Bubba lost face
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I don't really care, but the 6k shards are good so you won't hear me complain
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atlest i can think for myslef and im not going on some stupid agenda
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So... not better moderation. Not changing the content so that it can no longer be used in a hateful way (there were talks of changing the faces to having survivor keepsakes attached to them, and that would have been delightful.)
Just removing content. And the niftiest way to unlock content, at that.
It's really not hard for people to continue to be racist asshats using other things in the game. Removing the faces is not going to fix this problem. You will still have dipshits going after every Elodie, Claudette, Adam, people with pride charms, etc. The issue is with disgusting people playing the game. They'll always find ways to be disgusting for as long as they're allowed to continue playing.
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but yeah i forgot one thing if you dont aggre with "woke twitter people you are just bad person
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I see more people unhappy than happy with the decision. It's generally agreed that harassment can be a problem, but most people I've seen on the forum said it's a dumb way to deal with this problem.
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im confused how you can be hateful by doing that? What's the difference in targeting someone as the wraith from targeting someone as leatherface with a mask on?
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A world struggling with all the bad is going crazy. And people become very vulnerable to literally everything ...
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I don't expect plans to change but as a compromise it would be nice if we could just replace the mask by giving each survivor they represent a small cosmetic instead. When you purchase Leatherface Dwight received a pair of broken glasses as a cosmetic. The same thing for the other survivors would be a nice compromise. Although I get it this solution was easier granted it sucks.
Also trolls will use anything as a weapon - While I don't agree with this solution I hope the people who actually promoted hate with the mask were permabanned. It would feel so insulting if not only did trolls manage to get these mask removed but they're still allowed to play this game.
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i can also think for myself, and doing so made my decision to support my friends on a matter i was neutral in, but one they felt strongly about. because that's what friends do- and so i advocated for it's removal using their points + asking them for help when i didn't understand fully, since the topic is one they are more educated in.
i thought for myself, and decided to support them. clearly you did the same, and decided that you wanted the cosmetics to remain.
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It would created as much controversy but with more cosmetics for Bubba, the community benefiting. I repeat the same, removing all the masks is like using a sledgehammer to crack nuts.
And also, I don't think your opinion is honest, you're an employee and you can be fired if you disagree with the bosses in public.
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damn that's sad
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Eh, I think they're right about removing one or removing all. You remove one, now the issue is that Claudette is excluded and that BHVR's leaving out the black survivor.
I just don't think removing the masks outright was the right way to deal with this problem.
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You can think what you prefer, I still have opinions and ideas outside what my role is and I don't think I would get fired for saying I disagree with a change, because there are multiple changes I do not agree with.
However that's beyond the point, you are free to dislike the change, I'm just trying to see the reasoning behind it.
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I guess no more being camouflage as Claudette's face combined with p3 clothing.
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"Not changing the content so that it can no longer be used in a hateful way (there were talks of changing the faces to having survivor keepsakes attached to them, and that would have been delightful.)"
That would require the IP holders to sign off on it. If it is true that the IP holders were preventing BHVR from removing the cosmetics (until recently, at least), then I doubt they'd approve of your suggestion.
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So now those toxic Bubbas will continue their behavior and the rest of us are needlessly punished.
This has no effect on the individuals that were doing this. It just removes a cool horror-movie-relevant feature and does nothing to address the actual toxicity.
This change, of course, only affects killers and there is no way they would do something like this if it affected a paid survivor skin. Another move that shows the people running the show isn't the same horror movie-loving people as before as this just diminishes the horror movie 'coolness' without sacrificing the new style of gameplay as that's all that matters now.
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The thing is - lore-wise it's not a blackface. Bubba doesn't give two damns about race of the victims he makes masks out. It's not some dumb make-up, it's quite literally a skin-mask, a trophy if you will. A trophy he will take from black botanist and white athlete with the very same care. Native Americans aren't considered racist just for taking white people's scalps after defeating and killing them. Same goes for Leatherface.
And if lore-wise it's not a problem, then removing cosmetic (which in its nature has no connotation to "racism") will fix absolutely nothing. Absolutely. Nothing. Racist players will keep harrassing black creators, maybe now even more than before because of this change. They're doing that not because they have a Claudieface headpiece - they're doing that because they are morons who want to do it.
In this scenario BHVR should start finding a way of efficiently banning players, who are being racist/homophobic/xenophobic/etc. in the post-game chats and outside of it. But they don't do that, not even trying as far as I can tell (been playing this game for almost 3k hours and get harassed from time to time for my nationality only, have seen zero people banned for just doing that). Instead, BHVR chooses to punish players who did absolutely nothing wrong by robbing them of cosmetics they've put time and effort to obtain (they aren't purchasable after all, it's literally the only earnable set of cosmetics in game outside of Rift ones).
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True. Well, that's just a damn shame.
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Just use the P3 face it's equally as effective
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So real question, why not just remove the ones of non white males?
PR wise there is no such thing as being hateful towards white men so why take them all away? Hell why not make a face mask of every white male and add a special Bubba mori of slicing his face off and wearing it. I'm not joking or being sarcastic.
If it's hateful to include everyone then just don't include the people who don't want to be included. Leatherface should get more masks if they are gonna take some away. Plenty of white boys left to get a close shave and it's entirely PC.
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True at least we get compensation for it. They could have took them away and called it a day.
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I wish it wasnt just 6k shards though.... would it hurt that much to gives at least 10k? smh greedy mfs
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They can't ban outside of game chat. If you're on console report them to Sony and Microsoft.
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Mainly because they lose something they're accustomed to. In the end, there are people out there who complain that they don't do enough to combat harrassment, but when BHVR do then some get upset about that. They can't win, so in this case it's guaranteed the racial harrassment would continue if the masks stay, so the only guaranteed way of dealing with it is removing it.
Trying to educate racists in a game is not going to work, because of internet anonymity. Believe me, I wish there was another way, but I cannot see it.
Well, there is one way, but it involves the report system and an eternal backlog of complaints to sift through before anything is done. It would take too long, and although a racist won't stop if tools are removed, they have less opportunity to be this way than before in-game. If it ruins the fun, they leave. They leave, then it's good for everyone.
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So you are telling me that removing a single mask bad, and removing all good, try to don't think in controversies and only community wise, you are a player, are you happy for having all the masks removed instead of just only one. Alligning you with the removal of all masks is like being more catholic than the pope.
EDIT: Forgot Bubba had cosmetics, lol.
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Bubba has 2 outfits in the store.
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True I didnt remember.
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Leatherface has cosmetics.
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Have you read any of my other posts in this thread? I'm pissed about the removal. I just think that removing only Claudette would have been an equally bad decision.
Mainly, my stance is that this doesn't tackle the root of the issue and the players who were using the Smartface mask to harass PoC still have plenty of ways to harass people on the basis of race, gender, orientation, etc. You have to kick out those players as soon as they crop up and out themselves, not remove every aspect of the game they can possibly use to be gross.
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Well, it was fun to do the challenges to be able to play the different faces freely. It's a shame to have to go this route because of some racist rats, but I think it's the only right decision. The 6000 shards as compensation makes it a bit more bearable for me and I can live with that. But... what about the black Huntress mask? Will it hit her too?
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Good lord this thread is full of cringe. If removing the faces keeps even one person from behaving like a racist ass hat then it's worth it in my opinion. That kind of garbage behavior should never be tolerated.
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That's a black-painted bunny mask, not a black person's taxidermied face, so I can't imagine why that would be an issue.
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have you guys using the 'its bubbas character he doesnt care' response ever thought that perhaps the whole idea of a fictional character wearing skin masks of all races had racist connotations all along that go deeper than Dead by Daylight and it only took us till 2021/2 to finally realize it and speak up about it
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That's the kind of comment that I'm happy to read.
I'm genuinely baffled and beyond disappointed that so many people are happy to tolerate hate against other human beings on this thread and are trying to compare it to things like t-bagging.
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Glad I P3'd Adam, Tapp and Claudette for when you are going to make said characters invulnerable against hooking/sacrificing in the future /s
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I don't get it either. Is it sad to see the faces go? Sure, it was a cool thing unique to Bubba. Unfortunately people insist on ruining nice things.
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Who is "happy to tolerate hate"? That's kind of a reach.
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I'm not saying they can. I'm saying they should pay more attention to that kind of stuff, rather than headpieces that players choose.
They aren't particularly efficient in banning people who do all that in-game either, as you can't even report a person properly if they aren't on Steam, while in-game post-match reports do pretty much nothing ever. Granted, it's hard to tell which in-game report is valid and which is just butthurted trolling, but it's on BHVR to bring tools which would record matches and post-game chats regardless of whether victim has OBS or not.
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I don't know how disappointed you are. I think that before taking any action, they should put this in that questionnaire that they always do.
You as a player have your opinion, and as a developer I bet you have all the skins you want, we casual players don't have that luxury. Removing some skins that took so long to get, and giving a misery of Shards (you can't even buy a decent set) without being really transparent with the number of complaints and just appealing to the social discourse doesn't seem right.
All we want is data transparency and something fair in return.
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I'm not tolerating anything. I'm saying you're addressing the wrong issue and that taking away a cosmetic doesn't do anything to stop the kind of pea-brained player who boots up DBD looking to harass people on the basis of who they are.
The only way to prevent these people from having any tools to be disgusting without handling them from a moderation standpoint is to make every character a white cishet male, remove the pride charm, and remove the endgame chat, and obviously that is not a solution. I guess I'm just not thrilled that we're going part of the way down that road and removing content for everybody when the actual solution for the problem they present is fast and reactive moderation that doesn't waffle over whether harassment isn't bad enough to count. And I find it depressing that we're going this way, because that implies to me that DBD's not really interested in putting the resources towards more successful in-game moderation.
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A few people being harassed is different than the mask only being used by racists. Smart Face Bubba facecamping you? Doesn't mean they're doing it to be racist, maybe they facecamp everyone.
Should we also remove the LGBT charm because I've been called a F slur in end game chat for using it? I dont think so, because I'll still be called a F slur with it in the game or not.
If people want to target minorities in the game, they will do it regardless of charms, masks, or whatever the f.
What they should be doing is banning people who actually use slurs and hateful messages in post game chat, which happens quite a lot.
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Wait a minute! I ( for example ) didn't even know that there were such idiots who use skins as tools (which is a shame and a scandal). Just because I regret that the faces will no longer exist doesn't mean I'm racist. I would be careful with such statements!
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As I’ve stated in another post: I don’t have a problem with Smartface itself, I have a problem with people using it for racist intent. And yes, lore-wise, I know Bubba doesn’t care about the race of his victims. Horror movies/games are supposed to make people uncomfortable after all.
But BHVR, as seen today, doesn’t want their game to be that uncomfortable.
Since some people are using Smartface to be racist (combined with BHVR having a poor report system) it’s better to remove it asap. Don’t get me wrong, I do feel bad for the people who worked for these cosmetics and wish they got more than just shards. BHVR also needs to implement a much better report system to avoid this.
For now, I just see they don’t want to give racists a tool (which is similar to black face, let’s be honest) and let them run.
I don’t care if the harassment gets worse. At least these trolls will be easy to identify and no one playing as a black character is getting targeted with a Bubba using Smartface to be racist.
I know it’s just a game, but normal people don’t play games to be racist.
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"So as we can see from this survey about 54% of players believe racism exists in the community and about 80% of Black players have experienced at least 7% racist actions in the past. "
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So, once again, if it's hateful to have the non white male masks just delete those?
I do not understand why all the masks have to go, just remove all the masks that aren't considered pc and add the ones that are. It's considered pc for Leatherface to run around with a deli style Felix face. So why not let us have it?
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The skinned faces didnt look that good anyway. They were mere texture changes.
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I dont want to take it even more far, but are you guys considering removing the Rainbow-Flag-Charm since people are getting harassed for using it? I personally got often facecamped and insulted as many disgusrting things just because I used this charm.
With that logic I am kinda worried that we could lose it aswell.
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Because specific exclusion of POC also looks bad from a PR standpoint outside of changing them all to accessories which would require a lot more negotiations than just "lol can we get rid of these please" this was the best case scenario.
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