Today's Shrine
Yo BHVR what's the deal with putting Ruin and Undying together in the same Shrine? You're just telling your killers players to just give in and use Ruin + Undying (wich are DLC perks btw) instead of you doing your job of fixing the game so Band Aid Perks like Ruin and Undying aren't needed for killers. You are also fueling Survivor's to be angry at you because of how much they'll face Ruin + Undying against new killers players aswell. You're creating a storm where there wasn't a need, you already have plenty of Storms to handle atm.
I know fully well you can play without them, i don't use them cause i won't waste 2 Perks for 1 Hex and then lack some other type of Perk. Legion is probably the only killer i'd consider using Ruin + Undying. Make them Mend to buy Ruin some time to be valuable and if they don't wanna Mend then i can punish their greed with a down. but this is just me. Some people will just use Ruin + Undying on every killer wether it works or not.
Comments
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Ruin was in the shrine not that long ago and, correct me if I'm wrong, Undying has never been in the shrine at all, so it was going to happen sooner or later.
Besides, not that long ago we had Sprint Burst with Urban Evasion, followed be Fixated the day after.
And Adrenaline and Dead Hard a day before that.
If anything, I'm glad they're offering some decent perks.
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......
Wut?
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Next up will be DH and Prove for Survivors. #Balance
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Isn’t Prove Thyself currently in?
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yeah...?
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I just checked and it is! Prove and Detectives Hunch! They really trying to get both sides to complain. Must be looking to mix things up a bit 🤣
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And detectives hunch is also in the shrine. so the fixed the problem before it became one
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Sure Undying would get there sooner or later but out of all the perks it could be with it's with Ruin, it's closest ally...You can't tell it is random. Ruin + Undying is Meta and BHVR is using that...They are putting Meta Perks on discount so more people can acess Meta perks and keep the Meta the same without BHVR having to change anything about the game. Here's the Meta Perks now you're set...And those Meta perks are DLC aswell, without the Shrine you will have to PAY and then GRIND. I'll applaud the strategic move cause it's brilliant but i can still call out the Bullsheet when i see it.
Survivor perks are interchangeable, meaning you can use any perk and get a net buff because survivors aren't tied down to a speficic power that works one way and will combo or not with certain perks, there's no Perk that is a must have for survivors, while killers can't just slap any perk in and call it a build, a Trapper has no value to Ruin like Legion has. Legion has no value to STBFL or Sloppy Butcher like Trapper has, etc. Stridor was pointless to killers outside of Spirit and Nurse. Each killer benefits from perks differently while every survivor gets the same net bonus. THus any Survivor Perk in the Shrine is always valuable and they don't need to be Meta Perks.
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Yes BHVR never tries to change the meta that's why undying got nerfed and they released a perk with nemesis that has no synergy with hex/undying. You can say their attempts to change things don't often work but to say they don't try is pretty goofy.
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I know Ruin +Undying isn't that strong, it's why i said i wouldn't use it outside of probably Legion. But it's a Meta combo, BHVR is using a Meta Combo on Discount, think about the move they are making, giving players, especially new ones, Meta Perks on discount makes them use said Meta Perks to circumvent the issues of the game, thus BHVR doesn't have to actually make changes to the game because now new players can acess the Meta Perks more easily to circumvent the poor Balance of the game. Don't you see this as an issue? It's a brilliant move on BHVR's part but we can still call out the BS associated with the move. Out of all the Combo's Undying has Ruin is the one most people will go for regardless of it being strong or not. You see streamers/tubers going Ruin + Undying alot, propagating the Meta...
The fact Dettectives Hunch is in the Shrine doesn't solve the Meta of Ruin+ Undying, you don't need any Perk to know Ruin is in the game, you don't need any perk to find the Totem, even without Ruin + Undying you still get value out of Detective's Hunch wich is absolutly fine.
MY issue is they are forcing Meta Perks onto killer and then out of them being Meta they are THE META COMBO, obviously new killer players will use it because it's Meta and at the entry level of DbD Ruin + Undying is a strong combo and last time i checked Tutorial STILL didn't teach Survivors about Totems, so them not knowing Totems exists while new killers get Ruin+ Undying will make the entry level matches a living hell for Survivors and more Ruin + Undying being OP cries will happen which given BHVR's tendency to Balance the game for the lowest skill level will mean any cries against Ruin + Undying will have a huge ripple. This is what i mean about BHVR creating a Storm.
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Despite the Nerf, wich was deserved, Undying is still Meta so apparently BHVR sucks at changing the Meta. And if you're talking about Eruption then forget it, Eruption is not Meta and it's value is minimal for the set up required.
So now imagine, you're a new killer player and you already have Nemesis cause that's how you got into DbD, now you get Ruin+ Undying for FREE because BHVR gave you the shards during the event. Now you're on Meta Perks, and jsut like you there's manny more now on Meta, and the Meta is just going and going and BHVR doesn't have to change anything about the game so there's a Meta change, you got those FREE so you can't complain or won't think why BHVR is winning and we're all losing.
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You missed the entire point of my most I wasn't denying ruin/undying is meta (although it's far from necessary) I'm saying BHVR has attempted to shift the meta they just failed.
I really doubt this is the last attempt though and to suggest they want it to be the meta forever is silly. I swear only this community could take BHVR trying to do something nice and turn it into a dumbass conspiracy.
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This
LOL
:)
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This is some of the most tinfoil hat nonsense I've ever read on these forums.
They are good perks, the shrine is changing daily to include lots of different good, perks as part of the event. It's a good opportunity to give us Undying for the first time.
That's all there is too it.
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Some people complain that none of the powerful perks are ever in the Shrine.
There's a week that some of the most powerful perks for Survivor and Killer are actually in the Shrine.
Some people then complain that the Shrine is filled with these powerful perks.
Sigh. :shakeshead:
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I'm pretty annoyed that it changes daily. I saw that Pop was available earlier in the week but i had 2 nights off from playing due to availability and im miffed that I missed it :/
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I mean I had a rank 2 use all gen perks, he got 3 hooks... perks arent that strong, you just have to be able to play. Like alot of things people complain about are noob stompers...
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It's been really good meta perks for everyone all week, stop crying.
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How long has Ruin been in the game and how long has it been Meta? They've been failing for years cause the problem isn't the Perks, they can introduce how manny Gen regression perks they want, it won't fix the issue. The issue steams from the core of the game, the fundamentals, most notably killers lack of mobility compared to Map size, killers lack of pressure compared to Survivor Spawns, etc. It's why the Meta never really changes. What's the killer Meta? Ruin, Undying, Tinkerer, BBQ, Pop, Corrupt. Everything else is off Meta. Isn't Undying the only Meta Perk we got with the last 4 killers? That's a whole year right?
People complain about the Perks in Shrine normally because the Disparity between the quality of the perks is too big, the price of the perks is too high, It will take a high number of matches played to get your first 2000 Shards and the fact we never know if something good is coming after we used our Shards. If it wasn't for the Free Shards we got because of the Annyversary most players wouldn't get manny free perks and new players would have to endure the Grind like everyone else. They could honestly lower the price of Perks in the Shrine to half and keep it rotating twice a week to alleviate the Grind.
Ofc the perks aren't strong they are two Hex Perks...the problem is they are a solution still and they are Meta so even if they are the worst solution they will still get used, especially in lower ranks among new players cause they finally got the Meta Perks, low ranks is advantageous to killer, so this is a powerful combo to get just for 3k shards wich everyone got for free, it will boost noob killers in ranks and make noob survivors angry and cry Ruin + Undying is OP because at those low ranks yeah they are really Strong.
I'm not crying in the sense that they aren't Meta or both sides aren't getting them. I'm saying BHVR is propagating the Meta and washing their hands out of fixing the game by giving the Meta perks essentially for free, cause they gave shards aswell. What incentive do they have to fix the game and change Meta if they just give the current Meta and solutions away for free? Not manny players are gonna deny using the Meta, especially new players. The Shrine isn't random, it's not like the planets, stars and criquets aligned to give us the Dynamic Duo of Hex Perks, BHVR chose to do so.
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Imagine complaining about the game offering perks that are in the game...
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I mean, it's the meta they created so I don't think they are that mad about it.
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See this amazes me.
Yes, they gave killers ruin and undying.
They also gave you prove thyself and detectives hunch WHICH COUNTERS RUIN/UNDYING
Survivors i swear to God, youre all so focused on bitching about killers you dont stop to think about how you can counter what theyre doing that you hate
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Yes, having meta perks won't make people win a game. It helps, but it's not an auto-win-GG-EZ.
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I'm a survivor player once in a blue moon, if it's facing my window at the right angle... I'm complaining as a killer on this... WE shouldn't propragate a Meta that not only is Dumb, cause you're using 2 Hexes just for Ruin, but is also extremely innefective...
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Imagine not understanding why i'm complaining and complain about it...
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Your complaint is silly.
The shrine runs through random perks on a white list. Eventually, a combo that works well together was going to come up. Complaining about it is the same as complaining that someone rolled two 100s in a row on a 100 sided dice. While not likely, it's entirely possible and not a big deal. You're making a big deal out of it.
Get over it. You're being silly.
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Yeah they created that Meta as a band aid fix. Ruin to stop gens and Undying to protect Ruin. That's the issue, they created band aid solutions instead of fixing the problem. Do you honestly feel like running Meta Perks is fine and healthy for a game? BHVR just gave Meta away for free so we, or whoever wants to, keep playing Meta. For How long has Ruin been Meta? The problem isn't that there aren't other Gen Slowdown Meta Perks the Problem is the Gen Slowdown Meta when Gen protection isn't part of the killers objective but is tied to killer progression. Killers won't rank up without Protecting Gens...Killers should chase and hook and Gen protection should be a consequence of hooking survivors and not a mandatory non objective.
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Shrine has never been random.
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Undying was in a past shrine i think it was the week before the nerf or the week after the nerf.
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I have been having lots of fun with Undying/Devour. As for ruin it stays up longer for me if I run it by itself. Gone in less than a minute (if I'm lucky a minute) with Undying attached.
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+
Just saying....
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My point was they gave a killer build and a survivor build that counters it. Theres nothing to ######### about there. You dont have to like the meta, but it does exist.
That said i agree with you on it being mostly ineffective/inconsistent
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Mind citing your sources? I cannot find any proof that the shrine is not random.
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Metas are an unsolvable problem, if gens didn't need slowing down then a new meta would take it's place to deal with the next issue, metas are a constant they just take different forms, people will always play to their strength.
If slowdown is a bandaid, then you acknowledge there is a problem, then isn't it good that newer players now have access to the solution in the absence of bhvr changing the problem.
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The thing is survivor main want strong perk for them and they want the killer to have weak perk.
Killer main want strong perk for them and they want the survivor to get bad perk.
Then you have the people who play both side and they hope the shrine bring the perk they need so they can finish their survivor or killer build
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If we recognise Perks as band aid fixes, wich some Perks clearly are, then we identify the problem and then the solution is to fix the problem and not perpetuate the cycle of Band aid fixing via Perks, via mechanics like Bloodlust, etc. Forcing New Players into Band Aids isn't the Solution, i don't want New Players to endure what we endured and still do daily or just in occasion, i want the game to be better but we're trapped in an endless vicious cycle because BHVR doesn't have a Solution or isn't in their interests to get a Solution, afterall it's been 5 years and we're still here bigger than ever but still complaining about the same old things. If we solved the issues then there wouldn't be a Meta. The game should function without Band Aids first.
If there was no Perks then what would the Meta be? The game would have to be Balanced around the most basic abilities right? That would only strengthen the core of the game. The reality is that without Perks both sides have alot less they can do or know. Wouldn't it be better if the the most basic aspect of the game were actual base mechanics and abilities instead of Perks? What can a Survivor do without Perks? Nothing, what can a killer do against gen rushing without Perks if their power doesn't give mobility or information? Nothing. What makes all of this even worse? Map RNG...We're 5 years in and we're still playing a game from 2016 or 2017, none of the core features of the game have been improved. All we have are broken promisses...WE don't need another Gen Regression Meta we need a solution to the Gen Rush problem. Reflect on how the Maps affect the flow of a match, reflect how spawns directly impact the outcome of a match, reflect how the Grind affects progression, etc. In 5 years i havent seen any of these things being reflected upon and being changed, all we got was Perks and 2 mechanics that are hated by each sides, Survivors hate Bloodlust because it's a passive bonus for killers and killers hate Breakable Walls because they create or eliminate loops but you'll only know from experience so you're still playing into infinites unless you know, wich again punishes new players because BHVR refuses to fix Maps. Isn't there a way to make Maps better so Shift W isn't as strong and also make loops fair? I Believe there is, i believe BHVR lacks the capacity or has no interest in doing so and instead they just give us a Perk or a pointless mechanic that doesn't fix the issue.
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If the Shrine was Random you wouldn't be getting Corrupt, Pop and Ruin in 3 days for Killers and whatever Survivors got, obviously the Shrine is being Manipulated now so that means there's a way to Manipulate it so that means the Shrine is being predetermined, meaning it's not random. I don't need any sources, just use your common sense. If it can be manipulated now then it can be Manipulated any time. For example just before the DS change DS was in Shrine and right after Object of Obsession was changed they put Object of Obsession into the Shrine. Are you gonna say those were Random aswell? Are you gonna deny the fact that those were big changes and BHVR Manipulated the Shrine to have those Perks so anyone could get them and use them and give feedback about the changes? Again if they can Manipulate Shrine then it's not Random.
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You do realize, that both detectives hunch AND prove thyself, BOTH direct counters to ruin/undying, are also in the shrine right?
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Or, they are random but the odds can be changed for every perk, and the devs CAN (read: possible but not commonly) manually put in perks to be listed while it is otherwise random. Regardless, they have stated it is random, you have no ACTUAL proof it isn't, I'll take the devs word over yours since they made the game. They have stated that the current combination was random, and while I don't believe 100% of what they say, we have no actual evidence to the contrary.
So you can get all upset about what is in the shrine, I'm going to continue to not care because it's basically a random lotto of perks that anyone could get otherwise if they wanted them anyways.
If you get some actual proof it's not random and not just "look at me, listen to me, it's not random cuz I said so", we can talk.
Lastly, I want to point out that I agree with you about the meta. The slowdown meta is annoying in that it feels required, many perks are basically just patchwork fixes that should be standard in the game, and fixes to the game shouldn't be handed to us as though we're supposed to pick which fixes we want and which problems we simply have to endure. I wouldn't be surprised if the console optimization was a perk that all console players had to run in order to play the game.
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The perks being in the Shrine is not a big deal. They're perks from original characters, so players who wanted them could have easily just purchased the required killers with shards and just grind out the blood web. And since the streaming community is so big with Dbd, any killer who wants to learn how to better their experience would have already learned about these perks without looking at the shrine.
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But you're complaining? And people see to complain about most things in the game, so what I'd theyrr meta? Both sided have meta perks but when you actually look at it killer has far less useful perks so I dont blame them using it, but yes ruin beats bad survivors because they dont do gens or arent efficient but these perks wont carry the killer, like all perks they will help but not carry and that's both sides. Bad players can get better, but at high skill (not the best just high) the killer struggles and people can easily counter it
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Exactly, so it's a weak Meta, but it's still the Meta we got. They are giving a flimsy excuse of Meta Perks to circumvent the Gen Slowdown problem they don't wanna fix. With this being in the Shrine more people will be using it, especially new players, they are forcing a Meta that doesn't even work, on new players, they are tricking their playerbase. It's a weak Meta for killer, people shouldn't be using it but it's in the Shrine and it's literally free cause they already gave you the shards aswell. Can't you you understand what BHVR is doing? If they give the Meta away for free then everyone can run Meta and the problem is "fixed" everyone can run Meta to "fix" the problem BHVR ignores. This ######### shouldn't be happening. I'd rather buff Surge or Eruption rather than using Ruin + Undying but since apparently nobody read the whole og post they never understand why i'm "complaining" and i keep repaeating myself in every answer.
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Yeah sure go ahead, eat up all BHVR does. If i say X is wrong i'm just me but if BHVR says Y then yeah sure BHVR is not at all incapablke of lying and tricking their costumers. You want proof i gave you the Shrines as proof. Ignore all you want, licks BHVR's ass as much as you want.
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They made it accessible to have more statistics I guess. Nerf incoming ? Thats my bet.
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