Camping Solutions.... again
When I bring up face camping there's a few things people complain about, so before I bring up my idea let's just get this out of the way:
Face camping/extreme camping. Well, first off if you're here to tell me face camping isn't an issue anymore because swivel hook- I'm describing their actions. If they're in your face and they're sitting there. They're face camping or whatever you want to call it. It upsets me everyone assumes you're playing with friends and they can tell you the killer is face camping them. When you're playing alone (and this is a team based game for survivors, none of this 'oh why did you even check' BS) you're going to waste time running up and seeing the killer is refusing to let a person go. It's cheap, boring, unfair, and mind boggling this issue has not been fixed. Swivel hook is nice but
Solution: If you (the killer) are not chasing anyone and you're near a hooked survivor the survivors depletion bar before going into 2nd phase (or 3rd phase/death) the bar completely stops. As long as the killer is close to the hooked survivor, the survivor's depletion bar will stagnate coming to a complete halt (or move very very slowly) until the killer leaves the perimeters of the hooked survivor and the survivor is out of sight.
MESSAGE TO KILLER MAINS: Pallet looping still takes skill, my heart goes out to you I still think it's rough and I have experienced this playing as killer. Don't assume I don't/haven't play killer. Killer has way more advantages and control over the game, and though I think they should have control, the game gives the above unfair advantage too, however you can still have control/fun/kills without using the above tactic. Gen rush isn't a thing, if you're a good killer some games you get everyone super fast, some games the survivors are better than you and will get gens super fast.This game isn't just made for killers, and with this specific issue it really makes me wonder if I should keep playing, because there's a lot of DC's going on, and the best solution would be to fix issues like this.
(Part of this post was taken from my original post https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/33513/dcs-because-of-unresolved-issues )
Comments
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Seems like you use facecamping in the terminology "hard camping". Thats fine, but you should know that facecamping used to be the terminology that the killer moves himself in the hitbox of the hooked survivor and thus disables all other survivors from getting an unhook attemp, just to avoid confusion......
A killer comitting to "facecamping" surenders the game, the remaining 3 survivors can simply knock out all gens and leave the game. If you dont wanna do that and throw yourself against the camping killer, then thats your decision
Regarding your suggestion:
First of all, define "near a hooked survivor".
Second of all the chsae detection is completely broken and is thus a really bad condition for such a mechanic. For example at the tree loop in the corn, you lose chase over and over again even though you are running after a survivor within a few meters.By the way, the first PTB featured anti camping mechanics, but survivors abused the ######### out of it such that the devs had to drop this idea.
You say genrush isnt a thing, just a survivor doing his objective, but isnt a camping killer doing his objective too? :sarcastic:
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The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.
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@Master said:
Seems like you use facecamping in the terminology "hard camping". Thats fine, but you should know that facecamping used to be the terminology that the killer moves himself in the hitbox of the hooked survivor and thus disables all other survivors from getting an unhook attemp, just to avoid confusion......> A killer comitting to "facecamping" surenders the game, the remaining 3 survivors can simply knock out all gens and leave the game. If you dont wanna do that and throw yourself against the camping killer, then thats your decision
Regarding your suggestion:
First of all, define "near a hooked survivor".
Second of all the chsae detection is completely broken and is thus a really bad condition for such a mechanic. For example at the tree loop in the corn, you lose chase over and over again even though you are running after a survivor within a few meters.You say genrush isnt a thing, just a survivor doing his objective, but isnt a camping killer doing his objective too? :sarcastic: /s
I already covered why "simply knocking out all the gens" isn't realistic.
Here:** It upsets me everyone assumes you're playing with friends and they can tell you the killer is face camping them. When you're playing alone (and this is a team based game for survivors, none of this 'oh why did you even check' BS) you're going to waste a lot of time running up (from wherever you were at) and seeing the killer is refusing to let a person go. It's cheap, boring, unfair, and mind boggling this issue has not been fixed. **
Ive heard all the excuses how face camping can be countered and this isn't one of them.
My definition of 'near a hooked survivor' is within a terror radius or if the survivor is in line of sight. I originally added to my idea that if the killer is chasing someone, then the survivors life depletes as normal. Even if this mechanic is 'broken' it is still in favor of the killer, so it'd be harder for survivors to abuse. I'll explain:
if the killer is in chase mode, the bar depletes as normal. So if the killer loses sight of someone he is chasing (but is still in chase mode) while he's around a person that's hooked, that person can still go into phase 2 and die as normal.
This is better than nothing.
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@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue then clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
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@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
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@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
lol. you came here to tell me my suggestion isn't a solution because of a slew of opinions, and one fact.
The whole "handing out free unhooks" I don't hear that from people who play killer and survivor. Just killer mains. "Gen rush" okay okay okay. So survivors do 3 things. They unhook, they heal, the only way they can leave is doing gens. They can't block the gens, they can't do anything other than use tool boxes to do the gens. Gen rush isn't a thing. That's not an opinion, that's just fact.Killers need to get hooks, you lose points if you hang around someone who is hooked because it's discouraged. It's not acceptable behavior. That's a fact.
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
lol. you came here to tell me my suggestion isn't a solution because of a slew of opinions, and one fact.
The whole "handing out free unhooks" I don't hear that from people who play killer and survivor. Just killer mains. "Gen rush" okay okay okay. So survivors do 3 things. They unhook, they heal, the only way they can leave is doing gens. They can't block the gens, they can't do anything other than use tool boxes to do the gens. Gen rush isn't a thing. That's not an opinion, that's just fact.Killers need to get hooks, you lose points if you hang around someone who is hooked because it's discouraged. It's not acceptable behavior. That's a fact.
Your opinion is not a fact either, so I'm not sure why you expect me - or anyone else - to come in here with objective truths when you come to us with opinions.
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@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
lol. you came here to tell me my suggestion isn't a solution because of a slew of opinions, and one fact.
The whole "handing out free unhooks" I don't hear that from people who play killer and survivor. Just killer mains. "Gen rush" okay okay okay. So survivors do 3 things. They unhook, they heal, the only way they can leave is doing gens. They can't block the gens, they can't do anything other than use tool boxes to do the gens. Gen rush isn't a thing. That's not an opinion, that's just fact.Killers need to get hooks, you lose points if you hang around someone who is hooked because it's discouraged. It's not acceptable behavior. That's a fact.
Your opinion is not a fact either, so I'm not sure why you expect me - or anyone else - to come in here with objective truths when you come to us with opinions.
I objectively told you facts, they're not just to 'fit my narrative' it's you, who plays killer, talking about how 'why wouldn't I got the easier route" RIGHT. So if YOU the player aren't going to be held accountable for your poor behavior then the devs need to step in with a better solution. I'm getting tired of trying to explain to killer mains why camping shouldn't be viable. You can tell me all day long why you want to continue to play poorly for easy kills and turning around saying 'oh the survivors have it easy' but they don't, it's a tough game and if the killer so chooses they can ruin the game for everyone else because why? because they can. Not because they get more points, a higher skill. It's discouraged already but you think it should still be acceptable because it's easier. The kill already has all the power against 4 other people. This one particular issue should be fixed, and it's fine if you don't like my suggestion, just don't bullshit me with your opinion on why you don't see it as a problem.
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You objectively told me your opinion, but that's still not fact.
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@Orion said:
You objectively told me your opinion, but that's still not fact.lord, whatever, do you want a cookie? I want to talk about solutions for face camping, not argue with killer mains that gen rush is a thing and that camping ruins the game for other people.
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
You objectively told me your opinion, but that's still not fact.lord, whatever, do you want a cookie? I want to talk about solutions for face camping, not argue with killer mains that gen rush is a thing.
I didn't mention gen rush and I'm not a Killer main, so we're off to a half-decent start. Now you just need to stop being so hostile toward people who disagree with you and you'll be on your way to a conversation instead of an echo chamber.
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@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
You objectively told me your opinion, but that's still not fact.lord, whatever, do you want a cookie? I want to talk about solutions for face camping, not argue with killer mains that gen rush is a thing.
I didn't mention gen rush and I'm not a Killer main, so we're off to a half-decent start. Now you just need to stop being so hostile toward people who disagree with you and you'll be on your way to a conversation instead of an echo chamber.
Youre cute, I'm frustrated with you. I have no reason not to be, or with the other person who ignored half my post to give me advice to counter it which I already discussed at full length.
I'm frustrated because even though our conversation already ended a while ago you still want to have a last word in.We disagree strongly and we're not going to agree. Is there any chance I'm going to change your mind? No. So you can leave now. I think face camping is huge issue, you don't. You think 'easy unhooks' are a thing. I don't. I have made it very clear that I think whatever you're trying to feed me is opinion, and we disagree very strongly. I started off my topic with a 'suggestion' this is not fact, I did not say it would work. But I have been bombarded with people who clearly don't play survivor, and you really laughably don't sound like you play much survivor. One person just said it's not viable without saying why, another person recited what I already said doesn't work, and then there's you. Trying to answer a question that wasn't addressed to you, but filled with opinion. I pointed it out, and how dare I? Whatever you're doing here now, is just trying to get the last word in. So if I continue to respond to you, don't expect me to be kind.
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Fix tunneling and camping equals fix killer gameplay so they are viable
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Solution. Maybe increase 3 or 5% penalty hooked time for camping in radius of 10m (safe distance) of hook. Help other gen rush and get out.
Borrowed time In addition to giving time for the hooked survivor now give 5seg for survivor unhook other survivor.
About survivor DC. Add too Quitter bonus (1.500 boodpoints) for all other survivor in end the game.
Post edited by slipttees on1 -
@slipttees said:
Solution. Maybe increase 3 or 5% penalty hooked time for camping in radius of 10m (safe distance) of hook. Help other gen rush and get out.Anything would be better than what we have now. I really think there should be a penalty, so even a 3 or 5% penalty sounds great. (:
Post edited by wouldntyouliketoknow on0 -
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Master said:
Seems like you use facecamping in the terminology "hard camping". Thats fine, but you should know that facecamping used to be the terminology that the killer moves himself in the hitbox of the hooked survivor and thus disables all other survivors from getting an unhook attemp, just to avoid confusion......> A killer comitting to "facecamping" surenders the game, the remaining 3 survivors can simply knock out all gens and leave the game. If you dont wanna do that and throw yourself against the camping killer, then thats your decision
Regarding your suggestion:
First of all, define "near a hooked survivor".
Second of all the chsae detection is completely broken and is thus a really bad condition for such a mechanic. For example at the tree loop in the corn, you lose chase over and over again even though you are running after a survivor within a few meters.You say genrush isnt a thing, just a survivor doing his objective, but isnt a camping killer doing his objective too? :sarcastic: /s
I already covered why "simply knocking out all the gens" isn't realistic.
Here:** It upsets me everyone assumes you're playing with friends and they can tell you the killer is face camping them. When you're playing alone (and this is a team based game for survivors, none of this 'oh why did you even check' BS) you're going to waste a lot of time running up (from wherever you were at) and seeing the killer is refusing to let a person go. It's cheap, boring, unfair, and mind boggling this issue has not been fixed. **
Ive heard all the excuses how face camping can be countered and this isn't one of them.
My definition of 'near a hooked survivor' is within a terror radius or if the survivor is in line of sight. I originally added to my idea that if the killer is chasing someone, then the survivors life depletes as normal. Even if this mechanic is 'broken' it is still in favor of the killer, so it'd be harder for survivors to abuse. I'll explain:
if the killer is in chase mode, the bar depletes as normal. So if the killer loses sight of someone he is chasing (but is still in chase mode) while he's around a person that's hooked, that person can still go into phase 2 and die as normal.
This is better than nothing.
First of all, SWF is part of the game. For some weird reason the majority of the community is against the idea of having ingame voice comms (They are scared that the game gets balanced aruond voice comms I assume), but fact is taht SWF is part of almost every game nowadays.
And even if you are playing alone, there are multiple ways to identify facecamping. You can pay attenion to the killer movement, use eyes and ears or the survivor on the hook can wave arms etc.
And if you really want to batlle facecamping by unhooking, then you can still run BT for example which just received a huge buff.
So according your definition, its impossible for the doc to kill survivor since his terror radius is really huge and thus will always trigger your suggestion. ALso "line of sight" is not a mechanic implemented in the game.
Ehm what? Its NOT in the killers faviour since according to your suggestion the hook progress will be stopped if the killer is not in a chase.
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@Master said:
A killer comitting to "facecamping" surenders the game, the remaining 3 survivors can simply knock out all gens and leave the game. If you dont wanna do that and throw yourself against the camping killer, then thats your decision
The problem with this statement is there are a lot of ways to create a massive game delay when you camp someone, such as the survivors not knowing you're being camped until they come and check. This is countered by SWF, but a lot of killers that I've seen camping lately are Wraiths, and they go invisible and walk away from the hook just enough so it looks like they left, but they're really watching from a distance, and you can't tell until a friend comes for the unhook and they suddenly pop out of nowhere and smack you back down because Borrowed Time didn't proc since there was no terror radius.
Now you're on a greatly reduced hook time, and maybe two gens will get done by this point, but the game is left with just 3 players, which is really difficult to come back from, especially if someone else gets hooked and the other survivors who were working on gens didn't realize what the camper's strat was.
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@Demoth said:
The problem with this statement is there are a lot of ways to create a massive game delay when you camp someone, such as the survivors not knowing you're being camped until they come and check. This is countered by SWF, but a lot of killers that I've seen camping lately are Wraiths, and they go invisible and walk away from the hook just enough so it looks like they left, but they're really watching from a distance, and you can't tell until a friend comes for the unhook and they suddenly pop out of nowhere and smack you back down because Borrowed Time didn't proc since there was no terror radius.That is a mix of camping and tunneling and a popular Wraith tactic. As with any other killer that doesn't camp close enough to the hook so that an unhook takes place: The healthy teammate has to take a hit for the unhooked surv. That often buys enough time so they can reach the next pallet or window.
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new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.
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@slipttees said:
new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.This seems like a fair fix. Again, particularly if the killer isn't chasing someone.
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@slipttees said:
new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.This seems like a fair fix. Again, particularly if the killer isn't chasing someone.
Use Kindred
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@inkedsoulz said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@slipttees said:
new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.This seems like a fair fix. Again, particularly if the killer isn't chasing someone.
Use Kindred
Solution for camping without perks
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@slipttees said:
@inkedsoulz said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@slipttees said:
new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.This seems like a fair fix. Again, particularly if the killer isn't chasing someone.
Use Kindred
Solution for camping without perks
Repair generators.
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@Orion said:
@slipttees said:
@inkedsoulz said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@slipttees said:
new idea: 10m around hook for more 30 seg. Killer camper exposed for all survivors and yours aurea revealed for all.This seems like a fair fix. Again, particularly if the killer isn't chasing someone.
Use Kindred
Solution for camping without perks
Repair generators.
Force me bro!
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
lol. you came here to tell me my suggestion isn't a solution because of a slew of opinions, and one fact.
The whole "handing out free unhooks" I don't hear that from people who play killer and survivor. Just killer mains. "Gen rush" okay okay okay. So survivors do 3 things. They unhook, they heal, the only way they can leave is doing gens. They can't block the gens, they can't do anything other than use tool boxes to do the gens. Gen rush isn't a thing. That's not an opinion, that's just fact.Killers need to get hooks, you lose points if you hang around someone who is hooked because it's discouraged. It's not acceptable behavior. That's a fact.
I play both killer and survivor, maybe 60/40 playing survivor more.
And camping is not an issue from what i see from the games, camping works sometimes, because survivors instead of doing gens, they rush to the hooked person.
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There is a perk to show you when the killer is camping. Drop your DS and use it.
Sometimes you really want to get rid of a super annoying player who was also playing like an asshat. It happens. For me, its usually whoever has Decisive Strike.
No, don't make the progress bar stop if killer is near, because tryhard survivors always rush the hook, and would just do that to keep you near it.
Why should we have to run really far away and give you a freebie unhook? Play the game, earn it.
Currently balance in the game needs to be set as if all 4 players were coordinated and on voice chat at all times, until they give us a "Join Solo Queue" option that lets us only play against non SWF groups.
If I have to put up with bully BS from 4 man SWF groups, sorry, you've gotta put up with my assumptions that you're likely part of a SWF group, otherwise its not fun for me, and I won't play.
I get that 4/5 players are survivors, but that doesn't mean the killer has to clench up and grab his/her ankles every time just cause you don't know enough to do a gen while someones camping.
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@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
Saying survivors reward camping and it's survivor's fault isn't entirely fair. It's one of the main four categories and survivors typically miss out entirely on one category as survival doesn't reward more than 5k and it rewards nothing if you don't get out. Besides, it isn't hopeful for survivors. If you don't have people on page, you are unlikely to get gens done in time to actually punish that behavior. If you're playing solo, you can't tell everyone you're being camped, so people are wasting time checking. Honestly it's poor gameplay and only rewarded 'cause it's boring. If killer camps, that only leaves survivors with M1ing to victor. There isn't chases, no saves, etc. It also means you're likely getting a bronze in that category and no points unless you farm hits. You also won't get any points towards boldness and could get a bronze or a black pip, depending. Then if you get camped, you're likely not getting much points unless it's done a few generators in or with the doors opened.
Still, I wouldn't say the issue is forcing free hooks. I know how some survivors are entitled, but you also have to realize that that's how they get their points and they may want to make plays to get everyone out or as many as possible.
TLDR; Camping is boring for survivors and you're likely to not get pips or points unless you feed into camping and try to go for save; therefore, not entirely survivor's fault.
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Anytime I've played survivor its pretty well accepted to wave your arms by halfway doing the unhook animation, thus signalling every other survivor that you're being camped.
camping is boring, but so is playing against coordinated SWF groups.
IF I decide to camp, its usually cause the person has been ruining the fun of the game for me, and I want to return the favor. I care little about points.
The rest of the time, I'll just drop early. Not worth wasting my time in the match when its a cheese filled SWF team.
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@fluffybunny said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
Saying survivors reward camping and it's survivor's fault isn't entirely fair. It's one of the main four categories and survivors typically miss out entirely on one category as survival doesn't reward more than 5k and it rewards nothing if you don't get out. Besides, it isn't hopeful for survivors. If you don't have people on page, you are unlikely to get gens done in time to actually punish that behavior. If you're playing solo, you can't tell everyone you're being camped, so people are wasting time checking. Honestly it's poor gameplay and only rewarded 'cause it's boring. If killer camps, that only leaves survivors with M1ing to victor. There isn't chases, no saves, etc. It also means you're likely getting a bronze in that category and no points unless you farm hits. You also won't get any points towards boldness and could get a bronze or a black pip, depending. Then if you get camped, you're likely not getting much points unless it's done a few generators in or with the doors opened.
Still, I wouldn't say the issue is forcing free hooks. I know how some survivors are entitled, but you also have to realize that that's how they get their points and they may want to make plays to get everyone out or as many as possible.
TLDR; Camping is boring for survivors and you're likely to not get pips or points unless you feed into camping and try to go for save; therefore, not entirely survivor's fault.
I get that camping is boring. Having been on all sides of camping (the one doing the camping, the one being camped, and the one not being camped), I understand that it's boring. It's boring to do, boring to experience, and boring when it's being done to someone else. However, Survivors do reward camping, and it is their fault that Killers do it as often as they do.
When the game was first released, Survivors rushed generators when one of them was being camped. However, they soon started to let their entitlement get to their heads and tried to force unhooks even if the Killer was right there. This meant zero generator progress, and thus more time for the Killer to win. Eventually, Killers realized that they didn't have to go hunting for Survivors all that much - hook one, and the vultures come to you all on their own.
The ones who were camped, rather than blame the people who were actually to blame - the hook vultures - blamed the Killers, which only furthered the vultures' entitlement. After all, if the people whose rounds you're actively ruining are on your side, then surely you must be right.
So yes, it is actually entirely the Survivors' fault. The vultures for, well, being vultures, and the ones who blame Killers who take advantage of the vultures. This is a PvP game; taking advantage of your opponent's mistakes is what you're supposed to do.2 -
@Tiersis said:
There is a perk to show you when the killer is camping. Drop your DS and use it.Sometimes you really want to get rid of a super annoying player who was also playing like an asshat. It happens. For me, its usually whoever has Decisive Strike.
No, don't make the progress bar stop if killer is near, because tryhard survivors always rush the hook, and would just do that to keep you near it.
Why should we have to run really far away and give you a freebie unhook? Play the game, earn it.
Currently balance in the game needs to be set as if all 4 players were coordinated and on voice chat at all times, until they give us a "Join Solo Queue" option that lets us only play against non SWF groups.
If I have to put up with bully BS from 4 man SWF groups, sorry, you've gotta put up with my assumptions that you're likely part of a SWF group, otherwise its not fun for me, and I won't play.
I get that 4/5 players are survivors, but that doesn't mean the killer has to clench up and grab his/her ankles every time just cause you don't know enough to do a gen while someones camping.
Just drop DS. I wouldn't say use Kindred. It's cool, but if you have to show people you're being camped, that means your being camped. If you're having issues with being camped, run perks that will better help you avoid the killer or run the killer around.
I agree, that isn't a good thing.
Are you suggesting the best gameplay is to camp or saying that in regards to people who run at the hook when the killer is still nearby? For camping, you're wasting your time and creating a boring experience that either the survivors feed into, get everyone killed, but get their points. Or they don't and don't get points or pips. You know we lose points for leaving people on the hook, right? And if we get no beneficence because the hooked survivor had a friend who really didn't wanna leave, we're out of luck. Survivors already get less points than killer. We have a whole category that we only get 5k and we don't even get that if we happen to die ever.
The people who camp still does it for solo que. They do it for bad players, too, or nontoxic players. It makes no difference.
Once again, not that simple if you want a pip or points or if you have empathy and feel bad for them. It sucks leaving with just 1k if not less. The survivor was caught, but it isn't their fault that the killer decided to camp or that survivors decided to farm them. There's so much that survivors don't have any control over and you get so much more points as killer. Even when you have a bad match.
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@Orion said:
@fluffybunny said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@Orion said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
@NoShinyPony said:
The majority of players don't like camping but we would need other mechanics to make camping redundant. Your suggestion isn't a solution, sorry. That doesn't mean that you should stop making suggestions if you can come up with good ideas.I'd like to think the majority doesn't like camping but if it's an issue than clearly not enough people dislike it. I don't have any statistics on this, so I'll have to take your word for it.
How is my suggestion not a solution?
Your suggestion is not a solution because:
- Camping should always be an option for the Killer. Forcing the Killer to give free unhooks only makes hooks even less relevant than they already are.
- Camping is inherently bad for the Killer, regardless of your excuses that "not everyone plays SWF". Your opponent is doing nothing for two full minutes.
- It was already tried in the PTB and Survivors abused it.
- Camping is a symptom; not a problem. Giving a blood transfusion to someone with a severed femoral artery and ignoring the wound is not a solution.
- Camping is a Survivor-created problem with a Survivor-side solution. Like it or not, camping became widespread due to Survivors rewarding it.
Genuinely I feel like you all 3 are just killer mains. I get that survivors abused a system that attempted to thwart people who use camping.
That's all you needed to say.I don't agree with you on your other_ opinions_.
The last part, at the very least, is not an opinion. It's a documented fact that anyone who's played the game since release can tell you. Back in the beginning, Survivors knew to rush gens when the Killer was camping. Nowadays, they want to force free unhooks.
By the way, even if the rest are opinions doesn't mean pointing that out makes them invalid. This entire thread is your opinion, but you don't see anyone dismissing it out of hand because of it.
Saying survivors reward camping and it's survivor's fault isn't entirely fair. It's one of the main four categories and survivors typically miss out entirely on one category as survival doesn't reward more than 5k and it rewards nothing if you don't get out. Besides, it isn't hopeful for survivors. If you don't have people on page, you are unlikely to get gens done in time to actually punish that behavior. If you're playing solo, you can't tell everyone you're being camped, so people are wasting time checking. Honestly it's poor gameplay and only rewarded 'cause it's boring. If killer camps, that only leaves survivors with M1ing to victor. There isn't chases, no saves, etc. It also means you're likely getting a bronze in that category and no points unless you farm hits. You also won't get any points towards boldness and could get a bronze or a black pip, depending. Then if you get camped, you're likely not getting much points unless it's done a few generators in or with the doors opened.
Still, I wouldn't say the issue is forcing free hooks. I know how some survivors are entitled, but you also have to realize that that's how they get their points and they may want to make plays to get everyone out or as many as possible.
TLDR; Camping is boring for survivors and you're likely to not get pips or points unless you feed into camping and try to go for save; therefore, not entirely survivor's fault.
I get that camping is boring. Having been on all sides of camping (the one doing the camping, the one being camped, and the one not being camped), I understand that it's boring. It's boring to do, boring to experience, and boring when it's being done to someone else. However, Survivors do reward camping, and it is their fault that Killers do it as often as they do.
When the game was first released, Survivors rushed generators when one of them was being camped. However, they soon started to let their entitlement get to their heads and tried to force unhooks even if the Killer was right there. This meant zero generator progress, and thus more time for the Killer to win. Eventually, Killers realized that they didn't have to go hunting for Survivors all that much - hook one, and the vultures come to you all on their own.
The ones who were camped, rather than blame the people who were actually to blame - the hook vultures - blamed the Killers, which only furthered the vultures' entitlement. After all, if the people whose rounds you're actively ruining are on your side, then surely you must be right.
So yes, it is actually entirely the Survivors' fault. The vultures for, well, being vultures, and the ones who blame Killers who take advantage of the vultures. This is a PvP game; taking advantage of your opponent's mistakes is what you're supposed to do.Honestly if people were circling me and I died because none of them could get me off and they didn't even attempt to take the killer away, I would blame the survivor. Survivors looping around the hooked survivor or farming the survivor is the survivor's fault, not the killer. The most they can do is react to the situation. While it's nice when they just down you and show some sympathy, I don't really expect it. Having stupid teammates is part of playing survivor sometimes. It's to be expected.
I still don't think it's entirely the Survivors' fault. As I had previously said, the points would discourage you from not going for the save and sometimes them 'punishing' the camp doesn't even work as they don't get the gens done in time. This is a PvP game, not a PvE. So, someone camping effects the game experience of another person. A person is unlikely to get all that much points if they're camped, unless it's further into the game or at the end with the doors opened. There really isn't anything stopping a killer from camping if he caught a survivor with 5 gens remaining and I think it shouldn't just be a benefit/benefit for the killer to camp. It should be a tactical choice they make that might negatively affect their points. I've had people tell me they camp to make sure they pip and I don't think camping should give you pips as there isn't much challenge to that sort of gameplay.
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@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
When I bring up face camping there's a few things people complain about, so before I bring up my idea let's just get this out of the way:Face camping/extreme camping. Well, first off if you're here to tell me face camping isn't an issue anymore because swivel hook- I'm describing their actions. If they're in your face and they're sitting there. They're face camping or whatever you want to call it. It upsets me everyone assumes you're playing with friends and they can tell you the killer is face camping them. When you're playing alone (and this is a team based game for survivors, none of this 'oh why did you even check' BS) you're going to waste time running up and seeing the killer is refusing to let a person go. It's cheap, boring, unfair, and mind boggling this issue has not been fixed. Swivel hook is nice but
Solution: If you (the killer) are not chasing anyone and you're near a hooked survivor the survivors depletion bar before going into 2nd phase (or 3rd phase/death) the bar completely stops. As long as the killer is close to the hooked survivor, the survivor's depletion bar will stagnate coming to a complete halt (or move very very slowly) until the killer leaves the perimeters of the hooked survivor and the survivor is out of sight.MESSAGE TO KILLER MAINS: Pallet looping still takes skill, my heart goes out to you I still think it's rough and I have experienced this playing as killer. Don't assume I don't/haven't play killer. Killer has way more advantages and control over the game, and though I think they should have control, the game gives the above unfair advantage too, however you can still have control/fun/kills without using the above tactic. Gen rush isn't a thing, if you're a good killer some games you get everyone super fast, some games the survivors are better than you and will get gens super fast.This game isn't just made for killers, and with this specific issue it really makes me wonder if I should keep playing, because there's a lot of DC's going on, and the best solution would be to fix issues like this.
(Part of this post was taken from my original post https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/33513/dcs-because-of-unresolved-issues )
I'm seeing this a lot at rank 1 on PS4. There needs to be something done about facecampers. It was once talked about to decrease the killer's BP earnings when not in a chase, and while camping a survivor, I would agree with this, or even void BP earnings when camping, sometimes survivors DC just to deny the killer some BP because of their toxic behavior.
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@HURRI_KAIN said:
@wouldntyouliketoknow said:
When I bring up face camping there's a few things people complain about, so before I bring up my idea let's just get this out of the way:Face camping/extreme camping. Well, first off if you're here to tell me face camping isn't an issue anymore because swivel hook- I'm describing their actions. If they're in your face and they're sitting there. They're face camping or whatever you want to call it. It upsets me everyone assumes you're playing with friends and they can tell you the killer is face camping them. When you're playing alone (and this is a team based game for survivors, none of this 'oh why did you even check' BS) you're going to waste time running up and seeing the killer is refusing to let a person go. It's cheap, boring, unfair, and mind boggling this issue has not been fixed. Swivel hook is nice but
Solution: If you (the killer) are not chasing anyone and you're near a hooked survivor the survivors depletion bar before going into 2nd phase (or 3rd phase/death) the bar completely stops. As long as the killer is close to the hooked survivor, the survivor's depletion bar will stagnate coming to a complete halt (or move very very slowly) until the killer leaves the perimeters of the hooked survivor and the survivor is out of sight.MESSAGE TO KILLER MAINS: Pallet looping still takes skill, my heart goes out to you I still think it's rough and I have experienced this playing as killer. Don't assume I don't/haven't play killer. Killer has way more advantages and control over the game, and though I think they should have control, the game gives the above unfair advantage too, however you can still have control/fun/kills without using the above tactic. Gen rush isn't a thing, if you're a good killer some games you get everyone super fast, some games the survivors are better than you and will get gens super fast.This game isn't just made for killers, and with this specific issue it really makes me wonder if I should keep playing, because there's a lot of DC's going on, and the best solution would be to fix issues like this.
(Part of this post was taken from my original post https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/33513/dcs-because-of-unresolved-issues )
I'm seeing this a lot at rank 1 on PS4. There needs to be something done about facecampers. It was once talked about to decrease the killer's BP earnings when not in a chase, and while camping a survivor, I would agree with this, or even void BP earnings when camping, sometimes survivors DC just to deny the killer some BP because of their toxic behavior.
A facecamping killer doesnt earn BP.
Its the survivors throwing themselves at the camping killers that reward the killer.1
