you're playing Legion wrong, and here is why
HOW TO TUNNEL A SURVIVOR WITH LEGION
(a step-by-step guide for scrubs)
Step 1 - Injure the survivor with Deep Wound. This is free, and instant. It's the fastest injury in the game. You're already halfway to downing this person with no effort.
Step 2 - Use your speed boost to catch up to the survivor. This happens almost immediately also. Boy that's nice and fast.
Step 3 - DO NOT HIT THE SURVIVOR WITH A 2ND DEEP WOUND LIKE A SCRUB! You can do it. I have faith in you. I know it's tempting to swing. They are right there! SO JUICY!
Step 4 - End the ability when on top of the survivor, or get in front of them and body block - wait WHAT! But... but... the cool down. Yeah, well. Guess who else has a similar cool down? The Wraith's wailing bell.
Step 5 - Close the gap. Yes, believe it or not, you can still chase survivors down with 110% movement speed. No it is not impossible. Yes it takes a bit longer. But you're literally already over halfway to downing this survivor with almost no time invested.
Step 6 - Hit the survivor with a normal attack.
Step 7 - Hook your prey.
You should only do the steps above once you have injured all the survivors in the surrounding area. If the survivor is by himself, then just tunnel.
I"m honestly tired of seeing scrub killers spam Deep Wound, give the survivor a free speed boost + attack cool down + ability cool down, then whine about how "underpowered" this killer is. You're using the killer wrong. Every single killer in this game, with the exception of the Nurse, still relies on a base attack to down survivors. Deep Wound is not designed to be easy mode for bad killers, and no ability should be designed to just be spammed. The Hag, The Huntress, and the Spirit all have 110% movement speed. All of those killers still rely on the base attack in some way, and do not simply ability spam 100% of the time.
The only useful change might be to give the killer 112.5% movement speed, but it may end up overpowered. Try playing the killer correctly first before buffing and potentially overpowering this killer.
Comments
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Me like2
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@bigemu1 said:
HOW TO TUNNEL A SURVIVOR WITH LEGION
(a step-by-step guide for scrubs)
Step 1 - Injure the survivor with Deep Wound. This is free, and instant. It's the fastest injury in the game. You're already halfway to downing this person with no effort.
Step 2 - Use your speed boost to catch up to the survivor. This happens almost immediately also. Boy that's nice and fast.
Step 3 - DO NOT HIT THE SURVIVOR WITH A 2ND DEEP WOUND LIKE A SCRUB. You can do it. I have faith in you. I know it's tempting to swing. They are right there! SO JUICY!
Step 4 - End the ability when on top of the survivor, or get in front of them and body block - wait WHAT! But... but... the cool down. Yeah, well. Guess who else has a similar cool down? The Wraith.
Step 5 - Close the gap. Yes, believe it or not, you can still chase survivors down with 110% movement speed. No it is not impossible. Yes it takes a bit longer. But you're literally already over halfway to downing this survivor with almost no time invested.
Step 6 - Hit the survivor with a normal attack.
Step 7 - Hook your prey.You should only do the steps above once you have injured all the survivors in the surrounding area. If the survivor is by himself, then just tunnel.
I"m honestly tired of seeing scrub killers spam Deep Wound, give the survivor a free speed boost + attack cool down + ability cool down, then whine about how "underpowered" this killer is. You're using the killer wrong. Every single killer in this game, with the exception of the Nurse, still relies on a base attack to down survivors. Deep Wound is not designed to be easy mode for bad killers, and no ability should be designed to just be spammed. The Hag, The Huntress, and the Spirit all have 110% movement speed. All of those killers still rely on the base attack in some way, and do not simply ability spam 100% of the time.
The only useful change might be to give the killer 112.5% movement speed, but it may end up overpowered. Try playing the killer correctly first before buffing and potentially overpowering this killer.
pretty well put however you should also inform people to chase theyre pray near gens that way while the super long chase gos on you may be able to get another hit off someone else
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Nice effort, everyone has been trying to tell people this for days though but they always double hit and then complain about a double stun. Even Monto and Truetalent were moaning about the double stun in their recent videos because they were doing the double hit. Which just spreads more misinformation.
Also in step 1 you should add that after wounding a survivor they should look around for other auras first, if they see some chase them, if not commit to chasing the first survivor.
Because some people are content to focus on downing 1 even when ther survivors are nearby.
Edit: Could mods sticky this? I feel it would help if people could try Legion in this way before declaring he's way below Freddy. People just arent aware because cancelling the power without getting that second hit feels unintuitive.2 -
Sounds like unintended gameplay.
I can already imagine the devs noticing this and removing the bodyblocking part (just like myers stalking has no bodblock)0 -
to be honest i think we all can see that unless every new survivor buff is reversed and perks are nerfed and the legion ones are buffed the legion probably wont get anywhere because when this patch goes live and it doesnt have any changes sweaty sfws wil never have a single game were one of them dies
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@bigemu1 said:
HOW TO TUNNEL A SURVIVOR WITH LEGION
(a step-by-step guide for scrubs)
Step 1 - Injure the survivor with Deep Wound. This is free, and instant. It's the fastest injury in the game. You're already halfway to downing this person with no effort.
Step 2 - Use your speed boost to catch up to the survivor. This happens almost immediately also. Boy that's nice and fast.If you are extremaly lucky you can hit the second survivor, otherwise - smart ones will just flee/won't group up when facing Legion and you won't hit 2/3/4 of them.
Step 3 - DO NOT HIT THE SURVIVOR WITH A 2ND DEEP WOUND LIKE A SCRUB. You can do it. I have faith in you. I know it's tempting to swing. They are right there! SO JUICY!
Step 4 - End the ability when on top of the survivor, or get in front of them and body block - wait WHAT! But... but... the cool down. Yeah, well. Guess who else has a similar cool down? The Wraith.By the time you did this the first survivor already mended. Also you can't "get in front of them and bodyblock" because of one simple reason- you move only 120%MS speed, while they gain 150%MS when you hit them, and then normal 100%, and that just lets you gain enough distance to hit them again, not get in front of them and bodyblock. Also as you mentioned - stun. The survivor gains even more distance.
Step 5 - Close the gap. Yes, believe it or not, you can still chase survivors down with 110% movement speed. No it is not impossible. Yes it takes a bit longer. But you're literally already over halfway to downing this survivor with almost no time invested.
Step 6 - Hit the survivor with a normal attack.
Step 7 - Hook your prey.You write it as if it was so easy to chase and down a survivor with 110%MS. No, it is almost impossible against competent, mid-high rank looper. He/she won't let you get to him close, orat least not fast. So tell me - what's the point of using a killer with 110% MS speed while in chase if you can use other, better ones, even damn Freddy?
So, in the case of Legion, you have 2 ways of downing the surv - at the beginning hit as many as you can (useless, because when you chase the last one, the others are already mended) and:
a) Try to chase him as a 110% MS killer, which is literally pain in the ass and even Freddy can do it better.
b) Tryhard to hit the surv 4 times with Frenzy attack.What's the point of doing a) and b)? All killers can do it better, and this is the thing that places him at the bottom of tier list. That's the thing that makes him useless killer made by people, that do not play their own game/don't know anything about it and don't know how is it on mid-high ranks. Things that may work on low ranks (aka hitting multiple survivors with Frenzy, and many of them will just don't remember to mend) won't work on mid-high ranks.
Watch it here, there were some decent playing Legions, and see how survivors wrecked them:
Post edited by RSB on1 -
I would like to see this bodyblocking strat in play. Any clips out there?
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Yes. Someone with a pig avatar posted their clip the other day but I can't find it.Doultime said:I would like to see this bodyblocking strat in play. Any clips out there?
Alternatively, check out Dowseygg on twitch. He was doing the same strategy the other day when he was on the ptb.
Edit: Found it!
https://clips.twitch.tv/FlirtyPoliteBatteryBatChest
You'll notice that this person doesn't hit Jake a second time. That's the important part.
So they take a quick stun, but they can then M1 the survivor.
If you hit a person whose already suffering from deep wound, you get the attack cooldown/weapon wipe, then the survivor gets a speed boost, and then you suffer the stun. Those 3 things add to the distance.
Thats why after you've hit a survivor in frenzy and refilled your frenzy meter, you use it to catch up to them, block them and manually cancel the frenzy with M2.3 -
the bodyblocking doesn't work most of the time.
Also what's the point? freddy gets a free hit after dream transition if he uses good addons too, the difference is he'll stay at 115% ms while legion sprints at a laughable 120%.
ppl here defending a 110% ms char that has a 120% sprint and needs 5 hits to down a survivor are hillarious, citing some noname streamer because he got a few stuns in against ppl who don't know of this strategy (hint, the stun is long enough for the survivor to reach a different loop)
I bet it's the exitgate block clip which is stupidly situational btw. Most topkillers already said it: there's no reason to play him over any other killer beyond being fun.
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Well the manually exit frenzy works a lot better than double stabbing for tunneling and the ocassional bodyblock helps the chase, but is weird to pull off and, how others point out, all the other killers make better use of those tools. The only reedeeming part is the power to easily tag survivors and waste their time with mends and heals, but is not that great past that. We will see buffs before/at launch im sure of it and small tweaks will help them a lot get that mid tier people love
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Yeah Freddy with his best add ons.MhhBurgers said:the bodyblocking doesn't work most of the time.
Also what's the point? freddy gets a free hit after dream transition if he uses good addons too, the difference is he'll stay at 115% ms while legion sprints at a laughable 120%.
ppl here defending a 110% ms char that has a 120% sprint and needs 5 hits to down a survivor are hillarious, citing some noname streamer because he got a few stuns in against ppl who don't know of this strategy (hint, the stun is long enough for the survivor to reach a different loop)
I bet it's the exitgate block clip which is stupidly situational btw. Most topkillers already said it: there's no reason to play him over any other killer beyond being fun.
With basic freddy you put them asleep and they run to a nearby pallet so no he doesn't get a free hit. Plus Legion can tag multiple people in a couple of seconds. Freddy cant.
To compare freddy and legion in that manner is laughable.
And if you really want to get into freddy vs legion, at least legion foesnt have to wait 10 seconds to hit people, he can actually stop them going out the exit gates, or immediately stop a teammate who is healing them, he might be 110% speed but at least he doesn't have to wait 10 seconds just to hit them!
5 hits to down? Yeah because you're not meant to use his M2 to down otherwise he would be too powerful.
Also his strategy DOES work in certain places. Quite a few spots on the map allow it or when there's no pallets close enough. I've seen it a number of times. Near a loop no it doesn't work, he's a bit like wraith in that regard but admittedly not as good.
Look nobody is saying hes a strong killer. We're just saying that to say he's 100 levels below Freddy is hyperbole by people who aren't even playing him correctly.2 -
@RSB said:
By the time you did this the first survivor already mended. Also you can't "get in front of them and bodyblock" because of one simple reason- you move only 120%MS speed, while they gain 150%MS when you hit them, and then normal 100%, and that just lets you gain enough distance to hit them again, not get in front of them and bodyblock. Also as you mentioned - stun. The survivor gains even more distance.Is Frenzy confirmed to be 120%? Because it looks WAY faster than that, like 130 maybe. Sprint Burst just barely stays ahead of it.
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@friendlykillermain said:
to be honest i think we all can see that unless every new survivor buff is reversed and perks are nerfed and the legion ones are buffed the legion probably wont get anywhere because when this patch goes live and it doesnt have any changes sweaty sfws wil never have a single game were one of them diesYes because every swf group is a sweaty bunch of tryhards, and each time you and the rest use that argument you lose all credibility. It's the same thing after every PTB goes live the same arguments and lo and behold the sky isn't falling after all.
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@The_Crusader said:
Yeah Freddy with his best add ons.
With basic freddy you put them asleep and they run to a nearby pallet so no he doesn't get a free hit. Plus Legion can tag multiple people in a couple of seconds. Freddy cant.
To compare freddy and legion in that manner is laughable.
And if you really want to get into freddy vs legion, at least legion foesnt have to wait 10 seconds to hit people, he can actually stop them going out the exit gates, or immediately stop a teammate who is healing them, he might be 110% speed but at least he doesn't have to wait 10 seconds just to hit them!
5 hits to down? Yeah because you're not meant to use his M2 to down otherwise he would be too powerful.
Also his strategy DOES work in certain places. Quite a few spots on the map allow it or when there's no pallets close enough. I've seen it a number of times. Near a loop no it doesn't work, he's a bit like wraith in that regard but admittedly not as good.
Look nobody is saying hes a strong killer. We're just saying that to say he's 100 levels below Freddy is hyperbole by people who aren't even playing him correctly.
A million times this. But any time you suggest he's a viable killer, people attack you like you're claiming he's a tier 1 killer. Fanboys blindly link their favorite streamer's videos and link videos of Legion getting dusted by survivors, and its always (1) a video of a trash killer (2) not doing the strategy I have laid out.
I'm not even saying he DOESN'T need a minor buff of some kind. I'm saying the complain train that people are making this out to be is not even close, because no one is playing the killer right. They continue to link videos and cite evidence of people playing like idiots and spamming M2.
Personally I think any new killer should set the bar. There is almost always power creep in any game, because you have to sell the new content. But the devs in DBD do a nice job of staying fair and attempting to be balanced instead of appeasing all the initial whining, possibly at the cost of sales. Currently, I put him low to low-middle of the pack when played correctly. AT MOST, I suggest 112.5% movement speed top raise him closer to the middle, middle-high tier.
@Doultime said:
I would like to see this bodyblocking strat in play. Any clips out there?Nothing, he made that up to push his agenda, and make devs not buff the Legion.
Lol, that's it. I have an agenda. I would love to hear you elaborate on what exactly you think my goal is. The fact that someone had to link a video to show you that it works instead of trying it for yourself speaks volumes.
@RSB said:
@bigemu1 said:
Step 3 - DO NOT HIT THE SURVIVOR WITH A 2ND DEEP WOUND LIKE A SCRUB. You can do it. I have faith in you. I know it's tempting to swing. They are right there! SO JUICY!
Step 4 - End the ability when on top of the survivor, or get in front of them and body block - wait WHAT! But... but... the cool down. Yeah, well. Guess who else has a similar cool down? The Wraith.By the time you did this the first survivor already mended. Also you can't "get in front of them and bodyblock" because of one simple reason- you move only 120%MS speed, while they gain 150%MS when you hit them, and then normal 100%, and that just lets you gain enough distance to hit them again, not get in front of them and bodyblock. Also as you mentioned - stun. The survivor gains even more distance.
WHAT. You honestly believe that you can mend between my M2, me catching you, ending the ability, and hitting you with an M1. You're... you're joking right? Just wow. Honestly I don't even feel like reading the rest of your post after this word vomit. It's a complete waste of my time.
@RSB said:
@bigemu1 said:
Step 5 - Close the gap. Yes, believe it or not, you can still chase survivors down with 110% movement speed. No it is not impossible. Yes it takes a bit longer. But you're literally already over halfway to downing this survivor with almost no time invested.
Step 6 - Hit the survivor with a normal attack.
Step 7 - Hook your prey.You write it as if it was so easy to chase and down a survivor with 110%MS. No, it is almost impossible against competent, mid-high rank looper. He/she won't let you get to him close, orat least not fast. So tell me - what's the point of using a killer with 110% MS speed while in chase if you can use other, better ones, even damn Freddy?
So, in the case of Legion, you have 2 ways of downing the surv - at the beginning hit as many as you can (useless, because when you chase the last one, the others are already mended) and:
a) Try to chase him as a 110% MS killer, which is literally pain in the ass and even Freddy can do it better.
b) Tryhard to hit the surv 4 times with Frenzy attack.What's the point of doing a) and b)? All killers can do it better, and this is the thing that places him at the bottom of tier list. That's the thing that makes him useless killer made by people, that do not play their own game/don't know anything about it and don't know how is it on mid-high ranks. Things that may work on low ranks (aka hitting multiple survivors with Frenzy, and many of them will just don't remember to mend) won't work on mid-high ranks.
How it is that you cannot comprehend how physically close you actually are to the survivor at the end of the ability cooldown? What kind of distance do you think you are chasing over? How it is that you cannot comprehend how fast and how little time is spent getting from the first M2 hit to the end of the ability cooldown on top of the survivor? How is it that you are unable to force pallet drops by swinging through pallets, or use perks that coincide with forcing pallet drops on a 110% movement speed killer for the final blow. No where did I say 110% chases are easy. It just takes longer. It's made up for on the front end. There is and will always be God pallets you have to force, and infinite loop areas you'll have to abandon in certain circumstances. This killer is amazing at abandoning the chase if the circumstance isn't right. It's his entire design. You are describing the 10% case. I am describing a play style that is the 70% case on this killer, where you are in the open, where you were able to body block, where the survivor tried to 360 your feigned M2 and you can insta-down them coming off the cooldown, and where it is a non-loopable area with a simple pallet you can mind game, or a pallet you can force down.
You can stop referencing mid-high play as though I'm a rank 20 in my PTB testing. It's such an old and tired method of blindly discrediting someone it's as laughable as a personal attack over a video game discussion. Everyone even relatively decent in this game is rank 1. If you think rank 1 is even an achievement, then there's something wrong. The game is literally designed for guaranteed black PIPs, and relatively easy 1 PIPs. I have literally failed at attempting to de-PIP in this game to play with lower ranked IRL friends.
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If survivor is still running at you when you go ahead to get your CD done, then that survivor is a moron..
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@AlexAnarchy said:
If survivor is still running at you when you go ahead to get your CD done, then that survivor is a moron..Agreed and having played against Legion on PTB the smart ones didn't waste a 2nd hit on you, they hit you went for anyone close and if no one was around played like Wraith. They'd get close and m1 you, bam you're down then hooked.
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I can't ptb until monday but I will try this strat asap I really want to play the legion at launch. Any youtuber/streamer other than Dowseygg that manually exits frenzy?
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@bigemu1 said:
@The_Crusader said:
Yeah Freddy with his best add ons.
With basic freddy you put them asleep and they run to a nearby pallet so no he doesn't get a free hit. Plus Legion can tag multiple people in a couple of seconds. Freddy cant.
To compare freddy and legion in that manner is laughable.
And if you really want to get into freddy vs legion, at least legion foesnt have to wait 10 seconds to hit people, he can actually stop them going out the exit gates, or immediately stop a teammate who is healing them, he might be 110% speed but at least he doesn't have to wait 10 seconds just to hit them!
5 hits to down? Yeah because you're not meant to use his M2 to down otherwise he would be too powerful.
Also his strategy DOES work in certain places. Quite a few spots on the map allow it or when there's no pallets close enough. I've seen it a number of times. Near a loop no it doesn't work, he's a bit like wraith in that regard but admittedly not as good.
Look nobody is saying hes a strong killer. We're just saying that to say he's 100 levels below Freddy is hyperbole by people who aren't even playing him correctly.
A million times this. But any time you suggest he's a viable killer, people attack you like you're claiming he's a tier 1 killer. Fanboys blindly link their favorite streamer's videos and link videos of Legion getting dusted by survivors, and its always (1) a video of a trash killer (2) not doing the strategy I have laid out.
I'm not even saying he DOESN'T need a minor buff of some kind. I'm saying the complain train that people are making this out to be is not even close, because no one is playing the killer right. They continue to link videos and cite evidence of people playing like idiots and spamming M2.
Personally I think any new killer should set the bar. There is almost always power creep in any game, because you have to sell the new content. But the devs in DBD do a nice job of staying fair and attempting to be balanced instead of appeasing all the initial whining, possibly at the cost of sales. Currently, I put him low to low-middle of the pack when played correctly. AT MOST, I suggest 112.5% movement speed top raise him closer to the middle, middle-high tier.
@Doultime said:
I would like to see this bodyblocking strat in play. Any clips out there?Nothing, he made that up to push his agenda, and make devs not buff the Legion.
Lol, that's it. I have an agenda. I would love to hear you elaborate on what exactly you think my goal is. The fact that someone had to link a video to show you that it works instead of trying it for yourself speaks volumes.
@RSB said:
@bigemu1 said:
Step 3 - DO NOT HIT THE SURVIVOR WITH A 2ND DEEP WOUND LIKE A SCRUB. You can do it. I have faith in you. I know it's tempting to swing. They are right there! SO JUICY!
Step 4 - End the ability when on top of the survivor, or get in front of them and body block - wait WHAT! But... but... the cool down. Yeah, well. Guess who else has a similar cool down? The Wraith.By the time you did this the first survivor already mended. Also you can't "get in front of them and bodyblock" because of one simple reason- you move only 120%MS speed, while they gain 150%MS when you hit them, and then normal 100%, and that just lets you gain enough distance to hit them again, not get in front of them and bodyblock. Also as you mentioned - stun. The survivor gains even more distance.
WHAT. You honestly believe that you can mend between my M2, me catching you, ending the ability, and hitting you with an M1. You're... you're joking right? Just wow. Honestly I don't even feel like reading the rest of your post after this word vomit. It's a complete waste of my time.
@RSB said:
@bigemu1 said:
Step 5 - Close the gap. Yes, believe it or not, you can still chase survivors down with 110% movement speed. No it is not impossible. Yes it takes a bit longer. But you're literally already over halfway to downing this survivor with almost no time invested.
Step 6 - Hit the survivor with a normal attack.
Step 7 - Hook your prey.You write it as if it was so easy to chase and down a survivor with 110%MS. No, it is almost impossible against competent, mid-high rank looper. He/she won't let you get to him close, orat least not fast. So tell me - what's the point of using a killer with 110% MS speed while in chase if you can use other, better ones, even damn Freddy?
So, in the case of Legion, you have 2 ways of downing the surv - at the beginning hit as many as you can (useless, because when you chase the last one, the others are already mended) and:
a) Try to chase him as a 110% MS killer, which is literally pain in the ass and even Freddy can do it better.
b) Tryhard to hit the surv 4 times with Frenzy attack.What's the point of doing a) and b)? All killers can do it better, and this is the thing that places him at the bottom of tier list. That's the thing that makes him useless killer made by people, that do not play their own game/don't know anything about it and don't know how is it on mid-high ranks. Things that may work on low ranks (aka hitting multiple survivors with Frenzy, and many of them will just don't remember to mend) won't work on mid-high ranks.
How it is that you cannot comprehend how physically close you actually are to the survivor at the end of the ability cooldown? What kind of distance do you think you are chasing over? How it is that you cannot comprehend how fast and how little time is spent getting from the first M2 hit to the end of the ability cooldown on top of the survivor? How is it that you are unable to force pallet drops by swinging through pallets, or use perks that coincide with forcing pallet drops on a 110% movement speed killer for the final blow. No where did I say 110% chases are easy. It just takes longer. It's made up for on the front end. There is and will always be God pallets you have to force, and infinite loop areas you'll have to abandon in certain circumstances. This killer is amazing at abandoning the chase if the circumstance isn't right. It's his entire design. You are describing the 10% case. I am describing a play style that is the 70% case on this killer, where you are in the open, where you were able to body block, where the survivor tried to 360 your feigned M2 and you can insta-down them coming off the cooldown, and where it is a non-loopable area with a simple pallet you can mind game, or a pallet you can force down.
You can stop referencing mid-high play as though I'm a rank 20 in my PTB testing. It's such an old and tired method of blindly discrediting someone it's as laughable as a personal attack over a video game discussion. Everyone even relatively decent in this game is rank 1. If you think rank 1 is even an achievement, then there's something wrong. The game is literally designed for guaranteed black PIPs, and relatively easy 1 PIPs. I have literally failed at attempting to de-PIP in this game to play with lower ranked IRL friends.
You can pretend all you want, that Legion is fine, that "having trouble to down survivors as him is fine", that this tactic actually "works". You won't fool any intelligent player, you can only boost the survivors' agenda, that wants all killers to be on Legion's level.
You can pat yourself on the shoulder all you want - it won't change the opinion of any of normal players.
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Being close minded doesn't help the discussion. Every single legion gameplay out there is double hitting in frenzy. Manyually exiting frenzy might be a viable strat. No one is saying legion should stay the way it is, at least im not, and I think he needs some buffs but they are not freddy tier.2
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@Doultime said:
Being close minded doesn't help the discussion. Every single legion gameplay out there is double hitting in frenzy. Manyually exiting frenzy might be a viable strat. No one is saying legion should stay the way it is, at least im not, and I think he needs some buffs but they are not freddy tier.Yeah this is the point. Not sure why the other guy assumes it's all a survivor conspiracy theory.
Right now Legion is weak at downing as he's like a 110% Wraith without the speed boost from unlocking, however his stun is a bit quicker than an add-on less uncloak I believe.
Having said that Wraith can't turn around and injure 4 survivors in the span of 10-15 seconds like Legion can, nor can he keep them pressured to stay injured all game. So it's a trade off.
He;s low-mid tier for sure but the people calling him broken are the ones who keep saying it takes him 4-5 hits to down people, they don't get that he isn't meant to down them that way.
Freddy is legit broken. You down someone, 3 other survivors run along to heal, you can't pick them up, you can't hit them away for 7 seconds, you can't catch people running to the exit gates if they're not asleep etc
Legion isn't that bad.
Watching more gameplay people can mindgame survivors and get hits fairly easily. However on loops where it's not possible to mindgame yeah his slow speed really hurts him. I think this 112.5% movement speed might be an idea. 115% would definitely be too strong as when people do play him well survivors are injured almost all game, and very often they're also being hit with deep wound too so they're constantly getting slowed down. 110% is doable in open areas or when pallets are gone but makes some loops very difficult and a large time waste. The answer has to be a speed between 110 %- 115%.
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@powerbats said:
@friendlykillermain said:
to be honest i think we all can see that unless every new survivor buff is reversed and perks are nerfed and the legion ones are buffed the legion probably wont get anywhere because when this patch goes live and it doesnt have any changes sweaty sfws wil never have a single game were one of them diesYes because every swf group is a sweaty bunch of tryhards, and each time you and the rest use that argument you lose all credibility. It's the same thing after every PTB goes live the same arguments and lo and behold the sky isn't falling after all.
im not saying their all sweaty in fact gasp scandal i play sfw with a friend from time to time chill swf does exist im talking about the tryhards and how much more formidable they will be
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Your post is missing example, I shall provide one
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@friendlykillermain said:
@powerbats said:
@friendlykillermain said:
to be honest i think we all can see that unless every new survivor buff is reversed and perks are nerfed and the legion ones are buffed the legion probably wont get anywhere because when this patch goes live and it doesnt have any changes sweaty sfws wil never have a single game were one of them diesYes because every swf group is a sweaty bunch of tryhards, and each time you and the rest use that argument you lose all credibility. It's the same thing after every PTB goes live the same arguments and lo and behold the sky isn't falling after all.
im not saying their all sweaty in fact gasp scandal i play sfw with a friend from time to time chill swf does exist im talking about the tryhards and how much more formidable they will be
Oh I understand that completely and i've run into some groups on both sides and even had some friends go full toxic tryhard with me in group. I'm not playing with the toxic tryhards anymore and when I do group up we do try but we try to have fun more than anything.
We laugh at our mistakes and the killers equally and generally both sides have a good time.
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@powerbats said:
@friendlykillermain said:
@powerbats said:
@friendlykillermain said:
to be honest i think we all can see that unless every new survivor buff is reversed and perks are nerfed and the legion ones are buffed the legion probably wont get anywhere because when this patch goes live and it doesnt have any changes sweaty sfws wil never have a single game were one of them diesYes because every swf group is a sweaty bunch of tryhards, and each time you and the rest use that argument you lose all credibility. It's the same thing after every PTB goes live the same arguments and lo and behold the sky isn't falling after all.
im not saying their all sweaty in fact gasp scandal i play sfw with a friend from time to time chill swf does exist im talking about the tryhards and how much more formidable they will be
Oh I understand that completely and i've run into some groups on both sides and even had some friends go full toxic tryhard with me in group. I'm not playing with the toxic tryhards anymore and when I do group up we do try but we try to have fun more than anything.
We laugh at our mistakes and the killers equally and generally both sides have a good time.
that
that right their is why i will never ask for them to remove swf because when you dont go toxic tryhard and invite the killer to the chat and you all just have a great time and even go to kyf and rematch again and again each person switching roles and taking turns playing killer and eventually you add another friend to play with later.
those are the best moments you can experience in this game and thats why even though i feel some form of swf nerf should happen i will never agree it should be removed outright1 -
https://clips.twitch.tv/AlertArtsyMoonVoHiYo?tt
Here's another strategy people are using. Looks a bit cheap to be honest.
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-From what you are saying u mean how to adapt to Legion's power,the killer should have a variety of playstyles that fit and come with advantages and disadvantages .The fact that a killer must use 2-3 times of playing, or 2 types of The killers power should be complementary to his basic moves,The Huntress has a powerfull ability that (in my opinion )in the state of the game,a balanced killer in an unbalanced game.We don't need a new balanced killer,we need a inbalanced killer that can fit besides Hillbilly and Nurse.PLUS the fact that with the new patch even they wont be as powerful anymore because of the visual changes (hidden survivor Cough* Claudette Cought* and the new survivor anti-aura Perk).Playing a balanced killer is frustrateing in a inbalanced game.
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legion just needs a nerf to deepwound to buff him
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@Dragonredking said:
Your post is missing example, I shall provide oneThe problem with this example is that's quite specific. Yes it works here on the gate. But keep in mind that frenzy was used against an already running survivor in a quite open area in a race towards the gate. The block worked because the killer started the race from an angle that allowed to block the survivor.
In many scenarios survivors could use safe/loop spots to prevent the killer from getting infront of them and block.
And keep in mind as soon as the survivor got you into a looping scenario you either try to catch them in that one with 110% movement speed or try to pull a block off again. It's clearly a strategy you can't rely 100% all the time.
Besides that a killer and their power aren't meant to force you into one specific playstyle. Wraith can bodyblock with AddOns too, but that's just one possible strategy. Legions playstyles feel either cheap or way frustrating to pull off.And to all fairness, even one of the Devs told us in the forum that the core intention of this killer was, that you have an advantage in getting first hits and an disadvantage for the second. Problem is in the current state of the game balancing in this two modes is off. First so much guaranteed that survivors don't see much sense in healing themselfs. Second is too much as well, that decent survivor can loop Legion to hell with their low movement speed.
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@Freudentrauma said:
@Dragonredking said:
Your post is missing example, I shall provide oneThe problem with this example is that's quite specific. Yes it works here on the gate. But keep in mind that frenzy was used against an already running survivor in a quite open area in a race towards the gate. The block worked because the killer started the race from an angle that allowed to block the survivor.
In many scenarios survivors could use safe/loop spots to prevent the killer from getting infront of them and block.
And keep in mind as soon as the survivor got you into a looping scenario you either try to catch them in that one with 110% movement speed or try to pull a block off again. It's clearly a strategy you can't rely 100% all the time.
Besides that a killer and their power aren't meant to force you into one specific playstyle. Wraith can bodyblock with AddOns too, but that's just one possible strategy. Legions playstyles feel either cheap or way frustrating to pull off.And to all fairness, even one of the Devs told us in the forum that the core intention of this killer was, that you have an advantage in getting first hits and an disadvantage for the second. Problem is in the current state of the game balancing in this two modes is off. First so much guaranteed that survivors don't see much sense in healing themselfs. Second is too much as well, that decent survivor can loop Legion to hell with their low movement speed.
I totally agree with you that this is a best case scenario, but there are other scenarios like this, that seem to me comprise about 70% of all chase scenarios when I've tested:
(1) You body block and then down them instantly with M1 (like the video)
(2) They try to 360 you thinking you're going to M2 and the cool down ends with you still on top of them (like the video)
(3) You end the chase in an open-space area, not near a pallet or window - in this circumstance its exactly like teleporting to a trap on the Hag (the approximate size of the gap). Its a LITTLE bit larger, but i will totally take a slightly larger gap to basically have the 1st M2 hit being guaranteed. When they're in the open its super easy to close the gap with 110%.The remaining 20% of tunnel scenarios end (after the 1st M2 hit) with you at a pallet that you can still mind game with 110% speed, or a small/reasonable loop area. This one takes longer, but its exactly like forcing pallets down etc. on Hag. The only difference is on Hag you can end the mind game and force them to run away from the pallet area by setting a trap on the pallet. Realistically you spend the exact same amount of time on Legion just swinging through the pallet, forcing the drop, and carrying pallet perks. If they're dropping pallets nonstop, you're winning.
The final 10% of scenarios are where after the 1st hit they end up running to a nearby God pallet or one of the game's 4 or 5 infinite loop areas, in which case you're basically screwed on a 110% killer. If you chase you'll waste too much time. BUT, the benefit is you can recognize these areas, and after the 1st M2 hit, just use the speed boost to ignore the survivor and relocate yourself or go monitor gens. If you had to do this all the time, I agree, you would be screwed. But this is the 10% case not the 70% case. If the survivor is a highly skilled/nuisance survivor near a God pallet or a crazy loop area and teabags at you, you can still always be a dick and M2 spam him for a guaranteed down, and soft camp the hook to start a snowball effect.
All of this just describes Legion's ability to down and tunnel. It doesn't factor his ability to move across the map with the ability or the ability to injury back-to-back survivors in the area before you tunnel the final survivor.
He's legit not that bad.
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Sorry for so many words, but to be fair I want to point out there there is survivor counterplay to the strategy I have suggested above that people are not currently doing, hence I'm still not sure whether this killer needs a buff, and if so, to what degree. So for example.
(1) Right now, even high rank survivors, keep 360'ing waiting for the second M2, and screw themselves while I come off the cool down. Once high rank survivors start to figure out that they are actually supposed to just keep running, it changes things unless its in an open space.
(2) Most survivors (even high rank) keep using and wasting abilities like Dead Hard to avoid the first blow, which is a huge waste. If they're smart, they'll take the 1st M2 hit and save Dead Hard to extend the M1 110% chase I describe above. Most actually aren't surprisingly.
Those are two major things I see survivors doing wrong, even at high rank, mostly driven by the fact that Legion killers are spamming M2. The strategy pieces on both sides (survivor and killer) haven't settled yet to find optimal gameplay. That's the point of this post. Let's all start playing both sides of the equation correctly so we can accurately determine what to do, instead of screaming "off with his head". After 1 day of gameplay.
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The point of the Killer is to get easy hits but it takes him longer to down people this really isn't a really good way to play him nor is it the intended way to play him. not only that but survivors will just keep running after they figure out that there litterly is no pressure in getting hit the 2nd time and that it will actually just help them a shitload because they will get a second Sprintburst. He definetly isn't a good killer but definetly as bad or worst than Freddy but he will definetly need buffs the problem with him is that survivors have no pressure when beeing injured or affected by deepwound, and that he can't down survivors with his ability(Franks Mixtape should be default)
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipiUWXPyM7o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9oy7ZmFrsIE
