The Pinhead changes are terrible
Almost the entirety of the changes either don't make much of a difference or they make him even worse than he was before. The 1 good change that sticks out is that the chains in the chain hunts won't spawn behind a wall and immediately break. Everything else though is just... what were they thinking? The chains still break immediately if the survivor goes behind an obstacle, or if Pinhead himself walks through them. You can now go into his first-person chain shot only for 6 seconds, and I'm assuming you still get the meter cooldown even after that. What's next, is Nurse gonna get that treatment too? His long range add-ons aren't even gonna matter, because like Deathslinger you're not gonna get anything from snipes because the chain will break on an obstacle immediately. Survivors don't even have to press M1 on reaction to start getting the chains off. They can be holding the button down before they get hit, so the millisecond a chain gets attached to them they're already getting it off.
But the most insulting changes are to the box. To my horror, I discovered that a survivor simply holding the box being able to stop everyone else's chain hunt was not a bug but a feature! Looks like no lessons were learned with Twins. Sure, that one survivor holding the killer's power hostage is more vulnerable or whatever, but the whole rest of the team has little pressure on them if one decides to do that, and even less pressure if the killer decides to go for the person holding the power hostage.
If you ask me, a survivor should have to solve the box in order to stop everyone's chain hunts, not just hold it. And Pinhead should be able to teleport when someone starts working on the box, not when everyone's chain hunts are already gone. What's the point of that?
I wanted to be wrong, but it looks like I'm gonna be right. Pinhead is gonna be a contender for the worst killer in the game.
Comments
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Hey, maybe we should wait and see how Pinhead performs and then judge accordingly in a month or two?
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You are too early, we start with the "Killer X is the worst Killer/an OP Killer"-Threads after the release. Please come back in a few days.
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Yeah.........I've seen worse
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Strange, it seems to me they are addressing most of the requests I've seen based on the PTB. I'm willing to wait and see and not worry about what arm-chair quarterbacks have to say.
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I agree with all you said, specially the part where Pinhead can break his own chains just by walking through them, this feels so stupid.
I've said before that clown is a better pinhead because his bottles don't slow him down, cenobite makes you stop while you throw the chains, they are harder to hit and the slowdown is inconsistent; sometimes it stops the survivor a decent amount of time, sometimes it does literally nothing.
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Quarterbacks? I have never heard this one before... But I do generally agree that arm chair quarterbacks probably aren't fit to discuss game balance, rofl.
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Damn bro you from the future?
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I don't get why Pinhead can destroy his own chains. Why is the killer punished for using his power? That's such a flawed design
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Have you any gameplay to support your claims that the changes were terrible? If not, this is just a meaningless post.
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Kind of like how trapper can step in his own traps.
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Why bother?
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Because the devs apparently said "his ability is supposed to be used quickly mid-chase" yet doing so is usually gonna make you miss.
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The same can be said about almost every killer in the game.
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The only genuinely problematic and overtly silly change was locking his gateway to a 6-second window, because clearly an unlimited gateway duration wasn't gamebreaking (or even useful) and didn't need to be nerfed. For all the rest, we simply don't know how it's going to play out.
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I'm not gonna judge until he's been out for at least a week or two but the change I'm iffy about is the holding of the box hostage. I still think it can be held hostage but we'll see. I didn't have access to the ptb being console so I really can't judge anything until he releases.
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I'm quite sure that he's outclassed by Clown and far far more by Nurse, but we will see, as everyone said.
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Which killer can destroy their own slowdown power? I'm not talking about Pinhead standing still to use it.
Trapper would be the only one and he does really bad already.
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I'm talking about what you said about killers being punished for using their own power. Nurse's fatigue, Hillbilly's overheat, Clown's yellow bottles speeding survivors up, Legion's fatigue, Blight's fatigue, Victor being kickable even after a successful down, Trickster's knives going away on their own. It's like the devs can't make a killer without giving them a built-in counter for the survivors to benefit off of.
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That's what I don't get. The counterplay to Pinhead should be dodging the chains and using the environment to break the chains fast. That should be more than enough but Pinhead just straight up breaks them himself. Guess the killer is considered a part of the environment then.
I don't mind mechanics like fatigues but don't stack them.
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yes these are very anti-fun mechanics for killer. zero fun allowed.
survivors do not just want counter-play, they want an instant win button and breaking chains instantly is an instant win button against Pinhead's power. I mean survivors are 4:1 ratio to killers, so if survivor say this is good mechanic, that mechanic stays. Honestly I think that when Pinhead goes live, every single Pinhead is just going to use Engineer fang(an iri add-on that injures survivor instantly) and impaling wire(a purple add-on that spawns more chains) to play him, otherwise his power is worthless until they buff his chain charges which they won't do because he will probably be "good" statistically from those two add-ons.
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It’s dumb that Pinhead can break his own chains. However, the developer update DID mention that if Pinhead breaks his own chains, a new one will spawn, theoretically making the chains last a little longer if executed correctly. Did I read it wrong or have we just forgotten?
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Yes. Killers have been nerfed in their entirety before because of 1 or 2 (I don't even want to say) problematic add-ons. Say a killer has their 2 strongest add-ons, but they only use one during a standard match. That's manageable for the survivors. It's the spam of their best add-ons that people have issues with, because they're not unbeatable with those add-ons, but it's very tough. You're not gonna see All-seeing Blood/Silent Bell Wraiths, double iridescent Trapper, or Compound Thirty-three/Alchemist's Ring Blight every match, but if that's like half your matches, like some people are claiming it is, then you can see where they're coming from. But even then that's still not enough to warrant "nerf this killa" as much as it does nerfing 1 or 2 of those problematic add-ons. I like to run browns and yellows on killers, so I'm not always dependent on add-ons. Anyway, old Hillbilly, old Nurse, Freddy recently, they all got nerfs to their base kit that they didn't deserve AND had their add-ons gutted. That's what's ruining the game for killer.
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I still don't like the concept. To me it's just like Clown's yellow bottles speeding up the survivors, or Nemesis's tentacle giving the survivors a sprint burst just from an infection.
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I'd like to see you play Legion some day, lol. Most of the killers are punished in some way for using their power or require significant effort to get it. Because pallets and god windows/loops and so on isn't enough counter play for survivors, or long cooldown 1-3 conditions required perks aren't enough counter play for survivors lol.
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Yep: as is, Pinhead will be the #1 worst killer in the game. At least among the 115% MS killers.
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So I am of the opinion that strong add-ons make killers strong and viable for highest level(top 5%).
This statement though implies that the killer at base-kit is functional and effective to some degree. Pinhead current base-kit is really bad right now. those add-on are just going attempt to help his poor base-kit. good add-on with poor-base kit might elevate the killer to perform at average level. if he is average due to killers using his strongest add-ons, than they will not change him because according to statistic, he will do fine despite being almost unplayable without those two add-ons.
he will definitely not be the worst killer with engineer's fang and impaling wire. Its just that killers should not become entirely dependent on iri & purple add-on just to be average. killers should be somewhat playable to mild degree without add-ons.
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Just to further talk about your first post regarding the box:
His box in general is just badly implemented. if you did not know, using his teleport resets chain hunt timer. The fact that survivors control where he teleports means that they can walk to corner of the map with like sprint burst. solve box and if he teleports, you can just sprint burst away which wastes pinhead his time. moreover, pinhead is likely to start chases in favorable survivor positions when the box is solved. The teleport just is not very well thought out.
The aspect that is actually good about box which is chain hunt will not ever be activate because survivor can hold the box and the only way for you to activate that box is to find survivor that holds it and down that player. it means box mechanic forces killer to tunnel vision the survivor. that is as horrible as trickster's laceration mechanic.
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Its real shame because I think pinhead is super fun to play and I would definitely want to put many hours in learning him but there is currently too many drawbacks to his ability that make him unrewarding to play.
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For the holding the box thing, the issue is there are going to be trolls who hold the box and don't let anyone else solve it to cause problems. It should pause it for 10 seconds for all other survivors, then resume. If it is not solved in 20 seconds, it should leave their hands and teleport somewhere else.
I think BHVR's biggest flaws as designers is being unwilling to make small changes more frequently. A lot of killers don't need overhauls or reworks. Just change some numbers in small ways, and make it clear that you are experimenting with the numbers. TEST if Freddy needed less pallets too, or if less pools was enough. Reduce them one at a time. Reduce Legion's CD by .2 seconds for a few months, see if it makes them more viable. Increase Wraith's speed while cloaked from 122% to 130%, then 135%, then 140%. That kind of thing.
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I think he'll be better than Trickster simply because he's 115%. Both killers get forced into scenarios where they can't use their abilities, and 115% is definitely more favorable than 110% at those loops.
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Yes they should definitely do that. Looking back, they were on a roll with Trickster in terms of testing things. Changing him upon release, then after that, then when Nemesis released. And they were messing with multiple aspects of him too: his Main Event, his initial throw speed, his hit indication, his add-ons. Sadly even after all that we have a killer that's barely acceptable and can't beat good teams. If they at least try to put in similar time into changing Pinhead, he's gonna be alright, potentially even a new high tier killer.
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Pinhead is simultaneously a worse version of doctor and twins lol.
His chasing power doesn't do anything in a chase - he stands still while summoning a chain that doesn't prevent you from doing anything other than a fast vault - but you can still vault. So it's a neutral or even negative in chase. Especially since they're made of paper and break as soon as they touch a survivor in any kind of chase/loop and they can hold m1 before they even land and break all 3. Compared to Shock Therapy where sure it slows you down a bit but you get a big cone in front of you through all obstacles that flat out prevents any interaction.
His Lament Configuration isn't Victor, it's not injuring or preventing them from doing anything really. Someone can hold it hostage all game just like they already do with Victor and even better, they don't give killer instinct on them or their team-mates and can still do gens and other stuff aside from an annoying chain every few seconds you just let go/dodge and hop back on.
I think at the very least everyone should see the aura of Lament Configuration at all times, even Pinhead. If you wanna hold the box hostage all game, you're painting a target. This would also kinda be incentive for not having the same survivor pick it up every time, and likely they'd be solving it while you're carrying a survivor to the hook or stunned by a pallet/flashlight anyway.
Everyone seeing the aura makes the puzzle box a genuine threat and priority as it should be, wherever it randomly spawns after it's either been solved or a chain hunt has started - also incentive for survivors to spread out on their gens which is optimal play to begin with, but will also mean someone's bound to be closer to the box than Pinhead himself and can solve it. You might think it's super OP but it's ultimately just a super weak BBQ on a single survivor at a time. Compared to Victor where teams will literally not care about being incapacitated and giving killer instinct on themselves and allies nearby the entire game lol.
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I think survivors being able to see the box cross-map is busted. The add-on where they have to be close to it to see its aura should be basekit. His teleport should also function differently. What's the point in teleporting to someone if it's gonna pause everyone's chain hunts regardless? He should teleport to interrupt them, not when the damage has already been done.
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Agreed. Also the chains are pretty useless in a chase. It doesn't matter if the cooldown is super short if they don't accomplish anything lol, they should be twice as hard to break with twice the cooldown or something along those lines because right now you're standing still, the survivor is making ground, and then they break the chains just as you've made up any ground you lost using the power in the first place.
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Ya but you cant tell the devs that. They think its GREAT.....Trying to tell the devs something is wrong with the game is like trying to tell Trump not to build a wall. Neither one listens unless it brings them in money.
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He's objectively the worst Killer because he didn't come on release.
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He's absolutely trash and it's disgraceful that they thought this was okay to release ontop of having the nerve to ask for money for it.
He might as well just be a poster and stand there
also that statement they keep saying is gonna kill their own game.
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Yeah, Trickster was an example of them doing fine tuning mostly correctly, but I still think they tried to do too many changes at once. Still, I like that they are now making it clear they will have a set schedule to review the performance of newly released killers.
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