With the spirit and deathslinger nerfs the balance team proves they are totally bad at the game.
Removing any sorts of mind game from the spirit, being able to "know" where she is with sounds and be able to see where she precisely is with the dust she will leave while phasing, why not simply make her totally visible at this point and spirit can't see survivors at this point?
The dust itself isn't too awful and could help with some tracking but totally removing mind games is the worse thing ever, if the spirit stays still you check around you to see moving dust and if there isn't you stay there, or hell if the survivor has spine chill they can easily tell if spirit will phase or not, but they gave 2 extremely awful nerfs to her giving survivors way too many informations to track the spirit, how can the spirit expect to mind gam a survivor at a pallet they haven't dropped yet?, they will hear and see where she's going and drop it on her face.
At her release long ago, survivors could hear where she was going back in the days, until she got buffed and this was removed, now it's back, and she'll be awful like she was back then.
Spirit is ######### dead, good job BEhaviour.
Deathslinger is a killer that takes more time to injure survivors than huntress, has to reload, needs to be able to bring the survivor to him to put them into the dying state, CAN'T multi target, and you want to remove his 1V1 strength?????
That's all I'm gonna say about deathslinger, everything has been said
I hope the recoveries are 0.25 seconds for aiming and not more than 0.5 seconds for canceling the aim, or he's ######### dead too.
Good job at being bad at your own game BEhaviour.
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For sure it was for them
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To be honest, I don't mind the Spirit changes. For 2 reasons. First, at present, the Survivor can't really see or hear the Spirit but she can hear but not see them. Making it fair so both can hear the other doesn't seem like a terrible idea to me. Don't know about the Dust change but that's not in this patch so... *shrug*. Other thing is that current Spirit is probably the 2nd most powerful Killer in the game. Even if she does somewhat lose her really strong 1v1, she still has mobility and she still can use her Phase Walk similar to how Pig uses Ambush in chase. That alone should keep her from being completely terrible.
With Deathslinger, his ridiculous 1v1 is literally all he's got. I'm not exaggerating when I say his 1v4 might just be the worst in the entire game. Without his OP 1v1, he's probably going to be terrible.
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You didn't play spirit at her release for thinking that, She was awful at release, you'll know what I mean when you'll play as or against her with those changes, and she won't be the second most powerful killer in the game after this, I assure you.
And he will be, I truly hope they will be very very short delays, because if they are too long it will be so bad, and why making him 32 meters and keeping him at 110%? just make him 28 meters instead or something.
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I did not play Spirit at her release, no. However, one potential thing that could happen is if her phase noise stays nondirectional for Survivors outside her TR... I could see her equipping M&A and playing like a mix of old Global Bell Wraith and current Pig with Combat Straps + Shattered Syringe. Which wasn't the greatest, but it wasn't half bad.
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I am pretty sure M&A will not affect the 24 meter sound she will make when phasing, knowing the devs, it won't be related to the TR
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Spirit changes finally, the dust change will be delayed and should be tested to the extreme. But the other one is good. Slinger changes really surprised don’t know where that came from, but he’ll need more compensation.
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The thing is, the Devs have said multiple times that they balance the game towards fun. FUN. Not balance. Spirit and Deathslinger were not fun to play against, because their feedback was minimal, and their counterplay was minimal. They are changing the things that made those Killers not fun to play against. I do not think Deathslinger will "die" if he has to actually complete his aiming animation to shoot a fast moving projectile; Huntress has to do that same thing. FEEDBACK. I don't think Spirit's additional feedback will make her useless when she has high mobility. In short loops, or loops blocked by walls, her high speed might still give the Survivor little time to react to where she's coming from.
The point I am making, is that these changes are not that major. They are trying to change the specific things about these two Killers that Survivors have been complaining about for a long time, because they aren't enjoyable to go against.
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Possibly. But even if it isn't affected, that'd still be possible. Spirit can travel 35m in total while phasing. So... just run Whispers to know when you hit 32m away from a gen, walk ~1.5 seconds to get to about 25m then phase. Same effect. Bit more warning for the Survivors but I think it'll still be workable.
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I don't find it fun playing against entire lobbies of Iron Will and Dead Hard in 95% of my matches. I know I'm not alone here. Where are those nerfs at?
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in the 5.4.3 patch :(
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they went too far, that's all I'll sy about it
Deathslinger is a 1v1 killer, they remove a part of that strength.
they give too much information to survivors when against spirit, the dust alone should have been enough
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The spirit nerf might actually make her pretty bad. The directional noise should NOT be added. It nerfs her 1v1 chase and removed the 4v1 pressure. I do not enjoy going against spirit in her current state but these nerfs may turn her into Wraith 2.0.
Deathslinger got murdered. Nothing else to say. I don't understand why they would nerf one of the weaker killers that harshly. 110 ms with 32 TR come on Behaviour.
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He isn't weak but he for sure is weak now with this nerf.
only the dust would have been more than enough, they murdered her a second time with the directional sound
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IN that case you are proving that you are bad at the game as well.
Spirit doesn't have mindgames. As a survivor, as soon as she starts phasing, you just make a complete guess on where she will reappear, and that's it. Nothing else. Now survivors have at least a bit of information to work with, which Spirit has too.
Deathslinger has barely any counterplay at all. You just pray that the Deathslinger player misses his shots. I do think that he could need some other form of buff to compensate for the nerfs, but these nerfs to him are still good.
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In that case you proved you are a baby survivor main, thank you and goodbye
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100% justifable nerfs to both of these killers. And it took a looong time.
The only "counterplay" you have is pure luck.
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Wait... You needed proof?
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Wow what a good counter argument. I'm a killer main, but of course to someone like you, anyone who has a differing opinion that isn't as killer favorable has to be a baby survivor main.
This game would very likely be dead if the devs only listened to people like you. But luckily, they don't.
Post edited by Gcarrara on3 -
This game isn't designed around sweat. Flexing that you sweat or play high MMR only justifies that you don't play the game as intended and these changes aren't for you.
Then again, keys and hatch were seemingly changed based on sweat so Idek lol
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it's dying badly thanks to MMR and now the best killers are getting nerfed hardcore, yea killer main my ass, if you were you'd see why people starts to quit and ######### so much about the game right now but you approve changes at making it worse.
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Deathslinger nerf actually doesn't look bad.
As for Spirit.... eh, I'll reserve judgement till I see it action.
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MMR is screwed up quite a bit though, I will agree with that.
But yes, I am a killer main, and can still understand why these changes are made. And I doubt these nerfs will be that bad.
Also, this game is dying? If so, how? Steam charts definitely don't seem to support this claim.
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Dying for the veterans, I am playing since 1.0.0 and i've never hated this game more than I do now, even more when there was pallet vacuum, the best players are quiting, the casual are fine since noobs stays with noobs, veterans have it rough and most of us are getting tired.
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They will probably be more fun to play against, but will be the worst ones to play as.
There's no point to choose them over similar ones. I dont care how strong/weak they will be but sure that it'll be nuch lest fun to play as they become not that unique.
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I can at least understand getting tired of killer being stressful. But I am not sure how this game used to be better. Back then the game had some really broken crap for survivors, it's not nearly as bad anymore.
There are also enough veteran players that still seem to be enjoying the game as far as I can tell. I only started the game when Clown released, but I have over 1 thousand hours in this game, and while I do take may fair share of big breaks, I still enjoy this game. Of course, it still has a lot of room to improve, but I personally believe the changes made in this patch are very good, even if I do wish that Deathslinger would have received some form of buff as compensation.
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I don’t have fun going against survivor teams that slam pallets early and make it impossible to catch them. I don’t have fun playing on gigantic maps with gen spreads that are impossible to defend. I don’t have fun chasing at loops with no mind game. Why does that not matter?
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I'm not surprised and honestly I've kept my expectations low and close to non-existent. These developers are massively out of touch, and without a complete shake up of their map/balance teams, I doubt that'll change. Expect more of the same.
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Survivors slamming pallets down early are still catchable. If you are good with killer, you will be able to down them. Except maybe with the very weak killers on very survivor sided maps.
When it comes to maps though, I am not quite sure why BHVR has such a problem making them more balanced. They just still don't seem to understand what makes maps unbalanced.
They've made some great changes to maps in the past, maps like Thompsons House have been made much more balanced, but then there are maps like Fractured Cowshed, that received a big update and a visual rework and are still incredibly survivor sided.
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I just want to not lose 3 gens for 1-2 hook everytime and lose my ruin/u dying in the first 40 seconds and having almost every mind game impossible since they can read me even without seeing me, I am tired to sweat
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which is why many veterans are getting so tired of them
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I haven't said that didn't matter. Your point is just as valid as mine. There's nothing wrong with having strong Killers, but having a Killer that isn't fun to play against is what they want to avoid. Not being able to think about the other side is bad and toxic for the community, which they have in mind. I play both sides, and I also found Spirit not enjoyable to go against. And if I had to guess, she probably causes the most DC's, because nobody wants to play against a Killer with no counterplay.
I feel like reactions like these are a little unnecessary. This could just be temporary changes, while they find ways to make the Killers better, but also more bearable to go against. This game is meant to be played for both sides, not just Killer or Survivor mains, and that's what the devs focus on. They aren't really biased towards any side.
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No way ? What a scoop !
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The devs made a note on part 2 saying that they aren't adding the dust effect when she phases after all
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It states there was an issue and it won't be part of the mid-chapter, not that they won't add the change. Though I think the dust by itself is fine since it rewards survivors paying attention to the environment compared to directional phasing.
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Oh I guess I skimmed over it then, but depending on how frequent the dust is it might be a bit too much.
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Well I was saying that between Directional Phasing and Dust Effect, I would rather have the dust effect than directional phasing. Both are certainly overkill.
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i'd rather have the dust over the sound
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Here's the issue: killers like Deathslinger are a symptom of a much greater problem in DBD - map design. Rather than take the necessary long road for the game's health and fixing problematic maps, what the team has instead opted to do is nerf killers whose chase potential is overwhelming. This leads us into asking: why is their chase so strong? Simple, it's to make up for how ridiculous most maps are, and more importantly, how many safe loops/linking tiles there are (or can spawn).
Deathslinger's strengths are the following:
- Low TR (allows for cheeky first engagement hits and follow up shots).
- Quickscope shots that cannot be reacted to (not fair for survivors, granted, but neither is the pace of the game especially for slower killers).
- Zoning (again, not really fair for survivors as it's essentially a one-sided guessing game).
So, in conclusion, what we've seen is that in order for this killer to maintain what is generally considered upper mid tier strength, he's needed several unfair advantages over survivors in the chase. That said, as many people would state, he's not unbeatable because he lacks map pressure which is the most critical part of a killer's design, if they're fortunate enough to have it. That being said, if you take away his overwhelming chase potential, nerf his TR, and leave him at 110%.. without strong add-ons, he's essentially a worse huntress in every way possible.
If we go down the road of assuming his new add-ons are strong, then he simply becomes another add-on dependent killer. Again, we just seem to be in a worse place than before OR turning him into yet another killer who'll need add-ons to function similarly to before.
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you are making total sense, better ruin the killer experience over changing what's wrong with the game
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The quickscope was honesty not even a problem if the devs bothered to improve the reeling mechanic. That is where survivors suppose to have counterplay to being shot, but Deathslinger can just walk backwards to negate any sort of control survivors have while being reeled.
But of course instead of leaving the skillful quickscoping and brainless walkbackwards just nerf the skillful part of his kit and left the brainless part in. Pretty much dumbing down the killer, because it's "unfair" to survivors that the 1 killer has an advantage over them.
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Spirit nerfs were warranted, that killer was braindead
Deathslinger nerfs were way over the line
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Imagine looking at the two most boring killers in the game and thinking "Oh yeah, they only made these changes because they're bad not because people have been asking for these specific things for months."
Post edited by Rizzo on0
