Boil Over Change Incoming - BHVR Official Tweet
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I disagree. I play a lot of killer, and as I love PR, this works really well against me. I'd say that maybe half of my attempted PR hooks end up being regular hooks because of BO.
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But 99 % of times is much like this...
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and with boil over...
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the same, perhaps 0.33% to 1%
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Are you psychic? Can you see the future? Because the change has not happened yet, so I'm wondering how you can say 'It's like this' as if this has happened enough to be a trend. 🤔
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Sure you pick a surv, see the perk icon and you walk 10-15 secs before the drop
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Depends on situation, it actually... does.
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Well, the Survivors would get away if you walked '10-15 seconds' given it only takes 15-16 seconds to fill up the Wriggle meter. The 1 second difference being if you can hit all skillchecks.
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I'm going to say it now - getting a huge chunk of wiggle progress just because you moved to a high area where the stairway down took even more than 25% progress to reach should have never been a thing. It's gone, and that's a good thing.
What Boil Over can do now is punish the killer if they want to take you into the basement from a long distance away. They can't shortcut it and you may successfully knock them through the gap anyway. It also punishes trying to reach scourge hooks and makes team sabotage and bodyblock plays easier. There's also some small drops and areas where you might knock the killer off a platform/stairs for some bonus wiggle progress and a serious pathing screw-up (such as if you push the killer into one of the holes on the upper floor of The Game), but that won't be something you can generally control. Deliberate positioning was the heart of the abuse with this perk and it had to go.
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It needed a rework, not just a nerf. It's just another useless perk. Guess it's gonna stay that way.
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Good change and still a good buff from old BO.
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The issue is that other time, where people put themselves in certain places where you simply can't hook them.
Unfortunately, this is a design issue with Boil Over as a perk. It's just...not a good perk. It's annoying, and impossible to balance in a manner that isn't tooth grindingly frustrating to play against.
The perk needs to be reworked into something else. It's OoO all over again.
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I'd rather they found a way to make it useful.
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i'm with you there, but removing the abusability of it is at least something, and at this point expecting bhvr to make good changes to the mountain of junk perks is expecting too much sadly.
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Hardly a week and its already nerfed. Survivors always getting shafted. Meanwhile, Dead Man's Switch remains even more broken than ever. Nevermind how overpowered it is with other perks.
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I don't understand people complaining in this post. The perk was still trash after the buff and only served for squads using map offerings wanting to troll the killer. They just made a trash but abusable perk into a trash but not abusable one. There's no reason to complain unless you're one of those trolls, and if that's the case then I'll laugh at your face.
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Boil Over is a hard perk to make both useful and fair, because its effect deals with letting you break free on your own. Either it can reliably do that (in which case it's too strong to be balanced) or it can't (in which case it's too weak to run.) A perk like that can only be strong if its usage is capped.
There's always going to be forgettable perks, and if it's a choice between forgettable or abusive, I'll gladly consign Boil Over to the former pile.
Meanwhile, Distortion, Buckle Up, and Wake Up were all buffed this patch in nearly meaningless (or outright meaningless, in the case of Buckle Up) ways, and all of those are perks where I can think of ways to make them actually good. But nobody's talking about them and we'll be lucky if they get addressed again.
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Do you really think that this is a "healthy change"? The change makes the perk utterly rng based. In most instances the killer will use a drop instantly, causing the bonus to be minor percentage, and not be helpful at all. At this rate the perk is dead for sure.
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See how it is on eyre of crows and asylum i guess..
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There are perks that do currently exist to improve your ability to escape the killer's grasp that aren't problematic. I wouldn't even say they are weak, because they are situational. Flip Flop and Power Struggle aren't broken and aid in helping the survivor escape the killer's grasp and for the most part killers can play around both perks. There's like one situation where the killer can't do anything about it, but that requires at least 1 other survivor to be around in which it is free pressure to the killer if he plays it right.
The other perk is breakout which requires a survivor to not progress gens and put themself at risk to help the carried survivor wiggle out faster.
Boil Over was a problem because there was no real effective way to play around it and there was no trade off to getting it to work. Other survivors can just stay on gens as you were effectively unhookable in certain spots.
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Agreed, they need to fix that first, and on that note Balanced Landing has the same problem. Like on the Temple map, there are little raised platforms that don't even cause a survivor to lose running speed without Balanced Landing, and yet it still puts Balanced Landing on cooldown.
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That's...literally NOT 'RNG'. If the Killer picks you up fast; oh no! He avoided the perk!
If your friends distracted him & you had FLip-Flop; Yay! You got use out of it!
If he brought you to the basement and you made him stagger down the stairs; Yay! You got use out of it!
None of that is 'random' or 'random numbers'. it's all player-input on both sides.
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100% extra wiggle strength. (people underestimate this) plus if you get slugged and they drop from a great hight you get extra wiggle progress based on your current recovery, you could run flip flop and still instantly get out if they slug.
I think that's much better, I honestly didn't think the wiggle drop needed to be part of it.
The current boil over isnt good, it just causes a boring game loop where people where slugged to death while the gens don't get done.
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Is this your proposed change or you misunderstanding what this change is?
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This was a stealth buff (bhvr thinks we are stupid and don't notice) Survivors use to take stagger on that vault but it was a death trap when used by 20 hour survivors so they buffed it.
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Bruh its not like dead hard is still not nerfed and still just outperfomes every single killer chase perk by a million light years with spine chill iron will on top its literally reversed auto freedy no skill at all needed
I mean boil over in genral no good killer cares but its hardcore boring to get no points bc you have to let them all bleed out
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yeah this needs to go live asap, the current broken perk situation cannot continue. Killers are not playing and my queue times are depressingly long :(
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Its completely rng, cause you cant predict the movement of the killer. But a proper killer player first wont slug you for long enough to get any value out of a combi with flip/flop and second, wont drop down late. Cause you know what? You can see that someone has boilover the moment you pick them up. Before you would drop down late you would drop the surv instead to ensure he/she doesnt escape. Its utterly rng if the killer is stupid enough to let this happen. And we dont balance around killers not knowing what theyre doing.
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No, it's not RNG because it's not random, and it's not an action determined by a random number generator because the Killer is a human player.
It's not, in any way, shape, or form, RNG.
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Even though this was a change that should’ve been made between PTB and live. I’ll give credit where it’s due, because this is a bette change than what I expected.
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Does it help if you walk sideways? Haven't tried but it seems plausible. You could just turn when you need to squeeze through a doorway, or something like that
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Isn't it already kind of pointless after they added new hook locations by nearly every drop in a hotfix? i understand it caused frustrations to others but in the end i feel this is just overkill on a perk they tried to pull out of the shadows. really it should be reworked into like a flat 10% wiggle speed or something. thus it at least can get small value on any map but a killer whose smart doesn't have to worry as much and can plan better
think the biggest issue is no one bothered to test and give feedback with this and deadmans switch being around
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I couldn't get some survivors to the hook with the broken Boil Over even when I didn't have a drop. It's still going to give free escapes, just not against mouse and keyboard players. I'll probably still hate going against it but I won't feel completely powerless now.
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Yeah, kind of weird now that they've fixed the problem spots. They should've waited to see how it performed after these changes before nerfing the perk. The extra wiggle won't do anything, especially not at 33%.
It was already super unreliable, and needed the killer to not see a nearby hook while carrying you (except on certain spots like RPD and Thompson House which have both been fixed).
It'll be dead until they revisit it again, which I doubt they'll do anytime soon.
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There will be literally no point running the perk in 90% of cases. The perk is being used and abused cuz its 'fun' atm but its not that viable.
Ive had a few games with teams running it against me, with soul guard builds and picking ormond. Still managed to 4k, just had to change tactics and go for those outpositioned whilst keeping pressure on the slugs and keep them at main doing nothing.
I dont have a problem with changing perks if its the only way to fix it, honestly the hooks at RPD change was enough as there was literally nothing to get them to before. Two is even overkill for most games. Theres 1 to 2 hooks on eyrie of crows, and almost every other map had at least 1 hook within a reachable distance.
Just kinda seems like they shouldnt have bothered with trying to change the perk at all from the original.
33% of an instant pick up (as in 99% of times) is literally gonna be hardly any wiggle progression, 5% in most cases, and there will be hooks auras visible that will be easy to get to on almost every map.
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That's not a healthy change. It completely kills the perk.
Everyone told the developers that only way the new Boil Over buff would be used was by abuse. Could the developers have not buffed the perk in a different way so that it has some type of value. Or maybe have buffed a different survivor perk so it was usable.
Killers got a nicely buffed "Dead Man's Switch", survivors got stiffed by the developers once again. The developers buffed 1 single survivor perk to usability this patch and took it right back away.
Is it mandatory that all the DbD staff play so many hours of their game? If not, then that's my suggestion. Because you all don't seem to play your own game at all. You all definitely don't listen to the beta-test forums for patches.
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Are we talking about the same spot? Like I am talking about raised platforms that are one step. You can run down the stairs in the temple, no problem. But you step off the platform outside that is the height of barely one step, Balanced Landing goes on cooldown. It shouldn't.
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I think killers really overreacted to this. For instance i was using it a lot in soloq and had killers hitting me on hook even when i got no value out of it, just for using it.
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Imagine Nerfing Boil Over but DMS and Pain Resonance S tier Synergy not getting nerfed
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DMS is only busted on killers that are already powerful or highly mobile like Blight, Nurse, or Freddy. Artist too bc of her crows. Then you have to build around it. Like Pain Resonance and Corrupt. It literally requires you to catch, and hook people. It rewards the killer. Like PGTW. All of which can be stopped with flashlight saves, sabo, and body blocking. With PR it cuts only 15%. Then it stops progress not regress. 15% is minimal unless the killer kicks it with Pop after DMS is gone. So it’s actually quite fair by itself.
That’s why I couldn’t stand killer anymore. Matches were literally 5 mins. 1 good chase against a competent survivor is 2 gens. No matter how fast you caught a single person the others just did gens and left. 2 man escape was very common. Unless you carried NOED or DH for a snowball. Now survivors can’t just rush gens as the killer comes from hooking someone that purposely ran them across the map to give their mates time to gen rush. A braindead tactic. Now we have to engage with the trial as we should, or bring items like toolboxes to actually gen rush.
If you’re mad about new DMS it’s because you probably like gen rushing while the killer is chasing someone else (meaning it’s impossible to protect gens as killer). Just hide, bless, or loop longer until DMS is gone.
Post edited by WaveyTrey on0 -
And RPD was fixed with 3 hook spawns in library.
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My point? lol Everyone knows RPD was "busted" because of the library having no hooks and thats where most if not all the abusing of boil over took place on that map.
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If there was no indication of this perk affecting the killer then there would be a horde of bug reports noting that the hooks are no longer showing when carrying a survivor, the devs have no choice but to keep that notification in place.
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the perk is dead now and is good.
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AH yes. Another USELESS perk now. Thanks BHVR. Meta stays the exact same.
I wasn't even using Boil Over and only saw it occasionally, but much like Lucky Strike, when people ######### and moan, the perk gets gutted into obscurity.
BS company.
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They can always do what they should do and nerf the 4 meta perks so they are worse than everything else. Then you will get variety and the game would be slightly more balanced with less 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th chances.
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Boil Over doesn't need change. I've been playing as survivor and a killer and never had problems or huge benefits with this perk.
The main problem is that many killers are pretty fixed on the survivors that are escaping from the wiggling process. So they'll lose if the rest of the team is smart enough to do the gens.
As a killer you have so many advantages in the game. You can use iron grip, agitation and that stuff. And it feels like its always the same. If there is a new perk that survivors get a small advantage, killers are always crying like small kids about abusing the perk and stuff.
But what about all those rounds I've played, where the killer was camping, tunneling, used pretty strong perk builds (and abused them). If survivors were crying about that, it always got rejected like "Damn boy thats tactical playing!" And now If survivors are using the new boil over with perk building its abusive.
You guys know to win the round, you have to generators. And ofc there are maps like Ormond and Crotus Prenn where you can "abuse" the boil over. But upstairs or in the building itself there is only one generator. Survivors have to repair 4 generators and if you can't stop them doing them, getting fixed by those survivors that are "abusing" this perk its your own fault.
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So what perks do you define as dead?
Any chance to re animate them then? Or get rid of them.
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Spot on.
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