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There’s Still No FOV Slider, For Some Reason...
Still no FOV slider almost 5 years in for some reason.
This is a basic accessibility option, and prevent people such as myself from having motion sickness or headaches just from playing a match or two as killer.
The amount of random clutter on maps like Father Campbell’s Chapel and Autohaven that killer run into and get stuck on because it’s out of their extremely tiny FOV is also extremely aggravating.
Please add an FOV option and replace Shadowborn so people aren’t forced to use it to play killer.
Anticipated Arguments:
“Higher FOV eliminates survivor jukes like corner hiding, window techs, and spins.”
No, it doesn’t. It’ll be harder, but not impossible. Strats like these aren’t really essential to the gameplay anyways, and survivors still have many juking options.
”Don’t play killer.”
Or just increase the base FOV and more people would play killer.
”Killer FOV needs to be low or they would have too much information.”
Shadowborn exists and no one uses it unless they physically need to. Please don’t make the “Shadowborn OP” argument.
Comments
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Lots of people use shadowborn...
Huntress, Nurse, Hillbilly and Trickster players for example.
I doubt the devs will ever go back on their decision to have a fixed FOV, so my advice would be to move on unfortunately.
Use shadowborn if you really hate the FOV.
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Killers are supposed to have fixed FOV's. Thats why perks like Shadowborn and M&A exist
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”Killer FOV needs to be low or they would have too much information.”
Shadowborn exists and no one uses it unless they physically need to. Please don’t make the “Shadowborn OP” argument.
Shadowborn uses up a perk slot. If you could get Shadowborn for free just about every killer would use it. It's more than just a QoL feature because a wider FOV does give a distinct advantage while playing killer.
“Higher FOV eliminates survivor jukes like corner hiding, window techs, and spins.”
No, it doesn’t. It’ll be harder, but not impossible. Strats like these aren’t really essential to the gameplay anyways, and survivors still have many juking options.
I wouldn't say strats like these are essential, but they add lots of depth and variety to survivor gameplay. They are much more important to the game than killers having a wider FOV without using a perk for it and you unfortunately can't have both.
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Have you tried other methods of mitigating your motion sickness while playing killer, like sitting farther away from the screen and turning down graphics settings?
Most games nowadays, even competitive ones, have FOV sliders, but FOV sliders in a symmetrical game do not give one side an advantage. Adding a FOV slider would have balance implications in DBD because it is asymmetrical and only has a first-person camera on one side.
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Okay… colorblind mode is the most basic accessibility mode and we just got it. It took its time (and that was definitely too long) but we did finally get it.
they have stated year 5 will have more settings and accessibility options. Seen by struggle change.
FOV was obviously used in its current state for balancing and overall Gamestyle from the very beginning as you can see with Shadowborn, so it’s not as easy to just implement a slider into the game, it needs rebalancing.
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Did you seriously just use the argument I put in the post?
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The fixed FOV is part of the balance for this asymmetrical game.
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I can't believe people defend the horrible default FOV of killers in this game.
Even an ACTUAL competitive game like Counter Strike that never let you change the FOV, still has it big enough so that people don't get motion sickness.
Every argument against higher FOV is just dumb. It feels like some people have only played DBD in their life and nothing else.
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That's a different argument from what's being discussed here.
A bigger fixed FOV might be something to consider and they could tweak the Killer's accordingly for balance purposes.
A slider FOV is an instant no.
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If you’re on PC, you can use stretched res on killer and it basically does the same thing. There’s no guarantee the devs won’t remove it from the game down the line but it isn’t bannable as far as I know.
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Except this is not Counter-Strike. It's DBD, and it relies on it's FOV being a set thing.
To use your own comment: It's like you can't understand that this game uses its FOV as a gameplay mechanic, unlike Counter-Strike.
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The FOV for killer is doodoo and needs to be changed. idc about survivor this or killer that, the current FOV hurts my head and im sure it bothers other people physically as well, this is unacceptable. No one is asking for advantages they just want to comfortably play without it being physically painful. Shadowborn is clearly not op so I see no reason why it cannot be made the new base kit FOV and just change the perk to do something totally new.
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The killer's small fov is a deliberate design decision, as they are supposed to have a sort-of tunnel vision. It's also a balancing choice, allowing survivors to hide in their peripheral vision without getting seen.
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I dont even think many people want it to stay the way it is for ever. It’s just a fact that this game was built with this fixed FOV in mind and it’s not easily changeable. Doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be changed later on, but that it will take some work and time put into it.
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What do you expect them to do against third-party solutions like audio equalizers or filters, though? Are they going to start treating auto-banning people with something as benign and common as non-default NVidia control panel settings?
There is also a massive difference between BHVR not preventing people from exploiting something like stretched res and BHVR building support for it into the game so that everyone can use it. The former is an exploit benefiting a small minority of dishonest players and the latter would obviously have balance implications for everyone. The latter is basically what OP is asking for here with an FOV slider.
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Obviously it provides an advantage, however it’s not a huge game changing advantage. It’s only an advantage compared to now. If other games had awful FOVs and had perks that increased it, it’d be seen as a bandaid. It’s better than not having obviously, but low FOV does not have a huge stake in balance in DBD.
Are you really making the argument that non-important juke strats, which are still possible, are more important than accessibility? This is legit the exact argument that people had against colorblind settings.
I sit far enough away to be able to see vital info and I’m on console so no settings.
FOV is still not that important to DBD. Again, there’s a reason why Shadowborn is not used often and Monitor isn’t used for the FOV, because FOV is not largely important. Shadowborn basekit would be fine.
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I think the Devs have said that they're looking into addressing motion sickness in the future. I doubt that it'll be with an FOV slider, because nobody would use anything but the largest FOV. Hopefully they'll be able to implement a motion sickness mode that can accommodate those who face simulator sickness. (I know what it's like, because certain games will make me physically ill if I play them for more than 20 minutes, though DBD is not one of them.)
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Time and work = change Shadowborn and add to base game.
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How is FOV slider and instant no? Just make current Shadowborn the max setting and current FOV the minimum.
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People absolutely do get motion sickness while playing CSGO. Default killer FOV is 87 degrees. FOV in CSGO at 4:3 is 90 degrees.
There's also a difference between bumping up the default FOV a few degrees and adding an FOV slider (which implies a higher maximum FOV).
There's also more to FOV than "does it give people motion sickness". It's directly tied to balance.
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The fixed FOV is still trash and isn’t that important in terms of balance. Survivors still can loop the killer just as well with and without Shadowborn.
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This is... not a good argument lol.
Tunnel vision for what exactly? The hORRor aEthStetIc?
Survivors have many options to hide from the killer that don’t involve hiding directly in their faces. If they need to resort to that then they probably made many mistakes.
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You keep saying it’s tied to balance and then not addressing how important it actually is. Yeah, killers can see a bit more stuff, but it’s still not that important.
FOV slider does not mean or imply that the FOV must exceed what Shadowborn is already and I don’t know where you got that idea.
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The devs (and many players) seem to have a different opinion on the FoV in this game than you. you realize your point of view is not the one and only right one? Just because you think it doesn’t affect gameplay doesn’t mean that is the only true way of judging this.
they are addressing accessibility options. And they are known to be generally slow to introduce changes. Your attitude doesn’t make things faster. Be more reasonable. Chances are they are currently working on on some kind of solution anyways. Let your voice be heard, but don’t be so disrespectful in doing so.
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The only reason colorblind settings are in the game right now is because players started having an attitude after Almo’s comments lol.
I’ve been talking about FOV in this game for like 2 years and still no change. I’m aware that the devs don’t read all my posts but there are a bunch of people who’ve commented on the matter with radio silence from the devs.
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Okay you are delusional and only see what you want to see it seems.
they have actually talked about wanting to add colorblind mode some time before that incident. And they definitely didn’t just implement the mode in such a short time :D
they are working on multiple things at the same time and they are known to talk about stuff just shortly before introducing it to live (yeah I know there are obvious exceptions and stuff they already talked about that didn’t even make it in yet, but not in the scope of such an accessibility option afaik).
and just to be clear: communication is something they definitely need to improve and they have shown they are willing to do so recently as well (OoO).
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I am not convinced that Colorblind settings and low FOV are anywhere near equivalent in terms of accessibility. Colorblindness means that people of straight up can't see vital things like gen auras or scratch marks. There's no perk to correct. You're just straight up stuck. Adding colorblind filters could arguably help some non-colorblind players get an advantage, but almost no one will do that for aesthetic reasons even if it does help out a bit. It's pretty much just allowing colorblind players to play at the same level that everyone else already can. It also impacts both sides, not just killer, and has no balance implications. It makes a lot of sense, therefore, that this was addressed.
Low FOV, on the other hand, is just one of a number of factors that can impact motion sickness. Anything from proximity to your monitor/tv (or windowed versus full screen mode, if proximity can't easily be changed), to light level in the room you're playing in, to graphics preset, to vsync, to frame rate, to the killer's movement animation (for example, Billy's subtle up and down camera motion) can all potentially trigger motion sickness. There are lots of potential ways to mitigate motion sickness as a result. Most importantly, increasing FOV for killer across the board (or adding a slider, which would be functionally similar) gives everyone an advantage when playing killer. It's not just doing away with motion sickness for some people while leaving just about everyone the same, like it is for colorblind settings. This is an actual balance concern in the game for all players, not just a small minority of unlucky players.
Shadowborn is used fairly often on some killers, like Huntress and Nurse. Still, a perk not being used commonly across the whole roster says very little about how useful its effects are; not being considered one the top handful of strongest perks for a given killer does not mean the effect it offers is unworthy of a perk slot. Running Shadowborn is a perfectly fine workaround for people who have exhausted all other options for dealing with their motion sickness. It isn't meta, but it absolutely offers in-game utility. Once MMR is live there will be basically no downside to running Shadowborn aside from not having as much freedom in your builds, and even prior to MMR going live the impact is small.
Could the devs increase FOV and buff survivor to compensate? They could certainly balance the game around a higher FOV, but the increased FOV would still hurt the depth of survivor gameplay by seriously limiting the viability of stealth, spins, window techs, and a number of other maneuvers. This would lower the survivor skill ceiling and make the game a lot less fun to play for decent survivors. I don't think there's any way around this and it would probably hurt a lot more players than a wider FOV would help. As a result, I hope the devs never change this.
You clearly feel that addressing motion sickness out of the box for the few is more important than gameplay for the many, which is a fine opinion to have, but the arguments about Shadowborn and comparisons to colorblind settings are flimsy to say the least.
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How do you expect me to quantify how big of a deal it is? The only people with a prayer of having data on this are the devs. I have said that this will hurt stealth and severely limit survivors' ability to counter the killer with a number of advanced techniques (e.g. spins, window techs, a few different pallet techs).
I never said that an FOV slider would exceed Shadowborn. It clearly does imply that you want more than a slight increase, though, or you would have either asked them to bump the default FOV by a few percentage points or you would have specified that the slider be from 87-90 degrees, or something. Asking for an FOV slider with the justification that it's a basic accessibility feature that other games have implies that you're also looking for an FOV slider like other games have. It also isn't reasonable to expect only bumping the FOV a few degrees would be enough to fix FOV-related motion sickness across the board. Feel free to specify exactly what you want so I won't be forced to make any assumptions.
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I'm not even talking about competitive play. This would substantially lower survivor skill ceiling at high rank, which would likely hurt the gameplay experience for many more players than increased FOV would help. You can balance the game around a higher FOV, but it's hard to restore the depth of survivor gameplay when a lot of that depth specifically relies on the killer having limited FOV.
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A perk not being OP is weak justification for making it base kit. Think about it this way: You're arguing that all players, including players without motion sickness, should essentially get a 5th non-meta perk in order to help a small minority of players who would otherwise have to make their normal 4th perk slot that same non-meta perk.
Giving everyone that 5th perk for free lowers the skill ceiling for survivor by weakening or outright killing a number of spins, techs, and other maneuvers. It also tilts game balance back towards killer, which can at least be compensated for if necessary, but which would divert attention from other more important changes and which I also don't feel is needed from the data I've seen.
Meanwhile, requiring a small minority of players to run a non-meta 4th perk doesn't many implications at all. It's just a bit harder for those players to be creative with their builds. Normal game balance and survivor skill ceiling are untouched.
People might not be asking for an advantage when asking for an FOV slider, but it's simply not possible to increase FOV without negatively impacting gameplay and shifting balance in DBD.
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That is the intended design.
Survivors have better awareness provided by 3rd person view and more restricted movement, having to control momentum.
Killers have restricted FOV in 1st person while keeping better movement deploying full speed no matter the direction.
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I don't really care which techs you consider to be "high-rank"; if the plebs could do all these it would only help my argument lol
You're also downplaying how easy it is to counter them. Sure a killer can counter a window tech by moonwalking and switching direction if necessary, but they're losing time and therefore distance compared to a killer with a wide enough FOV to see the survivor perform the tech. 360s usually don't work against killers, but there are going to be some situations where a killer would need to lunge to land a hit, and in those situations a spin can certainly allow you to avoid hits. Techs like this one work from time to time even against good killers, provided you pick a good tile for them:
These techs will never work every time, but the fact that they can and do work gives survivors more tools at their disposal and lets them be more creative and unpredictable. It raises the skill ceiling and makes the game more fun. Then there are the stealth aspects, where you're walking for cover or revaulting a window right at the edge of a killer's FOV and such...
This would be a big buff to Nurse. You'll see people run Shadowborn on her with some regularity, so it's basically a free fifth perk slot that you're always dumping a solid perk into.
There is a difference between competitive play (e.g. tournaments) and high rank play (e.g. public matches filled with randos who through some combination of skill, play time, and getting carried by their teammates ended up at red rank). These changes would affect everyone in competitive or non-competitive settings. Making Shadowborn base kit would outright kill a lot of techs like the one mentioned above. It is not a harmless QoL feature.
It is really not a big deal to run Shadowborn if you're only of the small minority of players who can't mitigate your motion sickness in other ways.
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Apparently you cannot read between the lines and I need to spell it out for you. FOV should not be a perk, the fact they made it a perk means that it isn't overpowered giving killers a better FOV. I'm sure you will still argue with what I just said though.
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It's to prevent people from getting a hardware advantage. It's a casual game, the last thing it needs is that class of player.
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Most FOV sliders do not destroy the aspect ratio. If the sliders only impacted horizontal FOV, increasing FOV would cause everything to appear artificially tall and skinny and I cannot think of a single game for which that is the case. Increased horizontal FOV will also increase vertical FOV.
You're assuming a window tech where the survivor is crouching next to the window waiting to revault. Hitting S is not enough to check the window tech where you basically clip through the killer as they vault and run through them to the other side. This tech works consistently against Legions but you can do it against anyone.
Shadowborn is not a trash perk on Nurse. In addition to helping with quickly locating a survivor after a blink, it allows you to still catch survivors' feet while on fatigue. This is sometimes useless, but also sometimes a huge deal, such as when you're trying to locate a survivor in the corn. Not meta =/= not trash.
Again, this applies to all matches in which survivors have a clue what they're doing. It doesn't matter one bit if it's a tournament match or not.
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Huh?
Don’t think you got the point of the topic.
Shadowborn base kit still wouldn’t kill jukes. It’d make the current way they’re pulled off harder, sure, but if it became base kit, players would just need to adjust their positioning in order to have a better chance to pull it off.
Meanwhile, requiring people to use a bandaid makes the game less enjoyable and gives less options for the poor FOV that can be fixed. Again, if survivors need to rely on the FOV of killers being bad, they’re probably doing something wrong.
If balance was 100% on a scale, changing killer FOV would make killers 1% more powerful. The difference between current killer FOV and Shadowborn is not as large of a change as you suggest.
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Shadowborn is definitely a trash perk and is not that helpful if you’re a good Nurse or killer in general. just follow the scratch marks.
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You seem to have only read the first sentence, since you ignored most of my argument.
Shadowborn isn't overpowered, but large increases to base FOV substantially limits the effectiveness of a lot of survivor techniques. This lowers skill ceiling, reduces opportunities for creativity, and generally makes playing survivor less fun. This affects every decent player. FOV has huge balance and gameplay implications in DBD. There are no balance implications and usually no negative gameplay impacts from adding an FOV slider to a singleplayer or symmetrical multiplayer game. DBD is asymmetrical and only one side has a first person perspective. Everything was designed with this FOV in mind, from pallet breaking animations to Nurse's fatigue. Boosting FOV is not a simple QoL change in this game.
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Also, to come back to this, considering SWFs get basically every single aura reading perk for free just by being on comms, I’m not sure what your argument is here? Not saying “SWF OP!!!!” but this is a weak point.
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I'll take less enjoyable for a small minority of unlucky people over less enjoyable for any decent player and potential balance implications, extra dev hours for changes to things like Nurse's fatigue, Shadowborn & M&A, etc.
I'm a lot more concerned about the gameplay implications than balance implications. Balance can be adjusted, but no amount of balance changes can bring back techs that only work because of low killer FOV.
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This point is also very, very wrong. I mentioned this in the original post, but the low FOV also hinders killers because they aren’t able to see the random clutter scattered throughout the map for no reason without looking down, which can get them stuck and lose them chases.
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Good luck following scratch marks in the corn... It's not just for fatigue either; it's also for target acquisition when you land a blink. It's only trash if you really want an FOV slider.
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Read the first part of my comment again.
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If I really need help following scratch marks through corn I’d just use Predator (LOL). Shadowborn does not help that much through corn, and the corn needs to be toned down anyways.
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Killers should never be getting stuck on random clutter while looking straight ahead. With a few clearly unintentional exceptions, like the ramp to the new shack on Badham, tiles are rounded so that neither side will get grabbed by random outcroppings and such. This is a weak counterpoint compared to things like in-game animations that are specifically designed to give the survivor a chance to break line of sight.
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I disagree with the first part of your comment and have said as much many times in the thread.
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This is a casual game for everyone to enjoy. Adding an FoV slider would make people automatically put it to the highest they can, limited only by their hardware, because FoV is one of the most important things in this game. Which would mean that you get the rich snobs lording it over everyone else and having an unfair advantage like they do in other games.
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If FOV is increased, survivors would be forced to adjust their positioning in order to pull off their jukes... there’s nothing to disagree with, it’s just them having to change the method of execution. The aren’t going to be doing spins in the same way, so while it could be harder, it still would not be impossible.
Not sure I follow on the hardware part.
If there was an FOV slider in which the max was just current Shadowborn, I don’t see how the hardware part comes into play when everyone would have the same limit.
Also, the casual game part kinda directly contrasts with everyone else’s strict adherence to FOV being part of DBD’s balance argument, because if people truly saw it as just a casual game, then no one would have a problem with something as minuscule as the FOV.
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Have you ever seen someone on console using Shadowborn? It's not pretty.
And no, it doesnt, casual games need to be balanced which is exactly why there is no FoV slider and you have to use a valuable perk slot to get an advantage.
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You're right, just like everything else bhvr does they got the FOV right on the first try! What a fantastic argument, of course you should be able to run right up and touch the killer's hitbox so you vanish off his screen, naturally that is a "tech" and not just abusing a FOV that is worse than the original doom fov.
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I guess this won't ever happen though. The devs want killers to have as many unnecessary disadvantages as possible.
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