http://dbd.game/killswitch
Survivors have way too many perks the killer must respect
There's only one way to shake up the meta of this game, and that's to finally look at the survivor perks that have been meta for literal years, some of which are from the first 4 survivors. I'm not gonna be able to cover all of the ones I want, because then this would be insanely long, but I'll try to focus on the main offenders. I'm gonna be talking about perks that the killer pretty much has to respect or else he could lose the game. Hear me out.
Adrenaline: It is trivially easy to complete all the gens as survivor. Without gen defence, the killer's losing all those gens in minutes. With gen defence, a few more minutes MAYBE. You are lucky these days to kill 1 or 2 survivors before the gens get done. If you instead tried to injure everyone so that you could maybe get a big slug comeback at the end, this perk ruins it. You can't let the gens get done or else they might have this perk to use, and yet the gens will certainly get done. If 1 survivor has Adrenaline, you might still be able to get another kill at that point. If 2 or more have it, it becomes a near impossibility that you get another kill. Whether they're on the ground, injured, healthy, or about to be unhooked, as long as the survivors are alive they're going to get value out of this perk. I realize it's 1-use, but still. It gives a health state and a sprint burst even when exhausted. Coupled with an easy prerequisite of doing 5 gens collectively, this perk just has too much going for it.
Decisive Strike: I know it's been nerfed already, and yet I see it everyday. Sometimes all 4 survivors are running it, sometimes none are. But the 5-second stun is far too punishing, and will lose the killer the game. For that reason, the killer must respect it every time. If they don't, they could get an early 2nd hook or a kill because the survivor by pure chance did not have it equipped, but mostly what happens is you "get rid of" their DS early and lose the game because of it. It's a high risk, high reward perk... for the killer. The survivors who have DS'd the killer will not show their face until the end when they're in the exit area and are invulnerable, unless the killer takes all 4's DS in which case they lose anyway. You can avoid all of this by just not tunneling, but you've got to understand: killers must tunnel sometimes to play catch-up. And in a game where the killer's on the back foot and playing catch-up from the very start, it's a necessity. And despite the nerf, survivors can still abuse it. They can jump in a locker, body block, flashlight save, or open an exit and still have it. It's effect is so powerful that you can still bluff to the killer that you have it, and they'll most likely respect it.
Dead Hard: Other exhaustion perks like Balanced and Sprint Burst are usually used to delay the real start of a chase, but Dead Hard extends the chase at the end when the killer most needs the down. No other perk gives i-frames, and that's an unnecessarily huge advantage obviously. Even when the killer's planning/pathing/aiming/tile knowledge was perfect, Dead Hard could still allow the survivor to escape unscathed. And when used for distance, there's nothing the killer can do. No waiting it out. And assuming the survivor has a good connection, or bad depending on how you see it, they can simply react to the killer's swing. The only prerequisite this perk has is being injured, which encourages survivors to be insanely efficient by pushing gens while injured, simply because this perk offers so much protection at the press of a button. If the killer doesn't respect it, he misses and the survivor gets to the next tile, and if he does respect it a good survivor will use it to the fullest anyway.
Unbreakable: This perk, like Adrenaline, stops the killer from slugging. Except it can be used at any point in the game. And even when a survivor "uses it up" to pick themselves up, they still get the 20% increased recovery speed, which is still a huge blow against sluggers. And just like with tunneling, sometimes killers must slug to generate enough pressure to have a chance of winning. If 1 survivor has it, that's manageable. But if multiple have it, any chance of a mass slug is gone. Slugging has to be done quickly, because once the survivors figure out that's what the killer's doing, they'll focus just on staying healed so that the killer can't slug them again. It's 1-use, yes, but that's all it takes for the killer to lose, plus they still get the recovery speed increase. It's got too much going for it.
A lot of these perks are 1-use, and they're practically uncounterable. The killer may be able to deal with each survivor having maybe one of these, but more often than not the survivors will have all of these equipped at the same time. Survivors will guilt trip killers about using strong perks, but they refuse to accept the strength of their own perks. The killer should not have this much to worry about from each individual survivor. They're the 1, and the survivors are the 4. Why then do the survivors have the tools to 1v1 the killer? Why have they barely been touched when it seems like every update, killers are being given a crumb of a buff or are straight-up nerfed? The killer role can't go on with these circumstances, or everybody including myself is just gonna throw in the towel.
Comments
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Totally agree,the mid Oct update has supposedly has nerfs/negative adjustments to one of the better killers the spirit but have offset it with virtually usless buffs to the trapper(does anyone even play him).Its clear there is a strong bias for survivors.Like you i am becoming more frustrated playing killer as are some of my friends who feel the same way.If things dont improve and soon i will be throwing this game in the bin.
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Not Otz
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There is nothing wrong with adrenaline and you're overplaying how much it hurts the killer
Other than that I agree
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I didn't read the post, but why is your name familiar? Are you a dark souls youtuber or something like that? I swear I have seen your name somewhere before.
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Also deliverance is always possible so you must think about that too, as well as soul guard. Im afraid of new any means necessary too
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You mean the Perk which is still mediocre? BHVR can even remove the Cooldown and it will not be that good. When do you have mutliple Pallets lying around? And in the end, every Killer can do something against thrown Pallets (and they already do, at least the strong ones...AMN most likely can replace unsafe Pallets, at best).
And nah, you dont need to think about Deliverance. What do you want to do? Camp everyone who might have unhooked someone before? This is not really an option, except if you want to lose the game if the other 3 Survivors are mildly competent.
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Honestly, the only two troublesome perks here are Unbreakable and Dead Hard, both because they have such strong effects with no drawbacks or prerequisites to activate them, not to mention they're available to everyone. I have a ton of respect for people who run For the People or Deliverance, and I can bear eating a DS once a game. But DH and UB? Nuh-uh. Crutch perks that take no skill to use <-- and this is a sentence I have never said for anything in this game before. Two years of optimism led me to that conclusion.
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Meh - as killer I don't care what perks a survivor uses - nor do I care as survivor what perks a killer uses. A lot of perks - killer/survivor alike are "un-counterable" - but that doesn't cause me apprehension when playing either role. That would be like saying Tinkerer is counterable by simply never getting a gen to 70%. Bitter Murmur - don't finish gens! I realize the forums LOVE to pit one side against another with vitriol and hyperbole, but "un-counterable" perks are on each side.
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Overreacting with how much it hurts killer big time
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Lol, complaining about not being able to slug is the most precious thing I've ever heard. You play scummy - get treated scummy.
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Otz is one of the best killer players in the world, and watching him play Trapper is 99% not him playing Trapper. In most high level games, he's just playing an M1 killer with a lot of camping and slugging. You'll see traps used maybe once on a loop, or when he has people hooked in the basement (ala, game already basically won).
The problem isn't that Trapper's kit needed buffs - it's that Trapper needs to be reworked from the ground up.
Slugging isn't playing scummy, unless you are just camping. There are tons of times where slugging is essential - DS, sabo plays, spots in certain maps where there simply aren't hooks within realistic range, genrushes etc.
'Playing scummy' as killer really just seems to mean 'making the correct tactical decision to counter specific perks, map quirks and strategies'.
Except that there are ways to counter almost every killer perk, mostly via teamwork and pattern recognition. The only ways to counter certain survivor perks are, well - see above. Slugging. And you'll have multiple QQ threads on the forums about it at any given time.
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I think the problem is we have a plethora of things in the game designed to correct your mistakes or prevent/delete you being outplayed by the opposing team without much effort on your part at all.
DS, is a necessary evil, but it's basically that. You get a chance to escape the killer, even though you got chased, downed, hooked, chased and downed again.
UB: undo the fact you were downed by holding M1
DH: undo the fact you were outplayed or made a mistake in positioning by pressing E at the low cost of being injured
SB: never worry about positioning anymore, you can just run and have the killer waste 20 seconds before the chase even starts
Lucky Break: Get a chance to escape a chase for free, at the low low cost of being outplayed and hit.
NOED: Get a boost at the low cost of letting survivors do their objective and failing to stop them.
Spirit Fury: Get pallet stunned? Who cares.
And the devs are showcasing that they don't care about this when they design the game, since a bunch of the addons they reworked for spirit now give her her full charges back when either stunned by a pallet (meaning the survivor outplayed her), or breaking a pallet (a minuscule investment to get your power back).
Now, there's nothing wrong with having some safeguards here and there. I think Enduring is probably the best example of a safeguard that is useful but doesn't break the game the way Dead Hard does. The problem is that the game is riddled with safeguards or "mistake undoers" that are massively impactful and require no effort, no investment, absolutely nothing other than: you equipped a jpeg. It's very annoying to me.
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Despite Survivors having 16 perks and the Killer has 4, they can ALL equip multiple second chance perks while the Killer has NOED and... that's it.
It's not good game design, Dead Hard, Unbreakable and Borrowed Time all deserve nerfs like Decisive got.
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Nothing is scummy about slugging. It's a legit strategy, do not sit here and try and LIE to me that being hooked is even remotely more fun than being slugged. Pure BS.
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It's a legitimate strategy.
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Just DBD really.
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Resetting pallets is really strong. Yes, the killer will instantly break a god pallet if he's smart, but the "weaker" pallets that can be played around without breaking them are also stronger again once reset. The killer can't afford waste time kicking every pallet on the map or they lose.
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Adrenaline I think is fine. It's more game balance is the issue.
DS: A neccessary evil I don't like it but it has to stay.
Dead Hard: Being exhausted should have a draw back.
UB: Remove the ability to get up and increase the speed to get up or keep the get up but make getting up a lot slower.
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Oh, I sure do love bleeding out on the ground, with almost no ability to do anything about it unless I have a specific perk. It's SO MUCH FUN.
I'd rather get hooked so I could try and gamble on it for a kobe. Now that's much more fun.
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I gotta disagree on the DS position. I think DS is pretty balanced now, and honestly the amount of times I see a killer get hit with DS and still tunnel the survivor down is immense.
Also, I rarely see a killer respect DS, if they intend on tunneling, that is what they will do. I also think it is a good strategy to eat the DS early as opposed to later when it will indeed cost you a kill, say at EGC.
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thats because for some reason people stopped running DS. seriously, even the stats of it showed how the people who used it still escaped the same amount of times.
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A 4K slug intentionally bypasses the multiple hookstates that survivors have. And for the person who got slugged first, it's just several minutes of waiting for the killer to end the match, while you're unable to participate, but also not allowed to leave. And you can't even spectate, either.
And that last part is in contrast with hooks. If you're on the hook, you still have some options, provided you're not getting facecamped.
I also think that 'bypassing survivor hookstates' is the big issue people have with DS/BT/UB. You're supposed to hunt and down a survivor three times, but sometimes it feels like people are allergic to that concept here, with how upset they get over 'second chance' perks.
I just fail to see the problem with second chance perks when the game is designed to give survivors three chances.
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"You're supposed to hunt and down a survivor three times" And there it is, the problem. Play a game of non top tier Killer at the absolute highest MMR - I would LOVE to see you try this. It's not feasible, and it's not balanced. Slugging and tunneling exist because playing "fair and nice" gets the Killer 4 teabags at exit gate and Survivors telling them they suck and hope the Killers family gets cancer.
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wdym not Otz, he is Otz according to a recent survey D:<
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I think it is still a great perk that does what it is supposed to do. Those that stopped using it where probably the ones that abused it.
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lol even going against elite tier killers has the same results: tunneling and sometimes camping. Don't pretend tunneling is limited to weaker killers, it's widespread. It has never been a smart tactic to use for certain situations, it's the go-to for almost every situation including those where The Killer is winning.
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You've got the problem backwards. Camping, tunnelling and slugging can close a match out so effectively that the gens need to be incredibly fast and these perks are necessary. If camping wasn't a thing and tunnelling wasn't the de facto best way to go, survivors would be eligible for a good quantity of nerfs.
But as long as the killer shortcuts balance out with the survivors, nothing changes. It's not exactly fair to let the killers keep their overpowered tactics but strip the survivors of their defences against them.
And don't get me wrong, I'm in favour of some survivor nerfs, but only on the condition that camping, tunnelling and slugging are pulled out by the root. Not keen on nerfing survivors down and then just hoping that killers don't abuse it out of the kindness of their hearts.
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Getting a Survivor out of the game ASAP before too many gens get done is by far the most effective method of victory for Killer. That or snowballing via slugging.
Killer strength among the 2-3 that actually have a sense of power over the Survivors doesn't change that it's an effective strategy. It's not fun for that Survivor, but who cares what the other side thinks? You gain nothing but insults.
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Every suggestion you have is awful. ANY competent Survivor team will slams gens if you camp, this is a non issue. It may not be fun but it is NEVER a good play, until end game in which it's basically all the Killer can do. As for Tunneling and Slugging, I can't even imagine how you'd remove these. It'd require an entire game rework which is not ever happening, so I say just nerf the crutch second chance perks and be done with it.
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I never said any of that, but with that said, I have no problem being effective and securing "victory" while also refraining from tunneling. My point was that these tactics aren't limited to weaker killers or situations where the Trial is going bad, as is often their justification. Many killer players love to camp, tunnel, and slug, independent of whether or not you need to do so. It's appealing to them, so it doesn't matter how viable or fantastic a killer, add-on, or perk becomes.
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It's appealing because the game is not balanced and it works.
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My point is even when the Trial is going exceptionally well for The Killer, and they bring meta perks, powerful add-ons, and perhaps the map is a great choice too, they still tunnel. Some maybe most have a propensity to return to the Hook to tunnel a newly rescued Survivor. It's magnetic for some players. I want to see balance changes across the game, but I don't think it will result in much concerning tunneling.
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So are perks, crazy.
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Unbreakable and Decisive Strike were made by the Developers to nerf Slugging, Tunneling and Camping. If anything, Decisive Strike should be buffed, because tunneling and camping have become such a major problem. Unbreakable obviously isn't a problem in the Developers eyes because they made Soul Guard, another anti-slugging perk.
Adrenaline is an end game perk and only activates if the exit gates are powered, so I really don't see why that one is such a problem.
Everyone complains about Dead Hard but I've yet to see any prove Dead Hard extends chases more than any of the other exhaustion perks. In fact, from my experience playing survivor, Dead Hard is worse for extending chases compared to Sprint Burst and Balanced Landing (Which you can use in the middle of a chase). Lithe can even be used in the middle of a chase and from watching my friend, he can run a killer much longer with Lithe than I can when I try Dead Hard (I am a much bigger fan of Sprint Burst and Balanced Landing which I have way better luck at extending chases or completely shutting them down before they start).
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You should check the thread that popped up a short while ago where a couple of players were sharing facecamp strats to guarantee 2K+.
And what kind of reasoning is that? "We can't fix this bit, so let's just break everything else instead!"
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It's rather telling that all the best meta perks are just free health states in one way or another. DS, BT, UB, DH, Adrenaline, they all rewind to a better timeline where that hit didn't happen.
Most of these perks are at least moderately balanced by only triggering once per match (Adrenaline IMO is not really much of a problem, it's just Bizarro NOED and most of the time you win too hard for it to matter or die before it activates), but Dead Hard is maddening in that you get to do it every 40 seconds and can easily get multiple free chase extensions where you otherwise would've got hit, just for free, and the perk has been completely untouched for nearly 5 years.
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I think it's rather telling that meta perks are the Developers response to Killer-strategies that didn't have counters before.
- Decisive Strike - Anti-camping/Anti-tunneling
- Borrowed Time - Anti-camping/Anti-tunneling
- Unbreakable - Anti-Slugging
Seems like the Developers see an issue with these specific strategies and are putting counter-measures into place to prevent them. Notice how the Developers keep adding counter-measures against those specific strategies such as Baby-Sitter and Soul Guard
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and Dead Hard is a counter-measure to what, killers hitting you? that's a really toxic strategy for sure
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Adrenaline has to be earned so it's fair.
DS has already been nerfed hard. It will only effect you if you tunnel, and since it's an anti-tunnel perk it's doing it's job.
DH is overrated and no better than any other exhaustion perk imo.
UB is a one time use and the risk you take when you slug.
None of these things are unfair.
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Lol killer main. I NEVER camp and rarely tunnel (if it's end game). Play fair and still can get 3 and 4ks. It's possible not to play like scum to survivors. Keep playing like you are, it's why the devs are nerfing killers. They said in the last stream they're looking into penalizing camping and the reason they're changing moris is they are not happy with the tunneling and camping killers are still doing to get them. And are even coming up with counters to moris.
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I'm so glad the devs won't listen to this and won't nerf those perks. It IS fair they have these perks for the popular playstyles of killers.
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I don't really agree with any of these - especially when you've self-admitted that 3 out of these are one-use, with one being EXTREMELY situational, one being forced out, and the second depending on how good the killer is.
As a killer, you can easily deny unbreakable and decisive strike. As a killer, you can have an anti-gen build to deny adrenalin. As a killer, you can bait out a dead-hard.
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I have yet to see any data showing that Dead Hard gives you more looping time than Sprint Burst, Lithe or Balanced Landing. In fact, I suspect just the opposite since it only gives you 1 second of movement speed whereas all the others give you 3 seconds. I think the i-frames balances out the other 2 seconds of movement speed. Plus, it's more risk/reward than the other ones, since you have to time it very precisely to get it's full effect.
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This is disingenuous. The killer can "bypass" the hook states by simply hooking all 4 survivors in rapid succession if no successful saves are made. The only difference is that, if handed the opportunity to do this (which only exists if the survivors collectively throw), slugging enables the killer to act in a more time-efficient manner, which is simply stronger and smarter, which is why survivors hate it. Functionally, there is no option you have on the hook that doesn't exist with slugging. If you're on the hook, you're immobilized until a survivor rescues you, or you could throw the match and try to go for a kobe. This exists even in a 4-man slug, since the killer can only hook 1 at a time. You technically have more mobility on the ground than on a hook, and can be rescued in, at most, the same amount of time as an unhook (unless a survivor is hiding around you for some godforsaken reason). You can also go under a pallet in the hopes that a survivor can get a pallet save, which is a stronger rescue than an unhook.
Slugging leaves survivors with more options in exchange for allowing himself to have more efficient gameplay if the opportunity is handed to him.
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Hold your tongue, it happened to Decisive. You're scared aren't you? Of losing your free second chances
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Slugging and tunneling is playing fair lol, just because you don't like it doesn't mean these strategies are cheating or whatever.
You're no Killer player, and if you are your 5 hook 4 man escapes damn sure keep you in mediocre MMR. Get to the big boy leagues and try that 3 hook strategy on a non meta Killer, Survivors will laugh you out of the match. If the top skilled streamers know this, you damn sure should know it by now too.
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Lmao, I'm a killer main. I just don't whine and cry about survivors perks. I know I can still get kills without playing scummy
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Sure, against bad players. Top MMR eats 3 hook strategy for breakfast. If we were to place you at the absolute highest MMR with a non meta Killer, I have absolute confidence you wouldn't sacrifice more than 1 Survivor a match going for 3 hooks each.
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I stayed rank 1 every time before mmr changed and still get matched now with pretty decent survivors. Still can get 3ks. Again, 4 kills every single game isn't my goal. And I can give you my gt to prove I'm a killer main. Again, survivors deserve counters to slugging, camping and tunneling. Don't like it? Don't do those things. I slugged end game on a game the other day. That survivor had unbreakable and got up and opened a door and got out. The other one went out the hatch becauae he was a head of me. I didn't cry and cry. It was what it was.
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Cool story bro. Luckily for you we can't see our MMR, otherwise I'd demand to see a game from you at the absolute pinnacle.
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