Shape shifting Killers seriously
No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.
I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
Comments
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Because is sounds cool on paper… or would be scary in a movie…
but it would NOT work ingame! :P2 -
How about instead of shapeshifting into a survivor you can shapeshift into one of the other killers. It would be quite the plot twist because both survivor and killer would have to continue changing their playstyle.2
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@PhantomMask20763
@SurpriseSurprise
See those are good ideas. The killer one would be interesting but a little random.
Being able to change into debris would be amazing because I can be as small as a bunch of rocks and easily sneak up on the Survivor and man handle them off gen1 -
@SurpriseSurprise said:
Able to "shapeshift" into debris. Odd-colored grass in some maps, piles of papers/broken wood on others. While stationary any survivor that walks over you is insta-grabbed.While shifted, have no terror radius, or stain, but have reduced movement speed. This is what will be augmented with Addons.
Think of this killer as a Venom-like Trapper Trap that can move.
Imagine being a survivor being stalked by a slow-moving generator.
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@Countfunkular said:
2. How in God's name....Uh uh uh. Its "Entity's name".
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Tbh I feel Freddy could be the shape shifter1
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@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
People overestimate survive with friends groups..... dude.... its not rocket science, its just humans.
Humans are predictable. The main strength of survive with friends is communication. Even if they are playing the same game if you give the killer the power to make survivors second guess their communication you can easily pull off a killer who shape shifts by forcing survivors to separate with 1 power, then shape shifting with the other half of the power. Creating a penalty for being close together.There are 4 survivors all separated, if 1 person says Hey Jake is this you? By the time you have time to react it will be too late assuming you allow the killer to burst out of the clone and attack.
And assuming you escape the vision of the killer and can report the killers position, you have to go through the thought pattern of looking at who you SUSPECT is the fake, then asking "Hey jake is that you?" Then communicating to the team that you see a clone in X position. <--- Considering that information, as long as the killer has a power that makes working together as a group within close proximity of each other impossible, that killer can morph again before getting to the next target, thus making you have to recommunicate with your team and ask yet again "HEY DONNA IS THAT YOU?".And even considering all of that lets assume that SWF group says screw the call outs and checks to see if that cloned person is their team mate and just completely run from each other and stay away from each other, that means "YOU HAVE AN ENTIRE TEAM OF SURVIVE WITH FRIENDS PLAYERS PLAYING WITHOUT TEAMWORK" No more than 1 person on a gen, no more than 1 person going to save on a hook, NO MORE GOING NEAR OTHER SURVIVORS OUT OF FEAR IT COULD BE THE KILLER! <-------- THATS 1000 TIMES BETTER THAN RUIN!!!!
But how do you make it so survivors separate from each other?
Give the killer a secondary power that gives all survivors a heartbeat radius, and any survivors caught within another survivors heartbeat radius say 28 meters is exposed. <----- Forces all team mates to stay tf away from each other.6 -
I'd want to be a blob that can eat pallets and other crap like generators and slowly expand to swallow the entire map.
But it would have to be pink, like in the movie. And be afraid of cold....that way survivors would have no defense. GO AHEAD AND SHINE YOUR BRIGHTEST FLASHLIGHT, DWIGHT! IT WON'T SAVE YOU!!!0 -
@PigMainBigBrain said:
And even considering all of that lets assume that SWF group says screw the call outs and checks to see if that cloned person is their team mate and just completely run from each other and stay away from each other, that means "YOU HAVE AN ENTIRE TEAM OF SURVIVE WITH FRIENDS PLAYERS PLAYING WITHOUT TEAMWORK" No more than 1 person on a gen, no more than 1 person going to save on a hook, NO MORE GOING NEAR OTHER SURVIVORS OUT OF FEAR IT COULD BE THE KILLER! <-------- THATS 1000 TIMES BETTER THAN RUIN!!!!
Dude, are you kidding me?
You just described the core idea behind GEN RUSH!
Being on different gens each survivor working alone is the most efficient way to do the gens super fast.1 -
@PigMainBigBrain
O_o
I could kiss you right now you crazy son of a ######### you just figured out how to make a shape-shifting killer work and probably the only one on here who figured out how to make it work.
I was just going to post some speculation ideas and how to make it work but you pretty much hit it right on the head or at least how it should work.
Am I honest-to-god opinion the shape-shifting killer I thought could have a second power that could disrupt survivors vision. Allowing them to see their friends has a killer instead of you.
However the heartbeat idea is way better.
However certain perks like Bond might make this killer a little problematic. Perks only work another survivors not killers unless whatever or reading perk the survivors have also transfer over0 -
@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
I just want them to implement an agent from the IRS and that will get everyone screaming and running!
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I agree that Survive With Friends kills the idea of a Killer who shape-shifts into a Survivor.
The way to pull off a shape-shifting Killer, in my opinion, is to have it shape-shift into other Killers ("The Mimic?"). The transformation could be RNG-based (letting the game choose a random Killer for them to turn into), or it can be skill-based (the player(s) can memorize the order and switch to the appropriate Killer for the job).
However, if a player had the option to play all Killers during a single trial, why would they ever play a single Killer stand-alone? That, and which button do they push to transform? For these reasons, I think that the transformation should be out of their control. Maybe it happens once every 60 seconds, or maybe after each generator is completed.
Hmm...
* What happens if they are the Nurse and are charging a blink as the transformation happens?
* Can they teleport as the Wraith if traps they placed as the Hag are triggered?
* If they transform into the Shape, do they start out at Evil Within Tier 2 to make up for the lack of stalking time?Anyway, as far as spooking Survivors into not trusting their fellow Survivors, just have a perk that makes Survivors appear to be the Killer (or they have the Killer's terror radius attached to them). Other Survivors would have to witness them working on a generator or dropping a pallet before they could know for sure if they're trustworthy, (oh: or have voice chat. RIP -_-).
It could affect the last survivor hit; it could be a hex perk that affects all survivors who have been hit until the hex totem is cleansed; or it could be a much-needed buff to Hex: The Third Seal.
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I would approve of this only if I can hurl flaming skulls and scream fatality every time.PhantomMask20763 said:How about instead of shapeshifting into a survivor you can shapeshift into one of the other killers. It would be quite the plot twist because both survivor and killer would have to continue changing their playstyle.0 -
@Wolf74 said:
Dude, are you kidding me?
You just described the core idea behind GEN RUSH!
Being on different gens each survivor working alone is the most efficient way to do the gens super fast.Gen rushing is going to happen, it just is, unless you create a killer designed around gen control like pic or doc etc with build in gen protection you're gonna get rushed. The idea behind a shape shifter is just a different style choice for a stealth killer which requires survivors to stay separated from each other to pull off the best effect. Being separated isn't always a good thing even with survive with friends groups. For instance....if you're blind and can't see the person on the hook.... good luck trying to communicate which trash can or hay bale your body is strung up on should your team mates miss the queue or misnavigate on the way to your body. Blind as a status effect is incredibly underrated.
Now as far as adding gen control to a shape shifting killer you'd just have to use the tools you already have like ruin and thano and other stuff.
You know...now that I think about it this concept would be a badass freddy. Not sure of the details, but the concept would be epic.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Wolf74 said:
Dude, are you kidding me?
You just described the core idea behind GEN RUSH!
Being on different gens each survivor working alone is the most efficient way to do the gens super fast.Gen rushing is going to happen, it just is, unless you create a killer designed around gen control like pic or doc etc with build in gen protection you're gonna get rushed.
Ok, so you have no clue what gen rush is, huh?
You think "doing the objective" is already gen rush, ok, fine.1 -
@Wolf74
@PigMainBigBrain
Okay both of you calm down. This is supposed to be a discussion. Okay the Killer is not perfect because we're talking about a killer type that is very difficult to actually to actually make.
A gen rush in my opinion is when survivors recruit one of their own to do nothing but waste your time while the rest of them just do the objective.
However we're talking about a stealth killer that's main job is to destroy communication completely and to make survivor second guess. What we need is chaos. Something to get them off the objective.
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The only way I could see it having any chance of working is if it made everyone see the killer as a different survivor and/ or made survivors see each other as OTHER survivors.
SWF would still be able to see through it, but that would delay it at least a little bit.
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Because they OP?
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@Countfunkular said:
@PigMainBigBrain
O_o
I could kiss you right now you crazy son of a ######### you just figured out how to make a shape-shifting killer work and probably the only one on here who figured out how to make it work.I was just going to post some speculation ideas and how to make it work but you pretty much hit it right on the head or at least how it should work.
Am I honest-to-god opinion the shape-shifting killer I thought could have a second power that could disrupt survivors vision. Allowing them to see their friends has a killer instead of you.
However the heartbeat idea is way better.
However certain perks like Bond might make this killer a little problematic. Perks only work another survivors not killers unless whatever or reading perk the survivors have also transfer over
These are a few survivor perks that should be considered with a disguised killer.
Alert - depends whether or not they can break things while disguised.
Dark Sense - would their aura be revealed even when disguised? Imagine someone with Dark Sense repairing a generator with another survivor when suddenly your teammate's aura glows.
Object of Obsession - would the killer have aura protection when disguised?
Premonition - would it chime when disguised?
Spine Chill - would it activate when looking at a survivor while disguised?
Bond - would a disguised killer show up as a teammate?
Empathy - would the killer be able to fake an injury to fool survivors into healing them and gain a token for something devious?
Kindred - when disguised, would the killer be able to see the other survivor's auras? Though it would be suspect when suddenly another aura shows up because you shouldn't be able to hook while disguised.
Wake Up - when disguised, would the killer see the Exit Gates opened?This would all depend on how far the devs want to go with a disguising killer. When disguised:
Would they shift to third person view as long as they are disguised?
Could they pull pallets down and vault over them just like the survivors can?
Would they be able to break pallets while disguised?
Could they vault as fast as survivors?
Could they run, walk, and crouch at the same speed as survivors?
Would they be able to work on generators? To what extent?
Enable the animation, but no progress or skill checks are made? Enable progress and allow the killer to fail skill checks (or even succeed skill checks to set the generator back down)?
Would they be able to kick generators while disguised?
Could a disguised killer heal a survivor and gain a token for something else? Could they fake heal survivors to where they look and act healed, but when the killer reveals themselves, the survivor becomes injured?0 -
@Countfunkular said:
@Wolf74
@PigMainBigBrainOkay both of you calm down. This is supposed to be a discussion. Okay the Killer is not perfect because we're talking about a killer type that is very difficult to actually to actually make.
A gen rush in my opinion is when survivors recruit one of their own to do nothing but waste your time while the rest of them just do the objective.
However we're talking about a stealth killer that's main job is to destroy communication completely and to make survivor second guess. What we need is chaos. Something to get them off the objective.
Well if you consider the current healing changes (this has literally been some of the most difficult ######### I've played against as survivor) things are starting to spiral out of control real fast the more people get injured. Things like sloppy butcher+thano or sloppy + caulrophobia are destroying people. Self Care feels like doing a generator under those debuffs. Considering those changes survivors are gonna want to team up more just to heal each other, but even by getting healed by a team member without things like we'll make it you're gonna feel that. So with healing becoming another objective within itself, and considering communication, it would still be wise to add some kind of penalty for survivors to be in proximity of each other. And you could create many things with the power that would make "grouping" bad. (especially since you pretty much have to group to heal if you get these debuffs stacking)
Penalties for grouping?
Auras revealed when survivors are within X meters of each other
Healing reduced when survivors are within X meters of each other.
Exposed when survivors are within X meters of each other.
Hindered when survivors are within X meters of each other.
Pink add on? Blind when survivors are outside of X meters of each other.All these things could push survivors away from each other without even considering other mechanics like gens. Which I'm pretty sure if devs want to address gen rushing they could do it another way like they have with the healing reduction. But I've mained pig long enough to know bad it is, and unless you can quickly begin new chases ala nurse or baby nurse aka spirit, cover half the map ala billy, sabotage objective completion while having moderate time between chases ala doc, or add series's of objectives via pig, you're gonna have a hard time vs gen completion time. And I mean I feel bad for the other killers who don't have those forms of gen control, but the point of this thread is to address a style of stealth mechanic which is pretty much what doppelgangers are. Getting into the nitty gritty of how to enhance said stealth mechanic or what add ons could be useful in slowing the progression of the game along with stealth is another story. But you already have a killer who semi does both of these things at once with stealth being about the second lowest end of the spectrum from killers available. So whatever a shapeshifters kit is, it has to be different enough from Pig or Wraith, or Freddy so that the killers aren't clones of each other.
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@Wolf74 said:
@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Wolf74 said:
Dude, are you kidding me?
You just described the core idea behind GEN RUSH!
Being on different gens each survivor working alone is the most efficient way to do the gens super fast.Gen rushing is going to happen, it just is, unless you create a killer designed around gen control like pic or doc etc with build in gen protection you're gonna get rushed.
Ok, so you have no clue what gen rush is, huh?
You think "doing the objective" is already gen rush, ok, fine.Gen Rushing, Camping, Tunneling, are all made up arbitrary rules by survivors and killers to identify or justify a means of playstyle, nothing more, nothing less except our emotional attachment to the results of said styles vs the overall balance of the game. Its the same logic behind "Using decisive strike is TOXIC!" Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean its the survivors way of being "mean" to you. And just because you don't want to counter it or address the fundamental mechanics of why said skill or game mechanic is imbalanced doesn't mean that any and all use of said tactic or skill suddenly makes the person using it the devil.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Wolf74 said:
@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Wolf74 said:
Dude, are you kidding me?
You just described the core idea behind GEN RUSH!
Being on different gens each survivor working alone is the most efficient way to do the gens super fast.Gen rushing is going to happen, it just is, unless you create a killer designed around gen control like pic or doc etc with build in gen protection you're gonna get rushed.
Ok, so you have no clue what gen rush is, huh?
You think "doing the objective" is already gen rush, ok, fine.Gen Rushing, Camping, Tunneling, are all made up arbitrary rules by survivors and killers to identify or justify a means of playstyle, nothing more, nothing less except our emotional attachment to the results of said styles vs the overall balance of the game. Its the same logic behind "Using decisive strike is TOXIC!" Just because you don't like it, doesn't mean its the survivors way of being "mean" to you. And just because you don't want to counter it or address the fundamental mechanics of why said skill or game mechanic is imbalanced doesn't mean that any and all use of said tactic or skill suddenly makes the person using it the devil.
Like I said, you just show how clueless you are by comparing apples and oranges.
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@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
People overestimate survive with friends groups..... dude.... its not rocket science, its just humans.
Humans are predictable. The main strength of survive with friends is communication. Even if they are playing the same game if you give the killer the power to make survivors second guess their communication you can easily pull off a killer who shape shifts by forcing survivors to separate with 1 power, then shape shifting with the other half of the power. Creating a penalty for being close together.There are 4 survivors all separated, if 1 person says Hey Jake is this you? By the time you have time to react it will be too late assuming you allow the killer to burst out of the clone and attack.
And assuming you escape the vision of the killer and can report the killers position, you have to go through the thought pattern of looking at who you SUSPECT is the fake, then asking "Hey jake is that you?" Then communicating to the team that you see a clone in X position. <--- Considering that information, as long as the killer has a power that makes working together as a group within close proximity of each other impossible, that killer can morph again before getting to the next target, thus making you have to recommunicate with your team and ask yet again "HEY DONNA IS THAT YOU?".And even considering all of that lets assume that SWF group says screw the call outs and checks to see if that cloned person is their team mate and just completely run from each other and stay away from each other, that means "YOU HAVE AN ENTIRE TEAM OF SURVIVE WITH FRIENDS PLAYERS PLAYING WITHOUT TEAMWORK" No more than 1 person on a gen, no more than 1 person going to save on a hook, NO MORE GOING NEAR OTHER SURVIVORS OUT OF FEAR IT COULD BE THE KILLER! <-------- THATS 1000 TIMES BETTER THAN RUIN!!!!
But how do you make it so survivors separate from each other?
Give the killer a secondary power that gives all survivors a heartbeat radius, and any survivors caught within another survivors heartbeat radius say 28 meters is exposed. <----- Forces all team mates to stay tf away from each other.And I have to say you underestimate humans - they will just come up with a subtle signal to each other, like point before you approach or do a 360 before you approach another member.
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@PigMainBigBrain
@Wolf74
Okay I'll say it again both of you calm down.
Has for of the phrase Gen Rush.
Unless there's some sort of Wikipedia article of some sort giving a universal phrase we can all agree with.
It's just going to mean that the match lasted less than 5 minutes because one person distracted you while three others literally did nothing but the objective of the game. In this scenario the Killer isn't going to get anyone unless they have an endgame build that involves around no one escapes death.
Can we please get back to what this thread is about and wolf if you think rushing is going to happen then please explain what you think a shape-shifting killer could possibly do to avoid this
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@Countfunkular said:
Can we please get back to what this thread is about and wolf if you think rushing is going to happen then please explain what you think a shape-shifting killer could possibly do to avoid this
Nothing. Beside the usual anti gen rush perks. He can jumpscare one survivor at a time and that's it, like any other stealth killer.
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The shapeshifting idea hits soloplayers hard and SWF will just communicate their way out of that power.
Also the all survivors within heartbeat are exposed would be ######### overpowered especially on a 3gen strat or stuff like TheGame.
Can people stop suggesting the shapeshift crap? Heck I even read somebody who wanted to make the killer basically a trap, what "exctiting gameplay"
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@MhhBurgers said:
The shapeshifting idea hits soloplayers hard and SWF will just communicate their way out of that power.Also the all survivors within heartbeat are exposed would be [BAD WORD] overpowered especially on a 3gen strat or stuff like TheGame.
Can people stop suggesting the shapeshift crap? Heck I even read somebody who wanted to make the killer basically a trap, what "exctiting gameplay"
Actually, while a shape-shifting killer would not work very well in terms of it's power being to turn into a survivor. How about instead we get something that's like Venom. Being able to change parts of it's body and set goo-like traps around the map that will slow the survivors as they pass through it. It could be able to change it's arm into an extremely long blade with a longer lunge range. It's just people want the whole killer turns into a survivor thing instead of thinking about the other possibilities it could have.
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@darktrix said:
@PigMainBigBrain said:
@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
People overestimate survive with friends groups..... dude.... its not rocket science, its just humans.
Humans are predictable. The main strength of survive with friends is communication. Even if they are playing the same game if you give the killer the power to make survivors second guess their communication you can easily pull off a killer who shape shifts by forcing survivors to separate with 1 power, then shape shifting with the other half of the power. Creating a penalty for being close together.There are 4 survivors all separated, if 1 person says Hey Jake is this you? By the time you have time to react it will be too late assuming you allow the killer to burst out of the clone and attack.
And assuming you escape the vision of the killer and can report the killers position, you have to go through the thought pattern of looking at who you SUSPECT is the fake, then asking "Hey jake is that you?" Then communicating to the team that you see a clone in X position. <--- Considering that information, as long as the killer has a power that makes working together as a group within close proximity of each other impossible, that killer can morph again before getting to the next target, thus making you have to recommunicate with your team and ask yet again "HEY DONNA IS THAT YOU?".And even considering all of that lets assume that SWF group says screw the call outs and checks to see if that cloned person is their team mate and just completely run from each other and stay away from each other, that means "YOU HAVE AN ENTIRE TEAM OF SURVIVE WITH FRIENDS PLAYERS PLAYING WITHOUT TEAMWORK" No more than 1 person on a gen, no more than 1 person going to save on a hook, NO MORE GOING NEAR OTHER SURVIVORS OUT OF FEAR IT COULD BE THE KILLER! <-------- THATS 1000 TIMES BETTER THAN RUIN!!!!
But how do you make it so survivors separate from each other?
Give the killer a secondary power that gives all survivors a heartbeat radius, and any survivors caught within another survivors heartbeat radius say 28 meters is exposed. <----- Forces all team mates to stay tf away from each other.And I have to say you underestimate humans - they will just come up with a subtle signal to each other, like point before you approach or do a 360 before you approach another member.
+1 but whats to stop the killer from doing the same thing? Assuming you allowed it to transform fully into a survivor granting it emote use with kbd 1, 2, etc? Controls between killer and survivor are pretty much identical with the exception of M1 M2, E, and CTRL (pig) having conditional use with 1 and 2 for emote use. I don't think it would be that hard to code that kind of shift. Imagine how crazy it would be if you saw a Meg you weren't sure of was your team mate making the call over emote at you and it turned out to be the killer? Or if you're on voice coms telling the person you're approaching "ITS ME" but the person you approached is a killer mocking gen repair. By this point, you're already within visual range.... and for any killer thats more than enough by itself.
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Okay everybody it's been awhile but let's still be honest a shape-shifting killer would get destroyed and survive with friends and wouldn't be very efficient and solo play0
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So that we can have someone weaker than Fred boi.Countfunkular said:I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.
No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.
I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
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@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
Because the people that are asking for it don't play killer (or atleast don't play killer seriously)
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@Dragonredking said:
Because the people that are asking for it don't play killer (or atleast don't play killer seriously)
Rank 1 leatherface here, would totally love a shapeshifting or doppleganger type killer. >_>
It could work, I think, if creating a lobby with the shapeshifting killer only allowed three person swf groups, and gave the killer the same character model as the survivor that randomly joined the lobby. Although, I imagine 4-man SWF groups would complain about that.
It's not very realistic, but it's fun to dream.
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It would be pretty cool to shape shift your self on a hook then snatch some one when they came for the save. Still much like much of the game SWF kinda sinks da boat.
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Shapeshifting could work if not for the dozens of aura reading and detection perks. Just Spine Chill and Bond would break such a killer, unless they somehow revisit all said perks (and future ones) around it, which is a similar situation of old Tinkerer, which got reworked because it was too work for too little.
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@Countfunkular said:
Okay everybody it's been awhile but let's still be honest a shape-shifting killer would get destroyed and survive with friends and wouldn't be very efficient and solo playEverything gets destroyed by SWF except Nurse, Billy and Spirit who have the most optimal chase end times in the game. But I think we alaso overestimate SWF even at rank 1... some of these survivors at rank 1 even in an SWF team full of rank 1s are not all there sometimes. Like we really give waaaay too much credit to survivors and not enough credit to killers. Some killers obviously can't hang ala (pours one out for the boy Freddy) But some killers who are even considered trash tier like Leatherface can still demolish SWF groups.....
So why are we always painting SWF as some monster that can't be destroyed? When in essence SWF gives the survivors a permanent 2 perk advantage through a permanent bond, and a permanent kindred. Both of which are perks that as a killer have never slowed me down in the slightest.....
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@Countfunkular said:
I'm sorry but can someone please explain to me why it is some people still want shape-shifting killers. Seriously, I don't get it why would you want a particular killer that's main Power is useless if they're dealing with a group of Survive with friends.No I won't lie the concept is pretty cool but the execution is flawed in more ways than one.
1. You have to have another power on top of already being able to shape-shift.
2. How in God's name would you control your power to change into another Survivor of your choice.
3. Surprise won't mean much once they figure out what you are.I'm sorry but I don't get it...care to explain
To a degree, this already exists in the game, just without the "shape-shifting" cosmetic.
Myers at T1 is very slow, but has a very small terror radius. As he Tiers up, the terror radius, speed, and killing power all increase. The only difference between this and the possible execution of a shape-shifting killer is that Myers doesn't change the way he looks, aside from lifting his knife up into the air.
The Doctor moves between "stances" regularly, where he can shock in one stance and hit in the other. Again, all he's missing is a change in his cosmetic to be a shape-shifting killer.
The Pig can crouch and obtain stealth, or stand for increased speed and killing. Yet again, only missing a change in cosmetic between two distinct characteristics.
There are others, but hopefully you get the idea. Having a character with multiple abilities, and characteristics, is hardly unheard of in DBD. Furthermore, the game engine is already primed for a killer who can take on the appearance of a survivor.
Think about the Doctor and the Spirit: it doesn't matter which cosmetic option you chose, when the husk is left behind, or the false doctors appear in front of a survivor, they match the actual killer's cosmetics. Taken in reverse, it's certainly not unthinkable that a killer could take on the appearance of a survivor on the map, or to take on that appearance after he's killed a survivor. Which, based on the small reveal of the killer so far, I don't think is what is coming up, but it's certainly doable.
I actually think it's a really neat idea to add some real fear back into the game. If you're working on a gen and see Claudette running up, do you stay on the gen and vulnerable to her, or do you run away and look silly when she turns out to be another survivor? Never mind when people run 4 pizza-boy Dwight's in a match, and all the sudden there's a fifth of you! Who's the real killer?
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-Some (invisible?) debuff that makes Evers survivor See every other survivor as random survivor.
(Ofc survivor shouldn't be able to notice it easily theyre not themselves)
-Immunity to detection stuft while in disguise, vor decoys to trick those detections
-something that hurts survivor after successful ambushes from disguises (debuffs, "paranoia/madness")
(Killer group repair generators explode into tentacles for damage as an op example)
- some other kind of debuff/etc that forces survivor interaction, so that killer disguise doesnt geht useless.
That'd be some conditions a shapeshifter needs to be partially viable.0 -
You know, we are probably getting a killer next patch that will be as close to a shape shifter as we will ever get so... BHVR listened to them?0
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@thekiller490490
Honestly is this next Killers going to be a shapeshifter I might have to rethink a lot of things in my gaming life1 -
I would rather a shapeshifting game mode where you change into your different killers after awhile.But the other is an appeal to see if one could execute it good. With the dbd framework probally be hard to make that possible. Deceit is a game that is built around this concept. So they could just itch that scratch with that.
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Wow this new killer is not a shape-shifter sorry to disappoint you0
