http://dbd.game/killswitch
The US vs then mentailty
Just as the title says this is not a call to say everyone should think like this but rather a little snippet as to why people think this way.
the US vs them mentality is never going away thanks to the devs making a game where it is "all play the same vs all play differently" so unlike if a fighting game tweaked a character or if a team game tweaked something its not everyone gets hit only one side does and the other reaps the benefits no matter what anyone says that's why especially now when people say it's survivor sided it's not "they want a 4k" or some bullshit some people say for the most part it's that the game made it where survivors reap the reward while killers do not.
Comments
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It is US VERSUS THEM because it is a PvP game.
There are literally two sides.
It is literally "us versus them".
I have no idea why people get offended at this idea.
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This. But what isn't helpful is when people speak out proactively for both sides and disingenuous a-holes turn it into a pit-fight.
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To me, its more so about people excusing broken mechanics because the other side has broken mechanics when they should both be gone.
That us vs them mentality is the wrench that stops any kind of productive discussion.
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Thank you. +1
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Have you looked at the society we live in recently?
It is always us vs them. Everywhere. Always.
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Ya, but why? Does it have to be? Feels wrong to me.
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I know but for this it's a problem at its core meaning how the game is mechanically.
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This is why everyone should play both sides. Then you can see all game problems. I never take serious who is playing only one side, their opinion is worthless to me because they can not be objective.
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How about from the people who did and say its survivor sided.?
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It's human nature to seek out conflict, in any form. Part of what makes us great, is that we're always looking for the next challenge. Unfortunately, a lot of that is directed at each other.
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Not really. In most multiplayer game that I played people get along. There is very few games that have this issue. It's usually the one siders that seem not to have an ounce of empathy for the other side. Honestly I wouldn't mind the game forcing people to play killer, like we all load in into the lobby and the game randomly picks one person to play the killer role. But yeah I played many PVP multiplayer games where people still manage to get along. It's just that this game does not encourage people to have sense of unity.
Post edited by Trickstaaaaa on4 -
The thing is both sides are play two different games one side is a pvp(killer) and the other is a PvPvEish) and have completely different objects and need to be balanced in different way. So naturally when one person doesn't play enough of one side it blurs your understanding and it turns into and uneducated argument.
I think one of the biggest problems I'd killer has been getting less and less fun lately and there is a clear lack of killers because q times are always instant and they are talking about buffing solo(I'm all for it) but haven't said anything about killers QoL lately and there needs to be some especially if your buffing solo. All killers got was Ghostface Legion rework soon tm and some buffs to bad add ons in the wrong places people didn't use the other addons because the number where to low it'd because the effects suck.
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I don't think anything meaningful in this kind of mentality, I think anyone yelling "survivor main" "killer main" at someone else should be insta-banned.
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Oh of COURSE a [Insert your side] thinks this way!!! Why don't you try the hard role with all the BS that [Insert my side] has to deal with and actually takes some freaking skill to play and THEN maybe you can talk!!!
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Why? If someone is entitled and decided to treat someone like ######### why shouldn't they get called out for their ######### behaviour?
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Because that is literally has nothing to do with who plays what side, and then you can't even know actual main of "them".
Pointless, worthless and needless conflict for the sake of conflict, that bring nothing to the world.
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Sure.
Here's my best example.
In what's probably creeping up past 450 hours as a killer player, I've had literally 2 survivors give me a pity kill on a blowout game.
2.
If I don't give the last survivor the hatch or gate on a blowout game where I 3k at 5 gens, I'm the biggest jerk in the world and literally the sort of person that bullies people IRL.
The reason for the mindset comes down predominantly to the way survivors treat killer players in comparison to how they expect to be treated by killer players.
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That's just people being ######### because behaviour sucks at managing that.
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I'm just saying why killers tend towards a bunker mentality, especially when survivors start QQing about 'us versus them' nonsense, or trying to frame literally every killer feedback thread as 'lul us vs them shut up'.
It's an effect caused by survivor players - as people.
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What? Then we had completely different experience.
I have yet to play pvp game where people aren't toxic.
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I have to admit that the double standards are absolutely ridiculous and personally I feel most survivor mains are sus; however, it is VERY bold to blame our rivalry on survivors... as people. Like, damn. Savage.
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Have they been this bad however where both the match and outside of it were a horrible experience or a string of them now thanks to mmr.
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Ive played both sides since release but I still get ######### on for saying I think the game is fairly balanced at this point , it's a far cry from 2016-2018 DBD and I think for the most part alot of people do play both sides, I think a big part of the problem people have is refusal to accept mistakes and instead blame something on the other side for their loss, whether it's a survivor complaining about killers or vice versa the fact no one can accept their mistakes and alot of people think they're a god is where this mentality comes from on us vs them, people refuse to accept what they did wrong to improve it and instead will continue to play the same way whilst complaining the other side is abusing something.
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You can only do that for so long though until you realize there are certain issues going on now.
Such as the over reliance of perks such as DH and coh
The fact that now due to how the devs balanced killers its starting to devolve into match strings of "nurse nurse blight nurse blight blight nurse blight " since they made only 2 killers worth a ######### because of nerfs to base kit and keeping perks like DH the same as they were before only adding even more forgiveness as the game continues.
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That's simply not true there are more than just nurse and blight that can compete but I will agree there are lower tier killers who deserve more than what they have and what I mean by that is an entire killer power rework like old Freddy had.
As for perks, dead hard and COH really aren't that bad I kill teams with boon totems twice as fast as I do a normal team just from the time wasted to bless and then constant resetting and before someone complains about having to snuff the boons I will point out that people also complain about totems being in plain sight right by the objectives and if you play normally chances are you'll run right in front of it anyway because totems aren't hard to see and you'll eventually run by it without trying to find it.
Both sides have things that make them strong and things that make them weak, I don't care if you're the best survivor in the entire game if you get one or two bad apples on your team it can cost you the game and as a killer survivors who know to separate and rush gens can cost you the game on the right map if you aren't a killer who can physically get there in time to do anything or end chases fast enough, but these are mainly lower tier killer problems and with mid- higher tier killers you can do something about it, is it a stressful juggling game if you're not a high tier killer? Absolutely is but that just means there's less room for error in those situations and at the end of the day nobody is forcing you to play a low tier killer at rank 1 and if you choose to do that then you can't complain about the outcome for using a beginner tier killer in the advanced ranks because no matter what people say BHVR has already came out and said that there are killers made specific for beginners to learn the ropes easier, example noobs complain about wraith because he's a noob solo stomper that's easy to use but at high ranks he gets ######### on by solos and swf who know how to play against him without breaking a sweat.
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It's easier to control people if they're fighting amongst themselves. No one points a finger at the powers that be.
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The only problem I have is yes both sides can bring way strong stuff but the thing I think alot of people don't realize it its 4 strong perks vs 16 strong perks. This wouldn't be a problem if 1 of the killer perks was equal to 4 survivor perks but they aren't some survivor perks even beat killer perks where your now in a 3 perk vs 16 perk situation.
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But at the end of the day skill plays an important part in that, if the survivors are trash they could all bring the strongest build and still get beaten by a perkless killer who has more skill or game knowledge than they do, when you're on equal playing field I will agree yes survivor perks can seem strong and annoying but they aren't unbeatable and playing mid to high tier killers make a difference in those situations, I've already agreed there are lower tier killers who need looked and adjusted because against the right squad it can feel impossible to win but those are the beginner killers for a reason and they're there as a stepping stone to get into playing harder to master ones, I'm a nurse main so Ive endured the hazing to get to where I am and I was bullied for like 2 months straight before I started to really get used to her power and do good on a consistent basis, I would run her perkless and addon less while learning as well just so I had to rely on skill to get kills and improve my game and once I felt I got the hang of it I started playing with different builds .
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It’s human psychology. Tribalism has always been a big thing and it doesn’t stop at video games. Some people aren’t susceptible to it but many are.
I remember when I used to play on WoW and the forums always had a Horde vs Alliance mentality with some people.
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Wrong.
I am Nemesis main and i have more wins than loses. And high MMR btw. I have strong survivor teams and SWFs on my games. Sometimes i am losing, sometimes they but i am pretty sure i have +50% win rate.
Wrong again.
Last stats shows us, Nurse and Blight are popular but there is more popular killers. Huntress for example. And also Huntress is another great killer. She is fun to play or against.
And you are talking like survivors nefer nerfed. DS, keys, exhaustion effects, CoH, infinities, hatch, egc... All of this stuff nerfed because for killers. And this nerfs needed. And they are still looking CoH and plus they are planning rework DH. Except CoH and DH, survivor perks are fine already.
Some killers are weak (Trappi, Leg, Ghosty etc.) but there is so much strong killers. And BHVR is looking weak killers too. Plague and Trapper buffed last time, we know Leg and Ghosty are next.
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Not...really.
There is an element of this, to be sure - but I don't really mind losing a game.
What I mind is:
- The games where I'm clearly mismatched with my opponents, skill wise. It's not much fun to roll over newbies, and it's even less fun to get rolled over by a team with quadruple your hours and stacked meta perks. SBMM seems to work pretty well in the daytime, but nights are a horror show, and the fact that my killer queues are getting shorter during daylight hours is...worrying.
- The attitudes of survivors when they win. I understand people who are a little salty on a loss, but the survivors who are gracious in victory are an extreme minority. EVERY game I lose has people hanging out in the exit gates to teabag and act like fools. I think that so many gripes that killers have about the game would vanish if survivors were just a little...nicer.
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Thats the thing though you should be looking at it as if both sides are equal skill or at least similar not if one side is more skilled. The problem is once a survivor has certain understanding of the game and the mechanics there's not much a killer can do that won't waste tons of time. Safe loops have no counter play against a decent survivor you have to brake the pallet giving them time to make it to the next loop or run the loop tell BL3 and you will eventually catch them. Lately when I play killer the w key has been crazy. I'll roll up to a gen there will be scratch marks and I'll see the survivor way off in the distance running to the strongest tile on the map. Now I can chase them but it will take me like 20 seconds to start the chase plus they're running to like shack. I agree that alot of lower tier killers need some buffs not to nurse as you said thet are beginner killers but they should still be good at higher leaves if your good with them not have to super sweat for a 2k maybe.
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Last stats were all around not just high mmr which is what the devs want to make decisions on and if the stats are a case I guess nurse needs a major buff along with Trickster because they are under 50%
Also for the buffs and nerfs none of that matters when things such as coh is still being an issue thanks to the boon mechanic itself, ds and bt still being used in ways that contradicts the whole reason of existing and boil over making some multistory maps unwinnable except by slugging. As for DH, no it is still bullshit as long as people can abuse it at endgame and allowing people win while ######### up constantly is not "fine". Buffs to killer do not matter since all the most reason update just affected addons making the killers such as pig ,trapper, plague,slinger,etc still bad at it's core.
And also do you really believe BHVR will do anything to actually balance the game? Boons made hex perks basically useless since they can just be snuffed but not removed, instead of nerfing the meta to balance the pool of perks they just buffed more perks and having one or two buffs to one things does not excuse the times they gutted or in twins case constantly nerfed.
And if you want to use stats then why don't we think like the devs who decided twins should be nerfed (who has the lowest pick rate mind you). In that case DH should be banned for being to safe since it doesn't go off of high mmr like how they said to justify twins.
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Also like I said to another for your example for huntress, as long as the survivor meta exist the killer has to either be scummy ,lucky or play nurse or blight just to deal with the mixture of over forgiving perks and the general rng.
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Trickster, yes. Nurse, no. Nurse is already strongest killer in game, she is hard to learn and this is why her stats are not good.
And i did not mention kill rates, i said "pick rates". Nurse & Blight are not most popular killer in game. And we both know they are strong killers.
I have more Huntress, Nemesis and Plague. And then Blight and Nurse. And actually, i am facing with most killers already. Just Twins is so rare for me. Everyone does not care about which killers are strongest, they are going for fun killers.
DS is problem but not anymore. It is anti-tunnel perk. Remove it from game and kill survivor exp. Same for BT, people who using it for bodyblock can be annoying but this both perks needed in game. You can not play survivor without them at high mmr. Because tunnelling is so common. DH & CoH are last problematic perks from survivorside, i am okey for other perks. And don't except for any changes for BT & DS. They are here for anti-camp and anti-tunnel.
About Twins, i don't know wth BHVR is doing seriously. They are so rare but they are keep nerfing them. I can not see any sense or reason. They are buffing Nurse and nerfing Twins. They are weird, i will give that.
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All of what you're saying revolves back to lower tier killers who are still fun to play and easy to use but any mid to high tier killer has map pressure and anti loop potential to where you have a chance to outplay equal skill opponents, the problem with all that is that BHVR doesn't give you equal skill opponents I still stand by my opinion that they just throw you in there to the fastest available game whether you're a 40 hr killer vs 6000 hr survivors or the other way around, the old matchmaking may not have been the best but it was way more reliable
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Out of the top 3 what killers can play around safe loops consistently?
100% agree I've been getting stomped as a killer alot yet I still face really good survivors. Then I'll pull of a 2k against 1 group and then play 3 games against baby survivors with 3 yellow perks. As a killer I think I keep getting thrown in above my weight class and then it finds a match at my mmr and I've lost so many I'm playing babys.
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What you're saying revolves around BHVRS inability to properly matchmake and get a fair game , just yesterday I played as huntress and had 2 DC because I had lethal pursuer and downed someone across the map on the saloon, I couldn't believe it until i saw the guy had 15 hours in the game at the end , and the other dc had just over 200, meanwhile the other two survivors had around 6,000 and 4,000 they ended up letting me kill them after we farmed and they couldn't believe it either on the matchmaking
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And I just get stealth killers cause I don't play much survivor but that doesn't excuse that the only killers that can circumvent all the survivor issues are those two I'm not saying they are the most picked I am saying they are the most viable due to those two being rushdown killers which fixed the pressure issue that alot of killers have issues dealing with oni does too but since he gets screwed by being slow normally and needs to hit in order to get use out of his perk along with the windup to his Kanabo leading to hitting debris more than people.
DS and BT needs more work, I'm not saying those two need to remove the only one I say that needs to be removed is DH. But, why then do these perk reward hook swarming something that should punish them due to it being a risky maneuver? Those two don't need to be removed just tweaked to work more like how they should and they need to stop being so forgiving because for as much people want to stoke their egos and say it's "skill" it's not it's over reliance on perks being so forgiving that they can potentially be safety nets.
And for the last bit that's why I keep saying the devs are survivor biased and only care about hocking cosmetics is cause it's the only reason I can think of to and the question of "what the ######### are you doing?"
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Bro what are you talking about lol? Even worst killer have +50% winrate? Some weak killer needs love but most killers are not that bad. And like i said, i am not playing Blight or Nurse but i am doing okey with Nemesis. But for you, Nemesis is weak and needs buffs right?
You are exactly the person who is Us vs They. And yes, i can see you are not playing survivor not so much. Play survivor more, get high mmr at survivor and then we can talk.
And no, BT & DS okey perks, they does not need change. Maybe remove bodyblock ability for BT, that's all. And how would survivors fight against camper and tunneller killers without this perks? Because survivors have not "game mechanics" for this. They need to use this perks.
And no, DH does not need to remove from game. It needs rework.
And i am just curious, which survivor perks are problem for you and how would you change them?
And no, BHVR is not favor survivors or killers. They are trying to make game better. They are not good at that but it is ridicilous to say they are supporting one side.
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Huntress, artist, Demogorgon because his shred ability can hit through pallets being thrown and go a good distance to shut down a loop while having map pressure with portals, Hag is extremely underrated and has anti loop and camping without camping basically built in to her power, pyramid head when good with his power can shut you down at loops without much effort and it becomes a hold w and break LOS until he catches up game, a good billy can shut you down or force you to waste safe pallet while if he has lopro chains on you can go through the pallet and still get them, outside of those I could probably come up with a few more but they also have major downsides so I'm not going to consider them when the downside is pretty even with the upside, aside from that we all know nurse blight and spirit can all compete.
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Right changing it that's why boons have no permanent counter measure and they just made another perk viable for bully squads while nerfing a killer that has the lowest pick rate sure. "balance"
I already told you bt and ds just need something to stop hook swarming that's it DH and boons as a whole on the other hand are way too forgiving and I have though of having it where you lose the ability to vault and use pallets and lose collision at the cost of being able to be hit in the case of dh and for boons just make them singular placable hex totems and when it's snuffed its gone however much like how we saw with COH nerf they will gut killer and do basic damage control for that so I have no hope they will fix it so I am just saying screw it just remove it.
Yes Nemesis needs a buff or two because one his ai partners suck and most of is addons are garbage much like PH both are good in certain setups but as long as the meta for survivors is the way it is you have to camp and tunnel in some way to achieve results that's why I keep bring it up that for as much as people want to keep acting like statistics are gospel it's hard to do that when the game has an rng fetish
Also I have played survivor and it doesn't take someone at high mmr because the perks are way to forgiving. People want to spout out skill bullshit all the time even the devs to an extent commonly from someone who has played 1 vs many modes on other games why is it that the many side which should be weaker to compensate multiple people need to have perks that reward ######### up over and over and over and act like their egos need to be stroked as if they accomplished a major feat when in reality the game gimped the solo to a point of forcing certain play styles or certain builds to achieve much.
Oh and yes they do like I said given the most recent updates along with the past two seek having 4 to 5 trailers for cosmetics it's only natural to cater to the side with more people to sell #########.
And trust me if I really wanted to make it an us vs them I can go into much more detail such as how I think IMO every tbagger and flashlight spammer should be banned cause 9 times out of ten one of ther group messages me ######### after every match and I'm tired of it but I'm not now am I? I am not trying to make it an us vs them but I cannot accept what it is now because it's not balanced it's a breeze for survivors unless at high mmr which other have said is survivor sided to an extent and a sweetest to all killers thanks to the lopsided ratio and the speed focused mmr.
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