The Amanda's Letter add-on for The Pig has been Kill Switched due to an issue with incorrect RBT count.
http://dbd.game/killswitch
Why are they trying to make DbD Competitive when they declare tunneling etc 'fair'.
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Talk all you want you are allowed to its a forum but dont shoot people down when they make a statement that is actually based on fact.
Remember you called me out
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You are REALLY not familiar with competitive gaming if you think they would ban nebulous strategies like 'tunneling' and 'camping' and 'slugging' from a tournament.
It is extremely hard to ban strategies at the competitive level, its almost always massively unpopular, and it rarely works. It has to be something pretty extreme that is completely degenerate, adds no value to the game, and has a very clear cutoff point that can be measured mid play (ex: Wobbling from Melee). Otherwise, competitive play is literally a 'do your best' environment.
Like how do you define slugging, for example? Would you be required to INSTANTLY pick up survivors who are downed? Well then the meta just becomes flashlight saves all day every day. Ok so what if your allowed to search for a survivor going for that flashlight save? Well then you can claim 'oh well I thought I was going to get saved on.' If you find someone who doesn't have a flashlight can you hit them? What if someone is doing an objective right in your face? If you can't down them suddenly the killer literally can't mathematically win the game.
So slugging is never going to be banned. What about camping? Same deal. Are you required to run straight away? Then you never hook, you just slug, because the survivor will rescue instantly, and insta-rescues are a total tempo kill. What if your allowed to stick around if you see a survivor? The game still breaks, the survivor just hides. You can't ban camping at the high end. Some (bad) DBD tournaments tried and it always ends poorly. You cannot ban 'camping.'
This is because camping, tunneling, and slugging aren't mechanics. They are strategies, and they are words used to define strategies in a deliberately nebulous way so that basically anything survivors don't like can be thrown under them. There is no real clear definition, and more importantly you have to snowball to win as a killer, and you can only snowball by leaving people on the ground, eliminating a player early, or catching someone going for an unhook. That is it. Those are the only 3 ways you win in high level DBD. If your opponents aren't making mistakes and are coordinated doing gens, you literally don't have time to win 3 chases, let alone 12.
So this idea that these strategies are 'unfair' is something no high level DBD player takes seriously. Even streamers who don't do these things due to it not being exciting to watch will do them if they know they will get slammed otherwise, they tend to make content based around beating weaker players because DBD is at its most fun when the teams are unbalanced because survivors have so much insane basekit power its in their ability to deny all interaction.
And this is the real problem with DBD as a competitive game: It just isn't competitive because survivors are way too strong if their sole goal is to 'win.' Once your incentive becomes 'win a specific match at all costs' rather than 'have a good time' the game breaks utterly and even with slugging, camping, and tunneling only nurses and spirits can get anything done. And optimal play is not very exciting to watch on either side, which is the actual limit to DBD as an e-sport.
The game just isn't suited for it on many levels, but 'Camping, tunneling, and slugging aren't going to be tournament legal so why allow them in the normal game' is not one of them and betrays a COMICAL disconnect with the tournament scene in any game.
If Bayo was allowed in smash, tunneling is going to be allowed in comp DBD because tournaments that try to ban it won't be successful and will be overshadowed by ones that do.
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Behaviour devs have already said they don't care about tunneling, and will not punish it. So why do you think they will do it in a tournament setting.
"Please show me a written statement from behaviour about the rules of an official DBD tournament" is just a way of saying you have no basis for your argument, and are looking for the nichest way to discredit my point.
This shows you haven't understood anything that I have written.
I have never once said they will or they wont allow anything in a tournament.
Now for the 50th time, hopefully this one sinks in
We don't know what the rules of an official DBD tournament are because there has never been one.
is this clear enough or are you going to continue to get angry and not understand what I am trying to say.
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Whats the loose definition?
That there hasnt been an official tournament so we dont know the rules? is that loose?
and calling someone a slimy son a ######### might also fall into the category of debating in poor faith, dont you think?
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Ok
so what part of poor mans faith is the statement “There has never been a tournament, so we dont know the rules”
what part of this statement is not true?
lt cants be poor mans faith if it’s actually a fact right? or by your logic does poor mans faith work from 75% to 100% in an attempt to back up your argument?
l am not putting words in your mouth l simply made a statement.
l am not the one continually arguing over a statement that is fact.
you still didn’t answer how’s it a loose definition, that seems to be the way you argue, you just pick something new to argue about to deflect the fact you cant answer.
like l have been saying all along it’s ok to debate and it’s ok to speculate and discuss that’s what forums are for.
But we still don’t know the rules of a DBD tournament because there has never been one.
The fact you took offense to this statement so badly is mind boggling.
Anyway l will leave it there, l have slimy son of a ######### things to do.
Post edited by FattiePoobum on0 -
Completely fair. As Survivors it's in your power and responsibility to avoid the killer and escape chases. Before camping or tunneling can take place, you have to fail.
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No, these tactics wouldn't be banned, tournament players aren't expecting their entitlements to win for them. They might even try to safe unhook, the opposite of how all survivors do it.
Did you know that a survivor coming off the hook is actually no weaker than any survivor that's been hit? Did you know that injured survivors run and perform at the same speed as every other survivor?
So you come off hook and want to sit in your safe-space, have a good cry. Meanwhile, I just hit a guy with sloppy and franklin's, he's mangled, hemorrhaging and just dropped his equipment, but somehow he's expected to keep playing without anyone holding his hand or kissing his boo-boo. Why should you be rewarded for being hooked? Being punished for bad play is common in games, rewards for bad plays are rare.
How's about this, try running and escaping instead of standing there with a thumb up your ass. Camping and tunneling are specifically allowed, run, Forrest, run.
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You make a lot of assumptions, none of them I agree with. There have been several tournaments, and none of those things were banned. Care to revise your tinfoil hat theories? This is the game; you either like it or you don't. If you aren't happy, why are you still here? As you pointed out, the DEV have clearly stated that Camping, Tunneling, and Slugging (and many more) are valid tactics and all fall under Player agency. They aren't going away. You learn to deal with them in the game. That is the solution; it is the only solution.
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So let me get this straight,, I am driving people away from playing because I am doing the only thing I can because campers and tunnelers are making us do that,,,are you kidding me? LOL So your right I will just sit there on the hook game after game or foolishly run in for the save only to get downed myself for what,,,"the sake of the game,,,"and so others dont leave" when no damn killer main would EVER do that. No sorry, I will just keep doing what I am doing since that is what every killer main is doing. It sucks, this is what the game has turned into. Its not fun anymore but I am not going to play a certain way when NO ONE else does. Had a game with the wraith last night and he hooked then went invisible every damn time right next to the hook and stayed there so if we tried to save he downed us. After the third or so save attempt the game was over,,,why dont you tell that killer main to stop doing what they are doing. Because they wont and you know it, everyone plays they way they will and the devs could care less!
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This is something I don't get though. Whenever people argue for nerfing camping and tunneling people here often argue that those strategies aren't that good and can easily be counterplayed. Yet regarding topics like these, suddenly the argument is that these strategies can be viable and powerful.
I know the op's post is about not having these strategies used in competitive turnaments, but in the end the actual problem with camping and tunneling is that it's so unfun to go against.
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My honest confusion is when people say "camping and tunneling doesnt happen that much" or "only at the end of the match because there are three gens or so done and the killer is at his/her last resort", when that is not the case at all. Most of the camping/tunneling games happen right at the start of the game never at the end,,,its like the "go to tactic"? I am honestly confused why so many people say it doesnt happen that much when it happens in just about every game. I cant be that unlucky to have it happen that much. I dont count the occasional camping or tunneling so this is not an exaggeration,,,I am talking about from the beginning of the game til the end. Oh and a lot of those campers and tunnelers are very toxic writing ggwp or ggez when all of us got hooked trying to save and maybe one gen was completed. They are not trying to be nice,,,they are being toxic.
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I mean in that case I would argue you have been getting unlucky, I at least never had almost all my matches start with camping.
But I do agree that it is a fairly frequent problem. And extremely unfun to go against. It's especially unfair when the killer also uses NOED.
But I am talking about actual camping. Not the killer that occasionally proxy camps because it is the best strategy to do so.
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You got tunnelling, camping and slugging as various tactics, while SWF has callouts to counter all of them and less bugs hindering their gameplay (as in, they don't have to worry about power related bugs. Aside from hit validation, there doesn't seem to be very many game breaking bugs for survivors, and many that benefit them, such as the hooking bug, crawl under a hook or gen bug, the silent survivor audio glitch, being able to inch off the ledge to avoid making the landing sounds etc).
Competitive games ESPECIALLY give the survivors the power to punish killers for tunnelling or camping, and can coordinate well to recover from a slugfest. If you think these things are a challenge for real competitive SWF teams, you probably aren't on one
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Ayayay, just looked at the comments... I may want to remove myself from this aggro thread entirely lol
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In a competitive sense there would be no choice but to camp. It’s 4 against 1. It’s not Overwatch where it’s one full team vs another. It would be silly to just up and leave and walk around, only for the hooked survivor to get unhooked a few seconds later. Not only that but you have to hook the same survivor multiple times if you’re not tunneling or camping. Unless you’re nurse or spirit and slug everyone Killers are guaranteed to lose in a competition game. Unless they camp and even then the other team can just gen rush and let that one die. This game isn’t made for competitive play cause of the unbalance. Killers aren’t strong enough for it.
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It depends. There's the killers that camp from the offset, and then there's the killers that use proxy camp at strategic times.
I think a lot of people don't enjoy playing in that way but the sad truth is killers don't have time to run around and 12 hook everyone and never hook the same survivor twice in a row. I wish we did, and I try to play nice if I'm against beginners but against teams that have their sights set on the objective you simply don't have time as killer to play nice, not when the survivors are playing sweaty.
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I understand that. My complaints are mostly towards complete camping, i.e. killers that sit right in front of hooked survivors. Proxy camping is of course a strategy that is sometimes the best solution for a killer.
I think a gen rush nerf, as well as a tunneling and camping nerf need to go hand in hand. Giving killers a bit more time to compete with survivors would be great, but they should only be able to do well when not using insanely unfun tactics. It would help the game so much.
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Speaking from the bottom of my spiteful heart: esports are useless, so are "professional esports gamers" and so will be the competitive Dead by Daylight. I really hope BHVR would stop trying milking this cow and being complacent in generating more potato-shaped people with a carpal tunnel syndrome who call themselves "athletes"
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This is the reason that when I see 3 gens done by the time I have my first down, and the last 2 pop when I get my second down, I immeditaley open the gate and face a wall. Gen-rushing will ONLY stop when survivors lose enough pips. DBD isn't going to do anything about it ever because Holding M1 on a gen is boring, so they cannot ever increase game time.
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Okay first of all DBD will never be an E-Sports game. It never was and never will be. People need to get competitive DBD out of their heads because A. high elo DBD games are boring as hell and B. Asymmetric games are impossible to balance and this game is broken as hell. 90% of all competitive DBD players aren't even good but that's another issue. IF BHVR would officially announce that DBD will competitive in the future they still wouldn't change tunneling and camping. In fact, all that would change is that teams would be more picky of who is good enough to join their team. I always cringe when people think this game is a competitive game.
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Competitive =/= fair. At high level play, camping is a bad strategy because you will lose. Tunneling is required because gens go too fast and the only viable killers are nurse and spirit.
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