hurled it. I was stating that they took the saying too literally, just like you did with this comment, so my advice to you is to prove this theory wrong: go out, grab a hammer, and perform an overhand throw as hard as you can on open ground, and tell me how much your body was tossed "backwards and up" from the attempt.... go on, I can wait.
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Not a stagger, more of his vision moves downward and towards the middle, or slightly off center from the middle either left or right, not up and to the left or right as he is now as that makes 0 sense when it comes to throwing objects, even ones as light as throwing knives.
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I'm not saying they should take it away, I'm saying that they should change its direction!
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Yet as I've mentioned in a previous response, the devs seem fine with keeping the physics behind the projectiles themselves (the arc) somewhat realistic, so why can't they at least do this much for the physics behind rapid throwing?
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Be aysw it's an actual gameplay mechanic. I cannot stress that enough - realism takes a back seat to gameplay.
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Almo is literally a physicist, and this comment is just wrong.
- Newton's second law, in its most famous form: F=m*a
- Newton's third law states that the force you apply on an object is equal to the force the object applies to you.
However, whereas the (presumably rigid) object has a mass of, say, 1 kg, your body has a mass of 80 kg. The acceleration imparted to you is 1/80 of the acceleration imparted to the object. That's not to say you remain perfectly static, as that would be a violation of Newton's third law. However, you hardly notice it because not only are you much heavier, you also have the advantage of being on the ground, which helps counter that force by partially transferring it to the Earth via friction, as well as having many moving parts, which serve as inertial dampers by absorbing the force.
In space, astronauts carry pens (which have a tiny mass compared to 99% of everyday objects) with the express purpose of allowing them to move (should they get stuck in an area where they can't reach anything) by simply tossing the pen. Newton's third law doesn't stop applying just because you're throwing a very small object.
With the physics lesson over, the "real-world" answer would be what Deadeye said, regarding the aiming issue:
The actual explanation is that it's done for balancing purposes. Whether or not it's needed is a different discussion altogether.
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I got used to the recoil quite quickly I'd say (PS player), but my problem with Trickster is that he's super slow... Survivors loop me around vaults or pallets amd it's just impossible for me to hit them with so many knives, it usually ends up more effective and faster to just hit them eith the m1. Then they drop pallet and there's one thing I can do: hope I'll catch them off guard by faking my red stain OR hope I'll hit the 8Th hit with the knive somehow OR I destroy the pallet, but by that time the survivors is far ahead of me md the looping begins once again....BAM...3 gens done
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you put muscle power into the hammer throw to stay stable. if you won't, you would take a step back. do you really argue about this? you mix up first and third law here...
experiment for you to check the counter reaction: sit on a swing with that hammer and toss it forwards. the swing will go backwards.
And what "saying" do you mean? In your first post you were talking about Newton's laws
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There is no physics section about rapid knive throwing in my school book. This is more like physical education. Sounds equal, but is something totally different.
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And just another one about your camera movement complains. It is not the whole body that bumps around (at least it seems that is what you expect to happen ingame) and also the recoil is not applied to your head only (=moving the camera). BUT when you throw a bunch of knives, your head pretty much will move somehow. Not as direct feedback from the knive, but as a result from the throwing movement. Or do you look like that when you throw a lot of knives
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Praise the chicken
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Simple his arms are half cooked spaghetti. Read the lore 4head
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If I had to guess, I'd say they went for a rifle-like recoil to make him feel more familiar to the average gamer, since a downward recoil would feel wierd to most players.
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so how would you make aiming "realistic" in a video game without having a cyber suit?
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