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for the last time survivors, NOED ISN'T A PROBLEM, it's your fault it triggers
You know this perk exist, you know how it triggers, you know what it does, you know how to remove it from the game, you can remove it before it even trigger, every killer you play against could run this perk.
So why do you complain about a killer using it?
You can totally remove this perk before it even trigger and you complain about this perk being a thing.
Yes noed can reward bad killers, it can and does, but it also punish survivors because you gen rushed, if you would have took the time to break 5 totems in the whole match, 16 times 5, to remove this perk without trying to hard to finish 5 gens in 5 minutes well you wouldn't be complaining about noed, but you so badly want to rush gens that you totally ignore the fact the killer can have this perk and when they do because you finished the gens in 5 minutes you cry about it? it was your job to DO THE BONES AND YOU FAILED DOING THIS SIMPLE TASK 5 TIMES, deal with it, stop crying about noed if you can remove it before it even trigger, stop being childish and do the totems.
Comments
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you can break 4 totems, miss the last one because its hidden in space somewhere and still fall victim to a terrible killer with noed. Thats not gen rushing, that's terrible luck. If noeds power were based on the remaining number of dull totems at end games, the "it punishes bad survivors" argument would be valid. But it doesn't, so it isn't.
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be in denial all you want buddy
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An excellent, insightful counter argument.
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I do have 1 problem with that statement. If someone is camping another while you look and do totems, you're rewarding that killer since he'll get more than 2 kills due to time constraints. You don't and the rest might get NOED'd. That's my only real issue with NOED.
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Survivors definitely deserve to get punished if they decide not to cleanse all the totems, that's what happens when you glue yourself to gens.
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It's not overpowered and it's their fault it triggers, but that doesn't mean it's not a problem. It is unhealthy design.
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That argument falls apart with more than 2 minutes of logical thinking with solo-queue in consideration, so maybe you're the one that's in denial buddy.
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If you did 4 totems and the other 3 surv couldn't even do one its on them.
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The fact that its existence came from the idea of "gen rushing" or as a certain dev said (not hating) "if gens get done too fast for you" shows that its core design was to be there for killers who could not pressure the survivors, it is just a badly designed perk. I am not saying that the killer who uses NOED was bad though, sometimes you can just be outperked or outmaped (sometimes).
This also doesn't take into account of solo queue (none of these NOED posts saying "stop whining" do actually). Just how are you supposed to deal with NOED then? You have teammates who don't do bones for the most part and if you yourself (alone) actively seek out the totems scattered across the map, then you hinder your team from completing gens for a perk the killer might not even have. But I guess survivors should just suck it up and cleanse all 5 totems right?
Gen rushing is literally the survivors doing their objective btw, not some "meta or toxic strat".
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The "Just do the bones" arguement kinda falls apart in solo queue.
Especially on indoor maps,swamp or dead dawg saloon
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they will sing the same song every time. it's a waste of time.
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if you, as a team, do 4 totems but cant find the remaining one, you are being punished the same regardless as if you had done none. You're not being lazy survivors, some totem spawns can be incredibly good. In fact, in these cases, the remaining totem that nobody can find is guaranteed to be NOED so by doing 4/5 totems you've actually screwed yourself more than if you had done none.
This isn't punishing lazy survivors as OP said. This is punishing bad luck and rewarding a bad killer. If, for example, the number of exposed survivors was limited to the amount of remaining dull totems at end game, I would fully agree. All survivors exposed means at most 1 totem has been done and they deserve to be punished accordingly.
But as it is, thats not the case. NOED rewards bad killers far more than it punishes lazy survivors.
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Survivors cleanse totems: Killer cries Hexes are too weak and are broken 30 seconds into match
Survivors don't cleanse totems: Killer cries gen rushers
How about a survivor perk where if any breakable walls are left on the map at endgame all survivors have endurance. you will have to kick out the one wall with a light under it to end this effect.
on the plus side, at least you know which walls you've already kicked out, so you know if the task is done
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I dont care if a killer played well and then noed activates and i play mostly solo.
But when i have a camping killer and i need to pray that my teammates do gens and then theres noed its dumb. Theres only two minutes on the hook, we cant do all gens and totems. And the most annoying part is that i know that the killer will use this "effective" strategy next game, too.
Luckily i get only a few matches like that, but those matches are a waste of time.
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Wow I agree and I'm a survivor main these other survivors need to stop harassing the killer just because they won't emit there trash at the game just look for the totem or bring mettle of man in the game to counter it.😑
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In solo queue the perk can be a nightmare.
Bad killer chases you for the last 3 gens and you get hit by it. Was that my fault?. Did the killer deserve the instadown for not pressuring gens?
It encourages bad play from the killer perspective
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And yet thousands upon thousands of us (facing the same statistical appearance of NOED as you) do just fine. Riddle me that? :)
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"NOED isnt a problem its your fault it triggers"
So it was DS and look how well that perk ended.
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I'm with you that it rewards bad killers (same as DS rewarded bad survivors) but there needs to be a sweet spot for totem balance. If they spawn out in the open its to easy. If they are well hidden like on indoormaps, thats another story.
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Noed actually has the undying problem. In some scenarios noed cant be prevented because of killer camping. In other situations if you as a team do your best to find all the totems but with new totem spawns you get 4 now that one totem out in narnia is noed and your screwed. Most people say actually not to cleanse totems right away against noed because if you remember where the totem you saw was you can just hit it later. So the counterplay isnt even always prevent it from activating its to actually let it activate then spend the 12 second cleanse which the killer could still get a instadown in that time. Also strong killers imo will just throw it on to beat you while your down. So many times verses amazing nurses and spirits noed came out because we could barely do the gens and screwed us. Which against these 2 you already barely have enough time to do the gens depending on their strength let alone totems as well. I am a advid detectives hunch user but that doesn't mean i won't say how bs the perk is.
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Go look at totem spawns in maps like Lery's, Hawkins, Midwich, and Dead Dawg.
Now, remember that survivors don't have a totem counter.
Now, re-evaluate your thought process.
As someone else said above, it would be a very good change to make NOED's power based on how man totems are left in the match.
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Indeed, totem spawns in general can be pretty horrible. I stopped running hex perks as my lit totems would always be blindingly obvious. But the problem with noed is that you only need 1 of the dull totems to be a god spawn totem, hidden in some tall grass or inside a cart or where ever, and then unless the survivors have Detectives or something similar, Noed is all but guaranteed. Its even worse than a god tier ruin/devour as at least lit totems make a crackling noise to help locate them, whereas dull totems don't.
Long story short, I'd happily trade better totem spawns for a NOED rework, as I'm sure would most killers who have made it out of the yellow ranks.
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I dare you to play soloQ for once in your life and see how easy it is to know that all totems are done.
Until then don’t make stupid threads.
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I had survivors complain about noed but I killed them all before the EGC so noed never triggered.
So what is there to be mad about noed?
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do bones
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Ironically the best counter to noed is to leave totems alone then go quickly check them when the last gen pops
Going around doing dulls is time off gens while your teammates are getting chased + increasing the likelyhood of noed being the last totem you can't find
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considering how fast totems get removed within 1 minute of the game that's a bad idea to have it based on the amount of totems left.
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Your discussion history shows you are terrible at killer.
Git gud.
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or just do bones.
When have hexes ever been a threat? Most of them spawn next to generators or open areas
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As other people have said, it isn't always that easy. Solo queue have no way of determining how many totems are left or communicating to their teammates that they have cleansed X amount of totems. Not only that but with maps such as Midwich or Léry's, totems can be next to impossible to find even for a 4 man SWF.
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This is coming from the guy who thinks that he didn't tunnel someone who was being healed right after being unhooked...
Besides... Totems are not removed as fast as people think.
However, totems should NEVER be spawning next to gens or survivor spawn locations.
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Doing bones isn’t a counter, because you’re spending time breaking totems just to counter a perk the killer may or may not have.
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Go play soloQ.
Record your first match, show me how easy it is to find all totems without detectives or small game.
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Alternatively you let the one guy get downed and hooked because of noed then just leave
Know when to cut your losses.
I'd rather that then the killer manage to turn a 1k into a 3k/4k.
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Same guy who started an entire thread complaining about post nerf DS because it doesn't let him tunnel people, best not waste your breath. It's a very different game for him down at rank 17.
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Oh yeah it’s the same guy 🤦♂️ Forgot that green rank logic is different
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killers can't easily protect their totems from 4 survviors either.
totems need major buffs
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Yes, adn if survs escape is your problem as killer. Yo can avoid it, you only need to hit them and hook them
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I'm not complaining about NOED and am not calling for a nerf but I would like to say this.
If a killer is tunnelling a survivor aren't the other survivors encouraged to rush gens? Therefore when are they able to run around the whole map and make sure all totems are cleansed?
Still believe solo q should have a totem counter. Swf teams know how many totems are cleansed and where they were cleansed but solo q survivors unfortunately don't.
Imo I think NOED has the same problems as OoO. NOED isn't OP vs a swf, but I feel like it's a bit much vs solo q. OoO isn't OP vs solo q survivors, but it's definitely too strong in a swf team.
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you want a good argument? it's called detective hunch and small game and maps
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This seems a bit off to me. If you've cleansed four, why not go for the fifth?Even if its broken, you can confirm that it is by finding it and since you already know where four of them are, you can generally have a good guess of where it is since totems are are a certain distance away from each other and have memorable spots.
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Add in some way of counting the totems and NOED would be fine. Now the only people who complain about NOED are the ones that didn't counter it, just like how the only remaining people who complain about DS are still tunnelling and getting hit with it. I remember a really good idea someone had, where there would be 5 lit candles around the basement hooks, everytime a totem gets cleansed, a candle would go out. It's ideas like these that make me wish BHVR took suggestions from the community but nope.
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All they need is better spawn locations, if survivors manage to cleanse all 5 totems AND complete all 5 gens, that's on you, not them.
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the thing is you can do 4 totems (which still means you wasted half of the game not doing generators which just decreased your odds of even making it to the end game) and have the last one become noed. you legit cannot find all the totems unless you have an entire build centered around them. also, solo queue teammates dont do totems unless they have inner strength. seriously, in a total of 400 hours of playtime ive only seen noed get pre cleansed once and that was only because 2 of my teammates had a rainbow map+detectives hunch and all of us were dead on hook by the time we did the last gen.
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I made a thread called the noed trials I got about 5 games playing only Myers and not once did it have the chance to activate
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sad truth
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The issue is, as others have pointed out, that 'Do bones' is actually not a counter to NOED. In fact, it runs the very real risk of making it more powerful. If you do the obvious totems, NOED is guaranteed to shift to the well hidden totems.
Basically, the more totems you do, the less likely you are to find NOED when it pops, unless you get all five.
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NOED isn't that bad as long as survivors don't get stupidly altrusitic. The moment the Killer downs a survivor, he'll camp their ass into oblivion hoping that their team will come running. Rushing to the gate and leaving is the best option.
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gen rushing is survivors focusing on completing main objective as fast as possible.
It is a problem, really, especially for low tier killers that physically cannot pressure survivors well enough to enter endgame with at least 1 kill (not even talking about having at least 2 survivors on a death hook).
Noed naturally slows the game down by putting survivors under threat of being wiped out if they don't take their time to deal with totems.
So I personally see no real problem in the perk itself. You can focus on doing bones and making sure all 5 totems are broken (btw I personally always check for 5 broken totems when playing solo q if I know I'm not going to leave the moment exit gates are powered) or you can just let go of that, rush gens and leave.
There's more problems in some killers that can use noed, pop+tinkerer and some other gen slowdown perk as well as their ability to achieve insane pressure, although at the same time survivors can optimise themselves so well, that they overcome even such nuisance.
So I personally won't be looking forward to nerfing anything right now. I'll be waiting for MMR system to more or less sort everything out, so that slugging-motherdaughtersring-pop-tinkerer-noed-infectious spirits get matched with tournament swfs and casual players are matched with casual players, to really see how things are going on.
Because right now most perks or killers feel so OP or underwhelming because players are not playing with equally skilled opponents, which greatly affects the whole picture.
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Agreed, it isn't that gen speeds are too fast, it is just that killers are too weak for the most part and the maps are too favorable to the survivors.
I still sort of disagree with NOED though, it is just really hard for solo players to get them all cleansed. Even then, the fact that its existence was because gens were being done too fast is also just straight up poor design, instead of fixing the issue BHVR just implemented a band-aid fix (what a surprise). I would like to see NOED be changed to have a strong endgame effect rewarding the killer for doing well throughout the match.
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