What's your simple buffs that would make killers more fun/viable to go against and play?
Now this isn't a thread about nerf's. this is a thread about buffs, that would make killers feel more fun, or viable to play in the game. More so quality of life then outright "give spirit a glock"
Things like "Hillbilly should have his heat meter reduced upon a successful chainsaw" - or - Huntress/deathslinger/trickster should be 115% speed when out of ammo to encourage regular chasing outside of power usage etc etc.
I'm curious to hear peoples changes they'd make, that could be either easily added to the game, or would be so simple as to just, make playing killer feel more fluid to play. Global killer changes are also fair game as well! Want to be able to see when a survivor is on death hook on the Hud? Killer fov changes (within reasonable limitations?)
Comments
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Myers is 110% in tier 1.
Ghostface has lower power recovery than 30 seconds.
First pig trap removal attempt always fails.
Brown trapper bag basekit.
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Here's a general change that would make the game more fun for both sides.
Killers in order to be "viable" currently have to have extremely strong chase potential in order to keep up with how fast gens are right now. This leads to "un-fun" 1v1 interactions for survivors (short chases).
Instead of making killers strong enough to keep up with objective speeds, lets instead slow objective speeds down.
In other words lets make it so killers and survivors can enjoy those long chases without it costing them the entire game. This leads to much more fun interactions.
People hate some of the stronger killers because they can down you so fast and with little interaction but currently the game goes so fast that those downing speeds are required if they want a chance at winning. Let's just make those speeds not required.
IE instead of strengthening killers to the "unfun" levels required to be competitive, just slow the game down instead.
For context I'm using "viable" as against "good" survivors, not average rank 1 matches.
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I feel the biggest issue with killers is gen speeds and the ability to apply pressure. I don't think it's even possible to adjust gen times to be fair for all killers. What would be good for a M1 killer would be broken on a billy or a spirit. Which is why I think we need some sort of program that reads the flow of the match and adjusts things accordingly. Like "The Director" in L4D.
To make killer viable I would adjust the gen times depending on what killer your up against and how well they are doing. Low mobility killers get a little more repair time. High mobility killers stay the same.
At the start of a game. If the killer is chasing someone than the other 3 receive a slight penalty to repair speed. I feel the very beginning of the match is the most important part. When the killer is chasing someone and the other 3 are free to repair. I was hoping the devs would introduce that early game warm up idea but I don't expect it anytime soon.
If 3 gens popped before the killer hooked 1 person the remaining gens take a bit longer. Vice versa. If the killer has 2 people on the hook or dead. Gens go by faster. It never made sense to me how the survivors can complete 3/5s their objective in the time it takes a killer to complete 1/12 theirs and the devs think that's balanced.
A slight QoL I mentioned in other threads. If I have multiple Hex perks, as the killer, I would like to be able to tell which totem is assigned to which hex. Say Haunted Grounds+Devour Hope. So I know which ones to let go and which to protect.
Last I would add a swf indicator "at the score screen" not before. It's pretty obvious if we could tell it's a swf in the lobby most killers would back out. I don't see the harm in telling us it was a swf after the match is over. If I got my ass handed to me I wouldn't feel as bad if I knew it was a 4 man swf.
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Any kind of buff towards Trickster. Being so slow and ineffective is a pain to killer mains and survivor mains since being weak encourages area camping. Everyone would benefit.
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Trickster - lower the amount needed to remove health state. It’s ok on PC rn but on controller it’s hot garbage and he needs to be balanced around controller. I buff he’s speed to 115 until he starts to actively throw knives.
plague - instead of having to go across the map to get her corrupt power, make it a sort of teleport ability to where she can summon it wherever she is. If survivors cleanse, they shouldn’t have the power to waste more time.
Legion - I would like a secondary ability like clown has but with different ability. Something that maybe represents Julie.
Spirit - Add a sound for ppl in her tr when she activates her power(not the one she uses when phases but something to let survivors know she activated it)
Pig - more boxes instead of 4 and make them similar to trappers traps so they don’t get it on the first go.
Myers - 110 in tier 1, 2 seconds of stalk to get tier 2, not running out of stalk permanently on a survivor, have it come back after x amount t of time. I’d also boost his speed to Trapper speed in tier 3.
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Myers having 110% movement speed in Tier 1. Still Undetectable and has a short lunge. Basline Scratched Mirror, but limited to 16m. No Bloodlust. Stealth/Hit and Run playstyle.
Myers Tier 2: 10% increased action speed on everything, not just vaulting. Still 16m Terror Radius. Normal Lunge. Normal semi Stealthy m1 killer.
Myers Tier 3: Lasts 60 seconds. 20% increased action speed on everything, not just 15% vault speed. 32m Terror radius. Extended Lunge, and 120% movement speed. Fast Chase, High Risk killer
New Addons to support all 3 playstyles.
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50 megaton nuclear bomb.
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great changes!
the problem with that is that slowing down objective times, ultimately comes down to the arugement of slowing down gens. and 80's already feels slow enough with gen regression perks on the table. imo opinion, i think that once the hatch changes come through, that depending on the amount of survivors left alive, exit gates should have increased time to open (ie 4 survivors left alive, the exit gate is 40s instead of 20, with each survivor decreasing exit gate timers upon death. remember me would need to be rebalanced, but if done right, this could allow for extra pressuring of gate's as an additonal objective. - other things could factor into gate times depending on how long the match took as well. ie if the generators sped by incredibly fast (ie if the generators were powered in > 5 minutes, it takes longer to open, but not if the generators were "protected" ( < 5 minutes.) this would allow for killer's to emit pressure if they had a poor early game, whilst still allowing survivors the ability to speed through gens if not adequetly protected
I can deffinately agree to removing the stalking limit. that seems rather silly having ghostface in the game now. atleast have it regenerate over time so that only individual survivors are dry at any one point. - making him 120% in t3 isn't a bad change, but i think they should rebalance t1 instead and make it more powerful with him being 110% speed personally or even 115% with the small lunge. it would allow him to be a permanent stealth ghostace, or he could choose to tier up upon finding a survivor in order to get some nasty tier 3 potential. (tier 1 either small lunge and big speed, or big speed and small lunge
yes
Imo plagues already in a good place, but if we did give her additional abilities as such, i'd prefer she *move to the fountain*, instead. would save on travel time, but still allow for strategic cleansing from survivors as counter play.
on legion - Absolutely. if anything i would prefer for the ability to be split in two with addons. basekit legion works as normal, but addons adjust him to be a more lethal killer and less of a slowdown, gaining his power slowly and being able to unleash it like oni to go slashing for downs temporarily. like freddy pallets only useful! also having his basekit be more fun for both sides and less just mending simulator.
Spirit - i'd prefer for her husk to no longer be left behind actually. if you see her dissapear you know she's phasing. not immediately having it dissapear though, after a second or two. would also allow for her to have a higher skill cap as you could hide your body behind a wall rather then at a pallet, and make a survivor guess on whether or not you've phased or if your waiting behind the wall.
Pig - i think she just need's less rng to her kit. box's shouldn't be so far on a variety of maps, and she needs to never have someone get them off on the first go. - also no aura reading before activate, and possibly no allowing of searching boxes until they activate.
Yeah this is how i'd do it. that or make him even 115% speed in tier 1. there's no real reason stealth killers should have a detriment to their speed in stealth (ie pig or myers) if they already have detriments to their attacks (small lunge and charge for pig dash/exiting stealth for her.)
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i would increase myers to 130% movespeed, until he's within 32m of a survivor or unfinished generator or powered exit gate and remove his shirt
i would make trickster a 115% movespeed killer and make it so you have to "mend" to remove his knives instead of them just decaying
i would make nurse unable to shorten her blinks by aiming down
i would make hag traps removable by smearing them with your hands
i would put a little hat on victor 🤠
i would make trapper able to carry 3 traps as basekit, and make escaping one singular interaction which is longer but guaranteed to succeed and remove his shirt
i would revert freddy's rework because the older version of him offered a playstyle that no longer exists and i miss it, he's boring now (maybe keep the "sleep on hit" effect and make him unable to down awake survivors)
i would give ghostface this mask
i would give spirit a second to swing after phasing and then make her fatigue like nurse
i would make blight break pallets on his first rush instead of having to bounce first
i would make demogorgon wear pants
i would make oni suck blood from the survivor themselves like stalking instead of getting it from those droplets because i think they're kind of unfun when they're used to locate people and also remove his shirt
i don't play hillbilly nor do i see him played so i have nothing to say about him
doctor is fine
i would make legion be able to switch between frank and julie by jumping into a locker. what does julie do that's different? who knows...
i would make plague go to the doctor
fine, charlotte can also have a little hat to go on top of her existing hat 🤠
i would make huntress hum different things depending on what content is coming next. seriously, i think if instead of dropping a twitter trailer they simply had her hum
i would make clown officially celebrate fingers sunday as part of his lore
i would have to put a lot of thought into how to change pig to reduce RNG without necessarily stripping her of flavour, a lot more thought than a goofy post in this kind of thread is demanding of me.
i would make deathslinger be able to shoot people who are channeling keys, but in exchange he is now 100% speed and no longer owns any shirts
i would make pyramid head lose his pants, actually, not his shirt.
i would make bubba a 110% killer because i feel like he should chase a little bit longer. also no shirt.
think that's everyone... 👼
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Remove bloodlust, to buff people's skill
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How long is a long chase for you? Imo long chases are boring. Chases are interesting if you need to outplay the killer every few seconds. Like on unsafer pallets where you need to fake a vault or you need to stun the killer to get away. But currently a bad killer can get a easy hit with bloodlust in this structures. Safe loops should be rare and you would need to think when to use them in a match. So i want to create slower matches with more killer lethality which slow gens down.
Another problem with long chases are that 3 survivor need to wait and hold m1. So while i have no problem with doing gens, i dont like matches right now where i need to do 3 gens (240sec). And personally i prefer matches which take 10-15min.
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"the problem with that is that slowing down objective times, ultimately comes down to the arugement of slowing down gens. and 80's already feels slow enough with gen regression perks on the table. imo opinion, i think that once the hatch changes come through, that depending on the amount of survivors left alive, exit gates should have increased time to open (ie 4 survivors left alive, the exit gate is 40s instead of 20, with each survivor decreasing exit gate timers upon death. remember me would need to be rebalanced, but if done right, this could allow for extra pressuring of gate's as an additonal objective. - other things could factor into gate times depending on how long the match took as well. ie if the generators sped by incredibly fast (ie if the generators were powered in > 5 minutes, it takes longer to open, but not if the generators were "protected" ( < 5 minutes.) this would allow for killer's to emit pressure if they had a poor early game, whilst still allowing survivors the ability to speed through gens if not adequetly protected"
I don't this it necessarily comes down to increasing the 80 seconds of a gen per say. I was thinking more through extra objectives, an "early game collapse", smaller map sizes, etc. Things like that.
Longer gates is one of those options as you mentioned as well. I like the sliding scale gate time based on survivors alive. I also think we need gate regression when not being worked on as well.
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"How long is a long chase for you?"
In order for you to have a chance at winning against good survivors chases need to be <20 seconds tops. Hit or pallet in that time and then you rotate pressure. Longer than that and you're losing the game. Even then, you can still lose through objective time even when you're at sub 20 seconds if they're really efficient.
"Imo long chases are boring. Chases are interesting if you need to outplay the killer every few seconds. Like on unsafer pallets where you need to fake a vault or you need to stun the killer to get away."
The average community disagrees with this. Most players enjoy long chases. Long being greater than 20 seconds.
"But currently a bad killer can get a easy hit with bloodlust in this structures."
Bringing this up is completely irrelevant. The time it takes to gain bloodlust is losing you the game, so if they are actually bloodlusting you for hits they're throwing the game away for it. Bloodlusting is not a viable strat. IE not worth mentioning.
"Safe loops should be rare and you would need to think when to use them in a match."
I agree, they're currently way too prevalent.
"So i want to create slower matches with more killer lethality which slow gens down."
You're wanting to double dip.
Our options are either increasing killer lethality to keep up with gen speeds or slowing the game down so they don't need to be as lethal to compete. You're wanting both?
"Another problem with long chases are that 3 survivor need to wait and hold m1. So while i have no problem with doing gens, i dont like matches right now where i need to do 3 gens (240sec). And personally i prefer matches which take 10-15min."
That's understandable. That's part of why I think the "slowing the game down" should be with extra objectives that make "doing gens" more interesting and fun than it currently is.
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I'm not a Killer main mostly because, I don't find it to be fun. It feels like an anxiety attack.
I've thought for a while that DBD needs another mechanic to give the Killer some breathing room. I suppose totems kind of help but mostly survivors will just gen rush unless Ruin is up.
I'm not really sure what, but some side mechanic that can distract away from generators and hooks.
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Long chases are for the majority of the community only possible if they are that safe that the killer needs to absolutely outplay the survivor. (Example: a hit at a shack with pallet.) That would mean loops which are so strong that the killer should focus on forcing the pallet drop. But then its only a ressource management simulator like its currently on some maps with only strong pallets. Or you let the loops like they are now, but then bad survivor would absolutely destroyed bc they would need to go on long chases bc they need more time for gens but they just cant do it.
I brought bloodlust up bc a killer who depends on it makes for a boring chase. He will lose the game, but they will not care. Camping shows that. So my idea with weaker pallets would make the game boring if bloodlust stays and before someone comes again and say my idea is stupid bc bloodlust, i will say it myself.
I want slower gens created with killer lethality. Not slower gens by default. What that means is that if a killer get hooks gen slows down. So it isnt a waste to hook a person midmatch for the first time instead of tunneling. But i still want a mechanic which slows gens down at the start, so the killer has a chance to build up pressure. So the killer should get more time if he does good and shouldnt have more time by default. And for the increased lethality its more like a buff for the weaker killer. The majority of pallets shouldnt be so strong that you need a power to ignore pallets to get survivor quick enough. I shouldnt be able to loop at shack then hold w to a short wall long wall and hold w back to shack while the myers in T3 can only break the pallets and follow me.
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"I want slower gens created with killer lethality. Not slower gens by default. What that means is that if a killer get hooks gen slows down. So it isnt a waste to hook a person midmatch for the first time instead of tunneling. But i still want a mechanic which slows gens down at the start, so the killer has a chance to build up pressure. So the killer should get more time if he does good and shouldnt have more time by default. And for the increased lethality its more like a buff for the weaker killer. The majority of pallets shouldnt be so strong that you need a power to ignore pallets to get survivor quick enough. I shouldnt be able to loop at shack then hold w to a short wall long wall and hold w back to shack while the myers in T3 can only break the pallets and follow me."
Oh well you're talking about something completely different now. You're not talking about killer lethality your talking about an entirely new mechanic. Btw the lethality you're talking about is something akin to Spirit levels and the lethality she has is completely hated by lots of the community. You can say what they hate is the counter play component but then you lower lethality if you gave her more counter play than she already has.
I agree with your other points about loops. Most the loops in the game are way too safe and not balanced 50/50 to where the better mind game wins. Most loops are essentially so safe that as you mentioned, in order to meet the time standards for winning you have to have a power that ignores them.
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I think Pyramid would be closer to the amount of lethality then spirit.
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PH loses vs good survivors. I also don't think most survivors find PH fun to play against either for similar reasons to why they hate DS.
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Problem with the Trickster change is if you try to balance his power for controllers it becomes increasingly more unbalanced with keyboard and mouse. He and a few other killers need completely new controller-specific mechanics (implementing gyro aiming with joycons/dualsense on consoles would be a start. You can do it on PC and it feels pretty great if you set it up correctly)
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- Spine Chill no longer detects Myer's Tier 1 again. In another discussion someone mentioned to make it so Spine Chill doesn't detect stealth killers when they are using their power. I would like to see that change on the PTB or at least make it so the Spine Chill warning is like 20m or something.
- Killers get a hook counter like survivors.
- Bring back swiching killers in lobby.
- Trapper Bag is base kit for Trapper (adjust add ons accordingly).
- I would like to see some love for Pig. Maybe get rid of the limited vision when she is in crouch. I also think giving her 5 traps base kit would be nice.
- This one is probably going to be hated but make BBQ base kit. Its the best perk to incentives leaving the hook and it has multiple counters so its not too op.
Thats all I can think of for now ^^
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Trapper - Bigger bag by default.
Wraith - Either no footsteps when invisible or make them sound the same as survivors. Also remove flashlights burning him.
Billy - Remove the heating mechanic.
Nurse - Fix her bugs.
Mikey - Needs a full rework.
Hag - Remove flashlights affecting her traps.
Doctor - Remove all the static people get in their screens, people with epilepsy have been struggling with it for so long.
Huntress - She cool.
Bubba - He cool.
Freddy - Too early to say.
Pig - Make her traps more consistent. Make her dash more powerful by maybe increasing speed. Make her speed when crouched same as survivors.
Clown - Anything to make him more fluid and lethal. Maybe let him throw bottles with less of a cooldown so he doesn't take two years to set up a play.
Spirit - Remove injured sounds when phasing. Give an indication on if she is phasing or not.
Legion - Reduce the stun he gets by a second, increase his frenzy speed to 150%.
Plague - She cool.
Ghostface - Reduce his ability cooldown to 15-20 seconds.
Demo - Too early to say. Maybe let him get indication when people are sealing a portal without any addons.
Oni - Give him something when he is in his normal mode, he is countered too heavily by survivors playing it safe from the start.
Deathslinger - Make it so he can't noscope and give him a way to pressure gens by default.
Pyramid Head - I don't know him very well
Blight - Fix his damn collisions and he will be fine.
Twins - Don't know him very well.
Trickster - Don't know him very well.
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Pyramid is almost always a threat in a chase. But he needs too much time to down, travel the map etc. So i think there need to be more ways to slow down gens, but only so much that a chase over a minute still hurts the killer a lot. So while Pyramid right now would lose the match against good survivor they still need to outplay him in a chase and are not safe. How fun such a killer is and whether he has counterplay or not are other problems. And frankly speaking idk how some killer abilities can be fun for survivor and still viable. (Deathslinger, Pyramid etc)
I could say a chase should only last around 40sec to be viable. But its not so easy bc how good a chase was depends on what did you interrupt, where did you chase, how many ressources did the survivor use etc.
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I mean if we're talking about adding new mechanics or features into the game that slow the gens down enough to where the A tier killers like PH can compete then sure that sounds fine.
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I am liking most of the suggestions for Mikey. I wish Bhvr would take note.
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I would give trickster the clown treatment where when he aims his knife he doesn’t lose movement speed he stays at 110% but when he starts throwing knifes then he’s slowed down
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Trapper get traps from the lockers (with a limit of course), stitched bag basekit.
Pig RBT activates when unhooked or healed (if survivor was slugged after a RBT is placed instead of hooked) instead of being activated when a gen is done.
Demogorgon Rat liver addon completely basekit, not only part of the bonus as happened in the last patch, it's still the best addon despite being common and still mandatory. I want more varied addons builds with demo.
Plague. When a survivor remove the infection in a pool of devotion when fully infected, he must stay injured (broken status removed, of course).
Calm Class 1 and Mouldy electrode basekit for doctor.
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I have a laundry list of changes for Legion. Not all of these have to be added, but some should be added in my opinion.
- Heavily decrease the penalty for missed Frenzy attacks. There is literally no reason for it since Frenzy isn't lethal. Make missed attacks perhaps take off 10% of the Frenzy timer, or about 1 second basekit.
- Slightly lower the post-Frenzy stun, and rework the post-Frenzy stun addons to do something completely different. Nothing too drastic, just lower it from 4 seconds to 3 so Survivors can't make as much distance.
- Faster movement speed during Feral Frenzy. If Legion can only run for 10 seconds, he should at least be really fast with that period of time, especially since Victor can run indefinitely at 150% movement speed while also having a much further delayed indication of being nearby. I think Legion being 150% during Frenzy, or maybe a ramp-up mechanic where they get faster as they land Frenzy hits, would be fine.
- Decrease or remove the loss of Feral Frenzy when landing a basic attack. Again, completely unnecessary due to how unthreatening Frenzy is. At minimum, it should be decreased to only losing 25% of the gauge.
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Not sure if this qualifies as a "simple" change, but I'd revert Freddy's power back to it's older version, with him keeping the teleport from Modern Freddy's power.
That'd certainly make him more fun in my opinion.
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- Trapper can carry two traps at base
- Wraith's uncloaking speed buffed to 1.8 m/s
- Myers moves 4.4 m/s in Tier 1 now
- Pig moves 4.0 m/s while crouched now
- Afterpiece Tonic buffed to 15% movement speed buff
- For each successful attack in Feral Frenzy, Legion's stun duration is reduced .5 seconds (up to 2 seconds)
- Demogorgon now takes 1.2 seconds to enter a portal
- Nightshroud takes 24 seconds to recover instead of 30
- Knife Wounds no longer decay without survivor interaction
- While Undetectable, Killers are 50% quieter
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In this state of game 90% of game maps are the problem. Some maps are to big, Some maps are palet paradise. Soma maps have very strong loops. Some maps have this 3 things.
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demo pants!!!!
victor hat!!!
these are all interesting ideas, and even keep within the simple theme except for maybe freddy. don't know if any of them are truly balanced but there all unique atleast and could work if done well!
tbh agree with all of this except billy. I don't like his billy overheat as much as the next billy main, but rather then take it out entirely (it does serve a purpose, it just does it way way too agressively) i'd prefer a "blood coolant effect" where upon a billy sawing a survivor will reduce the overheat significantly, allowing him to chain downs if he's good enough, but still stopping him from endlessly revving.
same
Honestly? not a bad idea for trapper. atleast in order to restock his traps/remove traps being unused around the map. should be a hard cap based on map (size wise) if it added additional traps, to prevent it getting out of hand with him taking a couple hundred traps out of a locker over time and trapping an entire map with resetting traps.
pig - completely agree. more activation conditions need to be added, to make traps more of a priority. i don't know if unhooks in the endgame should count though, but ultimately yes.
I disagree on demo's addon. it really doesn't add as much as anyone thinks it does imo, and he needs other addons to be altered instead. that being said its not as if rat liver isn't significant, i just think its uneccessary to make basekit, since all it does is give you absolutely no punishment for chasing with a held shred (where as of currently, he's hardly punished at all)
Plague.... im really not sure on this one. on the killer side, i don't like the free heal, but on the survivor side i really think its neccessary with how just touching a generator can make you permanently injured - that being said, i think absolutely, that if the survivor was damaged OUTSIDE of puke, ie from an m1, or being unhooked, that they shouldn't be granted a free heal.
doctor, completely agree with. mouldy electrode is too... comfortable to not use. the added distance isn't even a buff so much as it just makes him so much nicer to play, and whilst shocks are easier to hit and you can hit ones that wouldn't normally, it doesn't effect his base gameplay too much, so much as make him so much easier to play and get shocks with. same with calm, the delay on shocks can be very punishing if shocking incorrectly, which considering a shock only increases madness and stops actions, is a far lesser version of the clown bottle tbf.
Absolutely agree with these. unironically. if he's to remain a "non-lethal" power, killer. he should have reduced punishments for using his power. punishments for using a power incorrectly should correspond with the amount of lethality or value a power can inflict, and inflicting mend and chasing with feral frenzy ultimately isn't that valuable without stacked addons, and is only really useful against groups. His power in its current state needs more value (not neccessiraly in terms of downing a survivor) against a single person. tbf i'd also like to give the legion an oblivious status effect within basekit for survivors hit with a feral frenzy, expecially the first survivor hit. would make it harder to track him after using it.
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The only thing i disagree with is the wraith change, because currently his uncloaking speed is pretty good within loops, expecially when followed up with his post cloak rush. im not abject to it being changed, and it would make him so much nicer to play, but i don't also think it needs a buf fat the same time?
nightshroud by default should be 20-24s, with cooldown addons reducing less, and other addons doing entirely different effects. minimum cooldown should be 16s though, that seems fair.
iudwiudialhwd YES on the undetectable change. that would make the effect so much more noticeable and scarier to go against. could also tie it to oblivious too.
yeah maps need a bit of adjustment. a less simple change, but their adjusting based on feedback slowly. and im pretty sure some of the "worst" maps are being reworked soon too.
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