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I don't understand devs logic
Hi, I'm still a new player because I have just 150h of playtime and I play the game for less than 2 months so I didn't know the game before and because I'm (I think) still not in highest MMR, maybe all nerfs that they made aren't a problem for now but I'm wondering about something, maybe it's obvious but I don't understand the devs logic.
It seems that they continuely nerf killers side even if the game is already unbalanced for survivors side but... They know if there are no longer killers, the game will not survive, I mean, how do you want to play as survivors without a killer ? They will put bots to keep their game alive ?...
I don't know this dev team but it seems that they aren't playing their own game, otherwise they wouldn't do as much as bad changes and controversial ones I guess. So why they don't ask to the community what to change ?
I play a bit more killer side and even if I enjoy it so much, it's really more stressful than survivor side, proof that the game is unbalanced imo + a lot of players are complaining about killer side, something is wrong no ?
BHV made a lot of games but isn't DBD the most famous one ? The game earns them a lot of money I guess so maybe it would be smart to listen players and keep the game alive no ? I'm not a dev but it seems logic in my mind..
Comments
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Dev logic is a bit different from ours and there are multiple things to take into consideration:
- Devs are not devs. The people working on balance may not be the same who work on new Killers, maps or reworks of killers. Look and animations are also done by "devs" but they do no coding. As such the term "the devs" is vague at best.
- Changes need time. Depending on how complex something is there can be multiple problems for the devs to fix. Take hit validation as an example: We now have a pallet and a Dead Hard hit validation system. However we have no window-hit validation. This could very much be because there are more interactions with windows (aka more code) that has to be considered.
- You may have to change more than you think. As an example: I demand that the different Exhaustion perks have different values to them. Now this would work if the values are stored in a seperate file and can be changed with just one input. However if maybe those values are glued to a different tag "Exhaustion" you would have to change this tag first and then every single perk with a new variable. This takes time, creates bugs and well...maybe you will not notice it as a player.
- Many things are done in the background. Bug fixes, performance issues and things like that are done in the background. We will not notice them.
- The game is on multiple platforms and crossplay. This is a hard one: You do not only have to develop for one platform but for multiple interacting platforms, leading to you writing the same thing 3 or more times for different systems and then watching those systems interact.
Sure, BHVR is big. But they are not only working on DbD, they have other projects too. How may people work on DbD? I have no idea. But these problems lead to a time delay with the devs work: We complain about something today and the solution may already be in development since 3 months.
To cut it short: There is a lot going on that we do not know about. There is no easy way to fix this and that is not our job. But overall please assume that those people have the best intentions for the game first. Maybe consider problems from a few months back when reading todays solutions.
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I think arguing that, with Killer nerfs, there will come a point where no one is playing Killer, is kind of silly, though it is evident that some people have been so sincerely bothered by changes to add-ons that they have uninstalled the game.
While Gwinty is right in that there are simply things we do not know and that there isn't just an easy insta-fix for any of the problems the game has, I think there is also the fact that the balancing team at BHVR is overall just...not sure how to go about things.
They very clearly want the best for the game -- despite what SpiritSimp69 might tell you, BHVR isn't actively working to undermine their main game -- but they also probably still have an outdated understanding of the game, ie that it is just a horror game, which it has not been for a good while. I think a fair evidence of this is that, as time goes on, there have been more Killers, all of them with very pretty and well-done models, that have powers that are just a power another Killer has with a few things changed about it -- they are going off of whatever is terrifying and cool first, and viable second.
That is not to say they do not give a ######### about balance though, quite the contrary -- we would not be getting nerfs and buffs with explanations if they did not care to make sure the game was enjoyable to everyone. The problem is that, like I said, since they are working to make a horror game first, they are not exactly sure how to go about these nerfs, which is why their justification for nerfing some things is that they were being used too much. Now, I am not saying this is all justified, because it isn't. BHVR should work towards having a balance team that understands they are not just making a horror game anymore (and probably hire someone whose prior work isn't just random mobile games) and act accordingly -- but, evidently, this has been going well for them, so they have not bothered yet.
This is all I gathered from what I have seen or heard, though. Anyone who knows the on-goings within BHVR is free to correct me if I am wrong.
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Long story short the devs dont understand their own logic either. Their company feels like a many headed beast where each head has its own opinion 9n how things should be done and through the constant fighting they, every month and a half release an update some how.
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Relevant comment but I wasn't really speaking about that :)
I don't complain on how much time they need to make changes or release a patch but I'm complaining about decisions they take. They know their game is still unbalanced, they aren't blind, I hope they follow the opinion of their community but they continue to make changes in a wrong way, that's the problem.
You took a perfect example while talking about exhaustion perk, I'm not a dev but I can easily understand that it's not easy as we think to change a piece of code. But when you know your game is unbalanced, you know killer side is harder and more stressful, you know survivor side is advantaged but you continue to nerf killer side, it's a bit misunderstandable, no ?
Sorry but it's hard to assume that they have best intentions for their game if they continue to make changes against the tide of opinion of players.
I don't know if you know Daybreak (H1Z1 dev team), their game wasn't perfect but still really great and enjoyable, they did changes against the tide of opinion of players, they didn't take our opinion in consideration and now the game is dead...
I understand what do you mean, I didn't know the game was designed like a horror game first but... When you are a dev team, what do you want ? That's your game stay alive to earn money, I know it's easy to say that but even if you are passionate about video games, while you are a company, you want money, it's a fact and logic.
So you need to keep your playerbase active but if you continue to make changes in wrong way, we'll arrive at a point that nobody will want to play killer anymore and if there aren't killers, the game is unplayable even if there are many survivors main that enjoy the game and stay on it.
I say that because it happened many time that a company was stucked in their bad decisions and the game they created, even if at a time it was famous, it died.
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Your entire acc posts is about mocking killers,this thing of 50 50 doesn't make sense,doesn't matter for you survivor mains if you do poorly you will still have 50% of underseved escape rate. The game is a 4v1,killers should be powerful to keep up with multiple people at the same time.
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It seems yeah, unfortunately for us..
I'm not agree with you, I play a lot killer side, survivor side too and killer side is way more stressful. Me and I guess other ones don't want to be the power itself, we just want a balanced game and not have a heartattack each time we play killer side because it's obvious that it's easier to play survivor than killer.
You said devs want a balanced game ? So why they continue to nerf killers side even if they know the game is still unbalanced for survivors side ?
A company must listen their community, even if a change don't seems logical for them but 80% of playerbase complain about it, maybe they need to change it, don't you think ? When you are a company, you need your community or your customers like you prefer to continue to exist, if you continue to make changes against the tide of opinion of players, what do you think it'll happen ?
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Because they want to cater towards their biggest base.
Survivors, like it or not, make up the majority (likely the vast majority) of the paying playerbase. Key word there is paying.
Why would any business do something that would upset the majority of their customers? They wouldn't.
Ergo, Survivor changes are top priority and Killer complaints take a backseat, not unanswered but just down the ladder a bit. You can see this reflected in things like Undying being nerfed fairly quickly but Circle of Healing remaining arguably stronger but still not being nerfed.
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Why do you have to make it an us vs them argument?
Survivors complain all the time too. About tunneling, NOED and camping. And before spirit too which got nerfed, deathslinger was complained about too by survivors and got nerfed as well. Should i go on?
Saying killers complain too much isnt a valid argument, because survivors complain about everything and still get the changes they want.
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For sure I can understand that, it's logic that you want to keep active the majority of the playerbase but it's not a shooter where you can nerf shotgun for example if there are just 5% of playerbase that use it, you know the rest will still continue to play.
Here it's a game that need 4 survivors and 1 killer to start a trial, if you continue to make bad changes about killer side and no one want to play killer anymore, even if you still have the majority of your playerbase (survivors), how do you want play the game ?
And if you continue in that way, queue time for survivor will be longer and longer, don't you think they will start to stop playing ?
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I think the Devs would have to mess up catastrophically to kill the game at this point.
DBD has always been a revolving door of players. I've been around since early 2018 and I'd say that most of the playerbase joined sometime after January 2020.
So long as they keep their licenses and continue to bring in new one's, the game isn't going to die no matter what balance decisions they make.
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Yeah maybe you are right.
It's painful to see that our opinion isn't considered and they continue to make changes like they want even if it's in the wrong way but what can we do :/
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Killers do get changes. The Devs aren't Survivor-sided, just to be clear. And we also don't know what the right way is either.
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I never said dev team is survivor sided, it seems that they aren't really playing their own game so for sure they aren't survivor or killer sided but the game is still unbalanced anyway.
Killers do get changes maybe but in which way ?
You are right about what the right way is, it depends about what you prefer to play and what kind of player you are but we can assume than nerf a side that is already unbalanced isn't the right way no ?
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There is no logic, only raw data.
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You need to watch Otz video about that, watch some killer mains play to see how much they win. Learn the strategies how to play. Killers can win effortlessly an overwhelming majority of the time if you use all the advantages the game gives you.
The devs have provided all the overpowered perks and killers and nerfed most maps so killers have a huge advantage.
Their logic needs to be about fairness, not a new killer winning effortlessly against everyone.
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Survivor players inevitably greatly outnumber killer ones and they obviously are where most of the $ comes from to BHVR. Can't be helped.
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Some issues do take time to fix (with they way that the game is coded) but (for me) it's the lack of awareness (or attention) to those issues
Like the Nurse and Haddonfield being Killswitched but not COH or RPD (not saying that the Devs are Survivor-sided but they don't make decisions or tell us that they are looking at issues being talked about)
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About time you showed up here.
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that was 2 months ago
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Yikes thanks for letting me know. It was early I was tired.
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