When are the devs gonna get rid of NOED?
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BHVR literally gave you a perk to speed run totems... Use it? Noed isn't an issue anymore
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please say this is ironic
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Here’s the thing...
The goal as survivor isn’t to just repair generators. If it were, the game would simply end after the finished repair of the fifth generator.
The goal of survivor is to SURVIVE and ESCAPE. This INCLUDES mitigating risks. Repairing generators is just one of the things that’s falls under the umbrella of surviving & escaping.
If you DON’T want to run totem detection, which is perfectly fine and valid, then:
- At least cleanse dull totems you DO manage to spot during your travels. Don’t ignore them.
- If you can’t be absolutely sure if all 5 totems have been cleansed, thus can’t rule out NOED, don’t finish the last repair in the killers face.
- Also play absolutely cautious during the time the last gen is finished, until about to leave a gate, until absolutely certain there is no NOED.
- Basically if you don’t yet know if the killer has NOED or not, don’t play recklessly at endgame.
- And if the killer does have it, just leave.
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How many gens does the Adrenaline user have to complete to get Adrenaline to activate?
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Lmao
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If all you do is camp all game, you eliminate two survivors, and there are STILL 3 gens left, then the survivors were just bad to begin with, tbh, totems or not.
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Doing gens is equally as boring
Post edited by EQWashu on2 -
False.
NoED is a risk vs reward hex; you risk it being cleaned before it ever activates, and you play with 3 perks all match. But the reward is a strong end game.
This 'It rewards failure' line is utter BS; the Killer has not failed to kill you until you escape, and not a second sooner.
Anything else is a lie invented by Survivors trying to push the idea that Killers 'failed' since the exit gates powered, so they have an excuse to nerf a disliked perk.
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Gens take 80 seconds to do.
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Each hook state take 60 seconds. If you facecamp for all 120 seconds, three gens are easily done if the survivors are doing their job. That's not including the initial chase. With a second hunt, chase, and facecamp, there is plenty of time to finish the final two gens and the totems.
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Your '80 seconds' is:
- Solo (no teammates helping
- Without items or perks helping you in any way
- Not counting Great skillchecks
So it's small wonder Gens pop so fast; Survivors can clear them in 47 seconds with 2 people, or 38 if all 3 are working on a gen while a Survivor is chased.
Hell; by the time a Survivor is chased & hooked, 3 Survivors can pop 2 gens if they stick together.
Though they can just as easily pop 3 gens if they split up, since an 80 second gen (not counting items or skillchecks or perks) is STILL easily within the realm of 'done' in a Killer's first chase.
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In honor of this thread:
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So you waste more time going to the hook to realize that the killer is face camping someone. Again, this is just proving my point. Don't have enough time to do totems and gens if someone is being camped.
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Small Game + Counterforce has saved my tail this way several times already!
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I did not prove your point. You keep saying I did because...reasons? Like, your 'gatchya!' is so vague.
If the Killer is camping (120 seconds for stage 1 & 2, add another 70 seconds for finding someone, the chase, 2 hits, pickup, & hook; so 190 seconds), 3 Survivors can do all 5 gens AND hunt for totems.
Plus, THE KILELR CANNOT CAMP A SURVIVOR AND STOP YOU FROM DOING GENS no matter how much you pretend he magically can.
Just because you keep saying 'I'm Right!' does not mean you're right. The numbers prove you flat wrong.
But Survivors keep walking towards a camping Killer while thinking 'I deserve this unhook because I want it REALLY BAD!' then screaming 'CAMPING OP!' because they walked towards the giant person who wants to find & hit them.
NoED is fine. It does not 'reward failure' because the Killer HAS NOT FAILED UNTIL YOU ESCAPE. This arbitrary '5 gens = Killer failed' metric is utter bunk made up to push for NoED nerfs. It's a lie. A flat lie.
And if the Killer is camping; you can EASILY find NoED and cleanse it, because he's giving you nearly 3 minutes to do so.
The perk is not OP just because Survivors are lazy.
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You shouldnt do totems. Do the gens, leave. Best a killer can do is a 2k and only 2 hooks. Depip.
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When devs fix Freddy’s add ons.
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When they add a beachfront map based off of 80's Miami
On a serious note do bones it's not that hard like no joke even during end game I spotted the noed totem and took care of it before someone got slugged because it was on my way to the exit if the killer isn't after you it's not hard to get rid of totems
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I've said this a hundred times, and I'll say it again: NOED is the easiest Killer perk in the game to counter. Take the 1m 15sec(assuming no Thrill, Thana, etc)and down 5 totems. POOF! No NOED. If you don't do that, you deserve NOED.
They're not getting rid of it, folks. Accept this.
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Spoken like a true red-rank gen rusher. Congrats.
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When are they going to get rid of Dead Hard? Decisive Strike? Borrowed Time? Infinite Loop Abuse?
You're a survivor, you have a massive advantage.
Post edited by EQWashu on1 -
My NOED gets cleansed all the time and I am not even high ranked. It is kind of just a cheeky perk to catch them off guard if they relentlessly gen rushed and not much else. But in those cases, my extra hook or two is relatively pointless as they are not usually at high hook states.
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I never take a Noed. A useless perk at the first ranks.
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The problem is that you never know how many totems are cleansed. This whole expectation of what survivors "should" be doing is a false reality.
On top of that, there are many realms in this game where totems are difficult as ######### to find without aura-detection perks/items. Swamp, The Game, Léry's, Midwich, RPD, Lab map, Dead Dawg Saloon, and even more.
You can very easily go an entire game without even seeing a single totem because of how well-hidden they are on some maps.
Post edited by EQWashu on0 -
Small Game tells you how many totems are cleansed and helps you find them.
Post edited by EQWashu on0 -
do bones. There are seriously three perks to fined all hex’s. Quit your complaining.
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Destroy totems and noed can't be activated. That is it, there is a counter to NOED.
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This is why boon totems won't work they still don't know that cleansing totems = good.
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NOED has enough counters honestly. Especially when killer starts slugging you...
Try one of these perks next time:
- Small Game (keeps track of how many totems are done/left)
- Counterforce
- Detective's Hunch
Or:
- Unbreakable
- Soul Gard (best with Unbreakable just in case)
Maps also help to find totems. So try that?
Small Game is now standard in my build to counter hex perks, especially NOED. Cause nothing is more satisfying to keep NOED from activating.
Also if NOED is worse, then Devour Hope will really be the worst for you... Since you will be exposed the WHOLE trial once at 3 stacks... Counter? Cleanse totems.
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Cleansing totems is not a NOED counter.
You can clean 4 out of 5 and the only totem you can't find is the one that ends up getting NOED, making it MORE difficult to get rid of than it might've been if you hadn't cleansed the totems you could find.
You can clean 5 out of 5 and then it turns out the killer didn't have NOED, meaning you wasted a ton of time to counter nothing.
You can clean 5 out of 5 totems and then it turn out the killer did have NOED, at which point it still worked about as well as Ruin or Thanatophobia.
Seriously, cleansing totems does not counter NOED.
And comparing NOED, which requires all five totems to be destroyed, to Devour Hope, which requires one totem to be destroyed, is especially nonsensical.
Even if NOED isn't a problem balance-wise, it is a problem design-wise and should be reworked to better reward totem cleansing as its counter.
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Honestly cleansing totems is already rewarded with 1k BP for dull totems and 1.5k for Hex totems. It also counts to the objectives score and overall score. Just doing totems, otherwise dont complain if you get NOED on you. Aint that hard honestly.
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You didn't read a single word, did you?
Also, have fun coordinating the full 5 totem cleanses in solo queue.
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You really only need to cleanse one totem - the one NOED spawns on (if and when it spawns). If, however, you want to prevent NOED from ever becoming an issue, then you cleanse all of them.
A strategy I've seen being kicked around is to cleanse only a few well-hidden totems, then check the rest that you found along the way for NOED before rushing for the gate.
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And this is a problem on multiple fronts.
One, it discourages this notion that everyone should be doing all totems. It's already been explained that without perks this is not realistic to do every game in solo queue.
Two, it basically it's not encouraging this alleged teamwork that's supposed to be going on to do totems and instead one person is doing the majority, if not all five.
NO ED is only a problem because there is no totem counter for survivor. There is absolutely nothing wrong with making it a basekit feature to tell survivors how many totems are left, simple as that.
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I love that people keep claiming 'NoED wastes time even if it's not in a match' is proof it needs reworking.
That's what NoED is supposed to do. The same that Killers have to assume Survivors have D.Strike, or try to bait out Dead Hard without knowing if Survivors actually have it. This is why every match now has an Obsession, even if no one has Obsession perks; to hide D.Strike and other Obsession perks on both sides.
Or are only Survivors allowed delaying tactics via unknown perks?
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Do bones
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Difference is that Decisive Strike has a stringent activation condition and baiting out Dead Hard will cost the killer a second or two, tops. And neither of these perks have nearly as much output value as NOED.
NOED demanding that all players in all games always do all totems is considerably worse than Decisive Strike politely requesting that killers don't tunnel. Not to mention that DS isn't even that effective as a tunnelling counter.
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This is the point of NoED. It's a hidden threat meant to make Survivors do bones. It was the answer to the genrush problem.
How is that so hard to understand? How? Survivors are literally complaining about a perk working as intended like it's flawed.
And you can counter it by DOING BONES. You can keep it from ever activating! Yet you sit here and say 'I don't want to do bones. This is a game problem. Change NoED so I don't have to do bones'
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I think thats the point of boon totems. To encourage totem cleansing. Its the "carrot or the stick" boon totems will be the carrot, noed the stick. Guess we'll see, im guessing
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Yes, do bones, simple. And the solution to old MoM and DS was hit again, and you didn’t need a perk to do it.
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Except that's not how NOED works. NOED -doesn't- incentivise doing bones, it's the exact opposite. If you invest time hunting totems, you run the risk of wasting time when NOED isn't in play. And if you do all the totems you find, NOED will move to the totem you didn't find.
NOED -would- incentivise doing totems if it either picked a dull totem at the start and didn't light it up, or if its efficacy was based on however many totems are left when the fifth gen is completed.
Doing totems makes NOED more effective, not less. As Orion mentions, the actual strat is to not cleanse the totems you find and instead just check them once the fifth gen pops. But that's still tremendously risky, fully RNG based, and impossible to coordinate in solo queue.
NOED is just an absolute mess of a perk.
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The real counter to noed is to ignore totems altogether and just leave immediately. The killer most of the time will get a 1k from it
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Sure it can suck to get smacked with NOED but it’s completely fine. At one time the perk didn’t insta down with tier 1 and 2 so people had to grind just a little bit to get tier 3 to even be worth running it. It also used to be tied to an exit gate and wasn’t even a hex but now NOED can be broken.
Leave an easy to find totem alone for the end and try to cleanse the 4 others before all the gens are done if you never want to risk it.
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(Note: All the caps is not 'internet shouting' in this case; it's just me emphasizing what I'm saying to make it stand out.)
'If you invest time hunting totems, you run the risk of wasting time when NOED isn't in play'
THAT. IS. THE. POINT!
The point is to make Survivors GET THE <oh heck naw!> OFF OF GENS FOR FIVE BLOODY SECONDS!
The point is to make Survivors do bones because NoED MIGHT BE IN PLAY! They have no way of knowing, so they HAVE. TO. DO. BONES!
Again; you are complaining that NoED does what it is supposed to do! It is supposed to, by EXISTING, make Survivors weigh the risks vs the reward of BOING BONES!
Do you risk it? What if NoED was not in the match? Then you risk your neck for nothing. Oh well!
But what if it is in a match, and you decide 'This Killer does not seem like he has NoED.' And BOOM! HE HAS NoED! Your RISK was not REWARDED.
On the flip side; what if you risk doing totems, and get out, and see he had NoED? Then your RISK of being found doing bones was REWARDED.
RISK VS REWARD! How much more do I need to shout it?
I'm not trying to be an ass (I know; a first for me), but you are LITERALLY pointing at NoED doing it's job and saying 'I don't want to waste time on bones unless I'm 100% rewarded, so it's flawed.'
If NoED makes you waste gen time bone hunting, then NoED did what it exists to do. It HAS to exist like this, because, if it was not an ever-present threat; if Survivors had 100% ways to know it's in a match from the start; It would be garbage.
Killer does not have it? Slam gens!
Killer does have it? Do bones, THEN slam gens!
It. Has. To. Be. A. Mystery. That is it's job; the lurking threat YOU DO NOT KNOW ABOUT UNTIL END GAME.
Risk
Vs
Reward
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You're not listening.
I'm not pointing at NOED 'doing it's job' and saying it's not working how -I- want it to work.
I'm pointing at NOED specifically doing the exact opposite of what you say it does.
On a superficial level, at a quick glance, the intuitive solution is, yes, to do bones. But if you take the full picture into consideration, it reverses, and survivors are strongly encouraged never to touch a dull totem, only to record its location.
You're more likely to counter NOED by never touching a dull totem than you are by cleansing all five. Which also means that the background risk you're talking about -isn't working-.
NOED would work exactly as you say it does if it was A) bound by the number of totems left, as opposed to whether there is any totem left and B) guaranteed to appear.
The fact that you don't know whether or not it's there is an incentive not to do bones.
The fact that there's a risk of it becoming stronger if you clear the totems you -can- find is an incentive not to do bones.
And I voluntarily waste time on bones because I run Detective's Hunch and Inner Strength on my main build. Doesn't mean that NOED isn't a design flaw.
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What a wonderful argument for making noed basekit. Thank you
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I mean, Power_Guy's argument is that it already is.
And honestly, with the right rework, NOED turning basekit is actually a good way to make totems into a pressing matter for the survivors. As it currently is, it does the opposite.
Imagine NOED being baseline, but instead of its current effect, it becomes 'When the exit gates are powered, a random surviving dull totem becomes a hex totem. While the hex is active, all survivors are exposed, and the killer gains 4% haste. This effect lasts 30 seconds per dull totem remaining at the time of activation.'
-THAT- would make survivors do bones.
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4/10 bait post. OP is most likely trolling rather than being generally interested in getting better.
Also, just do bones 4Head.
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As much as I like this supposed change into basekit most survivors still will not do bones and would rather complain about it
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Youre change is 'Let's give NoED a time limit'. You have changed NOTHING except giving NoED a controllable time limit and act like this would encourage Survivors to do bones.
If they won't do bones to permanently turn it off (You, yourself keep claiming that NoED somehow encourages people to NOT do bones...for some unknown reason that you think is fact), why would they do bones to reduce it's time limit?
Your whole claim is that cleansing 5 totems is just too hard, so no Survivor does it, and it's all NoEDs fault because it is a binary setting; countered or not.
But...Giving it some garbage time limit would make it 'better'? Really? Really?
Come on; you're just fishing to nerf NoED into the dust. No Killer would touch it, if they had to play an entire match with 3 perks, and then it proced for a whopping 30 seconds at the end (if all bones but 1 were cleansed).
You seem incapable, or just flat-out are ignoring, that Survivors can prevent it from activating with 'Yeah, well, what if they don't?' or 'We don't want too, and that means NoED is broken!'
You take it's effect, which ANYONE can see works the way I said it works, and reply with 'See? That means no one will cleanse! Ha!' with absolutely 0 evidence to back up your claim other than you said so.
If Survivors don't want to do bones to TURN IT OFF PERMANENTLY, why would giving it a timer change that?
It won't; it's just a pure nerf. Survivors still won't do bones, but now they can HIDE for a time limit to wait out NoED!
That's your 'fix'; just slap a time limit on it to allow Survivors to keep genrushing, then immerse 2 minutes 30 seconds to avoid NoED being a threat at all.
Your fix is a nerf, plain and simple. Anyone can see it.
NoED. Is. Fine. Just. Cleanse. Bones.
You have HOW MANY perks and items and addons that speed up totem cleansing or show you where bones are?! USE THEM.
But I get it; those perks aren't META. You guys want to ignore bones and keep your META perks; hence this thread. it's nothing more than 'We COULD do bones, but we don't WANT to do bones. So please change NoED so we never have to worry. K thx!' 🤦♂️
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