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Why is Wraith’s Uncloak Better than Pig’s Dash?
Wraith is at the point where his uncloak is essentially just a Pig Dash with less counterplay on the Survivor side.
Does that mean Pig should get some heavy buffs or Wraith should get nerfed?
Comments
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Because Wraith can't put a bear trap on your head.
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But he can move across the map at 150%+ while in stealth, don’t act like that doesn’t save as much time as Pigs traps buy her.
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That's actually a decent point, and I wondered that myself for a bit.
Wraith's stealth is way better than Pigs, Wraiths pallet play is way better than Pigs, Wraiths map control is way better than Pigs, and Wraiths find and chase potential are way better than Pigs.
Sure, Pig has RNG traps, but I do ask myself if those alone are really worth being inferior in every other way to Wraith. The answer to myself is typically no since I rank Wraith much higher than her however.
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Normally I wouldn't make buff/nerf propositions just because one killer is weaker than one other; however their play-styles are so similar and yet so different in power level at the moment that I begin to wonder.
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Yeah. Ms. Piggy has it rough right now. I feel like her extremely slow crouch speed isn’t justified at this point when you compare her to Ghost Face and Wraith’s stealth mechanics.
And her Dash could do with some updates like at bare minimum the Dash speed and missed attack add-ons should be base kit.
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I'm not saying Pig's as good as Wraith is now, i'm saying that Wraith's ambush is better because that's literally his entire kit. That's what he does the best-- getting ambush attacks on you.
With Pig, her ambush is half her kit. It's not her main focus, so of course it's not on par.
She should definitely be improved, though.
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If you want an actual answer as to why Wraith's uncloak is so much better: Speed.
A cloaked Wraith moves at 6 meters per second or more with Windstorm. A crouching Pig moves at 3.6. One moves at Sprint Burst speed and the other slower than a Survivor.
When you're playing Pig and you want to use your dash at a loop, you have to crouch down to your slower state and then hold still to charge the dash. This means that if a Survivor just runs away from the loop when you crouch, your only viable option is to slowly stand back up into 115 M1 Killer mode and hope you can catch up—which you won't. So you crouch at a pallet and then the Survivor just W keys over to the next one.
When you're playing Wraith and you want to use your uncloak at a loop, and the Survivor just runs away, you run up to them at 6 meters per second, uncloak, and then get them with the lunge + uncloak speed boost. Unless they position themselves very well at the loop or get a very well-timed/lucky pallet drop, they're getting hit, no matter what.
There's also the fact that when you lunge while receiving the speed boost, you move much, MUCH faster than a Pig dash and cover distance in a much shorter amount of time. It's faster, more expedient, and less reactable.
So yeah, Wraith wins purely because, in the words of the gnome himself, he's fast as fucc, boi.
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Wraith only has himself and his cloak just play around it and you will be fine
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The uncloak dash with the enhanced lunge is a relatively new part of his kit. A year ago Wraith didn’t really have pallet play at all and his power was mainly for getting hits on Survivors that didn’t know he was coming.
So I don’t think you can really say that the uncloak dash is Wraith’s entire kit. Especially since they gave him base kit map mobility and true invisibility.
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Your posts still confuse me. Are you like asking why as in why is it a stronger tool, or why as in why have the devs made Wraith's power stronger than Pig's?
And neither killer should get nerfed or buffed based solely on the fact that Wraith is better than Pig. But, Pig could do with some changes, mainly her RNG on her traps to become more consistently better, like Trapper's traps. Because Wraith is a pseudo-stealth killer that has a focus on mobility and chases, whereas Pig is a pseudo-stealth killer that has a focus on slowdown.
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Because having Traps that require you to down a survivor using that ######### power and rely entirely on RNG or blatantly broken add-ons to have a chance at having any real effect on outcome of the match means she would be overpowered if she had any real map presence or chase power or functional stealth on more than two maps.
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I'm surprised that no one's come here yet to scold anybody for saying that the Wraith is cheap. Usually by now there are at least a few comments along the lines of "he was the worst character ever and he's only just now halfway decent for the first time, just stay by windows and be better at looping and he's still useless. Get good at the game".
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bc theyre two different killer? What's next? Freddy is a better Clown? A Huntress is a better Slinger? A Hag is a better Trapper? A Demo has a better Dash than the Pig and also map mobility like a Wraith while completely silent? But a Freddy has essential the same kit but he doesn't have to set it up like Demo? And Spirit has essential the same kit bc she can use ehr ability to have map mobility (kinda) but also a dash while she's completely invisible?
You miss the point.
Just for you
Wraith moves very fast around the map. You sneak on Survivors and use your power to clap them away.
Amanda tries to trick a Reversed Beartrap on your Head. While you're trying to survive the Trap she's goes further manipulating the game and other Survivors, that way you won't have enough time to make it to the endgame.
Two completely different ways to kill you. Wraith by sneaking up and bashing you and Amanda by putting a Trap on you and stealing important time to manipulate the game even more.
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Wraith is fine.
Pig has needed substantial buffs for literally years.
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Why is freddys teleport better than demos?
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For me at least, with Wraith, you can see if a survivor is going to play the pallet, throw it early, or leave the loop while you are decloaking and can react immediately.
With Pig, it's a guess because of your low PoV. You can play around it and fake roars (if they don't realize that Pig's blade makes a 'shing' sound when she commits to a charge). But sometimes it's better to just face tank a few pallets then to try and dash gimmick a survivor that clearly knows better.
I still like Pig. She's one of my go-to's when I want to practice fundamentals.
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Wraith doesn't need a nerf and the Pig is the 2nd biggest bastard child in the game(Nurse is the first).
Pig has been in constant horrible states for years because of her trap mechanic(If they make it too good its effectively a 1 hook mori) that the devs refuse to rework.
So no don't cry that wraith is better at stealth then Pig. Call out the developers for not wanting to rework what makes her unbalancable.
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Why is Pig in stealth slower than Nurse? Shouldn't she at least be Tier 1 Myers speed? I mean he has no terror radius, and no way for survivors to force him out of it and can hit from that speed. So why not Pig?
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The lunge was already there and most Wraith mains have already used it the same way, it's just way stronger now and works on more loops. True invisibilty is really such a minor thing that i wouldn't count it as power (it's like saying Spirits low TR is part of her power). I mean it has it's moments on open maps but most of the time they wouldn't have seen you with shimmer (old Wraith) as well, since most Wraith's try to ambush from behind objects and stuff. You could argue that his mobility was already there aswell because really everybody was using Windstorm, they just have another add on space now if they want.
Maybe saying it's his entire kit was a bit harsh but the movement speed is necessary to make the lunge work as he is so loopable and unscary once you know where he is (compared to most of the cast), that you need this speed to play him unpredictable and annoying, since you often need several attempts to even get a hit against a good team.
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I feel like she shouldn't growl while charging her ambush. It takes away the surprise factor and its not like its very useful around loops either. So i find that change necessary because i always stand up instead of doing the ambush as its better to secure the hit and allow some gen grabs sometimes.
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Because Pig's kill rate is above Wraiths', so the devs haven't done anything with her.
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The answer is more that pig needs a small rework than anything else. Wraith is definitely not close to being overpowered, and despite what the statistics say, pig is definitely not a strong killer, however you can’t just buff pig without making her far too strong when she gets good rng.
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Imo Pig's Dash is a much better tool but requires more effort to be used wich means it's a high commitment wich means there's naturally less situations where it will be useful. It can change direction, it can moon dash and it can combine both to reverse moon dash. It's a Dash not a lunge that's why it requires set up, that's why it won't always be useful.
Wraith's uncloack Lunge is an extended Lunge not a Dash, it is good but can't be redirected, you have to commit to 1 side after uncloacking otherwise you lose the window at wich you're benefitting from the speed, wich means Wraith will always choose the quickest path, to make his speed boost as unreactable as possible but it is still reactable. Has less reach because again it's a Lunge not a Dash, the window to benefit from the uncloack speed is fairly large and most time's you will be making use of that speed for your first unannounced hit. It's somewhat useful in loops especially against Pallet Campers wich they have to commit to unless they have a window or another loop, they can't fake Pallet Camp and then abbandown to go out in the open. If you're bodyblocking a Survivor he is already there right in front of you so you're not really making use of the extended Lunge.
Out in the open they are the exact same thing.
Wraith can cancel his uncloack and keep going at you wich is a much faster process than Pig's Dash, again reiterating how the Dash is a commitment.Pig has a slower crouch and Dash charge times compared to how easier it is for Wraith to just uncloack and go. Wraith even has multiple uncloack add-ons while Pig only has combat straps. Pig needs some tweaks the speed of the process, that will diminish the commitement issue and make the Dash more user friendly.
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Pig's power is now obsolete. It is not skill based. Not only does she need an addon pass, she needs slight buffs that reduces RNG and makes ambush dash more viable on skill based.
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As much as I would love the RNG of bear traps to be improved so that they are more consistently useful you have to be very careful in how you go about doing so because of Tampered Timer + Crate of Gears.
If they ever make her RBTs work the way Trapper traps work now I'd expect a nerf to that problematic combo of add-ons. Honestly so many of her add-ons need reworked and certain things should be base kit. She needs a lot of work but it needs to be done carefully.
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Pig should get buffed. Less counterplay just means that survivors can't outright leave a tile the moment the wraith cloaks, other than that it's essentially the same and has the same counterplay - don't let the killer take control of the pallet at weak loops. Except Pig has the aforementioned counter of simply running away the moment she crouches, because even if she's baiting that's a lot of distance you just gained.
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First box always fails + replace Tampered Timer with a new add-on that has nothing to do with the timer? I'd be fine with that.
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Mainly because her dash is ass
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The pigs traps add a layer of RNG that makes her op or underwhelming with little to no in-between, especially with certain add-ons. I think we'd all love more consistent traps and a buff to pig dash and/or stealth
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because pig is outdated
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Give the Pig insta-crouch and stand with a 1.5 second charge to dash and she'd be great. Make it so if she's within 24 meters near a trapped survivor, the timer stops so she can't just follow a survivor crouched until their head explodes. Give her slightly faster crouch movement speed compared to GF and she would shine.
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Because Pig has a slowdown.. something that Wraith doesn’t have
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