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BHVR why selling expansion packs to a new player & not address the current Grind?
This is the price of ONE Expansion Pack:
These are only worth it if there isn't a sale for DLCs
One Expansion Pack contains 11 Characters, there are two of them for both sides totaling 22 Characters, 11 survivors & 11 killers.
With the game & 2 Expansion Packs, you're looking at 80 Euros in total
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On a scale of 1 to 10, how high are you BHVR? And why is it 12?
Do you know what's the kick in the balls? The poor ######### having to spend even more $ to get the Leatherface DLC for his Barbecue & Chilli Perk. Question is... Who is gonna tell him this is an essential perk to alleviate the grind for Killers & grind in general?
Do you have any idea how overwhelmed a new player will be once he purchases one of these packs, looks at the number of characters he has, plays a few matches, sees he got 10k BPs out of a few million he needs & realize the true grind of DBD? Do you honestly think he will stay?
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The game offers you a few free survivors & killers.
Survivors: Nea - David - Dwight - Claudette - Meg - Jake - Bill => 7 Free Survivors
Killers: Trapper - Nurse - Wraith - Hillbilly - Huntress => 5 Free Killers
Killer Expansion Pack => 11 Killers
Survivor Expansion Pack => 11 Survivors.
Now do the math of getting each character to level 40 to get their teachables. Now do it again to get one single character with all the other teachables. Now P1, then P2 & then P3. Now get all the perks. Now try to calculate the time it takes to do all this without BBQ / WGLF then do it with these perks... Agh, my brain..
All of this... To get 1 character to P3 with the teachables from the 7 free survivors & the 11 survivors that came with the Expansion...Jesus Christ... Did I mention there's a Killer side as well???
You get the point of this whole discussion now.
I would've done the math myself but I'm way too tired right now and should be sleeping. Honestly didn't feel like calculating millions, doing research on how much 1-50 costs, getting rough estimates on this, then on how much it takes to P3 & then how much it takes to get all perks....
Comments
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You dont have to buy killers to get their perks if they are in the store as a unlock i thought i
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They need to fix the grind for new players but they fear the backlash from old players and the "compensation" they will need to give them.
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You know what they say, “the second best time is now”. The sooner the grind improves, the better, who needs compensation?
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I don't understand why old players would be mad
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I bet you anything that people would rage at new players getting 200 million bp to spend, or reducing the grind by removing tiers would have people demanding legacy #2 or auric cells/ shards.
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Just look at the outcries when they gave everyone exclusive cosmetics. the people that had them complained like crazy about others getting them.
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ah right this game has issues with old player entitlement
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Absolutely nothing you have put in your post is mandatory for players to play the game. These arguments about the grind are all the same. They have no weight because it ISN’T mandatory to grind out EVERYTHING in order to a) enjoy the game, and b) play and get BETTER at the game!
Post edited by Rizzo on3 -
Disagree.
To play the game? No
To enjoy the game? Yes, here is where I will strongly disagree.
There's a pure fact that you can't enjoy the game if u don't buy/have DLCs. Do you want build variety? Then get the wallet out big boi and start spending cash. Then look towards getting those characters to LVL 40 for their teachables, then unlock the perks in your other characters by spending more BPs in the blood web.
New players that buy these expansion packs will be overwhelmed by the number of characters they have at their disposal, all level 1 I might add.
The blood web grind is atrocious & it gets worse the more you unlock. Being a long-time player in this game with just 5-6 pages of perks that you need to unlock for each killer is pure pain. Not to mention I don't own all the DLCs & Perks yet.
I've bought Myers a couple of days ago and only after 2.3 Million BPs later I finally managed to unlock the first level of BBQ and now still struggling to get get the other 2 levels after putting, even more, BPs into him. At least I know what I'm doing, compared to these new players that are exposed for the first time to the grind, DBD has to offer. Not to mention, I also have BBQ.
Imagine you have a conversation with a new player coming for the RE chapter, he bought the RE chapter & the game. Then you tell him he needs 1.63+ Million blood points in order to 0-50 a character. How do you think he is going to react when he realizes that he gets ~15k average per match? AND then you tell him about teachables & the grind to get those perks on each killer he likes & wants to play or survivor. Then you tell him at some point he needs a particular X perk from X killer in order to make his build work. Fun I guess is subjective, but then again, some perks are mandatory and the builds need to have synergy thus requiring DLCs and you can't tell me you have fun by losing gens.
- Corrupt from Plague
- Clown for Pop
- Hag for Ruin
- Blight for Undying
- Get Billy to 40 to get Tinkerer
- Leatherface for BBQ
Congrats, now the new player has access to this build
- BBQ
- Ruin / Pop
- Corrupt
- Undying / Tinkerer
One of the ways you can fun is by feeling strong & not lose 3 gens when the match starts.
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Besides the discussion but I'll add these on top of the grind.
Now... Factor in these things:
- Bugged Map. Imagine the disappointment of not playing the map you came for.
- Performance & plethora of bugs. Oh, the new player is on console, tough luck bud. PC also suffers from this but console is the most troubled one. They're finally getting a taste of BHVR.
- Bugged Cosmetics
- Overpriced Cosmetics
These are the things a RE new player will be exposed once he buys the game and the DLC, and then factor these things again:
- Toxicity
- SWF
- Solo Que
- Teabagging at Exit Gates might be toxic for some, a new player will definitely think of these as toxic.
- Matchmaking
After all of these & the grind, you're telling me... A new RE player will stay in the game? And these are only a few examples.
BHVR needs to address the grind for new players. There is no discussion about it.
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I don't care about being compensated or not.
What matters are the new players not having to deal with the BS we had to deal with. We are the parents, the new players are the children. We should strive towards making it better for them. This only results in a win-win scenario. To give one example is shorter queue times since that's one of the primary problems this game has.
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I have to disagree on that. Perk variance and possibility to play the build you want on the character you want are one of the things that make this game more enjoyable
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It hurts even more the fact that the expansion only gives you characters that you can get for free.
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Yes, you can get them for free.
However, a new player will more likely spend the shards in the Shrine of Secrets or unlock cosmetics rather than buying one character which is worth 9k shards, which might be a little too much for them.
The expansion packs are a good deal, only if the DLCs are not on sale.
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i just found out that both dlc have exclusive charms one for each expansion pack the Orb of Worlds and the Death Omen charms...... except for the fact i had already bought ALL since Demise of the faithful came out and everything was half off..... Now i do what i can to get all charms in give aways, events and Rifts . granted everybody has a way to get all of them when said event is during if i miss it some how not much i can do. but HOW in terms of accessibility and for those who want to collect everything in game as much as possible are you gonna put two charms behind a ******* 30-60 dollar pay wall when the majority of people who were collecting charms have gotten all the dlc somehow??? i understans charms being exclusive for new chapter DLC especially for chapters WE already have gotten???????? WHAT??
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Could've arranged that better... Had a time reading & understanding.
I'll explain something a lot of people don't seem to understand.
The expansion packs are not meant for US, they are meant for NEW PLAYERS.
BHVR, will not care whatever you have the DLCs or not, for them, this is nothing but a business move. I'm ready to bet 20$ that the people who already have all of the DLCs who will but these packs for the charm alone will use another after 1 month when a new fancy one comes out.
If u suffer from things such as collecting / hoarding everything then I honestly suggesting go and get help, as this can be quite damaging for your health & especially your wallet / savings. In BHVR's eyes, you are nothing more than the perfect customer they're looking for. Disclaimer: This is not for you, but for whoever suffers from this.
At the end of the day, they are nothing but a charm that is painted red with an icon on it. It might not even look good ingame...
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because old players need to get the teachables of the new characters, max them, and give their perks to the rest of characters
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Pretty much, Soon we're gonna have 7 pages of perks that we need to unlock for every new survivor / killer that comes out.
I am not that old, since I started in September 2019, but that doesn't mean I like to pull 5-6+ Million BPs out of my ass for one single character. Not to mention, I don't get the perks that I want, since it's all RNG & the bloodwebs get more and more expansive as you go from 0 to 50 then after 50 onwards. God help your soul if u decide to P3 all new characters that come out.
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THATS the point, they shouldnt put the charms in dlc based around splitting the chapters already gotten and not making it feel like a waste of money for those to want to get everything as much as possible. what they COULD have done is rather than putting it in the expansion packs, make a like a 5-10 10 dollar dlc of its own like a starter pack similar to 80s collection and charity case, giving some exclusive cosmetics to that INCLUDING the new charms, give them 1 million blood points and about 2000 shards so they can get starting on building up their characters. would be accessible to EVERYONE both new and Loyal for a reasonable price and NO ONE would feel like its a waste for 2 cosmetic side pieces. And dont tell us to get help... we want to complete and gain everything as much as possible and have the options to do what we like AND we choose to support to company financially DESPITE the bad deal we're getting now. u choose not to? fine thats all set. NOW GTFO your high horse and move along. i support BHVR on alot of things, but I will not lick their boots. No Maam
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Perks should not have tiers. Any grumpy old players would be fine with devotion finally giving like a boost to bp gain or something of that fashion.
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All the perks should be immediately available to all characters. Perks should not be bought for bloodpoints.
I am explaining this in detail in the post below:
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I agree that prestiging is not necessary, but please don't decide for others what is fun.
For me fun is to buy a new killer and try various perk builds. But I can't do it because I need to spend hundreds of hours to get the perks from the bloodweb.
I am not buying DLCs because of all the grind that is needed to get the perks on a new killer. BHVR is losing money because of the grind.
My suggestion:
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“I agree that prestiging is not necessary, but please don't decide for others what is fun.”
I didn’t dictate what is and isn’t fun for other players. I’m addressing the way most of these posts over-dramatically imply the grind absolutely HAS to be done, like it’s some sort of conscription into the military.
“I don’t wanna grind for so long 😭”
So then don’t. Just play.
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Because money. They only want new players to come in and buy a bunch of stuff, they'll get bored and leave, then the cycle continues. Behaviour doesn't care for the long term players that try to stay with the game.
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They could give us legacy skins on every character we currently have at P3. Id take that as compensation.
They could even do a different legacy skin than before so as not to ruffle feathers with those guys
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I've been playing since pre-release and have thousands of hours, and let me tell you: I do not care about compensation. I just want the grind reduced. Every time a new chapter comes out I just think "ugh here we go again". Grinding is not fun and kills my motivation to play, I would far rather just being able to focus on playing the game and have fun, and not have to even ever think about bloodpoints or the the insipid bloodweb system and it's RNG-based perk distribution. I dont want a second job, I just want to play a game.
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The real issue I have with grind is the amount of time it takes to unlock new characters. You need 9k shards, and it can take weeks to get that, depending on how much you're playing. I appreciate BHVR letting us unlock non-licensed killers without having to pay money for them, but damn.
The plus side of having the intense BP grind (and I'll admit that it can be intense) is that it forces people to play one killer for a while and really learn the ropes before unlocking perks. If you start relying on perks to get you through games before you really to learn how to play, you're not going to learn as much.
It does also suck that BBQ is locked behind a licensed, money-only character.
Because everyone is in the DBD community is always mad about everything.
Best idea so far. Or at least they could remove the first tier so you don't have to deal with goddamn three of them.
200 million is sort of a lot, but I could see new players getting 1-5 million or something. To reduce the whining, give all the players who are currently playing twice that amount and also give twice that amount to all new players who start playing within a week of the change, which could also boost sales.
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So that's the solution? If we don't like something then just let's don't play the game? Tell this to everyone then on the forum who complains about something: perks, add-ons, killer powers, bugs, etc...
For many players, including me, playing with good builds is important. Playing with e.g. with monstrous shrine or level 1-2 perks is not fun. Therefore grind is unavoidable currently.
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I didn’t say that either. Please improve your reading comprehension
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I have always said, the easiest way to remove the grind now is to get rid of perk tiers.
They made sense in 2016, not now.
Or make it so each prestige removes them. So P1 you only get tier 2 and up. p2 is 3 and up. p3 its removed and you get more party streamers
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Sorry, I misread theast sentence, but still...
"So then don’t. Just play."
Does this mean: Just play, ignore the fact that you will play with bad perk builds and just don't care that you can't use the perk you wanted. Play, even if it is not fun...
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Exactly, removing perk tiers is a good enough solution for the start.
Adding prestige as a requirement is not good however, because then you are unnecessarily increasing the grind for players who don't care about prestiging. With this proposal doing prestige is going to be the less grindy way to unlock perks.
So just simply removing perk tiers is enough.
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I agree completely. I have been playing since silent hill got released, and have nearly 1000 hours in the game. I am only now at the point where almost all my killers are lv 50 with complete builds, and soon I can start working on survivors, my highest level survivor is 48.
Its absolutely ridiculous. Mobile game levels of grind.
Seeing streamers with all killers p3 is insane, let alone killers AND survivors.
Think about a new person starting on the RE release. They need 4.5 million BP to max out the new content. But they also need all the meta perks which is millions more bps.
I honestly think the anniversary event theyre doing where everyday a new 4 perks is on the shrine should have been brought forward to RE chapter release, and do something different on the anniversary. Something insane like 200% cakes, stackable.
Their logic is flawed, the grind doesnt keep people, it turns them away. Awarding a total of 1000% extra bloodpoints with 5x cakes at 200% without a 1million total cap would be so fun, I would marathon the game. It would cost them nothing too.
The only problem would be going back to normal bloodpoints would make it feel even worse once you're used to 2 weeks of 400k bloodpoints a game.
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I started a bit less than a year ago, and I would like to buy DLCs to play other killers. But I don't buy them because of the grind. I would unfortunately never get to a point when I have all the perks I want. I don't play that much this game like some streamers.
For new players the grind situation is terrible. But I think also for older players it is becoming harder to keep up.
And I think giving more bloodpoints is not a good solution, because some players could spend it on add-ons instead of perking up a new killer/survivor. Then they could run the strongest add-ons all the time, which is in my opinion not how the game is balanced. Unless MMR is turned on, maybe that would mitigate this issue of add-on imbalance.
My proposal was to just make all the perks immediately available to the players. You buy only items, add-ons offerings in the bloodweb. But removing perk tiers is also a good enough solution for now.
My proposal:
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Another thing they could do is make it so you still need BP for perks, but remove tiers, make each perk directly buyable but more expensive, say 500k each ( ive spent millions getting just a tier 1 perk before )
So theyre all there, you want borrowed time, 500k you got it.
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How come Devotion is STILL useless...
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Oversight. I wouldn't be surprised if it never did anything just because there is now way too much devotion earned amongst the community. If they made it give a percentage to bp gain though there really shouldn't be any issues.
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