http://dbd.game/killswitch
As Long as SWF Exists...
There really isn't a way to counter it unless they drastically change the way the game is played. (AKA making the game mechanics for killer and killer perks based off of the fact that survivors are SWF)
I love Solo Q and SWF but unfortunately they're completely different experiences. I know this is a discussion that gets talked about a lot but just thought I'd put my $0.02 in.
Comments
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Mmr will address SWF just fine.
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I don't think so, cuz then you can inflate your MMR when you play with friends, but this will mean you will lose your solo queues for a while afterwards. It would be wonky.
There are a lot of ways to fix the SWF problem. One of which is making SWF games a separate ranking ladder (for both sides). But probably keeping it the same queue, to avoid ruined queue times.
I've also suggested that there be an option (that starts enabled) deciding whether you face against SWF's or not. Making it default enabled would mean MOST players wouldn't bother disabling it, if they even read patch notes at all. However, those that REALLY wanna avoid SWF's would be able to.
And those are just changes that don't even rebalance the game at all. There are also multiple ways to rebalance the actual game, and in my opinion, the game should be balanced around SWF's because that's the reality we're in.
Currently, a public team of 4 skilled solo queuers is still very tough for a good Killer to beat. So I see no issue with balancing around SWF's.
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How so? Ranked Matchmaking will fix this?
I'd like that, they should make it that you can go into Solo Play as an Option as survivor and only be teamed up with other Solo survivors. As well as Killers who are only looking for Solo Q Survivors.
And SWF can be it's own que.
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SWF isnt the problem here. Solo Q actually is.
The reason quite a lot of killers arent as strong as they should be to work with optimal SWF, is because they would be far too powerful to deal with Solo Q.
Nerfing or removing SWF would mean nerfing killers. Buffing Solo up to the potential of SWF would mean buffing killers.
Dont hate on SWF being strong, hate on Solo Q being weak.
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I just meant that SWF that are genuinely good would go up against the top killers, and SWF that are just chill homies would go up against chill killers. The issue work SWF 90% of the time is basically a killer complaining that they can't handle it. Which is probably true. And their matchmaking ratings will differ wildly if that is the case. Not all SWF are death squads, though. You know? They don't need addressing. The crazy high end is where they need to tweak balance, imo.
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MMR will do absolutely nothing except force high-MMR killers to run strict meta builds to have a chance
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Which is why we've been absolutely ######### begging for solo buffs for years so we can then buff killers as well but there's always someone like "SURVIVORS DON'T NEED TO BE STRONGER" not realising the bigger picture.
These people also include BHVR because no matter how many times I bring it up I don't get any less angry at the stupid horrible awful Small Game change and the fact that they keep putting vital information on ######### perks
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Well get used to it bc swf probably (hopefully) isn't going anywhere. The only way they can address swf is by changing killer and solo queue in some way.
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So how the real issue is needing to boost Solo Q?
How are we going to buff Solo Q then?
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Buddy here actually thinks MMR will work.
audiencelaugh.wav
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The game was never designed with team voice chat, which I think says a lot about how the game is supposed to technically be played. SWF gives you access to multiple perks that you otherwise would be using if you were playing solo. Which is precisely why you can tell when you're playing against solo survivors versus a SWF.
Honestly I'll believe it when I see it. They've been talking about the MMR for a few years now with nothing to show for it other than a handful of tests.
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I shouldn't be forced to play Blight with Tinkerer/Ruin/Undying/BBQ every single match because the game decided I'm high-MMR and matched me exclusively with 4-man SWFs. I main Clown, I should be able to play Clown and be competitive.
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Maybe I didn't understand the MMR system properly but I thought each killer had a seperate MMR. So, if you "win" 10000 games in a row as blight you wouldn't face the same survivors as clown if you're only "winning" a quarter of your games.
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That's the ideal form but not the one we saw. And that still wouldn't address the problem of high-MMR just being a meta vacuum with nothing else. Only 4 out of 25 killers are competitively viable, thus DBD is not ready for a competitive ranking system.
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The problem is simply this. The devs designed the game in such a way that having information, or rather lack of information, is a game mechanic. How many survivor perks simply tell you where your teammates are? Because of this, SWF, by the sheer fact that they are in discord together get around 40+ survivor perks for free and many other benefits that don't exist in perk form.
This is because the devs never want to address problems on a systemic level, they only ever introduce perks to deal with it.
Tired of getting tunneled? Run BT/DS
Tired of getting slugged? Run UB
Tired of getting gen rushed? Run some gen slowdown
Tired of keys? Run Franklins
Tired of not knowing what pallets your teammates used? Run Windows of Opportunity
Tired of your totems getting cleansed too fast? Run Hex: Undying
See the problem? Instead of addressing some of these problems, they just introduce perks to deal with it. The problem is, some of these like camping, tunneling, the gen to chase time ratio, keys, information about teammates, are all important things that should be dealt with on a systemic level, otherwise you have to run the perks to deal with them. And there are way more systemic problems than there are perks. This is why every survivor generally runs the same 10 or so perks and every killer runs the same 15 or so perks. Every other perk doesn't fix these systemic problems.
What they need to do, is address these things as part of the game itself (not perks) and then nerf or rework the perks that deal with them so that we can have true perk diversity.
Imagine a world where solo queue survivors just had permanent global "bond" in effect (and blindness didn't exist). Imagine a world where kindred was base kit. Imagine a world where the game was slowed down a bit and you didn't have to run 3 gen slowdown perks just to keep up. Imagine a world where tunneling or camping wasn't effective.
Once you do those types of things, and "Buff" solo queue, you can now buff killers to compensate and this will finally "nerf" SWF. Because if all survivors knew everything every other survivor was doing by default, it would "nerf" SWF in discord.
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Okay so. Currently DBD needs to be balanced for 3 different groups: Solo, Killer, SWF. Two fo these groups (Solo and SWF) have the same base tools to work with, only SWF have the extra advantage of voice comms.
Because of this, you cannot nerf survivors effectively, nor buff killers, without making solo queue a shitstorm to play through. So buffing killers without anything to survivors if off the table, as is nerfing survivors base.
So, why not nerf SWF and only SWF, like many have suggested? Because this would more than likely kill the game. SWF is the reason why the game is flourishing and why BHVR can continue to recycle veterans for new players. Also, anyone who isn't on comms is punished, as are those that just meme, so you effectively force everyone into playing very sweatily. Not what anyone wants.
So, buff solo queue to get the information SWF can get for free by existing on comms, and in return buff killers and their mechanics including better and longer totems, stronger perks, longer gen speeds, giving all killers some form of mobility, and stronger maps (for them).
Solo Q is what is holding back DBD from ever becoming anywhere near balanced, because all the perks they use to get information SWF get for free, the SWF themselves don't need to use. Kindred? Nope. Alert? Nope. Aftercare? Empathy? Bond? Nope.
Solos shouldn't have to use items, perks, or add-ons to get information SWF get for free.
Every time I mentioned SWF in this comment I do mean very good players who use comms to scream info at each other, not people who meme around with friends.
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SWF is fine and solo queue is (mostly) fine. The problems stem from matchmaking and bad players on both sides of the equation.
Killers greatly over-estimate how much average SWF comms do. You don't just load into a SWF and have good, tight, relevant comms on every map without any practice. Most of the comms I hear on twitch streams are things that a good solo queue survivor picks up from basic game sense. Killers think they're playing against Oracle when they're really playing a team that is talking about the food they just ordered.
Good players tend to get tired of bad solo teammates, so they SWF with other good players. Four good players are tough for an average killer to beat, with or without comms.
The reality is that most players (at least 75%) are sub-optimal at best. Good survivors tend to SWF, which causes an association between SWF and a balance issue. Most killers aren't nearly as good as they think they are. Beating bad solos will do that. Then they run into players they shouldn't be matched against and think the only possible reason they could have lost is SWF.
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With longer ueques for em and the poorly killer pool left even more poor cool!
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I almost never SWF - and have never 4-man SWFd in nearly 1900 hours as survivor.
As killer (almost 2000 hours now) - I have no issues with SWF - I like challenges and find most SWFs are not much better and no more "toxic" than 4 random solo players. One would think according to these forums that SWFs are death squads etc, but just not my experience and I have been a red rank killer for almost 5 years. I actually enjoyed SBMM as killer because I got matched with better survivors which was more challenging and fun. I am excited for SBMM to be coming (which will be much sooner than people think) because overall it made the game way more enjoyable as killer and survivor imo.
I will say that I find solo survivors to be more obnoxious AFTER a match has ended - they are generally the ones who come to my stream with their SDE and racist/homophobic comments.
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The problem with SWF is that parts of the game are balanced around it existing (blindness, Knockout, Spirit, etc) and others aren't (Hex totems, perk co-ordination, Trapper, matchmaking in general, etc).
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A way to counter swf is to go for the weakest link and tunnel them out, it is not fun for you or them but that is the counter honestly.
It is easier for the killer to play a 3v1 than a 4v1.
I just would like to know if they are in a swf so I could actually use slightly stronger addons or well use addons in my case or when I play trapper to place smarter traps that would catch solo players but not swf because of info.
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Solo Q survivors also suck because they lack skill. Period.
I never see anyone mention how inefficient and just outright mindless some of them are. Not to mention go down in 2 seconds. None of which comms has anything to do with.
Sure, comms can ease some parts of the match and killer builds with hexes. But generally and individually good survivors are independent regardless of communication. I don’t need someone to tell me the hex is at shack, I have enough hours into the game that I know where to look… that’s just one example.
90% of the problems in soloQ have nothing to do with communication not being given to them, it has to do with what I stated above. They don’t touch gens for god knows what reason, they are too afraid to unhook the second they hear a TR. These are too common. So I don’t blame the devs for not thinking SWF is that far off from Solo when you put things into perspective.
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