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Keys > Mori
I don't know if it's just me but why is a Mori extremely less game changing to use compared to a Key. Because an Ebony Memento Mori kills everyone, but they already have to be on final hook, which is kinda pointless and just waists more time to kill the person compared to just hooking them. The only benefits of killing someone rather than hooking is you avoid DS, avoid the flashlight saves, and don't use up a hook. Where as a key, as soon as the hatch spawns in it can instantly save an entire SWF group which is unbelievably game changing. Especially if the killer is putting extreme amount of pressure on the exit gate but it won't matter for them since they can't pressure the hatch and both exit gates since all the survivor needs is 20 seconds at the gates, and the person with the key only needs 1 second at the hatch, with an addition 10 seconds for the rest of the survivors to enter as well. I know in the livestream the devs said there is a solution with the key coming, but they also said they are changing the Mori again which I don't know what else they could change with it to make it any weaker because no one will use them. As said in past dev streams, they would randomly talk about things being added to the game, but get scrapped, so if the key idea ends up getting scrapped the key will stay at one of the most game breaking items and problems of the game.
Comments
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I wonder why keys are a serious complaint because of the fact that the "key" version for a killer, a Mori, is super garbage and just waists more time for the killer rather than save them more time. And not evey killer runs the most over powered add-ons. I personally use yellow+green mixers. The only time I use red+green add-ons is when I clearly see a SWF group with someone holding a key. Because that's how ridiculously game changing a key is. The fact if I know enough gens are done to spawn hatch but not activate the gates, my mindset has to change completely and I then have to stray away from the gens I should be protecting to finding the hatch first and try guarding that and the gens at the same time. Which, with hatch spawns being random (which obviously they should be) the chances of the hatch spawning in a very very good spot where survivors won't find it is 0. Also, Devs have been changing alot of the killer add-ons for the past few chapters. I think most recently Demo. So mostly ever killer has gotten a rework in their add-ons that needed it. For example Huntress is only allowed 1 Hatchet with Iri Head. Also, Wraith's "All-Seeing" Iri add-on isn't that good. His other Iri is way better. Then the Mother Daughter ring actually has a down side and is basically only meant for players who have a decent headset. And then The Blight is super strong because of his J flick along with the much needed height buff. And the main giant reason why killers need gen defense perks is because how fast gens can be popped if just one or even 2 people are running PTS. Paired with a few survivors who know how to loop and toolboxes. That'll be the end of the game. So when people do run those double/triple combo gen defense perks that's why.
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You are THE Epitome of a survivor main. Who probably never gone Killer sided once. And possibly carried by your teammates, even if you solo'que (I'm just assuming on that 3rd fact) Mori's NOW have to be done on final hook or else sacrifice to the Entity. That's the weakest of a game changing decision. (Not to mention that on the Anniversary, they stated they STILL will be changing it for Killers they'll be needing MORE effort to perform a Mori) Either just finish a survivor or kill them outta one's instincts of a killer. That's it.
A key, if even the killer does all they can and plays the game fair, a dropped key on the ground gives that last lazy survivor who done jack nothing all game but hide, let their team die, get an escape. And for what? No effort but playing like a Draco Malfoy.
Or, indeed, a killer trying their best to stave off gens being completely done, and at one gen left, all 4 get to escape. I ask you HOW? Does Death Hook Mori's compare far worse than Keys when killers can do nothing about it from happening?
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They "level the playing field" against those types of killers while being brought against pretty much every other killer who isn't. And you wonder why killers bring those perks.
You must not play killer enough to realize that gens can fly by in a matter of a few minutes if you aren't pressuring enough. Either that, or possibly you play at a lower rank against survivors with less-than-average skill and think that getting a 4K proves that gens aren't too fast.
If you play killer enough, and you play against actually competent survivors that have their one objective of escaping in mind, there isn't a whole lot you can do as most killers to stop them (or all of them at least.) Especially if, like I said earlier, you're a killer who isn't running a crap ton of gen slowdown. Most of my games personally I'm running like 2 slowdowns most (maybe like Oppression and Dying Light on Plague) and other than that, I'm running stuff like Enduring/BBQ/Spies from the Shadows/Stridor or some combo like that. Survivors do not take it easy if you aren't constantly chasing them. Even if they're not good at looping, they can still hold M1 on a gen.
Plus, two people can easily get out through the hatch if they bring a map and key, while only needing to complete I believe it's 3 generators? I could be wrong about that part, but point being, you don't even need to do all the gens in order to use the key. Also, once the key is in the trial, there's nothing the killer can do to take it out anymore. Not to mention even if the killer plays things perfectly, gets 1 survivor left alive, and closes the hatch, the survivor can still run up and unlock it anyway for a free escape. At that point, you're essentially being forced to guard 3 different exits, which is borderline impossible.
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Marth depip squad proves everything you said as wrong.
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This is OP that is OP. The Clown a crutch killer? You serious or is this a troll post? I mean ruin undying doesn't even work the same anymore. I am struggling to figure out where you are coming from because nothing you have stated makes any sense. Yet I get it you need your almighty key and the 1 in the 4 v 1 needs a nerf. So in closing, Please do not feed the troll.
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It's funny; you denigrate tunneling in virtually every post I've ever seen you make, but now you suggest it as a way for killers to deal with this perfectly okay item? That doesn't check out to me. Either you have way more tolerance for tunneling than you've suggested, or maybe keys aren't okay?
Anyway, tunneling the survivor with the key doesn't accomplish very much. The key drops to the ground, another survivor will take the key, and now the hatch is available at 1 gen. Franklins was a counter to keys because it could remove the key completely and force survivors to complete the game normally. It wasn't perfect, most SWFs knew how to counter it, but it was something.
Something I'm not sure you realize, because it doesn't sound like you've played killer extensively or at all, is that most of the killer's power comes in the late game. In the early game, nobody is injured or hooked, only one player is being chased, and everyone is free to work on gens. Depending on how the survivors spread out, if they brought toolboxes, and how long the first chase took (as the first chase is the one with the most resources for survivors to burn, and pallets can extend chases massively if used well), 0-3 gens will pop - 0 being the worst case scenario for the survivors and 3 being the best. Then the ball is in the killer's park, as fewer survivors can be on gens once the cycle of being chased/recuperating starts, and there are fewer gens left to work on, meaning a smaller patrol area. The reason a 3-gen is potentially powerful is because it is the smallest possible area to patrol, and unless 4 survivors are still alive, survivors generally can't out-attrition you through the cycle of chasing, unhooking, and working on gens. (If 4 survivors are alive, you can brute force any 3-gen unless you're up against a killer who can hit multiple survivors at once. Totems no longer matter; the killer can't guard the 3-gen and stop you from totem hunting at the same time.) But depending on that first chase, and how many gens popped as a result, the killer is either advantaged or disadvantaged for the rest of the map. As such, and this is the point I'm gearing towards, it is extremely difficult for the killer to prevent the hatch from spawning in the late game, unless the survivors massively screw up in the early game or the killer plays like a ruthless SoB and kills players on their first/second hooks. Because the killer will generally win the match by those later gens, hatch can spawn and enable multiple survivors to escape as early as 2 gens left. 1 gen left, or a 3-gen, is when the killer is the strongest, and a key allows 3 survivors to say 'nah' to this and walk out.
I take a lot of umbrage with your statement that "it's the killer's lack of foresight that allows survivors to complete enough gens and escape through the hatch." First off, you're assuming that killers should be able to kill all the survivors before 1-2 gens left, which is not something that should be expected and only possible against a team that screws up. And again... I do not believe you understand how this works.
Defending a 3-gen and a hatch at the same time is impossible unless the hatch is within the center of the 3-gen. The second you leave the hatch, the survivors will escape through it. There is no charge time for opening the hatch; it isn't something you can interrupt unless you're literally on top of it, and even then, that just means you stop subsequent survivors from escaping. The first guy always gets away unless you can down him before he reaches it - and if survivors have brains, they're going to heal up while you're guarding an objective and then rush it the second they have an opening, so unless you're a killer that instadowns, they aren't even afraid of that, just you closing the hatch before everyone gets out. If you camp the hatch religiously, because this is the only way to stop the mass key escape, the survivors can do your gens, and they also get out. None of your setup earlier in the match matters. This is busted the same way old moris were busted, and believe me, old moris were busted. It was the same principle; bringing an item allowed one side to win the game early, without having to meet the usual milestones of victory.
Like, I've really never cared about keys in my gameplay because I don't care much about 4ks, but everything you're saying here is wrong.
You really need to play some killer or SWF to expand your horizons. This laser focus on solo survivor, and the lack of scope to see that this is not how all matches play out and not the only power balance in the game, is not healthy. You're trying to dictate survivor based on their most disadvantaged form, and refusing to understand that killers need their tools on higher forms of competitive play in order to stand a chance. Should killers be weakened against solos? Maybe. Should killers be weakened uniformly? Hell no; games would become largely unwinnable once you refactored comms and high-end survivor gameplay back into the equation.
Also, Clown? Really? Clown is one of the most mediocre killers in the game. He can end chases easy, but has zero map mobility (theoretically he has some, but if he uses it for mobility, he has no chase power, so no Clowns use it like this.) He can't make use of Tinkerer at all, and Ruin/Undying is useless when you're not present to bother survivors off gens. The reason Ruin/Undying is so powerful on Blight/Spirit/Freddy is because they can be everywhere on a very short timeframe, and constantly interrupt survivors' every attempt to repair. This kind of info is not nearly as harmful on killers that have to walk all the way across the map to reach you.
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I'm unfortunately aware of that user you're talking about. I have had to deal with their nonsense several times on the forums, so unfortunately I have to be a little glad they got booted.
Regardless, it gets hard to tell who's trolling/baiting and who isn't anymore, especially on a forum where so many people are throwing out ideas. I figure I might as well get my comment out to reach people and maybe change a mind or two, even if it isn't the person I'm directing my comment at. Some people are right on the cusp of a realization, and all they need is a good counterargument or two to change their mind.
Unfortunately though, like I said, it's hard to tell sometimes whether people are genuine or not. I'm just here to discuss one of my favorite games, since I feel like I have a relatively fair way of putting things :)
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Moris in their current state are pretty pointless. I don't get how keys are still in the game.
Moris dont even feel like a threat anymore since your basically already dead when they are available.
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