The Key Nerf :)
The nerf to keys wasn't really that much of a nerf tbh 30 seconds to 10 seconds isn't that much if all the survivors are nearby the survivor who opened it they all get out either way. :\
How about when a survivor uses the key the hatch instantly closes behind them so no more than 1 survivor can escape with a key(So in the situation with 3 survivors left and there is 1 gen left and hatch spawns they cant just all escape through hatch).
Also make it to where once the survivor goes through the hatch, the hatch will be gone no longer appear unless its one person left alive; it will also spawn in a different area so the killer can't camp it as well as the survivor.
If the key is used after all gens are finished the hatch will close not spawn again at all even if your the last person forcing them to go through the gate and giving the killer a chance to get another kill there
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Pretty killer idea, just uh... the devs won't? I support it a lot
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Did you not read the next line on purpose?
"Please note that this is not the final change keys will be receiving. We’ll share more info on the future of keys as soon as we can."
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I saw that however if we don't say anything about it they will think its fine and actually think that it is going to solve the problem with keys
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Pretty sure the Devs already know what they want to do with Keys.
Changing it to 10 seconds instead of 30 seconds is already an improvement which can be done quite easily - it requires all Survivors to be at the Hatch to actually escape and it helps that the Killer is not forced to close the Hatch. So for the start, it is a good change.
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Or the best very simple change to let hatch spawn after 5 gens or with 1 person left alive.
No ? Too healthy as it doesn't let survivor bypass their main objective. Ok
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Yea that is true however SWF still get free escape
I don't care about a good start I care about them fixing the problem at hand, keys have been in the game for so long and they haven't done a single thing about the actual problem is SWF are the one's who take advantage of it the most and this nerf still doesn't do anything to them
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I'm fine with that however there are many circumstances i have come across where all my teammates are getting hooked left and right and the killer leaves one person slugged to get the 4k and if I had a key in that instance it wouldn't do anything because as you would want it spawn after all gens are done which isn't fair for the one survivor who actually does good and loses because of their teammates and a greedy killer.
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With that same logic, killers who camp should be teleported to the opposite side of the map as they are bypassing their main objective.
Sure, it might be inefficient bypassing if survivors know they are camping(which is only the case in SWF with comms or if someone brings Kindred), and act on that to rush a gen. But not everyone you face is SWF, not everyone you face runs Kindred. Camping allows killers to bypass their objective.
Or Judiths Tombstone, or Devour Hope, or Noed, or Haunted Grounds. Or any instadown in the game.
Guess that double standard of yours doesnt matter, because killers are poor helpless babies that need all the help they can get to kill more than 1 meanie survivor.
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Greedy killer ? Aren't you the one greedy for free key escape killer can't prevent before even all of your teammates die so you didn't outlive them yet.
I get your frustration with bad teammates but there's no way key escape in tha scenario is healthy or fair towards the killer.
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I play survivor and when I get bad teammates I could care less if I die however there are many people who bring keys the prevent this from happening
In return Survivor is happy however killer isn't
So lets remove keys
Survivors now are more unhappy and killer's are happier than ever!
See what I'm getting at now?
We will never be able to keep both sides of the game happy
However as a Michael Myers main myself I would much rather have 1 survivor escape with hatch then all of them :|
And whenever I see a survivor who is trying and the other's threw the game for some challenges I give him hatch in the end and we both come out happy in the end so my point is survivors should at least get a chance to escape if their teammates don't cooperate to finish the objective.
However all of them escaping from hatch isn't. That's why I'm proposing my nerf to keys.
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Where exactly did you get your information that killer is bypassing their objective of KILLING survivors by camping one of them giving others much easier time to do gens ? Old mories that let you kill before reacing final hook state were bypassing killers objective as do keys now, camping has nothing to do with that.
Geez man, you really think instadowns bypass killer's objetive ? Have you ever heard of hilbilly, one of the first killers to exist and have instadown basekit which is intended chase mechanic ?
I would understand at least a little bit the comparison to tombstones or DH which both have very effective counters unlike keys but man, you're one unreasonable individual that I'm afraid to even continue discussing this with you. You remind me of Sluzzy with those ideas of yours.
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HATCHES
Another small tweak: We have decreased the time the hatch remains open after a key is used from 30 seconds to 10 seconds. Like before, if the hatch closes naturally (is not kicked shut), the End Game Collapse will not start.
Please note that this is not the final change keys will be receiving. We’ll share more info on the future of keys as soon as we can.
the last sentence is the important one.
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Well survivors should be happy already, mori nerfs killed them off completely so they get full match experience every time, killers don't as keys are still extremely overpowered when used correctly.
I want both keys and mories to be equally useful and changing hatch conditions so that keys can't bypass gens is the only way they both become equally strong from my pov.
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So your ok with killer slugging for 4k at 1 gens left? :\ because that doesn't seem healthy either
That doesn't sound fair for the survivors
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Oh. Camping removes any chasing of that survivor. Chasing is as much as a killer objective as killing survivors is. Just as finishing generators is as much as an objective as opening the exitgate is.
"Geez man, you really think instadowns bypass killer's objetive ? Have you ever heard of hilbilly, one of the first killers to exist and have instadown basekit which is intended chase mechanic ?"
I mean, if we look at the game, they down survivors in 1 hit instead of 2. If they were left slugged, survivors need to heal 2 healthstates instead of just 1. Instadowns in the game is what started the "second chance" perks. So yes, if we're going to be technical about it that keys bypass objectives, then so do instadowns. Keys require you to sacrifice teammates. That is essentially sacrificing the escape objective of one survivor to finish the one of another.
"I would understand at least a little bit the comparison to tombstones or DH which both have very effective counters unlike keys"
Keys dont have effective counters. So Hoarders, Franklins, tunneling a keyholder to get rid of it ASAP all do not count as effective counters, when the effective counter of Devour is to find the totem before the killer gains the instadown ability and is capable of defending his totem while also defending any nearby gens? Or how tombstone can only be avoided by constantly hiding behind obstacles and hope the killer isnt smart enough to stop trying to stalk you and go for your teammates instead? I've had tombstone games with 3 stacks of PWYF and my t3 99'd before survivors were able to finish 3 gens, essentially getting me a 4k with no counters left in the game. Keys have more effective counters than DH and Tombstone.
And no, I am more like a devil's advocate where I like to put people who either think this game is a tournament level game or people who only care about the killer side in their place. I play both sides, have high winrates on both sides and could have even higher rates if I started playing sweaty. I simply do not care if I lose. People claiming *X thing that killer has is balanced but survivors having something comparable to X thing is not because in the 0.1% of all the games, there is nothing I can do as the killers I like to play* I just like to shut down. Same on the opposite side. Like survivors saying BT is too weak because killers have access to counting. But you're not one of those people. I am just attacking your logic. Doesnt mean I think keys are balanced, it just means that the argument of "survivors cannot have this" is BS.
And as for your first example: "Camping one of them giving others much easier time to do gens" only applies if there is comms or Kindred. Remove comms or Kindred, and suddenly, survivors will one by one investigate why their teammate is not being saved. Giving an easy kill as killer, and a much, MUCH easier time in hunting down the remaining survivors as gen speeds are nearly halved.
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You've put a lot of effort into this and I'd normally continue discussing this with rebuttals to your points but from reading it all it'd just lead nowhere, we both view fundementals of DBD too differently to ever find any common ground we could agree on.
I'll end this with just saying that you're free to view things the way you do but I can not agree with them at all.
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