The Amanda's Letter add-on for The Pig has been Kill Switched due to an issue with incorrect RBT count.
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Why do killers complain about gens when they camp?
I believe most killers who complain about gen speeds are the ones who either face camp or proxy camp you instead of actually trying to pressure gens early on in the match. Of course gens arent gonna pop when you dont even try to pressure them.
Thats why they think it's ok to use the excuse I only camped becuz of the gens. Not saying everyone does this, but I feel most do.
Just my opinion though.
Comments
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lots of variables when it comes to this kinda stuff. i don't think a majority of killers who camp do it right off the bat.
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Because survivors complain about camping
so killers complain about gen rushing
which then leads to survivors complaining about camping
therefore forcing killers to complain about gen rushing
which inevitably leads survivors to complain about camping
which final leads killers to the conclusion that they need to complain about gen rushing
it’s complicated.
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Most people who complain about gens are more so complaining about map size and how most killers don’t have the mobility to pressure gens
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I talking about the ones that do and then say the gens fly by and use that as an excuse
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Yes, noticed that many people here on the forums who camp/tunnel also think the game is survivor sided, gen speeds are too fast and killers are too weak. Which is a lot of strong words coming from someone that does the bare minimum
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Most of the maps are balanced. Big maps could go both ways because the bigger the map the more spread out gens, and the person hooked are as well. Now maps like Haddonfield and Most coldwind are unbalanced ya, but most maps are toss ups if the killer plays it right IMO
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I dont start camping/tunneling till the survivors have the gens going at break neck speed. So your theory is already shot in the foot.
Theres 2 reasons why gens feel so fast. Spawns, and nothing else for the survivors to do. You always spawn in 5 feet from a gen, that means as soon as the game starts youre working one. Lets be really generous and say it takes 10 seconds to find the first survivor. That means 30 seconds of generator time is already gone (10x3 survivors). Then i have an amazing chase that only takes 30 seconds. Thats really fast for a first chase running an m1 killer btw. Thats another 90 seconds gone (120 total). It only takes 400 seconds to do gens. So in really great circumstances, the survivors already have more than a quarter of their objective complete.
Now imagine if it took me 30 seconds to find the first survivor, and imagine that survivor was decent and it took me 60 seconds to down them (which isnt unlikely in reds). 90x3 is 270 out of 400.
If the survivors didnt spawn on gens, and they had to do something before they could work gens, this wouldnt happen and you would absolutely see less camping/tunneling. It wouldnt disappear though unfortunately.
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I do kind of feel it is a "chicken or egg" thing (Note; except in very specific situations, I do not camp so I'm assuming here).
I imagine the killers who complain about gen rushing camp because they had a few games where they were actually gen rushed. So they started to camp. But now that they're camping, other Survivors have nothing to do but gens so they rush through them. Proving to the camper that the survivors just gen rush and therefore they should camp to try to put pressure on the survivors who are too altruistic.
Kind of like the event here, people experience a few games of sadness and they start treating ALL their games with the assumption of sadness. Which just makes more sad games and now everyone is sad.
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Why do survivors complain about camping when all they do is gen rush?
This statement doesn't make any sense just like the OP
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Most killers don't know how to play killer imo they just run a rinse/wash cycle on repeat because some streamer told them to. They run some variation of pop, ruin, corrupt and then go to find a survivor, chase survivor, hit survivor, chase survivor until they get another hit and then hook survivor, repeat. They rarely ever create a decent build and play to the build, and they don't really pressure gens. To most killers running pop, ruin, or corrupt = pressuring gens so when you tell them to pressure gens they have no clue what you're talking about.
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It's pretty hard not to proxy camp survivors when there's only 4 gens left on the entire map at your first hook after 2 minutes of holding W and predropping pallets from every survivor you find.
Edit: and 2 of those gens are worked on and near the hook. This is my average trial.
Edit edit: seriously, I get what you're saying, but in my experience the camping comes after, though occasionally it does come before.
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Why do survivors complain about tunneling when they bodyblock with BT?
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Why do people think we need a new post complaining about camping every day?
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Why do Survivors complain about NoED when they genrush/ignore bones? 😁
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Cant really pressure gens if you're camping the hook.
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It's SWF sided, not survivor sided. Killers have a 70% win rate, which would be even higher if all they faced was solo players.
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Now hear me out.
Give me a way to pressure 4 individual survivors who are spread out around the map as a walking killer with no mobility.
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand go!
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People over simplify or over complicate this argument when in reality I believe it's sometimes a game by game circumstance.
Some killers camp because they aren't good at chasing or are having a bad game where they're chasing for 4 or 5 gens. Or they're just toxic.
Then there's time when survivors make it easy and keep sneaking around the hook. In this situation you're justified to camp because they won't leave the hook alone. A bad play on a survivors part.
The final circumstance is end game. Some people just let it go while others do what they believe is necessary which is sometimes camping when the exit gates are open. It's necessary and if they save them, it's the killers mistake but if the survivors get themselves killed trying to save the person on hook then its their fault.
They're might be more circumstances but these are the most basic one's. Camping is a strategy that often only works because your team let's it work.
I also don't know why people compare Gen rushing and camping when they're different things. Survivors gen rushing are just doing their objectives to which the blame can be put on the devs for still not adding more objectives or whatever is appropriate. Camping is a playstyle/strategy that killers choose to use which either works or doesn't.
This is also not taking I'm account the several dozen second chance perks survivors have to take themselves off hook or get someone else off. I don't actually know if killers have very many perks that revolve around hooks and are actually useful. Maybe I'm ranting or I look stupid but that's just my opinion and thoughts on the pointless argument that has no real answer
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Chicken and egg thing.
Do killers "proxy camp" an area with a 3 or 4 gen to prevent gens from flying?
Do killers in a match start camping because they see that gens are flying and they're trying to secure a kill or trying to get survivors to let go of gens to try and get the save?
Or do survivors do the gens fast because they see the killer is camping?
Personally I think it's a bit of both, but I mainly blame gens. I don't think it's survivors' fault. I think gens are too safe and too easy of an objective which leads killers to believe that there's nothing they can do to stop them in a lot of situations, especially with m1 killers. But, it's not just that. It's probably way more complicated.
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Kill rates are only so high because most survivors will kill themselves on hook, DC, or not save their teammates on hook, not because killers are actually that deadly.
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Survivors suicide at end game because escape is an option and not a requirement for a perk, where as killing is NOT an option for red rank killers if they wish to pip.
How many games have you had where all 4 survivors are alive after the 5th gen and 2 or 3 of them die attempting to save one guy instead of just leaving the killer with one kill?
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I dunno. Tunneling killers still complain about DS. !!Personal experience!!
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If killers are having so many difficulty against solo survivors I think they shouldn't be at the rank they're at, and pipping needs to be more difficult.
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No killer is having difficulty against solo's, its the swf groups that give anyone a hard time.
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I havn't complained about it since the change. I have noticed that it has become synonymous with swf though like adrenaline.
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Are you playing for killers?
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Could you verify that? Maybe a poll or something that shows campers/tunnellers think the game is Survivor sided? Anyway, Gen speeds are mostly fine in my opinion and the game is only Survivor sided at the highest levels of play (So it's mostly a non issue as comp is a joke in this game).
However, Survivors sometimes spawn in ways that make it essentially impossible to do anything as Killer. What is the Killer supposed to do if all 4 Survivors spawn on 4 separate gens? Even if the Killer downs one person quickly, 3 gens are still going to pop early if the Killer lacks mobility. Against a Survivor team with even a hint of competency, that's gg for the Killer. All the Killer can hope to do at that point is snowball (Which is quite difficult if the Survivors are splitting up), tunnel/camp or rely on their endgame perk(s) if they happen to have any. Gen speeds are fine for the most part but spawns can make gens pop very fast at times. Perhaps there could be a change where Survivors always all spawn together? This way, they have to make the decision to complete the first gen quickly, or take time to split up so that they're more efficient. I dunno.
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It has nothing to do with camping, it is a simple math problem that does not work in the killer's favor.
If a survivor does absolutely nothing, and just holds w, doesn't drop pallets, doesn't vault windows, literally uses nothing but shift + w. It will take the killer 48 seconds to down that survivor. Now factor in the time it takes to find that survivor to even start the chase, and the time it takes to pick them up, find a hook, walk to it, then hook them. If the other 3 survivors are on gens (as they should be) you just lost 3 gens. Rinse and repeat a second or 3rd time, and you just lost the game. Now factor in that pallets, windows, vaulting, LoS blockers, perks like iron will etc. all exist. Suddenly that 48 seconds can easily become much higher. This is why the current meta for survivors is just to forget looping and to hold shift + w and camp pallets and drop them immediately without actually looping.
The gen speed to chase ratio is off because the game is designed in such a way to assume that survivors don't slam generators as fast as possible. The whole point of this game is for survivors to be afraid of the big scary killer. To be afraid to do gens, to hide, and sneak away. To do totems, to do chests in hopes of finding an item that might save them against that big scary killer. The problem is, the minute you stop "roleplaying" that, the game completely breaks down. Because the reality is the killer is not big and scary, and survivors shouldn't be scared. they shouldn't waste time doing totems or opening chests or hell, even healing most of the time. Those things take too much time, when you could just be slamming a gen.
This is why camping, tunneling and slugging are so common. You just flat out don't have the time to hook, so you slug. You need to slow the game down because it goes too fast so you tunnel a survivor out asap. You need the survivors off the gens so you camp, and hope they become overly altruistic.
Probably the best strategy for killers to counter this is to run:
Corrupt + Lethal Pursuer + Sloppy + Thana.
Try to land a couple of good hits on survivors with LP, chase your second or 3rd one and then camp them. With Thana they get slowed down on gens, with sloppy, they have to heal before they go for the save. With corrupt, if they just slam gens, you now have a 3 gen.
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Usually because they're "forced" to camp because they lost 3 gens when doing one chase.
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Some killers complain about gen speeds.
Some killers camp.
It would suit my preconceptions against killers if I assumed these were the same people.
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Agree. Only with Nurse and Spirit too. Just a little less. And this is largely because many are simply not used to often playing against them.
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First you can find a survivor or at best more on a gen at the start that's one to all survivors off a gen. Two hook that survivor you chase after downing him. Three the survivors on the gen have to make a decision go for the save or do a gen. If they do the gen then their teammate dies. 4 while that person is on the hook and someone else is going for the save you can pressure someone else off of a gen. That's three people off of a gen maybe more if the 4th doesnt trust the 3rd person and decides he has to go to and thats big map pressure. There's your answer.
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Yeah, that 40% survive rate is oppressive to killers!
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The thing is: who complains about gens while camping?
This makes no sense...
If i camp, i already know im gonna get genrushed (unless the survivors are flowers standing still watching the guy in the hook die)
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The way I always look at it, at least before red rank, is I will play as relaxed as the survivors will allow. I pressure gens and hook survivors early in the match and when they are unhooked I make sure they can run away, sometimes even heal up fully. But when gens start popping left and right in the first two minutes and survivors start getting cocky then I play my way. If I know survivors are around you I will proxy camp. If I have to set up a 3 gen I will do it as close to your hook as possible and if I have to I will slug my way to victory. The issue with gen times and camping is ultimately some killers like Trapper and Demogorgon have to set up in the beginning of the game and lose a lot of time they could have had to pressure gens. Leading to aggravating tactics being used to catch back up. Survivors working together coordinated can also get one gen done in a minute, at max. Sometimes it takes longer than that to check all the gens.
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I don't mind gen speeds. But if there is only like one gen left and I did basically nothing, camping the hook is basically my only viable option outside of surrender. Rofl.
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