NoED needs to be removed
Now that we are in an MMR system and the Dev's are looking at balancing around it, NoED needs to be disabled. The number of games where a killer gets 2-3 hooks, and then gets NoED and gets 2-3 kills, skews the data. It makes it so you don't remotely see how strong the killer is or how well killers in general can perform, and instead see how well a single perk changes a game. BVHR said they were not looking at perk choice when determining MMR, and that they were using it for decision making, which means they cannot tell when a killer is accomplishing next to nothing, then being carried by NoED.
For example, Clown is one of the weakest killers in the game, but with decent anti-loop and slow down, he can make pretty good use of NoED. At higher MMR, Clown is not a killer who is viable AT ALL. Looking at the difference between a Clown with and without NoED is night and day. But they can't see that.
If it isn't disabled, it needs to be at least removed from their data so they can get a better understanding of the balancing for the killers who are relying on it.
Comments
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Hard disagree. If anything, NOED will be needed against the upcoming survivor meta change (boon perks). I'm saying this as a survivor main too. You can say the same with DS, people who are ######### at running the killer can extend a match, rather than their actual skill. Same for Unbreakable, Dead Hard, etc
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I disagree. it needs to be used more often due to the overpowered survivor perks that were added and the ones like built to last and vigil that got buffed. the games are very survivor sided to the point that even noed can't get wins. I mean adding a survivor hex that lets them heal themselves when in it's radius at a fast speed is very strong. gen rushing is very strong right now due to the buffed built to last. the vigil/sprintburst/fixated build is going to be used a lot because the buffed vigil makes exhaustion go away 30% faster. the other boon totem allows you to leave no scratch marks and not show your aura to the killer. if you think about it combining shadow step with object means you see the killers aura every 20 seconds but they can't see yours making object of obsession stronger then ever. killers can't avoid getting to endgame fast anymore because survivors just run one of the many overpowered builds on the ptb. so I think that noed needs to stay because at least it gives the killers a chance to get 1 kill. I was always anti noed but with the new changes noed needs to stay.
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NOED has a great impact on the endgame, but the main problem that makes it strong is the altruism of the survivors, not own perk.
I am not saying that it is perfect as it is, but NOED is one of those value perks that to the slight nerf becomes useless.
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How about you do bones
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It can be removed by breaking it or blessing it.
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Killer main. Gonna have to start.
The base purpose of altruism is ultimately to deny killers their kills. A lot of smarter survivors will not rescue if NoED is on the board, which means that it skews the statistics. Using NoED can easily get a killer +2 kills in an otherwise 2-3 hook game. That is my main concern. It makes killers look like they are performing better in BHVR's statistics, which means issues are not as readily and accurately addressed. Without NoED, BHVR could see which killers are most often getting 2-3 hooks per game and would be getting 0 kills. Seeing this data could help them make weaker killers more viable.
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NOED Is not fun in solo queue but it should not be removed or changed.
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I play Killer and Survivor evenly and I disagree. NOED actually makes the game more exciting and it is easy to counter. Considering the perks like Small Game, Counterforce and Detective's Hunch and heck even the new Survivor's perk, Clairvoyance, can help you. Have none of those? Well grab a map. Don't have any? Start mapping out where totems are in the maps.
Whenever I get NOED in a game as Survivor, I don't get mad at the killer and think they are using it as a crutch perk. I usually go "oh crap, we didn't get the totems like we should have". There is more to this game than holding M1 on a generator. It also depends on how altruistic you want to be. Whenever I see NOED and I'm on a hook, I tell my friends to leave and not give the Killer anymore kills than need be. Most of the time we can fine NOED, break it and have a happily ever after.
You also say you're a Killer main. Just don't bring it. BHVR does see how much of a perk is used with Killer and Survivor. Be glad that it's still not old NOED where it wasn't a hex perk. Also with how a lot of survivor perks are being buffed, we're going to be getting a different meta here. Killers don't have a lot of second chance perks whereas Survivors do.
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I get it, but I don't think behavior removes perks. I always saw the perk as an easy to use Blood Warden.
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^ this
I run Detective's Hunch every game and break all 5 totems to stop this perk. While doing this does waste some of my time, as I could be getting gens instead, that's kind of the point. Like DS and BT do to the Killer, it conditions Survivors to play a specific way, to either take the time to get the Totems, discouraging gen rushing, or to be mindful of NOED in the endgame.
The perk exists to prevent genrushing. Like DS and BT exist to stop tunneling.
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Everyone is pointing out that it isn't uncounterable. I am not saying that. I am saying it is a perk that heavily skews data. It is entirely based on survivor performance, since them not cleansing but fixing gens quicker is what gives it to you, and their altruism or lack of determines what you can accomplish with it. Almost nothing about how the killer plays changes, but it turns losses into ties or wins very easily, making it seem that killers who underperform without it are performing better than they otherwise would be. Please stop pointing out a totem can be cleansed. That is basic game understanding. Even in the posts that object to it like this;
Admits that you just tell your friends to give the killer a free kill. That is what I am saying shouldn't happen, because it makes the killer seem to get more kills than they should. Deathslinger is one of the best examples of this. The number of Deathslingers who get extra kills from NoED made him seem way stronger than he was, when the numbers drop drastically when you look at the ones who don't use NoED. So what happened? He got nerfed for 'Overperforming'. But Deathslinger wasn't the issue, it was NoED messing up the data. A similar problem exists with Clown, Doctor, and several other killers.
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Boon perks are already a huge nerf to NOED.
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Please read the actual concern.
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I am someone who actually plays both sides equally and even uses a random set of perks for builds
NOED is the most predictable perk a killer can have an as soon as you know it start looking for totems, and yes its technically hidden but would it be a little bit suspicious if the killer is only using 3 perks?
Can't find totems, we have so many perks now that can be used to find totems and if you don't wanna use any of those, try out maps
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One problem with noed is when a bubba get's his hands on it. that's where the true terror starts and it gets worse if they bring agitation monsterous shrine, agitation and insidious.
Imagine nurse tho with rancor noed no way out and bloodwardon.
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Needs a small buff if anything. You play with 3 perks and many times the whole game. B-tier perk.
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Nope. Noed exists as the incentive to do dull totems. If you're losing 2-3 people to noed you don't deserve the MMR because you're not playing in a way that considers all the aspects of the game. Just doing gens is the most basic aspect of survivor gameplay and doing the bare minimum doesn't mean you should be guaranteed the win.
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Dude im killer main too and ######### is this post, like literally anyone who replied actually understand what op is saying, anyone XDD. I understand what you are saying, and i actually agree, but i also think it would just be unfair to getting it temporaly removed, even knowing it would be better in the future to us (killers) due to bhvr being able to track killers performance more accurately, because yes, noed makes games in which you are going to get 0 kills change to having from 1 to 4 kills, depending on what survs do and how they play against it. If a "normal" deathslinger without noed gets an average of 2k lets say, if every deathslinger uses noed the average would became 3k and bhvr would think: "Oh, deathslinger is strong!" when its not the case, its just noed free kills, deathslinger doesnt have the skill to make 2k on average (all this stats and talking about deathslinger is just an example obviously)
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I don't know what they are based on to balance the game, but I sometimes play a endgame build without noed (Remember Me, Rancor, Blood Warden, No Way Out) and many times the kills I get them in that phase of the game.
If the survivors are very altruistic I can turn the game easily. It is simply a strategy, and it does not mean that by getting kills in the end I do not deserve the victory.
Hex: Ruin is more powerful and can make you win many more times than Noed.
I don't know the data that BHVR uses, but they should check the duration of the chases for each killer and the time it takes to make 5 generators in high mmr.
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Then remove Ds, Dh. Logic is same. Both support bad players. U can mess up, press button and escape.
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Depending on how MMR works, NOED is going to grant ######### killers kills they don't deserve and award higher MMR than they should have. Then they'll just get bullied by higher MMR survivors because they never learn how to play the game and just wait until end game for free kills.
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Holy crap, someone has reading comprehension! That's like seeing a unicorn!
They have made it clear they consider the number of kills, not the number of hooks or what point in the game, is what is considered most important.
Thank you! Another person with reading comprehension! My only concern is that it isn't just about ######### killer plays, it makes the actual killers (Like Deathslinger) look like they are performing well because they can get kills easily with NoED.
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