http://dbd.game/killswitch
Why is haddonfeild still a thing
This map is so broken. I mean I guess you can make the argument that most surv don't know how to run the map but its not that hard. This map is so dumb. its baisly has an infinite in the main house and the house of pain. the sad part is that when the devs do rework they probably won't address the main issues of the map. For example, disturbed ward that map is maybe slightly better but still sucks cuz of its size. Plus they will probably add 1000 breakable walls to the map which will be so annoying. This map suck or huntress, deathsligher, and tricsker btw since they are 110 and don't have a movement ability. I just hope this map gets fixed well.
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oh ya here's a vid to add to my point
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I've never thought Haddonfield was that bad with Deathslinger. There are a lot of areas that are either really thin and narrow corridors or loops that you can shoot over with no thought. And so by default I don't think it would be that bad as Trickster either since they both deal with loops the same way. The only things that you can't deal with are the 2 infamous window loops but then again no killer can except mayyyybe Spirit (obviously Nurse, Trapper and hag can but that goes without saying)
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i mean it's not that bad deathsligher but still its a pretty shite map
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The biggest counter argument I can give you:
You are aware that killers can bodyblock things, right? If you vault out of a window, Killers can block it without needing Bamboozle by just standing still.
The House of Pain is the only good argument you can make here, but guess what? That exact same building is in Springwood, so we know it's going to get at least 2 breakable walls(which, are not bad, the killers who need the doorways to be gone are killers that are strong in 1v1's anyway and have plenty of time to break them down, the killers who need them to be there dont have much time outside their 1v1's dont have to spend time breaking them down, therefor massively reducing their overal 1v1 times on those maps.
Seriously, I dont see the issue with breakable walls. People argue that "why not keep them removed around godloops" and the easy answer to that is that survivors have a limited amount of resources, if those walls were gone to begin with, there would be nothing to use. Or: "Why not just close walls up that people never break down anyway?". Because killers dont need their hands to be held. They need to be able to make mistakes. Opening up a god loop by breaking the wrong wall is a mistake. Let alone that, once again, not all killers loop the same. A Demogorgon can benefit from breaking open the doorway. Let alone that it gives survivors a way to use the wiggle meter against the killer, forcing them to open up a pathway they really dont want to be open for the sake of a hookstate.
Breakable walls heavily improve maps overall. Lery's and Haddonfield are the only major maps that still benefit heavily from breakable walls. Hawkins is the only map that doesnt benefit from breakable walls. Otherwise the argument can easily be flipped to the point of "why board 3 out of 4 windows in the Gas Heaven shop? It's so annoying to only use 1".
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i mean i hate breakable walls since when they removed infinities back then on the old maps they were pretty good, but when they came back to the old maps I.E. Macmillan, auto haven, etc. they just shave a breakable wall where a breakable wall didn't need to be in the first place. plus they are a pain since the killer already has a lot to do why should they give them more things.
plus your body blocking point doesn't really hold ground since New flash you cant body block a window when you aren't at the window if you like to see an example go ahead and see the vid I put in the comment
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I've never had an issue on this map for both killers and survivors. Its one of my favorite maps. The map is close quarters and tight. There is a lot of places to hide for survivors and with the maps size it's easy for the killer to move around it. It's not hard to deal with infinite loops if you bait a survivor. Sometimes psychological torment works better than running straight at them. People tend to make a lot of mistakes while pressured by an invisible hand. You just have to change up your play style a bit. Now when you run into survivor friends that for some reason are all red ranks and you're low rank, you're SOL.
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i mean i guess you can like but it sucks to play on for most anyone your just in the minority. might I ask what killer rank and surv rank are you
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I can't use my power on haddonfield, I'm literally just trapper on haddonfield.
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Don't forget how all mobility killers other than Nurse basically can't use their power other than in the street.
But Clown, Trapper, Hag, and Doc are almost average on Haddonfield. Almost.
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oh ya i forgot about that and the worst part it sucks for blight, and sometimes billy since it's so old the hitboxes are janky
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Haddonfield is a horrible map for killer's everyone knows this, trapper or hag excels on this map tho.
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I'm killer rank 15 and survivor rank 13 right now. I play casually and have never been under rank 9 for both. I don't think this game should have a ranking system. It's a survival horror. It's a bit silly to push needless competition.
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that makes sense
all I can say is stay there
it's much better than there, besides the tunneling and camping killers once in a while
red ranks is pain on haddonfeild
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Everyone can agree that Haddonfield is stupid.
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i dont think they need a license to rework since they reworked badham without the need for approval
plus I doubt they will rework it well
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Oh I agree, camping/tunneling killers and people using the meta aggravate me a lot. The ranking system makes people feel like they have to use the meta to be "good". I've run into a lot of killers and survivors who gave me a run for my money without using the meta. Those games I find more enjoyable even though they are challenging. Once the map is reworked, I feel it will be better and larger.
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You do realize that once they broke those infinites in the old maps, the maps essentially became heavily killer sided? I can easily break a door on those maps and still get a 4k with ease. Those doors dont take up much time at all to be broken. At best, you might need to break 1 door on a map, at worst, you need to break 3. Those pallets, mind you, have removed pallets to compensate for the doors. So you have less pallets to deal with, less powerful loops overall, but you ######### about 1 or 2 doors? If that breakable wall wasnt there, the tiles would not have been spaced out more. You do remember that on Ironworks, for example, added a wall to break an infinite but they added a wall upstairs to compensate for the lack of a looping area? There used to 2 god pallets in that area, which have been gutted. Do you want those god pallets back in exchange of the breakable walls? Or are you an entitled killer who only wants their hand held all game and only making loops easy for killers?
And yes, my bodyblocking point does hold ground. As for a video to counter your argument:
As you can see at 4:45(especially at 5:10), you can swing mid air to reduce a chase.
So lets break down the video you have given me for why it is not an infinite, and just Coco making mistakes:
If Coconut(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rVngwuLLQw) had swung at 0:20 and 0:27, he would have been able to close the gap and hit before he could reach the window again, MISTAKE.
If he either started charging the hatchet mid air, OR swung while dropping at 0:31, again, it would have been a hit.
At 0:55, he held w off a drop, instead of listening to footsteps.
So yea, there are no infinites in DBD, only killers that make terrible mistakes. You know what else he could have done at 0:19 instead of following the survivor? TURN AROUND. It's a one way loop, not a 2 way loop. Second MISTAKE.
Then the house of pain at 3:00, he vaulted a window that takes 2 seconds to vault, while he could have walked around in 1.4 seconds. Then he loses bloodlust by charging his hatchet instead of powering through, 2 MISTAKES he could have avoided. But to be fair, House of Pain is by far the strongest survivor structure in the game.
Let alone that he decided to keep chasing the survivor he couldnt catch, there's 4 survivors and he went for the 1 survivor that knew how to loop him. Again, MISTAKE.
That's not even including he's repeating the same mistakes, clearly showing ignorance of mechanics.
So WHEN haddonfield is being altered, dont expect the main building to be much different. It's not an infinite. There are no infinites, only ignorance. With Haddonfields rework, I expect the House of Pain to have 2 breakable walls, and some fences to have a breakable wall if they grow larger than 5 meters long. The windows will remain the same as Balanced Landing has been nerfed.
"BuT cOcO hAs NeArLy 7k HoUrS, yOu CaNt SaY yOu KnOw BeTtEr". Except that I have pretty much proven that I do. Even with T1 Myers, I can deal with Haddonfield better than he did with Huntress. And I can only get a 2k at best with T1 Myers on Haddonfield.
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every ######### generator on the second story is a safe generator too and you can watch the stairs while working on them
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doesnt make it a safe gen tho. Main building gen, unless the left front window is open, is by far the most dangerous generator in the map. The safest generator has a window right next to it, and that's a solo generator. Meaning it will take forever to finish that generator and is prime real-estate for 3-gens.
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Idk about haddnofield I only know Hadnofun, jokes apart that map sucks visually it's beautiful map but broken as hell
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No it's a ######### safe gen.
The killer can only get you by going up the stairs, which you can watch out for.
There is almost always a window in the room where you are doing the gen too so you can make an easy escape.
it's a safe gen
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Even if he does make mistakes, it's not exactly friendly to newer or casual players if a 7k hour player massively struggles in areas like this (on one side anyway). It's wonderful that you can dominate every square centimetre of haddonfield as T1 Myers or no blink nurse but few people going to commit to rigorous study of every tile of every map in a casual game.
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Because evil does exist.
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could not have said it better my self
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Except that there is the internet. If you struggle with something, you can google it and almost always someone has an answer to it.
The fact that Coco repeatedly made the same mistake over and over again to call something an infinite, instead of thinking what he COULD do to prevent that infinite.
"but few people going to commit to rigorous study of every tile of every map in a casual game."
Except that this guy is basing his argument on someone with 7k hours, who by all means should have at the very least studied some part of the game. I cant see anyone playing a game for over 3k hours without at least some hours studying game mechanics.
So, considering the matter that is presented has the following issues:
- same mistake made over and over again, which is a rookie mistake, any average player can inifinitely loop a rookie killer, doesnt mean its an actual infinite.
- he dedicated to the exact same chase in a situation where he couldnt afford to dedicate, which, again, is a rookie mistake.
I didnt study much at all, I just dont have the ego to say I am the best at what I do, and instead reflect on my own actions. That's all it takes. 1 5 second google leading to 1 14 minute video that explains within 5 minutes exactly why what you did is wrong, something you can literally do while in matchmaking.
I do not at all dominate every square inch. I improvise, adapt and overcome(and I do consider myself to be a casual player, I only play DBD about 20 hours at most per week right now, which is a tiny amount considering Coco streams the game 30 hours a week and probably plays it off-stream for a couple of hours too. That is not to say he is a bad player at all(arguably one of the best huntress players in the game). Just that he lacks the self-reflection and just blames it on the game instead.
You'll never get better if you dont self-reflect.
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i know he made a mistake but still, you do save time with the swing but not by a lot. the map is still broken. trust me, I and others can probably do well on it as killer but the fact that it's so stupidly strong and is a pain to play on warrants a good rework, It like old Ormond where a person can do pretty well but it still was a dumb and broken map.
now what that rework would be well that beats me tbh
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Like I said, there is only 1 configuration where it's safe: solo gen, left front side open. The rest? unsafe. You can bodyblock the window in the back before survivors can reach it, you can hit survivors before they finish their vaulting animation. They all have to LEAVE the area when you come, meaning that once you kick it, the only way for them to come back is to go up the stairs. Being able to see the killer come, doesnt mean its safe. Meaning that after you kick it, there is quite a large likelihood of it regressing 15% before any survivor can safely touch it again without you interrupting them.
You know what's a truly safe generator? The 3 man generator in the house of pain. There is 8 lockers there, one can easily hide in a locker before you even come down the stairs, meaning there can always be 1 survivor remaining and by the time you checked 2 lockers, the survivor could have left the area already.
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Okay having to do research on something, or even just figure it out through trial and error may not be the worst thing, but it is if that doesn't go for both sides. It's a completely brainless loop for survivor to play well and takes developing this knowledge for killer to play it at all, which isn't what balance is.
You also mentioned that bloodlust was necessary before, tiles like this combined with killers like huntress is why bloodlust currently still needs to be a thing, even though it isn't a particularly interesting or engaging mechanic.
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i mean the surv can just pre vault. as much as lord tony overacts what he said has a little truth to it. plus why are you defending Haddon field mostly everyone knows its a broken map. the map itself is so brainless a monkey can probably do well just vaulting and running. As @Aneurysm said yes the killer can look up how to beat it it's still is a pain to deal with even if you know what to do, for surv it's so easy to run a reg killer its sometimes boring.
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You sound like the exact opposite of a casual player.
And lets not act like 20 hours a week is a little amount, you're practically working a part-time job playing DbD
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"you do save time with the swing but not by a lot"
Enough to hit the survivor the second time you drop down, which is only 2 meters difference. But 2 meters is also the difference between baiting a Dead Hard or getting baited by a Dead Hard. I mean, if a survivor runs along the wall of the map, I can cut them off by cutting the corners. It might not save me a lot of time, but it does save me enough to hook them and go back to the gens that I need to pressure. "not a lot" can be the difference between a win and a loss in this game. Considering he did the same mistake 12 times(yes, I counted as he got looped on the same window 12 times), if he had swung instead, the loop would have lasted 5-6 windows at best. Since every 2nd or 3rd window it would have been a hit, instead, yknow, 12 windows with 0 hits. "not a lot" turns an infinite into a very finite loop.
"the map is still broken. trust me"
Ah yes, the biggest source of trust that trumps all counter evidence. I agree it needs alteration, after all, even with my sweatiest plays on my strongest killers I sometimes barely get a 2k. But to call it broken? I mean, would you call Hawkins broken? Haddonfield is to survivors what Hawkins is to killers.
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"It's a completely brainless loop for survivor to play well and takes developing this knowledge for killer to play it at all, which isn't what balance is."
Except that it's not a brainless loop. It takes research and experimentation to find loops like this. Those survivors probably spend 30+ minutes finding the best loops they could get and waited for a killer to follow their lead. Any loop becomes brainless once you have it in your muscle memory. It requires knowledge and skill to pull off a loop like that. Me and a friend of mine looped a doctor for 6 full minutes around the car walls in Gas Heaven because we did the research, we did the experimentation and we tried to find any optimization to loop as long as possible. We took 1 hour just scouring all the maps for the best location to loop like that on every map so we didnt have to rely on the map. Then we slapped on the perks required for the build to work(blood pact, for the people, soul guard and botany knowledge in case both of us were injured). It's as "brainless" as using BBQ to get hit with huntress. There are no brainless loops. It takes good decision making, good timing, optimizing the loop and often perks to pull off a strong loop. If you are not skilled as a survivor, no way you can loop any killer like that.
"You also mentioned that bloodlust was necessary before, tiles like this combined with killers like huntress is why bloodlust currently still needs to be a thing, even though it isn't a particularly interesting or engaging mechanic."
Agreed, and bloodlust is almost capable of being deleted from the game. My point was more that he dedicated so long on 1 survivor just for the sake of dedicating to that survivor, trying to catch him no matter the costs, and not even using one of the few mechanics he could have used in his favor to actually catch up. My point wasnt that bloodlust is fun or anything, more that considering his goal was to catch the survivor, denying any mechanic that can help is detrimental to such a chase.
I dont mind maps like haddonfield existing(my biggest issue is the house of pain and the fences on the side, that's it, the rest is fine). Survivors are allowed to have power in this game, as long as they cannot use that power permanently. That's the whole point on exhaustion perks for example, it's power that you have to save up to use in the right moment. Having infinite power(aka, infinite loop, infinite soulguard loop(which existed btw, its why it has a 30 second cooldown now), is what is being removed from survivors as soon as it is discovered. At least, as of November 2019, considering Balanced Landing was allowing the last truly infinite loop in the game).
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Prevaulting survivor means no one is doing a gen. A safe gen is where you can keep working on a gen up untill the last moment and instantly can get up to work on it again. He is only right in the case that a killer goes up, finds no one inside, refuses to check the balconies(it only takes a second or 2, and you can hear survivors slow vault now) and goes back down. In which case, the killer is the one making the gen safe, doesnt make it a safe gen.
"for surv it's so easy to run a reg killer its sometimes boring."
It takes 500+ hours to be able to run the average purple rank killer for longer than 30 seconds. How is that easy? My example with the video that was posted, was that Coco was very brainless in his chase aswell and expected good results, while the survivors thought at least 5 moves ahead(you can even see someone run ahead to potentially tank a hit mid-chase). If they make it look easy, then its because they have a tremendous amount of skill to do so. So to quote on one of the better animated american shows:
Seriously, try it yourself, try looping a killer like that.
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Eh, 20 hours is pretty mediocre. I've played games 50 hours per week casually. Casual gameplay is not a matter of time, its a matter of intent. I can play Witcher 3 for 3 weeks in a row, 20 hours per week, to finish the storyline. It would still be a casual playthrough.
I dont use meta perks, I dont use meta builds, I dont use meta killers. I just rely on the total amount of hours I have gathered over the course to perform well. How is that not casually playing the game?
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Looking at the depth of every one of your comments in this thread, and you personally saying that you've studied map tile layouts points to me, at least, that you take this game rather seriously.
Just because you don't use perks like dead hard and ruin every game does not automatically mean that you play this game casually.
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Assuming that survivors are going to leave a gen alone for 21 seconds just so it could go down a measly 15% is a mighty big assumption. I don't know about m any around here, but even people that watch my stream say I have been getting the worst luck because it seems like every team I get is some sweat SWF out to gen rush from the gate. My matches always start with 2-3 gens popping in the first minute to minute and a half and I down one person after chasing them for like 20 seconds. I've chased people off a gen only to watch them get right back on it like flies on turds. The old JUST PRESSURE BETTER argument does not apply here. Like I'm literally having to resort to widely considered scummy tactics to apply pressure because the gen rush is so ridiculous. So you add in a map like Haddonfield and it's a nightmare. Chasing somebody out of the top floors of houses means nothing when someone on comms is right nearby waiting for confirmation of me dropping down so they can run in and try to finish the gen.
I know it sounds ludicrous, but it's the truth. The amount of SWFs I face is ridiculous and maps like Haddonfield make it a very unenjoyable time.
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Didn't they announce that they were in the middle of doing a Haddonfield rework?
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The killer can take advantage of the new Thompson House map by bodblocking stairs? Disabled after less than a week.
The survivors can take advantage of the Haddonfield infinites? Stays active for 4 years.
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I'm not a great survivor by any means but I can run the Myers house. Same with the old ironworks of misery and wretched shop. I may not have been able to do so right when I started (I was too busy urban evading everywhere and the idea wouldn't have occured to me anyway) but it's nothing like running shack or jungle gyms where strong as they are I still have to use my brain and pay attention against a good killer or I'm going to get mindgamed and downed.
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sheesh man, you are like a damn fanboy of this map. you really think it needs some alterations it needs a rework of all reworks
What are you talking about its hard to run someone on this map. its one of the easiest maps to run a killer on. You are like an apprentice to sluzzy with all that bias of yours. dude this map is broken how don't you get that through your head. it may be that bad as some people make it out be but still, it is a map that needs a lot of work to make it somewhat good for both sides. why are really defending this map as well, everyone knows it's broken and you are one of the only people that won't just accept that.
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Nah, it's literally 2k hours of total gameplay over the course of 6 years. The tiles didnt really change too much, the maps barely changed, a lot of mechanics do not change. Even learning what perks do are just a matter of time.
If I began this year, sure, I'd be a freaking tryhard. But when I started this game, there were only 7 characters, 26 survivor perks and 21 killer perks. Its not that hard to keep up with what perks do when there are only 6 new perks and 1 new killer ability every 4 months.
And yeah, actually, not running meta perks kinda makes you a casual gamer. You can still sweat without meta perks, sure, but again, intent matters more than time played. Casual literally means "relaxed and unconcerned", and 99.999% of my games, that's exactly how I play. Therefor, casual. The only times I do notify some concern, is when there is something that makes the game unfun to play for any side. But if you use that slight concern to call me non-casual, I do like to point out that this thread started by a casual player, being VERY concerned about a map.
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Fair enough and point heard. We seem to have different definitions of casual so it seems best to agree to disagree here.
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Blight is another exception. He's rather very hard to avoid between fences. The only thing saving you is either a cutoff on the fence and/or a really well-timed Dead Hard. Even then, if he has enough Rush tokens to continue chasing, you're screwed.
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Tbh, survivors only have a limited amount of resources IF you throw all pallets down instantly.
And even then the chance of survival is really high as long as the other 3 just do gens.
If you play smarter on loops with pallets then by the time the game is over, there are still enough pallets on the map to work with.
As survivor the only thing you have to do are 5 gens, loop the killer for a bit and be smart with pallets.
The gens always spawn on the same spots so they are easy to find.
The killer has to search for a survivor, chase a survivor, hit a survivor, chase the survivor, down the survivor, pick up the survivor and walk to a hook and hook the survivor.
Repeat that 11 more times and you'll see the difference in amount of objectives on each side.
Now put in some breakable walls the need to break to prevent a god/infinite loop to add even more to it.
The chances are small that you block a window or pallet as killer when you're chasing a survivor.
You vault through a window and bodyblock that window by just standing there?
Sure mate you go ahead, I'll run to another loop then and waste even more time of you. ๐
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Myers house isn't even worst loop on haddonfield. There are these houses in haddonfield where..... a rng window spawns on top floor and the window does not have a balcony to the side so basically the strategy is to camp the window until the killer goes about 4/5th of staircase up than you just vault the window. there are more god loops windows than just middle on one in Myers House. The other loops consistent of beach loops that sometimes spawn a fance window facing the pallet(Creates a jungle gym on the map) or garage loop which you tend to predrop the safe pallet on corner, make 2 turns for killer to attain bloodlust 1-2 than you just drop the garage pallet and hard camp pallet. even if the killer has bloodlust 3, you react to the killer going on either side. Its infinity, even at bloodlust 3, you need to break it.
I don't know, survivors historically always had busted loops on most maps so you just need to get used to it.
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Seems like people who say "just pressure better" are not elaborating well. From my experience, there are 3 types of pressure a killer has:
Area pressure. Aka, simply being in an area, people are less likely to work on gens when they hear your TR, especially if that gen is within vision, people are less likely to show themselves unless they are confident they can take you for a loop. This is why survivors tend to run away from where their teammates are, because it means they are guaranteed to be safe, while you as a killer want to push the survivor as close to its teammates as possible, because the closer you are to other survivors when you down and/or hook someone, the quicker you can start another chase.
Direct generator pressure, this is what happens when you have Ruin or Pop and actively walk to the generator to cause it to regress. This pressure is your second most powerful kind of pressure, even though it heavily relies on perks. Kicking a gen and staying nearby to force it to regress normally is the most brute forced way you can apply this pressure and only really works if you're in a 3-gen.
Hooking pressure, probably the most forgotten kind of pressure by a lot of killers. Because when you hook a survivor, you're forcing another survivor to go for a rescue(especially someone who has never unhooked someone, because of Deliverance). So preferably, you want to hook a survivor near a generator with a lot of progression so you have 2 objective points in a very small area(especially if Ruin is also there, which can be shown in Otzdarva's Billy vs Bubba video where Bubba captures a survivor next to Ruin inside a 3 gen for the ultimate pressure). OR you want a survivor to be as far as possible from generators as possible. Because that means 2 survivors are away from your area, meaning only 2 gens can be pressured in the best case scenario.
"Chasing somebody out of the top floors of houses means nothing when someone on comms is right nearby waiting for confirmation of me dropping down so they can run in and try to finish the gen."
Here's a small lifehack for Haddonfield: check the other balcony and any lockers, if you can afford to, and then walk down the stairs while listening for breathing and footsteps, instead of dropping down. The staircase is their only way up, it increases the distance they need to walk to go back to the gen, and anyone hiding closeby will be quickly injured. Use mapdesign in your favor. If they only have 1 way in, but multiple ways out, always leave through the 1 entrance.
Bottlenecks can be used by both parties.
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I never said you had to be top 10% survivor. And yeah, in this kind of scenario, you're right. You dont have to mindgame as much because its a strong loop. The killer has to realize its a strong 1-way loop and just needs to turn around. It's like running shack. You preferably want them to run in on the pallet side and run out the other way because it removes the fast vault from the shack and clever survivors try to fake it so they can increase distance enough to turn you around and get the loop in their favor.
Outside the house of pain and fences that are 5km long, I actually dont have that many issues with Haddonfield. It has very powerful one way loops, but that's all they are, one way loops. There are no perks that allow a survivor to climb walls after they have dropped down. There are no perks that allow survivors to bounce back up. Once they have fallen, they can only go back up through the stairs. And in that sense, Haddonfield is mainly fine. Can it use some alteration in windows? Sure. Does it absolutely need it to be playable? Nah. Just as killers deserve strong maps like Hawkins, where there is little to no looping, survivors also deserve maps where they can use very powerful loops like Haddonfield. The fences are the bigger issues, because all survivors have to do is hold W. There is no way to shorten a hold W strat when corners cannot be cut. Most killers still can reduce distance on a hold W strat in some way, shape or form, but killers like Myers, Trapper, Doctor, Piggy and Ghostface dont have any effective distance reductions mid-chase, and their best chance is leaving a W holder to hope they wont heal up or get caught off guard in a more dense area.
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"its one of the easiest maps to run a killer on."
After you got skilled enough to loop a killer, let alone that the map is pretty unique in structure and a lot of killers do not take that uniqueness in their advantage. It doesnt need that big of a rework. You just need to think outside the box more.
As for bias? The past year I've put like 900+ hours as killer into this game, and only 150-ish hours as survivor. You thinking it's broken merely shows to me you are not experienced enough to think outside the box for this one. Is the map strong for survivors? Yes, definitely. Is it broken? Definitely not. It's biggest alteration it needs is addressing The House of Pain and Fences. That's it.
"Everyone knows its broken" except the only people I've been seeing talking that it's broken, are killer mains who rely on brute forcing and rarely use maps in their advantage. It's a strong map, but if Haddonfield needs that big of a rework, then so does Hawkins. Hawkins is more favourable to killers, than Haddonfield is to survivors.
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Hawkins isn't really a killer favored map. It sucks for most killers. the only killers that really excels on that map are stealth killers and maybe a few other killers like doc. but still, that isn't a very good example.
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"Tbh, survivors only have a limited amount of resources IF you throw all pallets down instantly."
12 pallets is still 12 pallets, regardless if they are thrown or not. How they are being used is a different discussion. Point being, if my teammate uses a resource, I can no longer rely on using that resource in the future. Meaning my teammate early on can affect how good I can loop the killer in the future. I dont care how many hours you have in the game or how skilled you are as a survivor, if there are no pallets to use, the killer can just brute force a hit. Which is why you should never really respect pallets in strong loops. Better to eat them ASAP than survivors keeping it for later.
"And even then the chance of survival is really high as long as the other 3 just do gens."
If they can find the gens, if they spread on gens and if the killer decides to keep chasing me instead of going for someone weaker and hope I can be healed up before a next chase or the killer can catch me later on quite quickly. Let alone that healing would aid the killer. If I cant get information that the killer is coming my way, I'm screwed if im not healed.
"If you play smarter on loops with pallets then by the time the game is over, there are still enough pallets on the map to work with."
Depends on who the killer is, depends on my teammates, depends on the perks being ran. Most pallets arent that useful. If the game is over, the killer has no reason to kick an unsafe pallet and just gets a hit rather, then depending on gate spawns, can still down you and will definitely camp as there is nothing else for the killer to do. Let alone that the killer has to, again, be dedicated enough to keep chasing me rather than going for a weaker link. If I am the weakest link as the killer is struggling to get me, the killer is simply outmatched. That simply happens. Any killer saying survivors shouldnt be able to do X are often killers who have a gigantic ego and cannot admit they get outmatched. There are survivors with way higher skill than the killers they are facing. But in 99% of the games, there is always a weak link or weak links you can use to get the stronger survivors. So if the killer plays smarter, by the time the game is over, all people are dead.
"The gens always spawn on the same spots so they are easy to find."
Except they dont really spawn on the same spot. There is like 20 spots they can spawn on in most maps, and some spots are RARE. If a gen spawns in a rare spot(a good example is Hawkins on top of the rafters, it's a 1 man gen, spawns almost never, everytime it spawns there, it's never touched so the killer only has to defend 2 gens). Besides, this argument can easily be flipped into: loops always spawn in the same spots, so you should recognise their structure and easily know the best way to counter that loop.
"The killer has to search for a survivor, chase a survivor, hit a survivor, chase the survivor, down the survivor, pick up the survivor and walk to a hook and hook the survivor. Repeat that 11 more times and you'll see the difference in amount of objectives on each side."
Except that this is false for the most part. Good killers will search survivors, hit a survivor before they can reach their first obstacle and then initiate a chase. Let alone that when someone is unhooked, you can easily injure the unhooker without any chasing. The whole "search, chase, hit, chase, down, pick up and hook" ignores the following things: grabs, locker grabs, stealth, unpredictability, pressuring a hook as the survivor is about to reach second stage to secure an extra hookstate with little to no effort. Besides, if any chase lasts less than 30 seconds, no one even gets close to finishing a gen. Let alone that survivors cannot really skip gens through vanilla ways, they need a key to do so. So excluding keys, survivors NEED to finish a gen. Killers? They can theoretically get all 12 hookstates with only 4 hooks. Survivors cannot open exit gates by only doing 2 gens. "difference in amount of objectives" right? Killers need to be skilled at manipulating their objectives while interrupting survivors as much as possible, where survivors need to be good at sabotaging killer manipulation alone so their teammates wont be interrupted. You cannot say "survivors only need 5 gens when the killer needs 12 hooks" when 12 hookstates can be done before survivors can do any gens, but survivors cannot do 5 gens while the killer gets 0 hooks unless the killer is AFK. That fact alone shows that the objectives cannot be compared to each other.
"Now put in some breakable walls the need to break to prevent a god/infinite loop to add even more to it."
Oh boo hoo, a wall that was always planned there before, that requires 2 seconds investing to turn a 60 second loop into a 20 second one, what a bad investment of time. Map balancing is a thing. It's part of setting up chase. Hag is a key example of investing time early on to save time later. There are no issues with breakable walls. You get them when you have time to get them or are forced to get them, you should not get them when you cannot afford to. If you have that much of an issue with breakables, run Brutal Strength.
"The chances are small that you block a window or pallet as killer when you're chasing a survivor."
Chances of blocking are actually pretty big, I get 30% more hits by just blocking while either in fatique or when I have any other animation where I can move. It's one of the most powerful aspects on Legion that is heavily unused.
"You vault through a window and bodyblock that window by just standing there? Sure mate you go ahead, I'll run to another loop then and waste even more time of you."
You do realize the context is Haddonfield right? If anyone is outside on the balcony, they cannot go back in untill you leave the window. You can pre-walk to windows that are not close to gens to block it for an easy hit. Bodyblocking windows upstairs to limit survivor escapes is by far the easiest way to get hits.
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